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# Goody CEO Katy Carrigan
- URL: https://www.ceo.com/episodes/goody-ceo-katy-carrigan/
- Published: 2024-11-05T11:00:03.000Z
- Updated: 2026-08-29T19:59:19.000Z
- Description: Goody's CEO on why a small company pays for Gong, how to prepare for a season that makes the year, and who gave her a chance.
- Author: Clint Betts

# Katy Carrigan runs Goody by listening

Katy Carrigan listens to her company's sales calls on the walk to the gym. Goody pays for Gong, the call recording software, which she admits is a strange line item for a business of its size.

"Gong, I would say, is typically not a tool that small companies will invest in because it is a fairly expensive item in the tech tool stack," she said on the CEO.com Podcast. "But my recommendation to any leader or CEO is totally worth it. I love listening to customer calls and learning a ton of information."

Listening got her the job. Goody launched in December 2020 as a consumer app. The pitch was that you could send a gift by text without asking for an address and spoiling the surprise. The recipient typed in their own address and could swap the gift for something else. Carrigan joined in April 2021 as a consultant, then as head of sales, and her assignment was to follow the customers who were already using the product in a way nobody had designed it for.

"I think, like any good tech product, you put it in the world thinking it's going to be used in one way, and then your users actually show you what they want to do with your product," she told the CEO.com Podcast. "What we saw was that people actually needed it for the workplace. The individuals who are spending the most money coming back most frequently were doing it for a work use case. So, we pivoted to serving our B2B community in 2021."

The business side became the company. Co-founder Edward Lando, who had run Goody as CEO from the start, decided the day-to-day no longer fit him. [He said in the June 2022 announcement](https://www.newswire.com/news/goody-the-leading-consumer-and-business-gifting-app-appoints-katy-21745516?ref=ceo.com) that he had always planned to hand the company to an operator once the team was in place, and he moved to chairman. Carrigan, by then chief revenue officer, was appointed CEO. She [was sitting on the panel interviewing outside candidates](https://risehier.com/blog/goody?ref=ceo.com) when she was asked to be considered herself.

"I often joke it escalated quickly from head of sales to CEO," she said.

Goody raised all of its money in 2021: [a $4 million seed round from Index, a $13.1 million Series A from NEA, and a $15 million add-on from SoftBank's Latin America Fund that November](https://techcrunch.com/2021/11/16/gift-giving-mobile-app-goody-holidays/?ref=ceo.com). The company has not announced a round since. Customer figures depend on who is counting and when. [Pulse 2.0 put the number above 45,000 companies](https://pulse2.com/goody-katy-carrigan-profile/?ref=ceo.com) in May 2024\. [The AI & Software Report said 15,000](https://theaisoftwarereport.com/at-goody-katy-carrigan-wants-gifting-to-mean-something/?ref=ceo.com) in August 2025\. [Goody's own press release that December said 20,000](https://www.prweb.com/releases/goody-introduces-ai-gifting-an-ai-powered-assistant-for-personalized-gifts-at-scale-302634904.html?ref=ceo.com). Whatever the count, the platform that started as a phone app is now a web product with integrations, automation, and single sign-on, built for someone sending 10,000 gifts at once.

That number is the merchandising problem. Goody's catalog covers [more than 400 brands](https://saleshive.com/vendors/goody?ref=ceo.com), and every one of those 10,000 recipients has to find something they want at the price the company set.

"The challenge becomes how do you build an everything store without it feeling like an everything store?" Carrigan said. "I think that goes back to merchandising and how you can leverage AI to bring the right products to the right people at the right time."

She was careful on the podcast about what that meant. Goody had just adopted an AI tool for customer support ahead of the holidays, and she was clear that operational uses were the easy call. The product was different. "I definitely don't want to be in the game when I have limited resources, of just putting vanity features in to say, 'Oh, we're AI gifting,'" she said. Her bet was that personalized recommendations would become table stakes for any store, and that Goody would build its own. [It shipped in December 2025](https://www.prweb.com/releases/goody-introduces-ai-gifting-an-ai-powered-assistant-for-personalized-gifts-at-scale-302634904.html?ref=ceo.com). A sender describes the occasion in a sentence and the model, trained on millions of anonymized transactions, proposes gifts, a card, and a message. In the announcement, Carrigan said the point was for the result to feel like it came from a person, not a model.

The company's year is shaped like a retailer's. "Maybe February through July, and we're a little bit quieter. We can do some of that work that we put up. The rest of the year, it's all about preparing for the holiday season," she said. Engineering runs load tests to find the point where the site breaks. Customer support hires. The marketing team runs experiments on the site continuously, keeps the winners, and goes back to figure out why the losers lost.

The customer base is also shaped for bad years. When tech companies cut back in 2022 and 2023, the elaborate boxes Goody had been building for flush tech companies went away. "For us, that meant, okay, fine, we're going to focus on accounting firms and legal firms and other agencies that are not getting as hit by this change in the economy," she said. "It's a lot easier to spend a corporate card than your personal card as well."

Carrigan spent several years at Dropbox before Goody, ending as head of the global Sales Assist team. She is not an engineer and does not pretend to be one. Asked what she has learned about leadership, she pointed to the founder mode debate and gave the hired executive's version of it.

"I come from a sales background. I'm not an expert in SEM. I'm not an expert in engineering. I do need to truly trust my leaders in those channels, but that doesn't mean I can't be hands-off. I can't learn enough to be at least part of the conversations and understand the building, particularly when you're at the smaller size, but even as you scale, prioritize the time to go deep into the most important areas of your business so you have a good grasp of what's going on."

Every CEO.com Podcast episode ends with the same question. The chances one gives are just as important as the chances one takes, so who gave you a chance?

"I would say I've been super fortunate to have had a lot of great leadership and managers along the way, particularly during my stint at Dropbox," Carrigan said. "So one person, I'd call out, Kate Taylor. She's now the global head of recruiting over at Notion and really was one of the first great leaders to give me the chance to join Dropbox. From there, I moved over and was under Yamini for a while, who's now the CEO of HubSpot. Having that opportunity, I think, particularly to work under very strong female leaders, not only showed me things like, 'Okay, where can I go?' I think that it also becomes really important, especially when you're younger, to see yourself or to see other people in places that you want to be. But I then think particularly what was so awesome about working under them is that they created space and opportunity for people to stretch into roles and learn."

```chapters
00:00:09 Introduction and Background
00:00:22 Origin of Goody
00:01:06 Pivot to B2B
00:01:50 Transition to CEO
00:03:01 Platform Tweaks and Growth
00:03:45 Preparing for Holiday Season
00:05:40 Secret Santa and Creative Uses
00:07:54 A Day in the Life of a CEO
00:09:16 AI Integration and Efficiency
00:10:43 Product Selection Criteria
00:12:01 Leadership Lessons
00:13:27 Personal Life and Decompression
00:14:06 Navigating Macroeconomic Trends
00:16:00 Acknowledging Mentors and Opportunities
```

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And<00:03:24.966> so<00:03:25.374> that's<00:03:25.701> where<00:03:26.012> the<00:03:26.045> majority<00:03:26.519> of<00:03:26.600> people<00:03:27.009> were<00:03:27.238> like<00:03:27.483> getting<00:03:27.745> their<00:03:27.908> job<00:03:28.153> done<00:03:28.709> in,<00:03:29.532> having<00:03:29.852> to<00:03:29.949> send<00:03:30.558> a<00:03:30.654> large<00:03:30.910> amount<00:03:31.375> of<00:03:31.600> gifts.

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And<00:03:32.433> so<00:03:33.203> our<00:03:34.100> focus<00:03:34.742> went<00:03:34.966> from,<00:03:35.463> you<00:03:35.543> know,<00:03:35.623> initially<00:03:36.024> taking<00:03:36.345> what<00:03:36.489> we<00:03:36.585> had<00:03:36.810> built<00:03:37.146> in<00:03:37.226> a<00:03:37.242> mobile<00:03:37.691> version<00:03:38.092> and<00:03:38.188> basically<00:03:38.589> just<00:03:38.829> putting<00:03:39.070> it<00:03:39.214> onto<00:03:39.406> the<00:03:39.535> web.

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So<00:03:40.352> who's<00:03:40.593> some<00:03:40.753> fields?

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And<00:03:41.234> then<00:03:41.859> over<00:03:42.035> the<00:03:42.099> last<00:03:42.356> couple<00:03:42.532> of<00:03:42.661> years,<00:03:42.757> it's<00:03:42.997> becoming<00:03:43.398> more<00:03:43.558> and<00:03:43.719> more<00:03:44.199> robust<00:03:44.664> to<00:03:44.825> include<00:03:45.626> integrations<00:03:46.380> and<00:03:46.524> automations<00:03:47.309> and<00:03:47.405> more<00:03:47.502> settings<00:03:48.207> and<00:03:49.089> things<00:03:49.313> like<00:03:49.570> SSO<00:03:50.291> and<00:03:50.435> all<00:03:50.611> of<00:03:50.772> those<00:03:51.173> features<00:03:51.557> and<00:03:51.653> functionalities<00:03:52.679> that<00:03:52.920> you<00:03:53.096> need<00:03:54.042> to<00:03:54.459> win<00:03:54.779> enterprise<00:03:55.180> customers.

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But<00:03:56.286> I<00:03:56.367> will<00:03:56.543> say<00:03:56.768> the<00:03:56.944> thing<00:03:57.105> that<00:03:57.249> has<00:03:57.425> continued<00:03:57.907> to<00:03:57.971> stay<00:03:58.147> the<00:03:58.244> same,<00:03:58.789> and<00:03:58.853> I<00:03:58.950> think<00:03:59.190> what<00:03:59.896> differentiates<00:04:00.618> us<00:04:00.955> from<00:04:01.260> potentially<00:04:01.581> other<00:04:01.757> platforms<00:04:02.238> out<00:04:02.399> there,<00:04:02.960> is<00:04:03.041> that<00:04:03.185> we<00:04:03.281> still<00:04:03.506> have<00:04:03.618> our<00:04:03.763> consumer<00:04:04.308> bones.

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So<00:04:05.222> at<00:04:05.303> the<00:04:05.591> end<00:04:05.704> of<00:04:05.832> the<00:04:05.928> day,<00:04:07.067> the<00:04:07.212> people<00:04:07.517> who<00:04:07.597> are<00:04:07.773> using<00:04:08.078> our<00:04:08.174> products<00:04:08.800> are<00:04:08.832> still<00:04:09.137> just<00:04:09.313> shoppers.

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They're<00:04:10.164> still<00:04:10.485> consumers<00:04:11.062> who<00:04:11.142> are<00:04:11.303> looking<00:04:11.624> for<00:04:12.426> the<00:04:12.570> best<00:04:13.051> gifts<00:04:13.388> to<00:04:13.549> send<00:04:13.870> to<00:04:14.014> their<00:04:14.174> employees.

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And<00:04:15.618> we<00:04:15.699> need<00:04:15.827> to<00:04:15.891> make<00:04:16.260> it<00:04:16.613> super<00:04:17.142> easy,<00:04:17.624> reduce<00:04:18.041> the<00:04:18.105> number<00:04:18.426> of<00:04:18.586> clicks<00:04:19.003> they<00:04:19.164> have<00:04:19.324> to<00:04:19.469> find<00:04:19.870> things<00:04:20.110> that<00:04:20.287> they<00:04:20.528> want,<00:04:21.250> the<00:04:21.330> items<00:04:21.731> that<00:04:21.891> are,<00:04:22.196> you<00:04:22.228> know,<00:04:22.437> tracking<00:04:22.854> them<00:04:23.078> on<00:04:23.175> their<00:04:23.271> social<00:04:23.640> media<00:04:23.977> platforms<00:04:24.843> outside<00:04:25.196> of<00:04:25.324> work.

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So<00:04:26.849> while<00:04:27.106> we've<00:04:27.572> continued<00:04:28.070> to<00:04:28.214> have<00:04:28.391> to<00:04:28.535> build<00:04:28.776> the<00:04:28.840> more<00:04:29.498> robust<00:04:29.980> business<00:04:30.430> side,<00:04:31.200> end<00:04:31.361> of<00:04:31.441> the<00:04:31.586> day,<00:04:32.083> it's<00:04:32.228> still<00:04:32.469> just<00:04:32.645> people<00:04:33.207> using<00:04:33.432> our<00:04:33.592> product.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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That,<00:04:36.097> that's<00:04:36.338> really<00:04:36.579> cool.

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And<00:04:37.542> you<00:04:37.686> got<00:04:37.927> the<00:04:38.024> biggest<00:04:38.345> gift<00:04:38.570> season<00:04:39.453> of<00:04:39.613> all<00:04:39.950> coming<00:04:40.255> up<00:04:40.432> the<00:04:40.576> holiday<00:04:40.914> season<00:04:41.395> here.

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Yes.

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Um,<00:04:42.760> how<00:04:42.936> are<00:04:43.065> you<00:04:43.225> preparing<00:04:43.723> for<00:04:43.836> that?

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How<00:04:44.173> are<00:04:44.285> you<00:04:44.446> thinking<00:04:44.767> about<00:04:45.008> that?

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And<00:04:45.232> then<00:04:45.393> this<00:04:45.553> is<00:04:45.650> kind<00:04:45.810> of<00:04:46.115> a<00:04:46.212> question<00:04:46.597> from<00:04:46.758> left<00:04:47.014> field,<00:04:47.978> like,<00:04:48.443> have<00:04:48.684> you<00:04:48.764> ever<00:04:48.861> thought<00:04:49.037> about<00:04:49.182> doing<00:04:49.374> like<00:04:49.599> the<00:04:49.680> Secret<00:04:50.081> Santa<00:04:50.868> type<00:04:51.044> stuff<00:04:51.349> for<00:04:51.815> companies<00:04:52.313> and<00:04:52.457> things<00:04:52.634> like<00:04:52.794> that?

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Because<00:04:53.356> that,<00:04:53.597> that<00:04:53.757> could<00:04:53.902> be<00:04:53.998> an<00:04:54.095> interesting<00:04:55.747> you<00:04:55.779> know,<00:04:56.147> market<00:04:56.468> to<00:04:56.676> tap<00:04:56.868> into<00:04:57.125> as<00:04:57.205> well?

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Yeah,<00:04:58.150> absolutely.

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So,<00:05:00.169> really<00:05:00.569> interesting<00:05:01.434> on<00:05:01.851> how<00:05:02.011> we<00:05:02.155> prepare.

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I<00:05:03.197> would<00:05:03.389> say<00:05:04.094> there's<00:05:04.334> like,<00:05:06.177> the<00:05:06.321> way<00:05:06.481> I<00:05:06.561> think<00:05:06.722> of<00:05:06.754> our<00:05:06.898> calendar,<00:05:07.443> it's<00:05:07.571> kind<00:05:07.699> of<00:05:07.779> funny,<00:05:08.035> it's<00:05:08.196> like,<00:05:08.404> kind<00:05:09.125> of<00:05:09.157> maybe<00:05:09.397> February<00:05:10.279> through<00:05:10.743> July<00:05:11.608> is<00:05:11.769> a<00:05:11.785> little<00:05:12.169> bit<00:05:12.409> of,<00:05:12.906> we're<00:05:13.002> a<00:05:13.066> little<00:05:13.291> bit<00:05:13.387> quieter,<00:05:13.948> we<00:05:14.108> can<00:05:14.268> do<00:05:14.444> some<00:05:14.733> of<00:05:14.765> that<00:05:15.053> work<00:05:15.293> that<00:05:15.390> we<00:05:15.550> put<00:05:15.774> off.

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Rest<00:05:16.511> of<00:05:16.575> the<00:05:16.655> year,<00:05:16.767> it's<00:05:17.056> all<00:05:17.152> about<00:05:17.392> preparing<00:05:18.498> for<00:05:18.738> the<00:05:18.818> holiday<00:05:19.091> season.

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I'm<00:05:20.388> not<00:05:20.517> sure,<00:05:20.597> I'm<00:05:20.837> sure<00:05:20.981> you've<00:05:21.141> had<00:05:21.558> some<00:05:21.782> other<00:05:22.535> CEOs<00:05:23.064> on<00:05:23.160> before.

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Who've<00:05:25.004> run<00:05:25.245> seasonal<00:05:25.565> businesses,<00:05:26.287> but<00:05:26.945> so<00:05:27.330> much<00:05:27.571> of<00:05:27.731> your<00:05:28.036> year<00:05:28.212> in<00:05:28.293> the<00:05:28.453> planning<00:05:28.854> goes<00:05:29.255> to<00:05:29.416> being<00:05:29.736> ready<00:05:31.004> in<00:05:31.180> those<00:05:31.565> few<00:05:31.726> months.

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So<00:05:32.688> right<00:05:33.089> now<00:05:33.587> it's<00:05:34.132> a<00:05:34.228> lot<00:05:34.469> of<00:05:34.629> looking<00:05:35.496> at<00:05:35.672> our<00:05:36.474> tech<00:05:36.651> stacks<00:05:37.742> on<00:05:38.383> the<00:05:38.704> engineering<00:05:39.282> side<00:05:39.683> where<00:05:39.923> every<00:05:40.164> day<00:05:40.405> doing<00:05:40.661> scaling<00:05:41.127> tests,<00:05:41.608> like<00:05:41.848> what,<00:05:42.169> you<00:05:42.250> know,<00:05:42.811> when<00:05:42.955> will<00:05:43.068> the<00:05:43.148> site<00:05:43.453> break?

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How<00:05:44.816> do<00:05:44.897> we<00:05:44.977> have<00:05:45.057> to<00:05:45.137> ensure<00:05:45.538> on<00:05:45.618> the<00:05:45.699> backside<00:05:46.244> we<00:05:46.308> have<00:05:46.405> the<00:05:46.485> right<00:05:46.741> infrastructure<00:05:47.864> set<00:05:48.089> up?

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On<00:05:49.565> CX,<00:05:50.255> you<00:05:50.415> can<00:05:50.592> think<00:05:50.816> about,<00:05:51.378> well,<00:05:51.795> what<00:05:52.035> kind<00:05:52.340> of<00:05:52.372> hiring<00:05:52.902> do<00:05:53.319> we<00:05:53.399> need<00:05:53.559> to<00:05:53.720> do?

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How<00:05:54.378> do<00:05:54.522> we<00:05:54.683> ensure<00:05:55.148> that<00:05:55.245> we<00:05:55.325> have<00:05:55.485> the<00:05:55.566> right<00:05:55.806> workforce<00:05:57.075> in<00:05:57.171> place?

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Maybe<00:05:57.990> not<00:05:58.295> as<00:05:58.600> extreme<00:05:59.402> as<00:05:59.675> Macy's<00:06:00.301> hiring<00:06:00.799> on<00:06:00.879> the<00:06:01.008> retail<00:06:01.345> side<00:06:01.650> during,<00:06:02.388> you<00:06:02.468> know,<00:06:02.613> the<00:06:02.709> holidays,<00:06:03.512> but<00:06:03.656> it's<00:06:03.753> similar<00:06:04.395> in<00:06:04.539> a<00:06:04.555> sense,<00:06:05.021> if<00:06:05.117> you<00:06:05.198> can<00:06:05.358> think<00:06:05.583> about<00:06:05.840> it,<00:06:05.984> that<00:06:06.642> we<00:06:06.867> need<00:06:07.044> to<00:06:07.140> make<00:06:07.365> sure<00:06:07.605> our<00:06:07.766> staffing<00:06:08.344> and<00:06:08.472> technology<00:06:09.211> is<00:06:09.371> beefed<00:06:09.757> up<00:06:10.415> for<00:06:10.575> a<00:06:10.720> busy<00:06:10.977> season,<00:06:12.165> which<00:06:12.341> does<00:06:12.566> look<00:06:12.662> different<00:06:13.048> than<00:06:13.706> July.

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And<00:06:15.375> then<00:06:16.338> on<00:06:16.419> the<00:06:16.579> other<00:06:16.836> side,<00:06:17.623> I<00:06:17.719> would<00:06:17.896> say<00:06:19.164> it's<00:06:19.710> all<00:06:19.886> about<00:06:20.207> ensuring<00:06:20.769> that<00:06:21.315> we<00:06:21.556> have<00:06:21.973> the<00:06:22.102> most<00:06:22.599> optimized<00:06:23.081> funnel<00:06:23.434> that<00:06:23.578> we<00:06:23.723> can<00:06:23.819> go<00:06:23.883> in<00:06:23.964> with.

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So<00:06:26.227> at<00:06:26.307> any<00:06:26.532> given<00:06:26.708> time<00:06:26.933> you<00:06:27.093> can<00:06:27.190> be<00:06:27.334> on<00:06:27.414> our<00:06:27.511> site<00:06:28.056> and<00:06:28.152> we're<00:06:28.297> running<00:06:28.554> different<00:06:28.778> experiments<00:06:29.821> and<00:06:30.303> constantly<00:06:30.720> looking<00:06:31.105> at<00:06:31.202> what's<00:06:31.442> winning,<00:06:31.747> what's<00:06:31.988> losing,<00:06:32.790> implementing<00:06:33.288> the<00:06:33.368> winning<00:06:33.625> strategy,<00:06:34.171> and<00:06:34.315> then<00:06:35.037> revisiting<00:06:35.599> where,<00:06:35.936> you<00:06:36.032> know,<00:06:36.080> an<00:06:36.177> experiment<00:06:36.802> lost.

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Why<00:06:37.300> did<00:06:37.476> it<00:06:37.605> lose<00:06:37.862> and<00:06:38.247> what<00:06:38.343> else<00:06:38.487> could<00:06:38.664> we<00:06:38.744> do<00:06:38.905> to<00:06:39.322> improve<00:06:39.707> it?

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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The<00:06:42.291> reason<00:06:42.516> why<00:06:42.676> I<00:06:42.756> asked<00:06:42.997> the<00:06:43.158> Secret<00:06:43.462> Santa<00:06:43.719> thing,<00:06:44.185> a<00:06:44.281> buddy<00:06:44.522> of<00:06:44.554> mine<00:06:44.827> started<00:06:45.549> Reddit<00:06:45.886> Gifts,<00:06:46.849> which<00:06:47.170> became<00:06:47.571> like<00:06:47.795> this<00:06:48.116> huge<00:06:48.453> like<00:06:48.694> gift<00:06:49.015> exchange,<00:06:49.657> and<00:06:49.721> it<00:06:49.801> all<00:06:49.978> happened<00:06:50.363> on<00:06:50.540> Reddit.

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I'm<00:06:51.406> not<00:06:51.567> entirely<00:06:51.984> sure<00:06:52.209> how<00:06:52.386> it<00:06:52.611> worked<00:06:52.964> or<00:06:53.253> how<00:06:53.365> we<00:06:53.510> figured<00:06:53.831> out<00:06:53.992> like<00:06:54.216> the<00:06:54.473> logistics<00:06:55.099> of<00:06:55.260> it,<00:06:55.581> but<00:06:55.694> it<00:06:55.774> seemed<00:06:56.079> like<00:06:56.239> they<00:06:56.400> were<00:06:56.480> like<00:06:56.721> actually<00:06:57.107> exchanging<00:06:57.829> each<00:06:57.925> other's<00:06:58.327> address<00:06:58.809> to<00:06:58.889> each<00:06:59.049> other,<00:06:59.210> like<00:06:59.370> they're<00:06:59.595> strangers<00:07:00.719> and<00:07:00.816> shipping,<00:07:02.485> you<00:07:02.518> know,<00:07:02.742> stuff.

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I<00:07:03.706> don't—<00:07:04.412> I<00:07:04.493> don't<00:07:04.669> know<00:07:04.910> how<00:07:04.990> that<00:07:05.215> worked<00:07:05.536> or<00:07:05.633> how,<00:07:06.195> but<00:07:06.355> it<00:07:06.435> seemed<00:07:06.660> like<00:07:06.757> that's<00:07:07.800> what<00:07:07.961> they<00:07:08.105> were<00:07:08.202> doing.

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And<00:07:08.507> they<00:07:08.667> put<00:07:08.780> like<00:07:08.940> a<00:07:09.069> limit,<00:07:09.245> like<00:07:09.406> a<00:07:09.470> $20,<00:07:09.727> $25.

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Anyways,<00:07:10.771> it<00:07:10.851> was<00:07:11.012> huge.

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Like<00:07:11.493> Bill<00:07:11.654> Gates<00:07:11.975> did<00:07:12.200> it,<00:07:12.360> all<00:07:12.457> the<00:07:12.553> celebrities<00:07:12.970> did.

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Like<00:07:13.356> it<00:07:13.420> became<00:07:13.741> like<00:07:13.902> this<00:07:14.127> huge<00:07:14.528> thing.

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Yeah.

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And<00:07:17.096> there's<00:07:17.257> nothing<00:07:17.513> like<00:07:17.689> that<00:07:17.818> anymore.

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That's<00:07:18.539> been<00:07:18.795> shut<00:07:19.036> down<00:07:19.341> by<00:07:19.421> Reddit.

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So<00:07:20.302> you<00:07:20.398> could<00:07:20.559> totally<00:07:21.184> use<00:07:21.440> our<00:07:21.585> product<00:07:21.905> to<00:07:22.002> do<00:07:22.146> that<00:07:22.322> today<00:07:22.883> because<00:07:23.027> you<00:07:23.108> could<00:07:23.204> just<00:07:23.364> generate<00:07:23.765> a<00:07:23.845> GIF<00:07:24.069> link<00:07:24.646> and<00:07:24.711> then<00:07:24.983> send<00:07:25.192> that<00:07:25.368> person<00:07:26.554> a<00:07:26.570> link.

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Hmm.

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So<00:07:28.638> you<00:07:28.814> could<00:07:29.055> leverage<00:07:29.439> our<00:07:29.600> product<00:07:30.097> in<00:07:30.241> that<00:07:30.417> way<00:07:30.642> or<00:07:30.818> for<00:07:31.059> that<00:07:31.283> use<00:07:31.523> case.

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And<00:07:31.844> I<00:07:31.940> think<00:07:32.101> that<00:07:32.245> would<00:07:32.341> be<00:07:32.421> one<00:07:32.581> of<00:07:32.646> those<00:07:32.886> fun<00:07:32.982> examples<00:07:33.607> of<00:07:33.848> maybe<00:07:34.168> we<00:07:34.265> didn't<00:07:34.505> intentionally<00:07:35.050> build<00:07:35.242> a<00:07:35.307> Secret<00:07:35.627> Santa<00:07:36.012> app,<00:07:36.188> but<00:07:36.653> you<00:07:36.749> could<00:07:36.894> absolutely<00:07:38.032> do<00:07:38.208> that<00:07:38.432> today.

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And<00:07:38.993> sometimes<00:07:39.458> with<00:07:39.571> some<00:07:39.731> of<00:07:40.116> the<00:07:40.260> companies<00:07:40.677> we<00:07:40.821> work<00:07:40.997> with,<00:07:41.558> it's<00:07:41.703> really<00:07:41.879> fun.

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They'll<00:07:42.344> come<00:07:42.520> to<00:07:42.584> us<00:07:42.745> with<00:07:42.841> like,<00:07:43.001> oh,<00:07:43.145> we<00:07:43.225> want<00:07:43.402> to<00:07:43.434> do<00:07:43.562> this<00:07:43.722> this<00:07:43.947> holiday<00:07:44.203> season,<00:07:44.700> or<00:07:44.844> these<00:07:45.069> are<00:07:45.101> our<00:07:45.261> themes,<00:07:45.726> like,<00:07:45.886> can<00:07:46.207> you<00:07:46.287> help<00:07:46.512> us<00:07:46.624> achieve<00:07:46.993> it?

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And,<00:07:47.650> and<00:07:47.794> usually<00:07:48.371> the<00:07:48.693> The<00:07:49.081> answer<00:07:49.339> is<00:07:49.501> yes.

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Oh,<00:07:51.359> that's<00:07:51.666> awesome.

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Yeah.

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What<00:07:52.927> does<00:07:53.073> a<00:07:53.137> typical<00:07:53.541> day<00:07:53.703> look<00:07:53.865> like<00:07:54.026> for<00:07:54.172> you?

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Yeah,<00:07:57.450> I<00:07:57.530> would<00:07:57.691> say<00:07:58.738> a<00:07:58.754> lot<00:07:58.915> of<00:07:58.996> meetings,<00:08:00.670> I<00:08:00.767> think,<00:08:01.411> and<00:08:02.860> running<00:08:03.102> the<00:08:03.246> business.

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It's<00:08:03.826> making<00:08:04.148> sure<00:08:04.374> I'm<00:08:04.486> in<00:08:04.680> touch<00:08:04.938> with<00:08:06.471> all<00:08:06.632> different,<00:08:07.197> like,<00:08:07.455> department<00:08:08.003> heads,<00:08:08.504> what's<00:08:08.730> happening,<00:08:10.843> you<00:08:10.924> know,<00:08:11.069> what's<00:08:11.247> top<00:08:11.489> of<00:08:11.569> mind<00:08:11.811> for<00:08:11.973> them,<00:08:12.715> spending<00:08:13.828> some<00:08:14.200> time<00:08:14.797> with<00:08:15.766> product<00:08:16.153> and<00:08:16.315> engineering.

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I<00:08:17.445> love<00:08:17.607> that<00:08:17.784> part<00:08:17.962> of<00:08:18.010> it.

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I<00:08:18.140> really<00:08:18.220> love<00:08:18.301> product.

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I<00:08:19.692> love<00:08:19.852> spending<00:08:20.173> time<00:08:20.574> talking<00:08:20.911> about<00:08:21.119> like,<00:08:21.761> what's<00:08:22.017> the<00:08:22.097> vision,<00:08:22.498> what's<00:08:22.707> the<00:08:22.739> next<00:08:23.043> iteration,<00:08:23.621> where<00:08:23.861> are<00:08:23.941> people<00:08:24.262> getting<00:08:24.599> stuck?

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Something<00:08:26.267> that<00:08:26.411> I<00:08:26.507> do<00:08:26.748> constantly<00:08:27.614> every<00:08:27.790> day<00:08:27.950> as<00:08:28.127> well,<00:08:28.431> and<00:08:28.511> it<00:08:28.592> can<00:08:28.736> either<00:08:28.993> be<00:08:29.169> like<00:08:29.939> on<00:08:30.035> a<00:08:30.115> walk<00:08:30.420> after<00:08:30.740> work,<00:08:31.462> as<00:08:31.799> I'm<00:08:31.879> heading<00:08:32.119> to<00:08:32.264> the<00:08:32.360> gym<00:08:32.745> or<00:08:32.777> something<00:08:33.082> like<00:08:33.242> that,<00:08:33.659> is<00:08:33.755> listening<00:08:34.044> to<00:08:34.204> Gong<00:08:34.509> calls.

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So<00:08:36.529> Gong,<00:08:36.850> I<00:08:36.914> would<00:08:37.026> say,<00:08:37.171> is<00:08:37.315> typically<00:08:37.748> not<00:08:39.015> a<00:08:39.095> tool<00:08:39.432> that<00:08:39.592> small<00:08:39.897> companies<00:08:40.378> will<00:08:40.474> invest<00:08:40.939> in<00:08:41.741> because<00:08:41.981> it<00:08:42.125> is<00:08:42.286> like<00:08:42.526> a<00:08:42.558> fairly<00:08:43.184> expensive<00:08:44.451> item<00:08:45.108> in<00:08:45.252> the<00:08:45.332> tech<00:08:45.573> tool<00:08:45.765> stack.

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But<00:08:46.872> my<00:08:47.433> recommendation<00:08:48.315> to<00:08:48.636> any<00:08:48.876> like<00:08:49.117> leader<00:08:49.325> or<00:08:49.454> CEO,<00:08:50.063> it's<00:08:50.239> totally<00:08:50.640> worth<00:08:50.945> it.

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I<00:08:51.747> love<00:08:52.068> listening<00:08:52.406> to<00:08:52.486> customer<00:08:52.823> calls,<00:08:53.754> learn<00:08:54.027> a<00:08:54.092> ton<00:08:54.316> of<00:08:54.413> information.

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It's<00:08:55.729> super<00:08:55.922> easy,<00:08:56.323> like<00:08:56.484> having<00:08:56.805> the<00:08:56.885> recording,<00:08:57.528> having<00:08:57.785> the<00:08:57.881> ability,<00:08:58.892> um,<00:08:58.989> they<00:08:59.053> have<00:08:59.149> a<00:08:59.165> lot<00:08:59.310> of<00:08:59.695> great<00:08:59.792> tools<00:09:00.257> for<00:09:00.354> like<00:09:00.675> themes,<00:09:01.221> like<00:09:01.381> searching<00:09:01.783> recordings,<00:09:02.425> et<00:09:02.505> cetera,<00:09:03.549> um,<00:09:03.806> has<00:09:03.966> really<00:09:04.191> helped<00:09:04.384> us<00:09:04.833> in<00:09:05.090> developing<00:09:05.556> product.

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How<00:09:07.499> are<00:09:07.643> you<00:09:07.740> thinking<00:09:08.125> about<00:09:08.366> AI<00:09:09.024> and<00:09:09.104> how<00:09:09.281> is<00:09:09.410> that<00:09:09.586> gonna<00:09:09.827> play<00:09:09.972> a<00:09:09.988> role<00:09:10.774> in<00:09:10.951> the<00:09:11.112> product<00:09:11.513> you're<00:09:11.674> building<00:09:12.316> and,<00:09:12.701> uh,<00:09:12.974> the<00:09:13.103> future<00:09:13.520> of<00:09:14.243> even<00:09:14.403> just<00:09:14.628> like<00:09:14.805> gift<00:09:15.061> exchanges?

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It's<00:09:15.800> kind<00:09:15.864> of<00:09:15.896> interesting.

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Yeah.

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I<00:09:17.117> think<00:09:18.176> there's<00:09:18.481> like<00:09:18.658> two<00:09:18.899> ways<00:09:19.204> that<00:09:19.541> I<00:09:19.605> would<00:09:19.718> say<00:09:19.862> most<00:09:20.344> like<00:09:20.825> leaders<00:09:21.211> are<00:09:21.243> thinking<00:09:21.628> about<00:09:21.933> AI.

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And<00:09:23.394> the<00:09:23.475> first<00:09:23.796> one<00:09:24.117> being<00:09:24.679> the<00:09:24.984> how<00:09:25.160> does<00:09:25.385> AI<00:09:25.642> help<00:09:25.867> me<00:09:25.963> run<00:09:26.124> a<00:09:26.140> more<00:09:26.349> efficient<00:09:26.686> business?

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And<00:09:28.115> I<00:09:28.211> think<00:09:28.436> that's<00:09:28.709> like<00:09:28.917> one<00:09:29.078> of<00:09:29.110> the<00:09:29.190> biggest<00:09:29.495> focuses<00:09:30.282> of<00:09:30.700> looking<00:09:31.005> for<00:09:31.117> the<00:09:31.245> right<00:09:31.358> tools.

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So<00:09:32.947> for<00:09:33.172> us,<00:09:33.413> for<00:09:33.493> example,<00:09:34.392> in<00:09:34.553> getting<00:09:34.713> ready<00:09:34.954> for<00:09:35.099> the<00:09:35.179> holiday<00:09:35.452> season,<00:09:35.757> we<00:09:35.918> implemented<00:09:36.479> this<00:09:36.801> amazing<00:09:37.154> new<00:09:37.266> CX<00:09:37.539> tool<00:09:37.764> called<00:09:37.924> Sienna,<00:09:38.952> and<00:09:39.594> it's<00:09:39.851> probably<00:09:40.092> some<00:09:40.172> of<00:09:40.252> the<00:09:40.333> best<00:09:40.558> customer<00:09:40.959> AI<00:09:41.152> support<00:09:42.099> I've<00:09:42.292> seen.

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And<00:09:42.725> it<00:09:42.886> really<00:09:43.062> helps<00:09:43.448> us<00:09:43.929> answer<00:09:44.427> a<00:09:44.571> lot<00:09:44.812> more<00:09:45.069> of<00:09:45.214> our<00:09:45.760> customers<00:09:46.257> quickly<00:09:46.994> going<00:09:47.315> into<00:09:47.556> the,<00:09:47.877> the<00:09:48.021> busy<00:09:48.278> season.

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Um,<00:09:49.561> and<00:09:49.705> then<00:09:49.801> the<00:09:49.881> second<00:09:50.266> one<00:09:50.683> is<00:09:50.844> where<00:09:51.004> does<00:09:51.164> it<00:09:51.245> make<00:09:51.421> sense<00:09:51.726> in<00:09:51.806> the<00:09:51.950> product<00:09:52.929> to<00:09:52.993> add,<00:09:53.955> which<00:09:54.292> I<00:09:54.452> think<00:09:54.613> does<00:09:54.869> take,<00:09:55.399> um,<00:09:55.880> a<00:09:55.912> lot<00:09:56.152> more<00:09:56.377> thought<00:09:56.682> because<00:09:57.500> I<00:09:57.580> definitely<00:09:57.901> don't<00:09:58.045> want<00:09:58.125> to<00:09:58.221> be<00:09:58.382> in<00:09:58.462> the<00:09:58.606> game<00:09:59.104> of<00:09:59.504> when<00:09:59.649> I<00:09:59.729> have<00:09:59.905> limited<00:10:00.242> resources<00:10:00.868> of<00:10:01.012> just<00:10:01.172> putting<00:10:01.349> like<00:10:01.589> vanity<00:10:01.990> features<00:10:02.456> in<00:10:02.552> to<00:10:02.648> say,<00:10:03.017> oh,<00:10:03.113> we're<00:10:03.354> like<00:10:03.658> AI<00:10:05.022> gifting.

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Um,<00:10:06.786> I<00:10:07.043> think<00:10:07.684> generally<00:10:08.165> the<00:10:08.326> baseline<00:10:08.967> for<00:10:09.128> any<00:10:09.304> sort<00:10:09.545> of<00:10:09.609> shopping<00:10:10.090> will<00:10:10.250> include<00:10:10.956> AI<00:10:11.373> because<00:10:11.614> people<00:10:11.854> are<00:10:11.934> going<00:10:12.031> to<00:10:12.095> look<00:10:12.255> for<00:10:12.496> personalized<00:10:13.041> experiences<00:10:13.939> and<00:10:14.083> recommendations.

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So<00:10:15.783> I<00:10:15.863> think<00:10:16.103> that's<00:10:17.625> the<00:10:17.866> area<00:10:18.106> that<00:10:18.250> we'll<00:10:18.410> invest<00:10:18.891> in,<00:10:19.003> in<00:10:19.131> our<00:10:19.308> own<00:10:19.468> marketplace.

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And<00:10:21.791> we<00:10:22.016> will<00:10:23.474> hopefully,<00:10:23.858> you<00:10:23.890> know,<00:10:24.034> we're<00:10:24.115> gonna<00:10:24.195> work<00:10:24.355> to<00:10:24.435> be<00:10:24.515> the<00:10:24.595> best<00:10:24.900> out<00:10:24.996> of<00:10:25.076> it.

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But<00:10:25.396> generally,<00:10:25.877> I<00:10:25.957> think<00:10:26.278> any<00:10:26.454> sort<00:10:26.758> of<00:10:26.902> e-commerce<00:10:27.431> site<00:10:27.800> is<00:10:27.944> gonna<00:10:28.120> need<00:10:28.280> to<00:10:28.377> have<00:10:28.585> that.

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Yeah.

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And<00:10:30.764> then<00:10:31.245> also<00:10:31.485> things<00:10:31.789> like<00:10:32.350> helping<00:10:32.607> you<00:10:32.751> write<00:10:32.927> your<00:10:33.087> gift<00:10:33.328> message.

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You<00:10:35.154> know,<00:10:35.250> those,<00:10:35.587> I<00:10:35.651> think<00:10:35.811> those<00:10:35.955> are<00:10:35.987> some<00:10:36.148> of<00:10:36.212> those<00:10:36.452> obvious<00:10:36.837> places<00:10:37.638> that<00:10:37.734> people<00:10:37.974> think<00:10:38.198> about.

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How<00:10:39.016> do<00:10:39.080> you<00:10:39.176> decide<00:10:39.560> what<00:10:39.721> products<00:10:40.137> you<00:10:40.297> put<00:10:40.458> on<00:10:40.682> the<00:10:40.762> platform<00:10:41.259> for<00:10:41.403> people<00:10:41.659> to<00:10:41.804> gift?

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Like,<00:10:42.204> how<00:10:42.300> do<00:10:42.364> you<00:10:42.525> decide<00:10:42.861> that?

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Yeah,<00:10:44.820> so<00:10:45.290> we<00:10:45.598> look<00:10:46.003> at<00:10:46.408> a<00:10:46.505> lot<00:10:46.813> of<00:10:48.773> what's<00:10:49.016> trending.

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We<00:10:50.931> love<00:10:51.110> being<00:10:51.353> able<00:10:51.500> to<00:10:51.597> highlight<00:10:51.922> businesses<00:10:52.491> that<00:10:52.588> have<00:10:52.735> values<00:10:53.125> that<00:10:53.238> align<00:10:53.466> with<00:10:53.612> ours<00:10:53.872> and<00:10:53.953> align<00:10:54.262> with<00:10:54.620> the<00:10:54.750> companies<00:10:55.156> who<00:10:55.188> are<00:10:55.318> using<00:10:55.643> us.

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So<00:10:56.456> whether<00:10:56.716> that's<00:10:57.090> women-founded,<00:10:58.897> BIPOC-owned,<00:11:00.754> US-made,<00:11:02.917> we<00:11:03.013> look<00:11:03.159> for<00:11:03.336> those<00:11:03.578> types<00:11:03.901> of<00:11:03.982> companies<00:11:04.692> that<00:11:04.789> we<00:11:04.950> can<00:11:05.112> really<00:11:05.354> highlight<00:11:06.000> in<00:11:06.080> our<00:11:06.210> catalog.

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I<00:11:07.623> would<00:11:07.786> say<00:11:07.867> the<00:11:08.094> interesting<00:11:08.744> thing<00:11:08.939> in<00:11:09.329> what<00:11:09.492> we're<00:11:09.768> creating<00:11:10.724> Means<00:11:11.047> we<00:11:11.192> have<00:11:11.289> to<00:11:11.337> have<00:11:11.450> an<00:11:11.611> everything<00:11:12.015> store<00:11:12.806> that<00:11:12.886> I<00:11:12.983> often<00:11:13.548> describe,<00:11:14.581> because<00:11:15.323> if<00:11:15.468> you're<00:11:15.646> talking<00:11:15.888> about<00:11:16.114> an<00:11:16.275> employee<00:11:16.630> sending<00:11:17.001> out<00:11:17.034> a<00:11:17.163> gift<00:11:17.356> to<00:11:17.501> 10,000<00:11:18.212> people,<00:11:19.086> I<00:11:19.118> need<00:11:19.263> to<00:11:19.344> make<00:11:19.521> sure<00:11:20.052> every<00:11:20.310> single<00:11:20.632> one<00:11:20.793> of<00:11:20.825> those<00:11:21.035> 10,000<00:11:21.679> people<00:11:22.806> is<00:11:22.838> going<00:11:22.967> to<00:11:23.048> find<00:11:23.450> something<00:11:23.934> within<00:11:24.191> our<00:11:24.320> marketplace<00:11:24.900> within<00:11:25.125> a<00:11:25.141> certain<00:11:25.447> price<00:11:25.705> point<00:11:25.930> too.

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Not<00:11:26.349> just<00:11:26.575> like<00:11:27.380> generally,<00:11:27.718> yeah,<00:11:27.815> there's<00:11:28.040> something<00:11:28.250> on<00:11:28.363> there<00:11:28.509> like,<00:11:28.850> but<00:11:29.240> let's<00:11:29.386> say<00:11:29.483> within<00:11:30.149> $50<00:11:32.161> that<00:11:32.405> they<00:11:32.583> like<00:11:33.135> that<00:11:33.314> speaks<00:11:33.589> to<00:11:33.800> them.

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So<00:11:35.069> the<00:11:35.166> challenge<00:11:35.655> becomes<00:11:36.144> is<00:11:36.290> how<00:11:36.388> do<00:11:36.453> you<00:11:36.616> build<00:11:36.795> an<00:11:36.876> everything<00:11:37.284> store<00:11:37.528> without<00:11:37.707> it<00:11:37.854> feeling<00:11:38.163> like<00:11:38.772> an<00:11:38.852> everything<00:11:39.253> store.

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And<00:11:39.558> I<00:11:39.574> think<00:11:39.734> that<00:11:39.846> goes<00:11:40.054> back<00:11:40.295> to<00:11:40.680> the<00:11:40.712> merchandising<00:11:41.417> and<00:11:41.818> how<00:11:41.962> you<00:11:42.058> can<00:11:42.219> leverage<00:11:42.603> AI<00:11:43.100> to<00:11:43.421> surface<00:11:43.886> the<00:11:43.966> right<00:11:44.126> products<00:11:44.463> to<00:11:44.543> the<00:11:44.623> right<00:11:44.783> people<00:11:45.088> at<00:11:45.184> the<00:11:45.264> right<00:11:45.425> time.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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That's<00:11:47.509> really<00:11:47.733> interesting.

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What<00:11:49.721> have<00:11:49.817> you<00:11:49.913> learned<00:11:50.089> about<00:11:50.394> leadership<00:11:51.035> since<00:11:52.638> stepping<00:11:53.039> into<00:11:53.215> the<00:11:53.296> CEO<00:11:53.841> role,<00:11:54.145> going<00:11:54.626> from<00:11:54.722> the<00:11:54.818> sales<00:11:55.187> role<00:11:55.524> to<00:11:55.668> like<00:11:55.844> the<00:11:55.925> CEO<00:11:56.470> role?

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What<00:11:57.335> have<00:11:57.431> you<00:11:57.608> learned<00:11:57.928> about<00:11:58.554> that<00:11:58.970> and<00:11:59.211> what<00:11:59.435> lessons<00:11:59.788> would<00:11:59.932> you<00:12:00.637> have<00:12:00.814> for<00:12:00.990> our<00:12:01.215> audience?

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Yeah,<00:12:02.561> I'm<00:12:03.363> a<00:12:03.523> very<00:12:03.844> hands-on<00:12:04.324> leader.

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I've<00:12:05.527> actually,<00:12:07.308> if<00:12:07.452> people<00:12:07.789> tend<00:12:08.110> to,<00:12:08.495> you<00:12:08.527> know,<00:12:08.607> maybe<00:12:08.848> if<00:12:08.976> someone's<00:12:09.265> listening<00:12:09.570> to<00:12:09.650> this<00:12:09.859> podcast,<00:12:10.340> then<00:12:10.436> they're<00:12:10.581> probably<00:12:10.773> someone<00:12:11.078> who<00:12:11.222> also<00:12:11.463> is<00:12:11.559> just<00:12:11.720> like<00:12:11.960> keeping<00:12:12.281> up<00:12:12.442> with<00:12:12.602> general<00:12:12.843> leadership<00:12:13.308> news.

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There's<00:12:13.725> been<00:12:13.885> a<00:12:13.902> lot<00:12:14.062> of<00:12:14.126> talk<00:12:14.431> recently<00:12:14.768> about<00:12:15.008> founder<00:12:15.329> mode<00:12:16.276> and<00:12:16.853> how<00:12:17.479> often<00:12:18.843> people<00:12:19.260> were<00:12:19.901> given<00:12:20.142> the<00:12:20.238> advice<00:12:20.768> of<00:12:20.928> just<00:12:21.089> hire<00:12:21.361> the<00:12:21.490> right<00:12:21.666> people<00:12:21.987> and<00:12:22.067> then<00:12:22.228> trust<00:12:22.532> them<00:12:23.351> to<00:12:23.431> do<00:12:23.575> the<00:12:23.672> work.

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I<00:12:24.313> think<00:12:24.458> that's<00:12:24.746> sound<00:12:24.939> advice<00:12:25.436> and<00:12:25.500> like<00:12:25.837> very<00:12:26.222> true<00:12:26.639> and<00:12:27.185> has<00:12:27.666> allowed<00:12:27.939> us<00:12:28.035> to<00:12:28.228> grow<00:12:28.484> in<00:12:28.645> that<00:12:29.527> I<00:12:29.688> come<00:12:29.832> from<00:12:30.008> a<00:12:30.024> sales<00:12:30.393> background.

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I'm<00:12:31.533> not<00:12:31.710> an<00:12:31.838> expert<00:12:32.176> in<00:12:32.336> SEM,<00:12:32.834> I'm<00:12:32.914> not<00:12:33.123> an<00:12:33.284> expert<00:12:33.605> in<00:12:33.702> engineering.

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I<00:12:34.344> do<00:12:34.441> need<00:12:34.665> to<00:12:34.746> truly<00:12:35.131> trust<00:12:35.710> my<00:12:35.854> leaders<00:12:36.754> in<00:12:36.915> those<00:12:38.264> channels,<00:12:38.907> but<00:12:38.987> that<00:12:39.164> doesn't<00:12:39.469> mean<00:12:39.646> I<00:12:39.790> can't<00:12:40.288> be<00:12:40.593> hands-off<00:12:41.654> or<00:12:41.718> I<00:12:41.734> can't<00:12:42.039> learn<00:12:42.200> enough<00:12:42.601> to<00:12:42.698> be<00:12:43.019> at<00:12:43.099> least<00:12:43.405> part<00:12:43.919> of<00:12:44.047> the<00:12:44.144> conversations,<00:12:45.268> understand<00:12:46.875> building.

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And<00:12:48.336> so<00:12:48.722> particularly<00:12:49.365> when<00:12:49.525> you're<00:12:50.393> at<00:12:51.469> a<00:12:51.533> smaller<00:12:51.855> size,<00:12:52.096> but<00:12:52.272> even<00:12:52.481> as<00:12:52.642> you<00:12:52.738> scale,<00:12:53.059> like<00:12:53.702> prioritize<00:12:54.409> the<00:12:54.505> time<00:12:55.067> to<00:12:55.148> like<00:12:55.790> go<00:12:56.015> deep<00:12:56.288> into<00:12:56.513> the<00:12:56.754> most<00:12:56.995> important<00:12:57.381> areas<00:12:57.718> of<00:12:57.814> your<00:12:57.959> business.

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So,<00:12:58.842> you<00:12:59.003> have<00:12:59.244> a<00:12:59.324> good<00:12:59.549> grasp<00:13:00.271> of<00:13:00.303> what's<00:13:00.528> going<00:13:00.833> on.

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I<00:13:01.812> think<00:13:01.972> that<00:13:02.293> goes<00:13:02.518> back<00:13:02.694> to<00:13:02.791> me<00:13:02.935> wanting<00:13:03.176> to<00:13:03.272> listen<00:13:03.497> to<00:13:03.641> customer<00:13:04.043> calls<00:13:04.861> really<00:13:05.102> regularly.

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Like,<00:13:06.209> I<00:13:06.241> need<00:13:06.546> to<00:13:06.707> understand<00:13:07.349> our<00:13:07.493> customer<00:13:07.846> sentiment<00:13:09.034> and<00:13:09.195> be—<00:13:10.077> continue<00:13:11.121> to,<00:13:11.297> like,<00:13:11.682> have<00:13:11.987> customer<00:13:12.340> centrality<00:13:13.592> as<00:13:13.929> a<00:13:13.945> main<00:13:14.234> pillar<00:13:14.491> of<00:13:14.636> this<00:13:14.812> business<00:13:16.562> if<00:13:16.722> I<00:13:16.899> think—<00:13:17.204> if<00:13:17.380> for<00:13:17.460> us<00:13:17.621> to<00:13:17.701> hit<00:13:17.813> our<00:13:18.006> goals.

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Yeah.

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Yeah,<00:13:20.911> that<00:13:21.312> makes<00:13:21.778> a<00:13:21.794> ton<00:13:22.051> of<00:13:22.291> sense.

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What<00:13:23.752> do<00:13:23.864> you<00:13:23.961> do<00:13:24.185> for<00:13:24.346> fun?

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What—<00:13:25.148> I<00:13:25.325> mean,<00:13:25.485> how<00:13:25.646> do<00:13:25.790> you<00:13:26.609> decompress?

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Yeah,<00:13:29.991> I<00:13:30.136> often<00:13:30.411> say<00:13:30.556> like<00:13:31.201> the<00:13:31.427> reason<00:13:32.073> I<00:13:32.573> work<00:13:32.895> hard<00:13:33.234> or<00:13:33.347> my<00:13:33.476> motivation<00:13:35.703> is<00:13:35.945> probably<00:13:36.203> for<00:13:36.348> that<00:13:36.526> decompressed<00:13:37.010> side<00:13:37.220> of<00:13:37.332> spending<00:13:37.654> time<00:13:37.799> with<00:13:37.960> my<00:13:38.057> friends<00:13:38.298> and<00:13:38.459> family.

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So<00:13:40.133> I<00:13:40.230> love<00:13:40.455> to<00:13:40.552> throw<00:13:40.729> a<00:13:40.793> dinner<00:13:41.115> party.

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I<00:13:41.823> love<00:13:42.016> to<00:13:42.226> cook.

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I<00:13:42.805> love<00:13:43.127> to<00:13:43.755> like<00:13:44.012> throw<00:13:44.173> a<00:13:44.334> large<00:13:44.737> party.

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I<00:13:46.359> do.

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I<00:13:46.617> just<00:13:46.858> really<00:13:47.100> like,<00:13:47.325> I<00:13:47.342> would<00:13:47.503> say<00:13:47.648> I'm<00:13:47.825> just<00:13:47.986> prioritizing<00:13:48.791> spending<00:13:50.032> time<00:13:50.225> with<00:13:50.322> my<00:13:50.483> friends<00:13:50.724> and<00:13:50.886> family<00:13:51.288> and<00:13:51.449> I<00:13:51.594> hope<00:13:51.788> to<00:13:52.641> be<00:13:53.866> rich<00:13:54.107> and<00:13:54.204> successful<00:13:54.835> so<00:13:55.066> I<00:13:55.165> can<00:13:55.280> bring<00:13:55.577> them<00:13:55.906> on<00:13:56.154> vacations<00:13:56.615> with<00:13:56.714> me<00:13:56.797> and<00:13:56.846> throw<00:13:56.978> these<00:13:57.060> big<00:13:59.360> lavish<00:13:59.712> parties<00:14:00.914> because<00:14:01.299> I<00:14:01.379> do<00:14:01.636> really<00:14:01.956> just<00:14:02.357> enjoy<00:14:04.056> spending<00:14:04.585> time<00:14:04.985> with<00:14:05.322> everyone<00:14:05.707> and<00:14:05.803> having<00:14:06.204> fun.

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Oh,<00:14:07.406> that's<00:14:07.646> incredible.

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Yeah.

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As<00:14:09.810> CEO,<00:14:10.227> like,<00:14:10.451> how<00:14:10.611> are<00:14:10.756> you<00:14:10.916> thinking<00:14:11.156> about<00:14:11.333> the<00:14:11.477> current<00:14:11.878> macroeconomic<00:14:12.711> environment,<00:14:13.336> the<00:14:13.496> various,<00:14:14.282> you<00:14:14.362> know,<00:14:14.618> trends<00:14:15.019> that<00:14:15.163> we're<00:14:15.260> seeing,<00:14:16.702> inflation,<00:14:17.167> all<00:14:17.263> that<00:14:17.407> type<00:14:17.584> of<00:14:17.648> stuff?

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And<00:14:17.984> I<00:14:18.000> know<00:14:18.065> that's<00:14:18.545> kind<00:14:18.706> of<00:14:18.738> like<00:14:18.866> a<00:14:18.946> broad<00:14:19.331> question,<00:14:19.748> but<00:14:19.892> is<00:14:19.972> that<00:14:20.132> affecting<00:14:20.629> your<00:14:20.950> business<00:14:21.655> at<00:14:21.751> all?

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And<00:14:22.953> what<00:14:23.274> are<00:14:23.354> you<00:14:23.514> thinking<00:14:23.835> as<00:14:23.979> you<00:14:24.155> look<00:14:24.396> to<00:14:24.540> 2025,<00:14:25.582> how,<00:14:26.063> you<00:14:26.095> know,<00:14:26.319> that<00:14:26.495> environment<00:14:27.024> might<00:14:27.185> change?

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Yeah,<00:14:28.344> so<00:14:29.135> I<00:14:29.312> will<00:14:31.184> say<00:14:31.410> that<00:14:31.555> I<00:14:31.797> wouldn't,<00:14:32.216> I<00:14:32.281> don't<00:14:32.442> think<00:14:32.555> it's<00:14:33.910> impacted<00:14:34.459> us<00:14:34.652> necessarily<00:14:35.281> because<00:14:35.604> something<00:14:36.007> that<00:14:36.394> we've<00:14:36.798> really<00:14:37.056> focused<00:14:37.443> on<00:14:37.540> doing<00:14:37.750> since<00:14:37.959> early<00:14:38.200> days<00:14:38.442> is<00:14:38.571> trying<00:14:38.748> to<00:14:38.893> build<00:14:39.070> a<00:14:39.151> very<00:14:39.392> agnostic<00:14:39.875> product.

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And<00:14:40.922> why<00:14:41.083> that<00:14:41.244> matters<00:14:41.953> is<00:14:42.050> when<00:14:42.211> I<00:14:42.372> think<00:14:42.597> back<00:14:42.839> to,<00:14:42.935> let's<00:14:43.096> say,<00:14:43.258> '22<00:14:44.063> to<00:14:45.335> '23,<00:14:45.834> tech<00:14:46.140> was<00:14:46.237> having<00:14:46.479> a<00:14:46.559> really<00:14:46.785> hard<00:14:46.930> time.

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So<00:14:48.649> you<00:14:48.747> could<00:14:48.828> imagine<00:14:49.298> like<00:14:49.558> employee<00:14:50.028> onboarding<00:14:50.677> is<00:14:50.840> going<00:14:51.099> down,<00:14:51.992> holiday<00:14:52.397> gifts,<00:14:52.868> the<00:14:52.949> spend<00:14:53.273> isn't<00:14:53.776> as<00:14:53.955> much.

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Right?

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Like<00:14:54.982> in<00:14:55.062> 2021,<00:14:55.927> we<00:14:56.023> did,<00:14:56.488> companies<00:14:56.808> had<00:14:57.385> budgets<00:14:57.706> for<00:14:57.850> their<00:14:58.010> holiday<00:14:58.411> gifts<00:14:58.651> that<00:14:58.747> were<00:14:58.827> just<00:14:59.468> insane.

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Like<00:15:00.189> we<00:15:00.333> were<00:15:00.429> building<00:15:00.830> very<00:15:01.150> cool<00:15:01.390> boxes<00:15:02.255> that<00:15:02.592> went<00:15:02.752> away<00:15:03.393> over<00:15:03.569> the<00:15:03.713> last<00:15:03.954> few<00:15:04.114> years.

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And<00:15:04.835> you<00:15:04.931> know,<00:15:05.075> for<00:15:05.219> us<00:15:05.395> that<00:15:05.540> meant,<00:15:05.796> okay,<00:15:06.116> fine,<00:15:06.437> we're<00:15:06.517> gonna<00:15:06.677> focus<00:15:07.062> on<00:15:07.142> like<00:15:07.318> accounting<00:15:07.718> firms<00:15:08.279> and<00:15:08.439> legal<00:15:08.680> firms<00:15:09.385> and<00:15:10.826> other<00:15:11.227> agencies<00:15:11.804> that<00:15:11.900> are<00:15:11.980> not<00:15:12.316> getting<00:15:13.069> as<00:15:13.245> hit<00:15:14.127> by<00:15:14.447> this<00:15:15.488> change<00:15:16.369> in<00:15:16.514> the<00:15:16.850> economy.

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So<00:15:18.132> I<00:15:18.212> would<00:15:18.356> say<00:15:18.596> that's<00:15:18.789> something<00:15:19.157> that<00:15:19.237> we're<00:15:19.397> constantly<00:15:19.894> looking<00:15:20.278> at<00:15:20.455> is<00:15:20.599> like<00:15:20.855> what<00:15:21.079> sectors<00:15:21.560> are<00:15:21.656> doing<00:15:21.977> well<00:15:22.217> and<00:15:22.361> how<00:15:22.457> do<00:15:22.601> we<00:15:22.698> ensure<00:15:22.954> that<00:15:23.098> we<00:15:23.258> can<00:15:23.675> service<00:15:24.043> that<00:15:24.364> as<00:15:24.476> a<00:15:24.540> way<00:15:24.700> to<00:15:24.780> stay<00:15:25.021> resilient.

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When<00:15:26.608> particular<00:15:27.105> ones<00:15:27.586> are<00:15:27.650> getting<00:15:27.891> hit<00:15:28.693> on<00:15:28.789> a<00:15:28.870> like<00:15:29.335> larger<00:15:30.137> macro<00:15:30.458> level<00:15:30.698> of<00:15:30.875> inflation.

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Um,<00:15:32.816> I<00:15:32.960> mean,<00:15:33.105> that's<00:15:33.361> tough,<00:15:33.923> but<00:15:34.003> people<00:15:34.228> are<00:15:34.324> still<00:15:34.549> spending.

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So,<00:15:37.356> um,<00:15:38.238> you<00:15:38.270> know,<00:15:38.431> it's,<00:15:38.960> it's,<00:15:39.281> you<00:15:39.377> know,<00:15:39.522> it's<00:15:39.618> hard.

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It's,<00:15:40.340> uh,<00:15:40.645> you<00:15:41.222> hopefully<00:15:41.623> they<00:15:41.768> continue<00:15:42.185> to<00:15:42.281> do<00:15:42.570> when<00:15:42.730> we,<00:15:43.211> when<00:15:43.308> the<00:15:43.388> reports<00:15:43.853> come<00:15:44.014> out<00:15:44.190> and<00:15:44.270> all<00:15:44.366> of<00:15:44.415> a<00:15:44.431> sudden<00:15:44.751> the<00:15:44.832> stocks,<00:15:45.778> uh,<00:15:46.115> will<00:15:46.340> drop<00:15:46.741> and<00:15:46.837> things<00:15:47.062> get<00:15:47.158> a<00:15:47.174> little<00:15:47.398> bearish.

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It<00:15:47.864> makes<00:15:48.120> me<00:15:48.217> nervous,<00:15:48.682> but<00:15:48.842> then<00:15:49.003> they<00:15:49.147> keep<00:15:49.324> going<00:15:49.548> back<00:15:49.789> up<00:15:50.286> and<00:15:50.430> people,<00:15:51.152> they're<00:15:51.313> continuing.

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To<00:15:52.516> spend,<00:15:52.934> it's<00:15:53.079> a<00:15:53.159> lot<00:15:53.577> easier<00:15:53.898> to<00:15:54.059> spend<00:15:54.926> a<00:15:55.006> corporate<00:15:55.408> card<00:15:57.979> than<00:15:58.075> your<00:15:58.155> personal<00:15:58.541> card<00:15:58.959> as<00:15:59.055> well.

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For<00:15:59.344> sure.

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For<00:16:00.099> sure.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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That<00:16:01.851> makes<00:16:02.092> all<00:16:02.270> the<00:16:02.366> sense<00:16:02.593> in<00:16:02.657> the<00:16:02.738> world.

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Finally,<00:16:03.869> we<00:16:04.031> end<00:16:04.257> every<00:16:04.418> interview<00:16:04.742> with<00:16:04.903> this<00:16:05.081> question.

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We<00:16:05.727> believe<00:16:06.050> at<00:16:06.131> CEO.com<00:16:07.004> that<00:16:07.100> the<00:16:07.181> chances<00:16:07.585> one<00:16:07.892> gives<00:16:08.312> is<00:16:08.393> just<00:16:08.603> as<00:16:08.700> important<00:16:09.039> as<00:16:09.136> the<00:16:09.265> chances<00:16:09.686> one<00:16:09.912> takes.

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When<00:16:11.237> you<00:16:11.464> hear<00:16:11.642> that,<00:16:11.950> who<00:16:12.128> gave<00:16:12.354> you<00:16:12.468> a<00:16:12.532> chance<00:16:12.921> to<00:16:13.018> get<00:16:13.180> you<00:16:13.261> to<00:16:13.342> where<00:16:13.568> you<00:16:13.746> are<00:16:13.908> today?

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Yeah,<00:16:15.916> I<00:16:16.013> would<00:16:16.191> say<00:16:16.725> I've<00:16:16.903> been<00:16:17.243> super<00:16:18.020> fortunate<00:16:18.603> with<00:16:19.153> a<00:16:19.250> lot<00:16:19.380> of<00:16:19.478> great<00:16:20.641> leadership<00:16:21.297> and<00:16:21.379> managers.

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Along<00:16:22.813> the<00:16:22.958> way,<00:16:23.198> particularly<00:16:24.723> at<00:16:24.819> my<00:16:24.915> stint<00:16:26.006> at<00:16:26.424> Dropbox.

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So<00:16:27.627> one<00:16:27.948> person<00:16:28.189> I'd<00:16:28.349> call<00:16:28.574> out,<00:16:28.831> Kate<00:16:28.991> Taylor,<00:16:30.259> she's<00:16:30.419> now<00:16:30.580> global<00:16:30.820> head<00:16:30.900> of<00:16:30.997> recruiting<00:16:31.398> over<00:16:31.542> at<00:16:31.655> Notion,<00:16:33.067> really<00:16:33.243> was<00:16:33.388> like<00:16:33.548> one<00:16:33.660> of<00:16:33.709> my<00:16:33.885> first,<00:16:34.206> like,<00:16:34.848> great<00:16:35.153> leaders<00:16:35.634> who,<00:16:35.795> like,<00:16:36.035> gave<00:16:36.148> me<00:16:36.292> that<00:16:36.452> chance<00:16:36.773> in<00:16:36.918> joining<00:16:37.239> Dropbox.

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From<00:16:37.897> there,<00:16:38.121> I<00:16:38.153> moved<00:16:38.442> over<00:16:38.683> and<00:16:38.763> was<00:16:38.859> under<00:16:39.036> Yamini<00:16:39.581> for<00:16:39.726> a<00:16:39.806> while,<00:16:40.047> who's<00:16:40.175> now<00:16:40.304> the<00:16:40.384> CEO<00:16:41.651> of<00:16:41.732> HubSpot.

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And<00:16:43.914> having<00:16:44.235> that<00:16:44.395> opportunity,<00:16:45.101> I<00:16:45.117> think<00:16:45.342> particularly<00:16:45.839> to<00:16:45.984> work<00:16:46.160> under<00:16:46.465> very<00:16:46.722> strong<00:16:47.749> female<00:16:48.182> leaders,<00:16:49.514> not<00:16:49.915> only<00:16:50.172> showed<00:16:50.397> me<00:16:50.557> like,<00:16:50.798> okay,<00:16:51.054> where<00:16:51.279> can<00:16:51.440> I<00:16:51.616> go?

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Because<00:16:52.097> I<00:16:52.258> think<00:16:52.418> that<00:16:52.659> also<00:16:52.900> becomes<00:16:54.006> really<00:16:54.247> important,<00:16:55.225> especially<00:16:55.625> when<00:16:55.770> you're<00:16:55.946> younger,<00:16:56.363> is<00:16:56.507> to<00:16:56.603> see<00:16:56.828> yourself<00:16:58.094> or<00:16:58.270> to<00:16:58.351> see<00:16:58.575> other<00:16:58.751> people<00:16:59.136> in<00:16:59.216> places<00:16:59.617> that<00:16:59.713> you<00:16:59.873> want<00:17:00.018> to<00:17:00.178> be.

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But<00:17:01.220> I<00:17:01.316> then<00:17:01.701> think<00:17:01.957> particularly<00:17:02.502> what<00:17:02.663> was<00:17:02.759> so<00:17:02.983> awesome<00:17:03.256> about<00:17:03.544> working<00:17:03.881> under<00:17:04.057> them<00:17:05.003> is<00:17:05.147> that<00:17:05.404> they<00:17:05.564> created<00:17:05.869> space<00:17:06.189> and<00:17:06.269> opportunity<00:17:07.007> for<00:17:07.151> people<00:17:07.360> to<00:17:07.408> stretch<00:17:08.369> into<00:17:08.610> roles<00:17:09.796> and<00:17:09.892> learn.

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So<00:17:11.239> I'd<00:17:11.736> give<00:17:11.880> a<00:17:12.217> shout<00:17:12.521> out<00:17:12.617> to<00:17:12.714> those<00:17:12.938> two.

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That's<00:17:14.301> incredible.

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Yeah.

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Thank<00:17:15.888> you<00:17:15.984> so<00:17:16.144> much<00:17:16.449> for<00:17:16.529> coming<00:17:16.769> on.

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Seriously,<00:17:17.266> I<00:17:17.346> love<00:17:17.507> what<00:17:17.651> you're<00:17:17.747> doing.

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Everybody<00:17:18.372> check<00:17:18.565> it<00:17:18.613> out,<00:17:18.773> it's<00:17:18.933> ongoody.com.

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I<00:17:20.232> think<00:17:20.392> it's<00:17:20.488> incredible.

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Yeah,<00:17:21.691> I<00:17:21.739> think<00:17:21.835> it's<00:17:21.995> very,<00:17:22.460> um,<00:17:22.781> interesting<00:17:23.502> way<00:17:23.839> for<00:17:24.159> companies<00:17:24.784> and<00:17:24.881> leaders<00:17:25.217> to<00:17:25.410> love<00:17:25.507> to<00:17:25.589> each<00:17:25.768> other.

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It's<00:17:26.062> awesome.

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Thank<00:17:26.306> you.

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Yeah,<00:17:27.073> absolutely.

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Thank<00:17:27.807> you,<00:17:27.954> Clint.

```