> ## Content Index > Fetch the complete content index at: https://www.ceo.com/llms.txt > Use this file to discover other available public pages before exploring further. # Fandom CEO Perkins Miller - URL: https://www.ceo.com/episodes/fandom-ceo-perkins-miller/ - Published: 2024-10-17T10:00:03.000Z - Updated: 2026-08-29T20:31:36.000Z - Description: A year before Fandom hired an AI-era CEO, Perkins Miller told the CEO.com Podcast exactly what AI would do to a business built on search traffic. - Author: Clint Betts # Perkins Miller saw the problem coming Perkins Miller is no longer the CEO of Fandom. [He left in October 2025](https://variety.com/2026/digital/news/fandom-new-ceo-jay-sullivan-1236652090/?ref=ceo.com). On October 22 of that year, [PlayOn Sports named him chief executive](https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/playon-sports-names-perkins-miller-ceo-founder-david-rudolph-to-lead-streaming-and-analytics-business-302590528.html?ref=ceo.com), an Atlanta company that streams high school games and sells tickets. The following February [Fandom's board hired Jay Sullivan](https://about.fandom.com/news/fandom-appoints-jay-sullivan-former-mozilla-groupon-facebook-and-twitter-executive-as-ceo?ref=ceo.com), a product executive out of Twitter and Facebook, and Jimmy Wales explained the choice in one phrase: the age of AI. So it is worth going back to what Miller told the CEO.com Podcast a year before any of that, when he was asked what happens to 300 million monthly visitors if AI answers the question before anyone clicks. He had thought about it. He said he spent a lot of time on it. His answer was that Fandom's traffic is not the kind AI is good at replacing. "We're not talking about formulating a new vaccine here," he told the CEO.com Podcast. "We're talking about figuring out what's going on with Captain Kirk in this episode." A person lost in Skyrim does not know how to ask a precise question. They want to wander. Google, he said, had started ranking Fandom higher for exactly that reason. Then he described what Fandom might build instead of waiting. "What if there's a native application on your desktop that you just had to say, 'Hey, I can't get around this wizard. I've been here for 10 minutes, I'm dying here. What do I do?' And we'll be able to say, 'Hey, you know what? You missed going and getting the strength coin back in that closet, and that strength coin will let you beat the wizard.' That's probably not something that Sam Altman's focused on right now." It was a good answer. Whether it was the right one is now someone else's problem. Miller came to Fandom with a deck. In 2018, he was running StubHub's business in the Americas, a $5 billion ticket marketplace, and eBay was getting ready to sell it. He had spent years in sports and entertainment and had come to believe that the big platforms, Google and Amazon and Facebook, were leaving vertical communities underserved. He wrote it up. Then Fandom called, and the thesis matched. [He started as CEO in February 2019](https://variety.com/2019/digital/news/fandom-perkins-miller-ceo-1203129212?ref=ceo.com), a year after a TPG-backed group bought the company, when it claimed nearly 200 million monthly visitors. Fandom began in 2004 as Wikia, Jimmy Wales's attempt to point Wikipedia's software at everything Wikipedia would never cover in depth. By the time Miller sat down with the CEO.com Podcast, it hosted more than 200,000 wikis and 45 million pages, written by a couple hundred thousand volunteers. The Star Wars wiki alone runs to 170,000 pages. Around that core, the company kept buying. Gamepedia and the D&D Beyond toolset had arrived a month before Miller did, in the Curse Media deal. Under him, Fandom bought Fanatical, which sells PC games, and sold D&D Beyond to Hasbro. In October 2022 [it acquired GameSpot, Metacritic, TV Guide, GameFAQs, Giant Bomb, Cord Cutters News, and Comic Vine from Red Ventures](https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/fandom-acquires-leading-entertainment--gaming-brands-including-gamespot-tv-guide-and-metacritic-301638635.html?ref=ceo.com). Four months later it [laid off staff at those sites](https://variety.com/2023/digital/news/fandom-layoffs-giant-bomb-gamespot-metacritic-tv-guide-1235495258/?ref=ceo.com), under 10 percent of a workforce of fewer than 500, by one account. Advertising is 80 percent of revenue. Selling games is the rest. Asked what makes a community, Miller gave two answers. The first is that people have to share something they care about, and at Fandom that something is the intellectual property itself. Loving horror is a value. Loving anime is an identity. The second is that people need a way to say so, and need to feel safe saying it. "You have to, of course, in our case, maintain the standards so that folks feel like they're safe and feel like they've got a way to connect without getting trolled or otherwise folks behaving badly." A year earlier, on The Verge's Decoder podcast, he had been asked about a different kind of safety: the ads. Fandom's wikis had become infamous for them, and the host wanted to know how much advertising was right. Miller's answer, which [Decoder clipped and posted](https://www.tiktok.com/@decoderpod/video/7270544800430951723?ref=ceo.com), was this: "We're doing our best to make it as elegant as we can, and yet, we need to drive the economics." Both statements are true. Both came from the same man about the same site. The part of the business Miller was most eager to talk about was not the wikis. It was the data. Fandom built a taxonomy of everything on the platform and a product called FanDNA on top of it. No personal information, he said, but 300 million people leave a lot of behavior behind, and Fandom can see what one community does when it is not being a community. "Turns out the people who love RPG fantasy also love horror movies." Studios buy that. Paramount came to Fandom to understand Star Trek canon before writing more of it. Game publishers advertise and get the audience map in return. He was asked whether Fandom, knowing what it knows about what fans want, would ever make a game. He said no, mostly. A console title costs tens of millions at the low end, hundreds at the high end, and takes years. The big franchises win. He would revisit it if AI made development fast enough to act on a trend before it passed. Miller's first decade was the Olympics. He was in Salt Lake City for the 2002 Games, streaming live results at a time when that was the frontier of the internet. He was seconded to Sydney in 2000\. From there he went to NBC to run sports and Olympics digital through Beijing and Vancouver, then to WWE, where he launched the WWE Network in 2012, then to the NFL as chief digital officer. In 2001, he had briefly quit the Olympics for a Utah startup called Campus Pipeline, which was trying to build something like what Facebook later built. He quickly realized it wasn't for him. Mitt Romney, Fraser Bullock, and Dave Busser let him come back. "I was young back then when I was so inexperienced to have folks like Fraser and Mitt and this guy Dave Busser, who really have seen the world beyond the lens of my whatever it was, outlaw idea and let me take, come back and do what I wanted to do and have an impact," he told the CEO.com Podcast. "If I hadn't been given that chance at that time to do that work, I definitely would not be here where I am today." When it comes to running a company, he is a schedule man. Six-month clock, two board meetings, quarterly reviews, a monthly executive review, weekly staff. Mondays belong to his executive team. He reads Ethan Mollick on AI and recommends "The Courage to Be Disliked" for its handling of ego. The thing he said he did not understand early was how few decisions a CEO should make. Everything that reaches the top has been packaged. The person deciding is the person furthest from the material. "The more singular decisions a CEO makes, the slower the organization will go." He had a test, too, for the moments when CEOs are expected to say something about the world. Does the community of people who love anime need to hear from him about this? Usually not. So he does not speak. At PlayOn, he is back in sports, back in streaming, back in ticketing, working alongside a founder who ran the place for 17 years. He is also [lead director of Herbalife's board](https://www.herbalife.com/en-us/about-herbalife/our-leadership/perkins-miller?ref=ceo.com). Fandom, under Sullivan, is building for the thing Miller said it could outrun. ```chapters 00:00:00 Introduction 00:00:28 Perkins' Journey To Becoming CEO 00:01:10 Fandom's Core: Wikis And Content Scale 00:02:16 Acquisitions And Business Expansion 00:03:35 Building Great Communities 00:05:33 Strengthening Community And Commerce 00:08:02 Revenue Model And Competitors 00:09:06 FanDNA And Data Insights 00:11:02 AI's Impact On Fandom's Operations 00:13:52 Working With Studios On Game Insights 00:16:51 Previous Roles At StubHub, NFL, WWE 00:20:25 A Typical Day As CEO 00:22:14 The Future Of Search With AI 00:25:31 Reading Recommendations 00:27:04 Leadership Lessons Learned Over Years ``` ```vtt WEBVTT 00:00:09.732 --> 00:00:11.665 Perkins,<00:00:10.280> thank<00:00:10.441> you<00:00:10.473> so<00:00:10.618> much<00:00:10.795> for<00:00:10.924> coming<00:00:11.246> on<00:00:11.343> this<00:00:11.440> show. 00:00:12.229 --> 00:00:15.419 It<00:00:12.310> is<00:00:12.471> a<00:00:12.632> 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community? 00:03:36.652 --> 00:03:40.440 Well,<00:03:36.896> I<00:03:36.993> think<00:03:37.302> number<00:03:37.546> one,<00:03:38.262> you<00:03:38.684> have<00:03:38.928> to<00:03:39.010> have<00:03:39.595> something<00:03:39.839> you<00:03:39.969> care<00:03:40.148> about. 00:03:40.879 --> 00:03:43.448 So,<00:03:41.513> I<00:03:41.546> mean,<00:03:41.757> I<00:03:41.774> think<00:03:42.001> there's<00:03:42.180> this<00:03:42.652> shared<00:03:43.058> values. 00:03:44.133 --> 00:03:50.998 And<00:03:44.278> so,<00:03:46.309> those<00:03:46.550> shared<00:03:46.873> values<00:03:47.437> in<00:03:47.582> the<00:03:47.839> worlds<00:03:48.146> that<00:03:48.307> we<00:03:48.484> live<00:03:48.726> in<00:03:48.887> are<00:03:48.967> around<00:03:49.612> this<00:03:50.192> intellectual<00:03:50.563> property. 00:03:51.062 --> 00:03:52.917 So,<00:03:51.288> it's<00:03:51.465> a<00:03:52.190> shared<00:03:52.432> value. 00:03:53.063 --> 00:04:00.096 I<00:03:53.160> like<00:03:54.212> 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there's<00:06:41.863> caves,<00:06:42.361> there's<00:06:42.827> roads<00:06:43.165> that<00:06:43.245> go<00:06:43.390> places. 00:06:44.514 --> 00:06:46.153 It's<00:06:44.772> hard<00:06:44.916> to<00:06:44.948> sometimes<00:06:45.334> keep<00:06:45.495> track<00:06:45.736> of<00:06:45.800> where<00:06:45.896> you<00:06:46.121> are. 00:06:46.314 --> 00:06:55.810 So,<00:06:46.443> we<00:06:46.539> built<00:06:46.764> this<00:06:46.925> mapping<00:06:47.326> tool<00:06:48.146> that<00:06:48.290> says,<00:06:48.403> okay,<00:06:48.644> here's<00:06:48.885> how<00:06:49.094> you<00:06:49.126> can<00:06:49.270> keep<00:06:49.415> track<00:06:49.736> of<00:06:49.817> where<00:06:49.994> you<00:06:50.218> are<00:06:50.395> so<00:06:50.556> that<00:06:50.700> you<00:06:50.813> know<00:06:51.665> you're<00:06:52.066> making<00:06:52.243> your<00:06:52.468> way<00:06:52.645> towards<00:06:53.432> the<00:06:53.528> doom,<00:06:53.994> whatever<00:06:54.396> you're<00:06:54.557> 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all<00:07:26.088> about,<00:07:27.308> do<00:07:27.453> I<00:07:27.549> buy<00:07:27.709> this<00:07:27.870> game? 00:07:28.095 --> 00:07:28.480 Is<00:07:28.191> it<00:07:28.271> good? 00:07:28.897 --> 00:07:29.893 Or<00:07:29.138> do<00:07:29.218> I<00:07:29.379> watch<00:07:29.572> this<00:07:29.780> movie? 00:07:29.941 --> 00:07:30.487 Is<00:07:30.053> it<00:07:30.182> good? 00:07:30.663 --> 00:07:40.071 And<00:07:30.711> so<00:07:30.856> we<00:07:31.065> aggregate<00:07:31.546> all<00:07:31.642> these<00:07:32.830> rankings<00:07:33.312> and<00:07:33.408> ratings<00:07:33.810> from<00:07:34.034> both<00:07:35.415> folks<00:07:35.640> who<00:07:35.736> are<00:07:35.881> professional<00:07:36.282> reviewers<00:07:36.715> as<00:07:36.860> well<00:07:37.020> as<00:07:37.101> fans<00:07:37.534> to<00:07:37.663> give<00:07:37.887> you<00:07:37.984> that<00:07:38.546> picture<00:07:38.963> so<00:07:39.107> that<00:07:39.252> you<00:07:39.348> can<00:07:39.428> make<00:07:39.605> 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competitor<00:08:48.800> be<00:08:48.944> like<00:08:49.201> Reddit? 00:08:50.309 --> 00:08:51.048 Yeah,<00:08:50.630> I<00:08:50.662> think<00:08:50.887> so. 00:08:51.128 --> 00:08:58.466 So<00:08:51.305> between—<00:08:52.252> kind<00:08:52.413> of<00:08:52.493> think<00:08:52.653> about<00:08:52.894> Reddit,<00:08:53.376> you<00:08:53.440> think<00:08:53.553> about<00:08:53.842> IMDb,<00:08:54.966> um,<00:08:55.447> think<00:08:55.560> about<00:08:55.784> Twitch,<00:08:56.732> you<00:08:56.764> know,<00:08:56.828> those<00:08:57.069> are<00:08:57.101> sort<00:08:57.213> of<00:08:57.872> trying<00:08:58.113> to<00:08:58.193> calibrate. 00:08:58.514 --> 00:09:02.400 Maybe<00:08:58.675> Rotten<00:08:58.915> Tomatoes,<00:09:00.023> um,<00:09:00.923> those<00:09:01.083> are<00:09:01.147> sort<00:09:01.324> of<00:09:01.485> in<00:09:01.629> our<00:09:01.870> time<00:09:02.143> zone. 00:09:02.592 --> 00:09:04.872 Regulation<00:09:03.090> of<00:09:03.235> all<00:09:03.476> of—<00:09:03.813> 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00:29:26.266 Who<00:29:24.711> knows<00:29:25.016> what's<00:29:25.897> really<00:29:26.138> there? 00:29:26.410 --> 00:29:36.331 So<00:29:26.715> that's<00:29:27.292> another<00:29:27.532> thing<00:29:27.740> that's<00:29:27.901> really<00:29:28.077> important<00:29:28.462> for<00:29:28.542> me<00:29:28.574> to<00:29:28.702> learn,<00:29:28.958> which<00:29:29.135> is,<00:29:29.423> you<00:29:29.455> know,<00:29:29.744> how<00:29:29.840> to<00:29:30.080> say,<00:29:30.321> okay,<00:29:30.561> well,<00:29:30.706> I<00:29:30.722> have<00:29:30.898> to<00:29:31.042> be<00:29:31.988> having<00:29:32.228> a<00:29:32.308> team<00:29:32.501> of<00:29:32.629> people<00:29:32.949> underneath<00:29:33.286> me<00:29:33.382> that<00:29:33.526> has<00:29:33.751> a<00:29:33.767> team<00:29:34.007> underneath<00:29:34.312> them<00:29:34.488> that<00:29:34.552> is<00:29:34.728> able<00:29:34.969> to<00:29:35.049> scale<00:29:35.530> and<00:29:35.834> have<00:29:35.995> impact. 00:29:38.354 --> 00:29:51.440 It's<00:29:38.499> interesting,<00:29:38.900> like,<00:29:39.285> in<00:29:39.446> your<00:29:39.687> role,<00:29:40.088> you're<00:29:40.329> kind<00:29:40.570> of<00:29:40.666> where<00:29:40.827> people<00:29:41.228> go<00:29:41.710> to<00:29:42.047> escape<00:29:42.673> reality<00:29:43.396> and<00:29:43.476> the<00:29:43.637> current,<00:29:44.118> like,<00:29:44.375> macroeconomic<00:29:45.339> environment<00:29:45.853> or<00:29:45.949> what's<00:29:46.190> happening<00:29:46.511> in<00:29:46.591> the<00:29:46.768> world<00:29:47.330> and<00:29:48.197> geopolitics<00:29:49.096> or,<00:29:49.417> you<00:29:49.513> know,<00:29:49.883> national<00:29:50.284> politics,<00:29:50.766> all<00:29:50.798> that<00:29:50.926> type<00:29:51.119> of<00:29:51.167> stuff. 00:29:51.986 --> 00:29:57.622 Do<00:29:52.050> you<00:29:52.372> ever<00:29:52.548> find<00:29:52.869> yourself<00:29:53.255> having<00:29:53.752> to<00:29:54.154> think<00:29:54.491> about—<00:29:55.422> 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00:33:57.251 Great<00:33:56.977> to<00:33:57.025> see<00:33:57.090> you. ```