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# Rally Co-Founder Rob Petrozzo
- URL: https://www.ceo.com/episodes/rally-co-founder-rob-petrozzo/
- Published: 2024-07-30T12:00:03.000Z
- Updated: 2026-08-29T23:49:59.000Z
- Description: Rally's co-founder on Barrett-Jackson, 400 rejections, and why the worst thing you can do in a transactional app turned out to be the right thing.
- Author: Clint Betts

# Six clicks from the buy button

Every January, about a hundred thousand people go to Scottsdale, Arizona, to watch cars sell at Barrett-Jackson. Rob Petrozzo went a few times in the years before he started Rally, and what he remembers is where everyone stood. The crowd was behind a rope. Four or five people were bidding.

"We know this stuff probably better than some of these owners," he told the CEO.com Podcast, recalling the thought he had in that room. "We have no access to it. There's no way to get the museum-quality stuff. There's no way to add it to a portfolio. The regular investor is stuck buying whatever's left over."

He and his co-founders, Chris Bruno, a friend from high school, and Bruno's college roommate [Maximilian Niederste-Ostholt](https://www.crainsnewyork.com/technology/investing-platform-rally-trades-digital-shares-opens-soho-museum?ref=ceo.com), were all collectors of one thing or another. For Petrozzo it was art and sneakers. Bruno was cars. Max was baseball cards. In every category, the best pieces belonged to someone with a storage locker, and by the time anything reached a person like Petrozzo, it had passed through five or six middlemen. They started talking about the problem in 2014\. Crowdfunding was new. Robinhood had a waitlist. Coinbase had just started to matter. The 2012 JOBS Act had told the SEC to let ordinary people into private investments, and in 2015 the Commission [adopted Regulation A+](https://www.sec.gov/newsroom/press-releases/2015-49?ref=ceo.com), which allowed companies to sell securities to the public without a full registration. Petrozzo and his friends did not have a million dollars in net worth, which was what it took to be called sophisticated. "We didn't have the money," he said, "but we had the knowledge base."

They sat down with lawyers and confirmed that a single collectible could be turned into a company and sold in shares. That is what [Rally](https://rallyrd.com/?ref=ceo.com) does. It buys an asset, files it with the SEC, opens an offering in its app, and after about 90 days lets investors trade the shares through a broker-dealer. The company says it has listed [more than 450 items across 25 categories](https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20230615654573/en/Collectibles-Platform-Rally-Unveils-First-Museum-Where-Visitors-Can-Own-Everything-Inside?ref=ceo.com), and shares have typically sold for [under $50](https://techcrunch.com/2020/09/29/rally-raises-17m-to-expand-a-platform-that-lets-you-invest-in-but-not-buy-collectibles?ref=ceo.com).

Petrozzo is the Chief Product Officer, which in his case means he designed the thing. He came up as a graphic designer, drawing fonts by hand and doing package design in the early 2000s, and he has never fully trusted the process Ivy League product people follow: wireframes, discovery interviews, and A/B tests. He skips steps. He goes straight to pixel-perfect. When he sketched Rally's first product page, he was thinking about two apps. One was StockTwits, whose founder became Rally's first investor. The other was Maple, David Chang's food delivery app in New York, which sold five or six dishes a night and told you where every ingredient came from. Rally borrowed the timeline from one, and the storytelling from the other, and then Petrozzo made a decision that any growth marketer would call malpractice. He hid the buy button. It sits six clicks from the front page, behind a button that says explore.

"Finance, in general, is a zero-sum game," he said. "It's always about making as much money as possible and getting out. And we knew that wasn't going to exist. That was a race to the bottom for us." Robinhood had made investing frictionless, and to Petrozzo it had also made investing empty. He wanted people to read about a car for a while, look at the provenance, argue with themselves, and buy at the end because they had already decided. He thinks it worked because the people who get that deep tend to convert.

The same logic applied to raising money. The founders started pitching in 2015, cold, over email and Twitter DMs, with a deck Petrozzo describes as pretty and thin. He counts around 400 rejections. One came from a well-known tech billionaire whose business manager cut in on the email thread, said no, and told the founders that if they wanted to understand why, they should read chapter six of his book. He included the Amazon link.

Petrozzo did not buy the book. He still opens the email every five or six months, usually when things are bad.

What changed the pitch was a demo. It was, in his words, mostly a puppet show, a front end that only pretended to have a back end, but it let a person hold a phone, flip through a few cars, and buy in about 10 clicks. Investors who had passed on the idea started making introductions after they touched it. "Everybody is receptive to emotion," he said. "Whether a sophisticated investor or a VC, they're always going to say, 'Take the emotion out of investing.' They're lying."

The money eventually came. Rally [raised $17 million](https://techcrunch.com/2020/09/29/rally-raises-17m-to-expand-a-platform-that-lets-you-invest-in-but-not-buy-collectibles?ref=ceo.com) in 2020 with about 200,000 users and 120 completed offerings, bringing its total to $27 million from backers including Porsche Ventures, Jim Pallotta's Raptor Group, and Alexis Ohanian. The same announcement named George Leimer, who had worked at Disney, ESPN, Apple, and eBay, as CEO. Bruno became president. A [$30 million Series B led by Accel](https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20210517005143/en/Rally-Raises-%2430-Million-Series-B-Led-by-Accel-To-Make-Everything-in-the-World-a-Tradable-Asset?ref=ceo.com) followed in May 2021\. Petrozzo said Major League Baseball came into that round, along with players from the NBA and MLB, and sports has since become Rally's biggest category. In June 2023, the company opened a [3,000-square-foot museum](https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20230615654573/en/Collectibles-Platform-Rally-Unveils-First-Museum-Where-Visitors-Can-Own-Everything-Inside?ref=ceo.com) on the ground floor of its headquarters at 446 Broadway in SoHo, laid out as a walk-through history that begins with dinosaur fossils and classic cars and moves on to sports memorabilia and comic books. The opening collection included a 1955 Porsche Speedster, a Triceratops skull, a Warhol Marilyn screenprint, and the Honus Wagner T206 card. A [coffee shop](https://newsletter.rallyrd.com/p/shiny-thing-0131?ref=ceo.com) opened up front the following spring. Petrozzo was sitting in the building when he recorded the CEO.com Podcast.

He wants that room inside a stadium. He watched sports betting go from a vice to a league partner in a few years and took it as a signal. "Every fan is a speculator in some capacity," he said. His version is a corner of Yankee Stadium near Monument Park where you can buy shares in a piece of team history before the first pitch. He has started the conversations with leagues. Nothing is signed.

Whether any of this makes investors money is a fair question. An independent [analysis of Rally's SEC filings](https://altstreet.investments/platforms/reviews/rallyrd?ref=ceo.com) counted 111 completed exits with a median return of 1.20 times the original investment, and about one in six lost money. Petrozzo has never pitched Rally as a way to get rich. The pitch is that you own a share of a thing you care about and can say so.

He is candid about what he would do differently. Rally went to venture capital immediately. "There are a lot of different ways to get the money," he said, when asked what he wishes he had known. He has watched other founders bootstrap to $20 or $30 million in revenue while keeping all of it, and he thinks that is a bigger accomplishment than the venture world admits. His own habit is to argue with anyone who tells him what to do, except the people who have just given him $15 million. "The conversation starts, and their opinion is right," he said. In hindsight, he would have skipped a round or two and dug in through a few of the rough patches.

He is also candid about himself. He wakes up and spends the first 30 or 40 minutes of the day going through every regret in his life, then gets to work. He has been fired more than once and says the last two felt like relief. After one of them, in 2012 or 2013, his father told him something he now repeats to young designers: whether you're right or wrong, if you're an asshole, you're wrong. He says he still violates it about once a week, down from once a day.

He rides Citi Bikes everywhere and has mostly stopped taking Ubers. He keeps a MoMA Store timer on his desk set to 20 or 30 minutes. He opens Photoshop every day and expects to be one of the last people alive using it. On the day of the interview, he had left the house without a watch and said he felt naked. He has been rereading Goosebumps because the office bought all 63 books for the museum, about $1,200 for the set, and because he is trying to understand why the 18-year-olds walking around SoHo are dressed the way he dressed in 2005\. He thinks the late 1990s and early 2000s are the window that matters right now for anyone selling nostalgia, and that if you do not study it, you will not see what comes next. He is also wary of it. Nostalgia, he said, can be toxic when it lets you build a memory of 1997 that never happened and then spend your life chasing it.

The CEO.com Podcast ends every episode with the same question, on the premise that the chances one gives matter as much as the chances one takes. Petrozzo named two people. The first is John Monopoly, now Kanye West's manager, who in the early 2000s saw something Petrozzo had designed sitting at a print shop in Queens, asked the owner who made it, and called him in to work on what became G.O.O.D. Music. Petrozzo had no portfolio, just a box of loose printouts. Monopoly gave him a budget and a tour to design and told him to do whatever he wanted. The second is John Lima, who ran [ScrollMotion](https://www.outlieracademy.com/episode/27?ref=ceo.com), a company building digital editions for Vogue and Esquire. Lima was not a designer and did not care that Petrozzo had never designed for a screen.

"That was literally the first time I even heard the term product designer," Petrozzo said. "When, in my mind, I was a graphic designer."

```chapters
00:00:00 Introduction
00:00:21 What Is Rally
00:00:43 Financial System Insights
00:01:57 Early Fundraising Efforts
00:04:58 Building the Product
00:09:01 AI Integration
00:15:20 Daily Routine
00:18:10 Building Relationships With Leagues
00:21:10 Lessons Learned
00:23:05 Reading Recommendations
00:25:08 Power of Nostalgia
00:26:37 Essential Tools and Apps
00:28:39 Role of New York City
00:31:14 Advice for Entrepreneurs
00:34:32 Mental Health and Staying Grounded
```

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And<00:02:27.402> it<00:02:27.498> allowed<00:02:28.348> what<00:02:28.461> you<00:02:28.605> would<00:02:28.846> consider<00:02:29.166> regular<00:02:29.551> people,<00:02:30.033> everyday<00:02:30.434> people,<00:02:30.690> to<00:02:30.851> invest<00:02:31.957> in<00:02:32.054> what<00:02:32.230> the<00:02:32.374> government<00:02:32.775> at<00:02:32.855> that<00:02:33.016> point<00:02:33.401> deemed<00:02:33.722> riskier<00:02:34.139> assets.

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So<00:02:34.700> those<00:02:34.876> are<00:02:34.925> like<00:02:35.085> private<00:02:35.342> companies<00:02:36.208> and,<00:02:36.464> you<00:02:36.529> know,<00:02:36.625> crowdfunding<00:02:37.106> campaigns.

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And<00:02:38.549> before<00:02:38.886> that,<00:02:39.111> you<00:02:39.191> needed<00:02:39.416> to<00:02:39.496> be<00:02:39.576> an<00:02:39.608> accredited<00:02:40.073> investor.

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You<00:02:40.458> need<00:02:40.587> to<00:02:40.651> have,<00:02:40.939> you<00:02:41.036> know,<00:02:41.164> $1<00:02:41.276> million<00:02:41.757> in<00:02:41.838> net<00:02:42.062> worth<00:02:42.624> or<00:02:42.784> have<00:02:42.944> made<00:02:43.217> a<00:02:43.281> couple<00:02:43.506> hundred<00:02:43.682> thousand<00:02:43.987> dollars<00:02:44.260> a<00:02:44.388> year<00:02:44.644> over<00:02:44.805> the<00:02:44.885> course<00:02:45.190> of<00:02:45.350> years<00:02:45.559> to<00:02:45.751> kind<00:02:45.944> of<00:02:46.088> prove<00:02:46.505> to<00:02:46.633> the<00:02:46.730> government<00:02:47.211> that<00:02:47.692> you<00:02:47.837> were<00:02:47.917> a<00:02:47.949> sophisticated<00:02:48.720> investor.

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But<00:02:49.860> for<00:02:50.085> us,<00:02:50.261> we<00:02:50.406> always<00:02:50.566> looked<00:02:50.727> at<00:02:50.759> ourselves<00:02:51.369> as<00:02:51.931> potential<00:02:52.413> sophisticated<00:02:52.975> investors.

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We<00:02:53.488> didn't<00:02:53.617> have<00:02:53.777> the<00:02:53.826> money,<00:02:54.580> but<00:02:54.661> we<00:02:54.741> had<00:02:54.901> the<00:02:54.933> knowledge<00:02:55.319> base.

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And<00:02:55.865> I<00:02:55.881> think<00:02:56.041> that<00:02:56.266> that<00:02:56.379> was<00:02:56.539> the<00:02:56.684> big<00:02:56.908> unlock<00:02:57.310> for<00:02:57.470> us,<00:02:57.711> was<00:02:57.872> that<00:02:58.594> Robinhood<00:02:59.028> at<00:02:59.092> that<00:02:59.269> point<00:02:59.574> was<00:02:59.670> starting<00:02:59.879> to<00:02:59.959> gain<00:03:00.120> some<00:03:00.280> traction.

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It<00:03:00.842> had<00:03:01.003> the,<00:03:01.340> the,<00:03:01.645> um,<00:03:01.902> the<00:03:02.143> early<00:03:02.705> kind<00:03:02.929> of<00:03:03.026> waitlist<00:03:03.507> version<00:03:03.764> of<00:03:03.893> Robinhood<00:03:04.390> that<00:03:04.471> became<00:03:04.872> the<00:03:05.017> real<00:03:05.177> platform.

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Coinbase<00:03:06.799> was<00:03:06.976> new,<00:03:07.602> but<00:03:07.746> in<00:03:07.778> 2015,<00:03:08.485> people<00:03:08.645> were<00:03:08.677> starting<00:03:08.886> to<00:03:08.950> pay<00:03:08.983> more<00:03:09.191> attention<00:03:09.480> to<00:03:09.593> crypto.

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You<00:03:10.717> had<00:03:10.877> all<00:03:10.973> these<00:03:11.198> mobile-first<00:03:11.841> platforms<00:03:12.354> that<00:03:12.483> were<00:03:12.579> coming<00:03:12.884> out.

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And<00:03:13.462> they<00:03:13.606> were<00:03:13.702> engaging<00:03:14.263> millions<00:03:14.664> of<00:03:14.744> people<00:03:15.129> really<00:03:15.450> quickly<00:03:15.867> because<00:03:16.171> there<00:03:16.251> was<00:03:16.668> this<00:03:16.828> democratization<00:03:17.566> of<00:03:17.630> finance<00:03:18.095> that<00:03:18.175> was<00:03:18.271> happening<00:03:18.608> all<00:03:18.688> around<00:03:19.073> us.

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The<00:03:20.099> last<00:03:20.516> kind<00:03:20.756> of<00:03:20.836> category<00:03:21.397> that<00:03:21.558> was<00:03:21.862> left<00:03:22.504> was<00:03:22.760> collectibles<00:03:23.417> and<00:03:23.530> alternative<00:03:24.026> assets.

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And<00:03:24.924> that<00:03:25.085> was<00:03:25.165> something<00:03:25.405> that<00:03:25.565> we<00:03:25.710> had<00:03:25.822> a<00:03:25.966> very,<00:03:26.207> very<00:03:26.672> unique<00:03:27.088> view<00:03:27.313> on<00:03:27.650> individually.

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All<00:03:28.611> of<00:03:28.692> us<00:03:28.836> were<00:03:28.932> collectors<00:03:29.413> in<00:03:29.493> some<00:03:29.653> capacity,<00:03:30.760> but<00:03:31.096> you<00:03:31.192> never<00:03:31.385> had<00:03:31.561> access<00:03:31.754> to<00:03:31.834> the<00:03:31.962> best<00:03:32.170> stuff.

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So<00:03:32.523> we<00:03:32.603> would<00:03:32.683> go<00:03:32.796> to<00:03:32.860> like<00:03:33.645> auctions<00:03:34.286> and<00:03:34.447> go<00:03:34.543> to<00:03:34.623> like<00:03:35.024> Barrett-Jackson<00:03:35.585> at<00:03:35.681> this<00:03:35.825> big<00:03:35.970> car<00:03:36.290> auction<00:03:36.627> in<00:03:36.787> Arizona.

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We<00:03:37.509> pop<00:03:37.813> in<00:03:37.910> there<00:03:38.390> and<00:03:38.471> kind<00:03:38.631> of<00:03:39.096> get<00:03:39.192> a<00:03:39.208> feel<00:03:39.432> for<00:03:39.513> the<00:03:39.657> room,<00:03:40.314> you<00:03:40.458> had,<00:03:40.795> you<00:03:40.875> know,<00:03:41.019> 100,000<00:03:42.077> people<00:03:42.382> would<00:03:42.430> show<00:03:42.542> up<00:03:42.718> at<00:03:42.863> these<00:03:43.039> events.

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They're<00:03:43.824> all<00:03:43.920> behind<00:03:44.241> a<00:03:44.257> velvet<00:03:44.706> rope<00:03:45.363> and<00:03:45.427> you<00:03:45.459> have<00:03:45.603> 4<00:03:45.748> or<00:03:45.988> 5<00:03:46.229> people<00:03:46.485> bidding<00:03:46.725> on<00:03:46.806> individual<00:03:47.286> items.

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There's<00:03:55.782> no<00:03:55.942> way<00:03:56.038> to<00:03:56.182> get<00:03:56.407> the<00:03:56.487> museum<00:03:56.904> quality<00:03:57.304> stuff.

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There's<00:03:57.785> no<00:03:57.881> way<00:03:58.010> to<00:03:58.170> add<00:03:58.202> it<00:03:58.330> to<00:03:58.426> a<00:03:58.587> portfolio.

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The<00:03:59.933> regular<00:04:00.350> investor<00:04:00.831> is<00:04:00.863> stuck<00:04:01.231> buying<00:04:01.696> whatever's<00:04:02.113> left<00:04:02.417> over.

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I'm<00:04:11.755> not<00:04:11.979> getting<00:04:12.204> that<00:04:12.381> from<00:04:12.782> the<00:04:12.927> source.

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I'm<00:04:13.489> cutting<00:04:13.730> through<00:04:13.826> 5,<00:04:14.067> 6,<00:04:14.388> 7<00:04:14.565> different<00:04:14.773> middlemen<00:04:15.030> before<00:04:15.271> I<00:04:15.351> get<00:04:15.512> there.

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And<00:04:16.219> whatever's<00:04:16.475> left<00:04:16.716> is<00:04:16.797> mine.

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So<00:04:17.856> now<00:04:18.081> that<00:04:18.178> we<00:04:18.242> had<00:04:18.386> the<00:04:18.467> JOBS<00:04:18.788> Act<00:04:18.900> in<00:04:19.029> place<00:04:19.366> and<00:04:19.462> you<00:04:19.542> had<00:04:19.751> non-accredited<00:04:20.409> investors<00:04:20.827> can<00:04:20.923> make<00:04:21.196> investments,<00:04:21.935> you<00:04:21.999> had<00:04:22.160> the<00:04:22.240> structure<00:04:22.818> to<00:04:22.914> kind<00:04:23.075> of<00:04:23.139> turn<00:04:23.525> things<00:04:24.006> into<00:04:24.199> companies,<00:04:24.745> which<00:04:24.889> we<00:04:24.970> sat<00:04:25.227> down,<00:04:25.484> talked<00:04:25.708> to<00:04:25.853> lawyers<00:04:26.190> about,<00:04:26.495> realized<00:04:26.816> it<00:04:26.848> was<00:04:26.993> possible.

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And<00:04:28.021> we<00:04:28.101> had<00:04:28.197> this<00:04:28.342> domain<00:04:28.663> expertise<00:04:29.096> ourselves<00:04:29.562> in<00:04:29.594> these<00:04:29.803> individual<00:04:30.188> asset<00:04:30.429> classes.

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It<00:04:31.312> was<00:04:31.377> like,<00:04:31.489> all<00:04:31.521> right,<00:04:31.650> we<00:04:31.730> could<00:04:32.051> maybe<00:04:32.372> make<00:04:32.533> this<00:04:32.693> a<00:04:32.774> business.

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Building<00:04:36.047> the<00:04:36.208> demo<00:04:36.528> out,<00:04:36.785> and<00:04:36.929> all<00:04:37.009> of<00:04:37.089> a<00:04:37.121> sudden<00:04:37.362> you<00:04:37.426> look<00:04:37.586> down,<00:04:37.826> you're<00:04:37.923> like,<00:04:38.772> damn,<00:04:38.948> dude,<00:04:39.109> we<00:04:39.173> have<00:04:39.285> a—<00:04:39.445> I<00:04:39.509> think<00:04:39.621> we<00:04:39.653> have<00:04:39.750> a<00:04:39.830> business<00:04:40.150> here.

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And<00:04:40.615> that<00:04:40.775> kind<00:04:40.952> of<00:04:41.096> led<00:04:41.272> to<00:04:41.577> a<00:04:41.609> lot<00:04:41.769> of<00:04:41.913> better<00:04:42.154> conversations<00:04:42.715> with<00:04:42.859> potential<00:04:43.179> investors<00:04:43.676> and<00:04:43.756> VCs<00:04:44.398> and<00:04:44.702> early<00:04:44.959> users.

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And<00:04:46.225> then,<00:04:46.481> you<00:04:46.561> know,<00:04:47.667> as<00:04:47.843> life<00:04:48.084> often<00:04:48.324> does,<00:04:48.645> 7<00:04:48.885> years<00:04:49.126> pass<00:04:49.446> and<00:04:49.510> now<00:04:49.671> it's<00:04:49.831> something<00:04:50.007> that's<00:04:50.183> a<00:04:50.199> little<00:04:50.328> bit<00:04:50.488> bigger<00:04:50.648> than<00:04:50.728> we<00:04:50.873> expected,<00:04:51.369> but<00:04:51.594> also<00:04:51.850> something<00:04:52.155> that<00:04:52.251> definitely<00:04:52.475> is<00:04:52.588> super<00:04:52.956> rewarding<00:04:53.309> to<00:04:53.453> be<00:04:53.533> able<00:04:53.661> to<00:04:53.693> sort<00:04:53.854> of<00:04:54.030> see<00:04:54.399> where<00:04:54.495> it<00:04:54.575> came<00:04:54.799> from,<00:04:54.976> having<00:04:55.216> built<00:04:55.456> that<00:04:55.681> from<00:04:55.777> that<00:04:56.001> one<00:04:56.162> concept<00:04:56.562> 7,<00:04:56.835> 8<00:04:56.979> years<00:04:57.155> ago.

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Yeah,<00:04:58.229> it's<00:04:58.325> huge.

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It's<00:04:58.806> an<00:04:58.838> incredible<00:04:59.463> product<00:04:59.960> you've<00:05:00.169> built<00:05:00.345> too,<00:05:00.489> which<00:05:00.665> I<00:05:00.746> want<00:05:00.906> to<00:05:01.018> talk<00:05:01.162> about<00:05:01.403> here<00:05:01.531> in<00:05:01.611> a<00:05:01.627> second.

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But<00:05:02.428> at<00:05:02.573> the<00:05:02.653> beginning,<00:05:03.053> when<00:05:03.214> you<00:05:03.614> are<00:05:05.393> thinking<00:05:05.714> about<00:05:06.178> raising<00:05:06.595> money,<00:05:06.915> talking<00:05:07.380> to<00:05:07.476> investors,<00:05:08.037> talking<00:05:08.438> to<00:05:08.518> venture<00:05:08.758> capitalists,<00:05:09.159> all<00:05:09.223> this<00:05:09.335> type<00:05:09.495> of<00:05:09.559> stuff.

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What<00:05:10.264> was<00:05:10.360> that<00:05:10.521> process<00:05:11.065> like?

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What<00:05:11.402> did<00:05:11.482> you<00:05:11.722> learn<00:05:11.963> from<00:05:12.203> it?

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What<00:05:12.684> advice<00:05:13.068> would<00:05:13.164> you<00:05:13.228> have<00:05:13.405> for<00:05:13.565> people<00:05:13.805> who<00:05:13.885> are<00:05:14.030> going<00:05:14.366> through<00:05:14.526> that?

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Yeah,<00:05:15.712> I<00:05:15.728> mean,<00:05:15.888> listen,<00:05:16.129> everybody<00:05:16.433> tells<00:05:16.625> a<00:05:16.673> story<00:05:16.914> of<00:05:17.010> like<00:05:17.154> how<00:05:17.186> many<00:05:17.394> doors<00:05:17.715> closed<00:05:18.051> and<00:05:18.116> how<00:05:18.148> many<00:05:18.292> nos<00:05:18.548> you<00:05:18.612> got<00:05:18.772> along<00:05:19.013> the<00:05:19.093> way.

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We<00:05:19.558> got,<00:05:20.118> you<00:05:20.150> know,<00:05:20.295> 400<00:05:20.855> nos<00:05:21.112> or<00:05:21.176> whatever<00:05:21.416> it<00:05:21.496> was<00:05:21.673> early<00:05:21.961> on.

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I<00:05:22.298> think<00:05:22.442> there<00:05:22.538> were<00:05:22.618> two<00:05:22.858> parts<00:05:23.163> of<00:05:23.259> it.

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This<00:05:24.060> is<00:05:24.140> in<00:05:24.284> 2015,<00:05:25.102> 2016.

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We<00:05:25.823> first<00:05:26.063> started<00:05:26.303> to<00:05:26.383> raise<00:05:26.624> money<00:05:27.425> and<00:05:27.505> we<00:05:27.649> were<00:05:27.729> like<00:05:28.306> going<00:05:28.611> in<00:05:28.787> very<00:05:29.091> cold,<00:05:29.428> finding<00:05:29.732> people's<00:05:30.053> emails,<00:05:30.630> DMing<00:05:30.950> people<00:05:31.254> on<00:05:31.351> Twitter.

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Luckily,<00:05:33.196> VC<00:05:33.661> in<00:05:33.758> general,<00:05:34.063> I'll<00:05:34.416> say<00:05:34.641> for<00:05:34.785> all<00:05:34.866> the<00:05:34.962> bad<00:05:35.203> things<00:05:35.347> that<00:05:35.444> people<00:05:35.588> will<00:05:35.684> say<00:05:35.909> about<00:05:36.006> venture<00:05:36.246> capitalists<00:05:37.210> and<00:05:37.290> the<00:05:37.434> greed<00:05:37.675> element<00:05:38.077> and<00:05:38.173> they're<00:05:38.269> not<00:05:38.494> really<00:05:38.719> your<00:05:38.799> friends<00:05:39.217> and<00:05:39.297> all<00:05:39.377> the<00:05:39.457> things<00:05:39.618> that<00:05:39.698> are<00:05:39.763> probably<00:05:40.019> true<00:05:40.324> for<00:05:40.405> the<00:05:40.469> most<00:05:40.726> part,<00:05:41.625> they're<00:05:41.930> very,<00:05:42.653> even<00:05:42.813> the<00:05:42.990> biggest<00:05:43.295> VCs,<00:05:43.776> the<00:05:43.857> ones<00:05:44.033> who<00:05:44.114> have<00:05:44.290> a<00:05:44.322> name<00:05:44.676> who<00:05:44.772> you<00:05:44.836> can<00:05:45.061> Google<00:05:45.318> and<00:05:45.462> find<00:05:45.783> out<00:05:45.896> are<00:05:46.024> in<00:05:46.121> your<00:05:46.265> industry,<00:05:47.148> they're<00:05:47.389> always<00:05:47.790> really<00:05:47.967> receptive<00:05:48.754> to<00:05:48.914> the<00:05:49.011> cold<00:05:49.332> pitch.

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And<00:05:50.215> we<00:05:50.359> started<00:05:50.696> with<00:05:51.017> Twitter<00:05:51.323> DMs<00:05:51.901> and<00:05:51.981> we<00:05:52.045> started<00:05:52.302> with<00:05:52.462> like<00:05:52.639> a<00:05:52.655> very,<00:05:53.506> what<00:05:53.715> I<00:05:53.747> thought<00:05:53.827> was<00:05:53.924> a<00:05:53.988> really<00:05:54.293> pretty<00:05:54.614> deck<00:05:54.935> but<00:05:54.983> didn't<00:05:55.176> have<00:05:55.272> a<00:05:55.288> lot<00:05:55.449> of<00:05:55.497> substance<00:05:56.059> that<00:05:56.139> explained<00:05:56.541> what<00:05:56.701> the<00:05:56.781> market<00:05:57.054> opportunity<00:05:57.584> was.

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That<00:05:58.468> opened<00:05:58.725> a<00:05:58.805> couple<00:05:59.126> of<00:05:59.207> doors,<00:05:59.448> but<00:05:59.528> there<00:05:59.608> were<00:05:59.689> still<00:05:59.866> a<00:05:59.930> bunch<00:06:00.171> of<00:06:00.251> nos.

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Some<00:06:01.215> of<00:06:01.280> the<00:06:01.312> nos<00:06:01.601> that<00:06:01.697> we<00:06:01.842> got<00:06:02.340> early<00:06:02.565> on<00:06:02.822> were<00:06:02.967> just,<00:06:03.208> you<00:06:03.240> know,<00:06:03.561> it's<00:06:03.706> not,<00:06:03.850> it's<00:06:04.027> too<00:06:04.172> small<00:06:04.429> right<00:06:04.590> now.

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Let<00:06:05.072> me<00:06:05.152> know<00:06:05.200> when<00:06:05.297> you<00:06:05.329> have<00:06:05.473> some<00:06:05.634> data.

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A<00:06:07.080> couple<00:06:07.321> were<00:06:07.643> a<00:06:07.707> little<00:06:07.948> rougher<00:06:08.430> where<00:06:09.249> there<00:06:09.346> was<00:06:09.876> one<00:06:10.053> billionaire,<00:06:10.615> a<00:06:10.695> well-known<00:06:11.081> tech<00:06:11.322> billionaire<00:06:11.595> in<00:06:11.660> particular,<00:06:12.383> who<00:06:12.463> we<00:06:12.543> got<00:06:12.704> on<00:06:12.800> an<00:06:12.865> email<00:06:13.106> chain<00:06:13.427> with<00:06:13.973> him,<00:06:14.214> his<00:06:14.311> financial<00:06:14.729> advisor,<00:06:15.596> and<00:06:15.677> myself,<00:06:16.014> my<00:06:16.143> co-founders.

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We<00:06:17.508> set<00:06:17.749> the<00:06:17.830> pitch.

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He<00:06:18.810> sounded<00:06:19.051> like<00:06:19.212> he<00:06:19.276> was<00:06:19.372> interested,<00:06:20.336> and<00:06:20.401> then<00:06:20.513> it<00:06:20.577> kind<00:06:20.738> of<00:06:20.818> got<00:06:20.979> circumvented<00:06:21.541> by<00:06:21.702> the<00:06:21.863> business<00:06:22.184> manager<00:06:22.570> who<00:06:22.682> stepped<00:06:23.068> in<00:06:23.229> and<00:06:23.309> said,<00:06:23.952> "this<00:06:24.016> is<00:06:24.128> a<00:06:24.192> big<00:06:24.416> no<00:06:24.593> for<00:06:24.817> us.

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And<00:06:25.539> if<00:06:25.635> you<00:06:25.779> wanna<00:06:25.971> know<00:06:26.260> why,<00:06:27.142> you<00:06:27.222> should<00:06:27.318> read<00:06:27.462> chapter<00:06:27.799> 6<00:06:28.119> of<00:06:28.184> my<00:06:28.424> book."<00:06:28.616> And<00:06:28.681> he<00:06:28.841> linked<00:06:29.065> us<00:06:29.177> to<00:06:29.386> Amazon<00:06:29.803> to<00:06:29.947> a<00:06:30.107> book<00:06:30.284> that<00:06:30.380> he<00:06:30.508> wrote.

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Now<00:06:31.566> those<00:06:31.790> things<00:06:31.967> are<00:06:31.999> like<00:06:32.368> along<00:06:32.688> the<00:06:32.832> way<00:06:32.929> are<00:06:33.009> always<00:06:33.249> gonna<00:06:33.345> be<00:06:33.442> a<00:06:33.474> little<00:06:33.650> bit<00:06:33.714> of<00:06:33.746> a<00:06:33.762> knockdown.

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But<00:06:35.093> what<00:06:35.253> we<00:06:35.477> realized<00:06:35.814> coming<00:06:36.055> outta<00:06:36.199> that<00:06:36.375> process,<00:06:36.920> the<00:06:37.177> early<00:06:37.481> process<00:06:37.898> of<00:06:37.978> trying<00:06:38.154> to<00:06:38.459> use<00:06:38.635> the<00:06:38.780> idea<00:06:39.485> as<00:06:39.645> the<00:06:39.806> hook,<00:06:40.383> was<00:06:40.527> that<00:06:40.623> we<00:06:40.687> needed<00:06:40.896> something<00:06:41.184> tangible.

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So<00:06:41.970> we<00:06:42.547> built<00:06:42.803> a<00:06:42.867> demo<00:06:43.268> and<00:06:43.316> it<00:06:43.348> was<00:06:43.509> mostly<00:06:43.893> a<00:06:43.909> puppet<00:06:44.230> show.

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It<00:06:44.470> was<00:06:44.567> a<00:06:44.631> little<00:06:44.775> bit<00:06:44.871> fake.

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It<00:06:45.673> linked<00:06:45.897> into<00:06:46.090> like<00:06:46.298> what<00:06:46.458> would<00:06:46.554> be<00:06:46.715> a<00:06:46.795> backend<00:06:47.196> in<00:06:47.276> the<00:06:47.356> future,<00:06:48.382> but<00:06:48.462> it<00:06:48.494> was<00:06:48.638> a<00:06:48.654> version<00:06:49.424> of<00:06:49.664> Rally<00:06:50.402> with<00:06:50.498> a<00:06:50.562> few<00:06:50.867> cars<00:06:51.268> in<00:06:51.348> a<00:06:51.364> carousel<00:06:51.925> that<00:06:51.973> you<00:06:52.069> can<00:06:52.165> click<00:06:52.470> through,<00:06:52.823> see<00:06:53.127> all<00:06:53.224> the<00:06:53.368> details,<00:06:54.073> see<00:06:54.250> the<00:06:54.330> price<00:06:54.651> mechanism<00:06:55.132> and<00:06:55.228> some<00:06:55.372> charts<00:06:55.789> that<00:06:55.933> speak<00:06:56.174> to<00:06:56.318> provenance<00:06:56.815> and<00:06:56.895> detail<00:06:57.376> and<00:06:57.601> authenticity,<00:06:58.884> and<00:06:58.980> then<00:06:59.140> make<00:06:59.397> an<00:06:59.461> investment<00:07:00.904> with,<00:07:01.080> you<00:07:01.144> know,<00:07:01.641> the<00:07:01.770> equivalent<00:07:02.106> of<00:07:02.187> probably<00:07:02.427> 10<00:07:02.812> or<00:07:02.844> 11<00:07:03.213> clicks<00:07:03.469> start<00:07:03.710> to<00:07:03.854> finish.

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I<00:07:04.752> think<00:07:04.912> putting<00:07:05.217> that<00:07:05.377> in<00:07:05.458> the<00:07:05.538> hands<00:07:06.099> of<00:07:06.131> a<00:07:06.211> few<00:07:06.420> of<00:07:06.452> the<00:07:06.580> people<00:07:06.901> who<00:07:07.061> were<00:07:07.237> receptive<00:07:07.863> early<00:07:08.103> on<00:07:08.761> was<00:07:08.905> what<00:07:09.001> put<00:07:09.161> us<00:07:09.306> over<00:07:09.418> the<00:07:09.562> edge.

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And<00:07:09.947> those<00:07:10.123> people<00:07:10.364> didn't<00:07:10.588> necessarily<00:07:11.005> invest,<00:07:11.406> but<00:07:11.486> they<00:07:11.647> made<00:07:11.807> introductions<00:07:12.432> to<00:07:12.529> people<00:07:13.314> who<00:07:13.394> had<00:07:13.587> significant<00:07:14.196> domain<00:07:14.533> expertise<00:07:15.094> in<00:07:15.174> marketplace<00:07:15.960> or<00:07:15.992> in<00:07:16.056> consumer<00:07:16.553> or<00:07:16.761> in<00:07:16.858> collectibles<00:07:17.499> or<00:07:17.563> in<00:07:17.723> auction<00:07:18.044> houses.

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And<00:07:19.023> having<00:07:19.424> that<00:07:19.729> sort<00:07:19.906> of<00:07:19.970> feedback<00:07:20.628> in<00:07:20.789> hand<00:07:21.495> on<00:07:21.591> a<00:07:21.656> phone<00:07:22.057> where<00:07:22.153> they<00:07:22.234> can<00:07:22.378> click<00:07:22.571> through<00:07:22.780> it<00:07:22.860> was<00:07:23.036> invaluable<00:07:23.582> for<00:07:23.663> the<00:07:23.743> product.

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But<00:07:24.786> also<00:07:24.979> in<00:07:25.043> terms<00:07:25.300> of<00:07:25.429> letting<00:07:25.605> them<00:07:25.766> know<00:07:25.862> it's<00:07:26.007> not<00:07:26.167> just<00:07:26.328> an<00:07:26.472> idea,<00:07:26.729> it's<00:07:26.890> real.

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I<00:07:27.291> think<00:07:27.435> that's<00:07:27.676> always<00:07:28.335> any<00:07:28.431> advice<00:07:28.736> I<00:07:28.816> give<00:07:28.977> to<00:07:29.057> any<00:07:29.218> new<00:07:29.458> entrepreneur<00:07:29.940> or<00:07:30.036> someone<00:07:30.325> especially<00:07:30.743> starting<00:07:31.000> a<00:07:31.064> digital<00:07:31.385> product<00:07:32.284> or<00:07:32.332> anyone<00:07:32.589> doing<00:07:32.750> hardware<00:07:33.809> is<00:07:33.874> that<00:07:34.660> everybody<00:07:35.078> is<00:07:35.174> receptive<00:07:35.575> to<00:07:35.720> emotion,<00:07:36.362> whether<00:07:36.844> a<00:07:37.020> sophisticated<00:07:37.711> investor<00:07:38.048> or<00:07:38.208> VC,<00:07:38.594> they're<00:07:38.674> always<00:07:38.851> going<00:07:38.963> to<00:07:39.043> say,<00:07:39.236> you<00:07:39.268> know,<00:07:39.878> take<00:07:40.039> emotion<00:07:40.360> out<00:07:40.472> of<00:07:40.536> investing.

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They're<00:07:42.206> lying.

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Everybody<00:07:43.490> looks<00:07:43.667> at<00:07:43.747> something<00:07:44.229> and<00:07:44.293> when<00:07:44.390> they<00:07:44.550> see<00:07:44.871> something<00:07:45.273> and<00:07:45.353> touch<00:07:45.578> something<00:07:45.915> and<00:07:45.995> it<00:07:46.059> has<00:07:46.236> that<00:07:46.380> haptic,<00:07:46.798> a<00:07:46.814> taptic<00:07:47.263> response,<00:07:48.002> and<00:07:48.082> they<00:07:48.114> can<00:07:48.322> click<00:07:48.659> through<00:07:48.884> start<00:07:49.124> to<00:07:49.268> finish<00:07:49.765> and<00:07:49.910> feel<00:07:50.262> it<00:07:50.407> in<00:07:50.471> real<00:07:50.647> life,<00:07:51.369> there's<00:07:51.593> an<00:07:51.657> immediate<00:07:51.994> reaction.

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You<00:07:52.427> can<00:07:52.555> see<00:07:52.667> it<00:07:52.731> in<00:07:52.795> their<00:07:52.892> face<00:07:53.212> whether<00:07:53.389> they<00:07:53.533> like<00:07:53.773> it<00:07:53.854> or<00:07:53.886> not.

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And<00:07:54.639> they're<00:07:54.976> way<00:07:55.232> more—<00:07:56.419> they're<00:07:56.563> halfway<00:07:56.980> there<00:07:57.076> to<00:07:57.156> making<00:07:57.445> that<00:07:57.541> investment<00:07:57.942> if<00:07:58.022> they<00:07:58.102> can<00:07:58.263> really<00:07:58.519> see<00:07:58.888> it<00:07:58.968> and<00:07:59.032> understand<00:07:59.465> it<00:07:59.609> in<00:07:59.770> real<00:07:59.930> life.

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And<00:08:00.251> that's<00:08:00.427> always<00:08:00.587> what<00:08:00.683> we<00:08:00.748> kind<00:08:00.908> of<00:08:00.988> focused<00:08:01.373> on<00:08:01.469> going<00:08:01.710> forward<00:08:01.902> from<00:08:02.110> that<00:08:02.191> point.

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Did<00:08:03.393> you<00:08:03.473> read<00:08:03.633> the<00:08:04.018> chapter?

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No,<00:08:05.301> I<00:08:05.397> didn't.

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I,<00:08:06.984> I<00:08:07.016> look<00:08:07.161> at<00:08:07.225> that<00:08:07.321> email<00:08:07.545> every<00:08:07.658> now<00:08:07.802> and<00:08:07.882> then,<00:08:08.107> and<00:08:08.427> I<00:08:08.507> look<00:08:08.684> like<00:08:08.908> once,<00:08:09.309> once<00:08:09.501> every<00:08:09.646> like<00:08:09.870> 5<00:08:10.223> or<00:08:10.287> 6<00:08:10.527> months,<00:08:10.736> I'm<00:08:10.864> in<00:08:10.992> like<00:08:11.153> the<00:08:11.249> doldrums.

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I<00:08:11.810> look<00:08:11.970> back,<00:08:12.179> I'm<00:08:12.291> like,<00:08:12.596> this<00:08:12.852> guy<00:08:13.397> really<00:08:13.734> told<00:08:14.055> me<00:08:14.151> to<00:08:14.375> buy<00:08:14.616> his<00:08:14.856> book.

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And<00:08:15.257> that's—<00:08:15.722> it's<00:08:15.850> like,<00:08:16.203> what?

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And<00:08:16.636> now<00:08:17.470> that<00:08:17.710> particular<00:08:18.070> person<00:08:18.510> who<00:08:18.650> we<00:08:19.070> were<00:08:19.130> pitching,<00:08:19.570> I'll<00:08:19.670> see<00:08:19.770> like<00:08:19.950> pop<00:08:20.170> up<00:08:20.330> on<00:08:20.430> TV<00:08:20.730> or<00:08:20.870> something<00:08:21.070> every<00:08:21.250> now<00:08:21.410> and<00:08:21.550> then.

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Just<00:08:22.270> like,<00:08:22.590> man,<00:08:22.790> I<00:08:22.970> really<00:08:23.190> want<00:08:23.350> to<00:08:23.430> connect<00:08:23.610> with<00:08:23.710> this<00:08:23.850> guy<00:08:23.990> and<00:08:24.070> ask<00:08:24.230> if<00:08:24.350> he's<00:08:24.450> still<00:08:24.590> working<00:08:24.790> with<00:08:24.970> that<00:08:25.150> business<00:08:25.410> manager.

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But<00:08:26.070> no,<00:08:26.610> I<00:08:26.710> haven't,<00:08:26.970> I<00:08:27.370> never<00:08:27.670> read<00:08:27.850> the<00:08:27.930> book.

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No.

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That's<00:08:29.870> hilarious.

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It's<00:08:30.690> hilarious<00:08:30.990> he<00:08:31.170> wouldn't<00:08:31.350> send<00:08:31.550> you<00:08:31.730> a<00:08:31.810> copy<00:08:32.150> of<00:08:32.310> the<00:08:32.330> book.

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He<00:08:32.591> actually<00:08:32.750> wanted<00:08:32.930> you<00:08:33.070> to<00:08:33.250> buy<00:08:33.370> it.

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Nah,<00:08:34.370> I<00:08:34.371> mean,<00:08:34.610> listen,<00:08:34.990> if<00:08:34.991> anything<00:08:35.630> that's<00:08:35.930> worth<00:08:36.110> doing,<00:08:36.730> if<00:08:36.731> it's<00:08:36.910> good<00:08:36.990> enough,<00:08:37.330> you<00:08:37.350> should<00:08:37.490> charge<00:08:37.690> for<00:08:37.910> it.

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You<00:08:38.051> know,<00:08:38.430> I'll<00:08:38.550> give<00:08:38.570> him<00:08:38.750> credit<00:08:38.870> for<00:08:39.090> that.

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Like<00:08:39.450> send<00:08:39.610> me<00:08:39.710> the<00:08:39.810> link<00:08:40.030> and<00:08:40.150> send<00:08:40.250> me<00:08:40.350> to<00:08:40.470> Amazon.

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But<00:08:41.070> yeah,<00:08:42.090> I<00:08:42.170> don't<00:08:42.230> know.

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He<00:08:42.590> didn't<00:08:42.730> get<00:08:42.890> his<00:08:43.070> residuals<00:08:43.750> off<00:08:43.850> my<00:08:44.230> purchase.

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That's<00:08:44.770> for<00:08:44.870> sure.

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That's<00:08:46.874> awesome.

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Tell<00:08:47.755> me<00:08:47.916> about<00:08:48.156> building<00:08:48.396> the<00:08:48.477> product<00:08:48.797> because<00:08:48.941> you've<00:08:49.101> really<00:08:49.358> built<00:08:49.983> a<00:08:50.560> unique,<00:08:51.265> fascinating<00:08:51.842> product.

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How<00:08:52.563> do<00:08:52.707> you<00:08:53.043> think<00:08:53.300> about—<00:08:54.149> you<00:08:54.229> mean,<00:08:54.470> and<00:08:54.566> you<00:08:54.790> are<00:08:54.886> the<00:08:55.046> chief<00:08:55.271> product<00:08:55.543> officer,<00:08:55.928> obviously.

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So<00:08:57.114> how<00:08:57.194> do<00:08:57.274> you<00:08:57.434> think<00:08:57.626> about<00:08:57.931> building<00:08:58.251> products<00:08:58.876> and<00:08:58.972> what<00:08:59.117> is<00:08:59.213> your<00:08:59.373> process<00:08:59.918> like?

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Yeah,<00:09:01.376> look,<00:09:01.600> my<00:09:01.761> process<00:09:02.257> has<00:09:02.562> always<00:09:02.882> been,<00:09:03.443> um,<00:09:04.004> a<00:09:04.244> little<00:09:04.565> bit<00:09:04.821> different<00:09:05.222> than<00:09:05.318> what<00:09:05.446> I<00:09:05.542> would<00:09:05.622> consider,<00:09:06.488> um,<00:09:06.824> like<00:09:07.000> the<00:09:07.225> Ivy<00:09:07.545> League<00:09:07.770> product<00:09:08.090> managers<00:09:08.571> and<00:09:08.651> product<00:09:08.923> designers<00:09:09.532> who<00:09:09.853> really<00:09:10.333> want<00:09:10.430> to<00:09:10.606> sort<00:09:10.830> of<00:09:10.862> start<00:09:11.311> with<00:09:12.032> bare<00:09:12.272> bones<00:09:12.977> wireframe<00:09:13.939> through<00:09:14.355> the<00:09:14.676> research<00:09:15.060> process,<00:09:15.701> through<00:09:15.861> discovery<00:09:16.278> phase<00:09:16.582> with<00:09:16.694> new<00:09:16.903> users,<00:09:17.944> to<00:09:18.104> onboarding<00:09:18.457> small<00:09:18.697> batches,<00:09:19.226> A/B<00:09:19.482> testing,<00:09:19.963> and<00:09:20.027> then<00:09:20.187> releasing<00:09:20.684> pieces.

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I've<00:09:21.181> always<00:09:21.405> been—<00:09:22.286> I've<00:09:22.430> always<00:09:22.607> taken<00:09:22.911> shortcuts<00:09:23.536> for<00:09:23.600> the<00:09:23.664> better,<00:09:23.872> for<00:09:23.968> better<00:09:24.129> or<00:09:24.209> worse,<00:09:24.673> personally.

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And<00:09:25.635> from<00:09:25.731> a<00:09:25.811> product<00:09:26.051> perspective,<00:09:26.516> I've<00:09:26.612> tried<00:09:26.917> to<00:09:27.013> lead<00:09:27.734> with<00:09:27.894> intuition.

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I<00:09:28.631> think<00:09:28.775> the<00:09:28.855> business<00:09:29.176> that<00:09:29.400> we're<00:09:29.640> in,<00:09:30.377> in<00:09:30.457> that<00:09:30.602> we<00:09:30.682> have<00:09:30.762> to<00:09:30.842> find<00:09:31.082> collectibles<00:09:31.579> that<00:09:31.723> people<00:09:31.980> love,<00:09:32.300> we<00:09:32.364> have<00:09:32.460> to<00:09:32.524> syndicate<00:09:33.021> them<00:09:33.101> to<00:09:33.245> thousands<00:09:33.598> of<00:09:33.662> people,<00:09:34.143> we<00:09:34.463> have<00:09:34.607> to<00:09:34.639> tell<00:09:34.799> stories<00:09:35.200> effectively.

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That<00:09:36.770> to<00:09:36.866> me<00:09:37.027> was<00:09:37.187> always<00:09:37.587> a<00:09:37.603> mix<00:09:37.844> of<00:09:37.924> intuition<00:09:38.372> and<00:09:38.469> taste.

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And<00:09:38.949> I<00:09:39.093> think<00:09:39.254> that's<00:09:39.494> the<00:09:39.670> one<00:09:39.975> thing<00:09:40.231> that<00:09:40.872> the<00:09:40.968> standard<00:09:41.513> kind<00:09:41.754> of<00:09:42.074> the<00:09:42.219> PM<00:09:42.780> who<00:09:43.020> runs<00:09:43.357> product<00:09:43.918> now<00:09:44.463> at<00:09:44.623> most<00:09:44.864> startups<00:09:45.280> and<00:09:45.377> most<00:09:45.585> companies,<00:09:46.066> especially<00:09:46.563> bigger<00:09:46.803> companies<00:09:47.444> and<00:09:47.589> giant<00:09:47.909> organizations,<00:09:48.727> you're<00:09:49.192> not<00:09:49.304> gonna<00:09:49.448> get<00:09:49.512> away<00:09:49.689> with<00:09:49.833> just<00:09:50.073> having<00:09:50.250> taste<00:09:50.586> or<00:09:50.715> just<00:09:50.827> having<00:09:51.196> feel.

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But<00:09:52.318> early<00:09:52.638> on,<00:09:52.799> I<00:09:52.895> think<00:09:53.119> when<00:09:53.296> we<00:09:53.392> started<00:09:53.680> putting<00:09:54.017> thoughts<00:09:54.257> on<00:09:54.337> paper,<00:09:55.363> it<00:09:55.444> was<00:09:55.620> gonna<00:09:55.860> be<00:09:56.021> sort<00:09:56.197> of<00:09:56.261> a<00:09:56.277> finance<00:09:56.806> app,<00:09:56.902> but<00:09:57.047> we<00:09:57.127> wanted<00:09:57.367> it<00:09:57.447> to<00:09:57.608> look<00:09:57.880> and<00:09:57.960> feel<00:09:58.265> way<00:09:58.441> more<00:09:58.682> like<00:09:58.842> a<00:09:58.906> consumer<00:09:59.371> experience<00:09:59.948> and<00:10:00.028> more<00:10:00.189> like<00:10:00.509> buying<00:10:00.750> a<00:10:00.830> pair<00:10:00.926> of<00:10:00.990> sneakers<00:10:01.455> on<00:10:01.872> GOAT<00:10:02.272> or<00:10:02.513> anywhere<00:10:02.769> in<00:10:02.850> a<00:10:02.898> marketplace<00:10:03.475> that<00:10:03.715> wasn't<00:10:03.956> about<00:10:04.196> finance.

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So<00:10:06.120> I<00:10:06.200> started<00:10:06.585> doing,<00:10:06.905> we<00:10:06.953> did<00:10:07.066> a<00:10:07.082> lot<00:10:07.258> of<00:10:07.322> competitive<00:10:07.883> analysis<00:10:08.444> early<00:10:08.749> on<00:10:08.989> and<00:10:09.085> did<00:10:09.166> the<00:10:09.246> brand<00:10:09.566> twin<00:10:09.791> exercise<00:10:10.368> and<00:10:10.432> really<00:10:10.608> focused<00:10:11.073> on<00:10:11.249> brand<00:10:11.570> as<00:10:11.730> the<00:10:11.811> pillar.

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But<00:10:12.837> a<00:10:12.853> lot<00:10:13.078> of<00:10:13.174> it<00:10:13.238> was<00:10:13.800> initial<00:10:14.073> sketches.

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I<00:10:14.538> skipped<00:10:14.859> straight<00:10:15.421> to<00:10:15.501> the<00:10:15.581> pixel-perfect<00:10:16.159> designs<00:10:16.480> at<00:10:16.544> that<00:10:16.785> point.

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And<00:10:17.122> this<00:10:17.266> was<00:10:17.427> in<00:10:17.523> an<00:10:17.571> era<00:10:17.908> when,<00:10:18.149> you<00:10:18.646> know,<00:10:18.726> Photoshop<00:10:19.914> and<00:10:20.010> a<00:10:20.074> few<00:10:20.251> other<00:10:20.395> platforms<00:10:20.796> that<00:10:20.877> are<00:10:20.957> no<00:10:21.198> longer,<00:10:22.064> you<00:10:22.096> know,<00:10:22.241> Figma<00:10:22.626> runs<00:10:23.107> product<00:10:23.348> design<00:10:23.589> at<00:10:23.685> this<00:10:23.910> point.

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Yeah.

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But<00:10:24.889> at<00:10:24.985> a<00:10:25.113> time<00:10:25.434> when<00:10:25.530> it<00:10:25.563> was<00:10:25.691> really<00:10:25.851> about<00:10:26.092> the<00:10:26.236> visuals<00:10:26.959> and<00:10:27.456> we<00:10:27.601> looked<00:10:27.921> at<00:10:28.579> two<00:10:28.884> apps<00:10:29.077> at<00:10:29.141> the<00:10:29.221> time<00:10:29.526> that<00:10:29.622> made<00:10:29.783> a<00:10:29.847> lot<00:10:29.927> of<00:10:29.959> sense<00:10:30.329> to<00:10:30.425> me<00:10:30.746> in<00:10:30.826> terms<00:10:31.083> of<00:10:31.147> consumer<00:10:31.532> experience.

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One<00:10:33.217> was<00:10:33.538> a<00:10:33.715> company<00:10:33.955> called<00:10:34.100> StockTwits<00:10:35.239> who<00:10:35.945> the<00:10:36.041> founder<00:10:36.443> wound<00:10:36.603> up<00:10:36.683> being<00:10:36.828> our<00:10:36.924> first<00:10:37.165> investor.

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And<00:10:37.983> it's<00:10:38.128> kind<00:10:38.368> of<00:10:38.432> like<00:10:38.673> a,<00:10:39.668> It's<00:10:39.812> a<00:10:39.877> forum-style<00:10:41.080> communication<00:10:41.657> tool<00:10:42.042> for<00:10:42.203> people<00:10:42.523> in<00:10:42.620> finance<00:10:43.181> to<00:10:43.326> talk<00:10:43.582> about<00:10:43.983> individual<00:10:44.769> stocks<00:10:45.331> and<00:10:45.427> to<00:10:45.587> add<00:10:45.732> sentiment.

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And<00:10:46.791> it's,<00:10:47.095> you<00:10:47.176> know,<00:10:47.288> it's<00:10:47.448> very<00:10:47.625> much<00:10:47.897> kind<00:10:47.994> of<00:10:48.058> a<00:10:48.090> timeline<00:10:48.539> feature.

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And<00:10:49.421> the<00:10:49.454> second<00:10:49.839> was<00:10:49.935> an<00:10:50.063> app<00:10:50.159> called<00:10:50.384> Maple,<00:10:50.881> which<00:10:51.042> was<00:10:51.282> from<00:10:51.908> David<00:10:52.084> Chang,<00:10:52.389> was<00:10:52.501> a<00:10:52.630> food<00:10:52.870> delivery<00:10:53.352> app.

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It<00:10:54.009> was<00:10:54.090> in<00:10:54.170> a<00:10:54.234> couple<00:10:54.410> of<00:10:54.475> markets<00:10:54.876> here<00:10:54.972> in<00:10:55.084> New<00:10:55.213> York.

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It<00:10:56.031> was<00:10:56.111> really<00:10:56.239> about<00:10:56.416> telling<00:10:56.576> the<00:10:56.640> story<00:10:56.881> behind<00:10:57.121> the<00:10:57.202> ingredients<00:10:58.164> and<00:10:58.405> kind<00:10:58.581> of,<00:10:58.645> you<00:10:58.678> know,<00:10:58.966> why<00:10:59.143> they<00:10:59.383> put<00:10:59.464> this<00:10:59.624> dish<00:10:59.800> together.

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They<00:11:00.715> had<00:11:00.891> only<00:11:01.292> 5<00:11:01.629> or<00:11:01.709> 6<00:11:01.950> individual<00:11:02.415> items<00:11:02.736> on<00:11:02.784> a<00:11:02.897> menu<00:11:03.217> any<00:11:03.378> given<00:11:03.634> night,<00:11:04.276> and<00:11:04.372> it<00:11:04.421> was<00:11:04.581> all<00:11:04.661> kind<00:11:04.822> of<00:11:04.854> sourced<00:11:05.479> in<00:11:05.624> a<00:11:05.720> really<00:11:06.041> interesting<00:11:06.426> way<00:11:06.602> that<00:11:06.650> it<00:11:06.763> told<00:11:06.923> the<00:11:07.003> story<00:11:07.404> of.

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And<00:11:07.741> it<00:11:07.805> was<00:11:08.030> this<00:11:08.367> really<00:11:08.768> nice<00:11:09.073> paginated<00:11:09.554> experience.

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Those<00:11:10.709> two<00:11:10.853> pieces<00:11:11.255> kind<00:11:11.415> of<00:11:11.479> blended<00:11:11.752> together.

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I<00:11:12.218> took<00:11:12.458> the<00:11:12.603> best<00:11:12.859> parts<00:11:13.100> of<00:11:13.180> both<00:11:14.063> and<00:11:14.143> designed<00:11:14.625> what<00:11:14.849> would<00:11:15.010> be<00:11:15.106> kind<00:11:15.331> of<00:11:15.363> like<00:11:15.571> the<00:11:15.652> first<00:11:16.149> product<00:11:16.614> page<00:11:17.497> for<00:11:17.738> our<00:11:17.914> products,<00:11:18.460> for<00:11:18.701> our<00:11:18.813> individual<00:11:19.278> collectibles<00:11:19.840> that<00:11:20.000> told<00:11:20.241> the<00:11:20.321> story<00:11:20.626> effectively,<00:11:21.348> that<00:11:21.445> allowed<00:11:21.685> for<00:11:21.878> a<00:11:21.910> little<00:11:22.022> bit<00:11:22.119> of<00:11:22.167> communication<00:11:22.729> with<00:11:22.953> us<00:11:23.130> and<00:11:23.194> with<00:11:23.290> other<00:11:23.451> individual<00:11:23.916> users,<00:11:24.959> um,<00:11:25.296> and<00:11:25.376> kind<00:11:25.537> of<00:11:25.617> told<00:11:25.922> the<00:11:26.002> whole<00:11:26.195> story.

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But<00:11:27.286> we<00:11:27.462> pushed<00:11:28.345> the<00:11:28.586> buy,<00:11:28.987> the<00:11:29.147> idea<00:11:29.372> of<00:11:29.468> investing,<00:11:30.174> all<00:11:30.335> the<00:11:30.415> way<00:11:30.511> to<00:11:30.688> the<00:11:30.832> back<00:11:31.635> because<00:11:31.811> we<00:11:31.875> were<00:11:31.956> trying<00:11:32.100> to<00:11:32.180> flip<00:11:32.357> it<00:11:32.437> on<00:11:32.533> its<00:11:32.678> head.

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Everything<00:11:33.560> at<00:11:33.721> that<00:11:34.026> point,<00:11:34.668> because<00:11:34.941> of<00:11:35.069> Robinhood<00:11:35.550> more<00:11:35.711> than<00:11:35.807> anybody<00:11:36.208> else,<00:11:36.369> when<00:11:36.513> we<00:11:36.674> launched<00:11:37.412> was<00:11:37.572> about<00:11:37.748> making<00:11:37.989> the<00:11:38.117> investing<00:11:38.597> experience<00:11:39.319> seamless,<00:11:39.895> and<00:11:39.992> it<00:11:40.136> took<00:11:40.520> a<00:11:40.616> lot<00:11:40.841> of<00:11:40.873> the<00:11:41.001> heart<00:11:41.338> and<00:11:41.418> the<00:11:41.498> soul<00:11:41.962> out<00:11:42.075> of<00:11:42.139> investing.

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It<00:11:42.700> became<00:11:43.501> get<00:11:43.725> in<00:11:43.805> as<00:11:43.901> quickly<00:11:44.222> as<00:11:44.302> possible,<00:11:45.263> very<00:11:45.504> binary<00:11:45.968> outcome.

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Finance<00:11:47.266> in<00:11:47.347> general<00:11:47.635> is<00:11:47.763> a<00:11:47.811> zero-sum<00:11:48.388> game.

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It's<00:11:48.709> always<00:11:48.885> about<00:11:49.093> make<00:11:49.253> as<00:11:49.350> much<00:11:49.510> money<00:11:49.734> as<00:11:49.830> possible<00:11:50.215> and<00:11:50.311> get<00:11:50.535> out.

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And<00:11:51.353> we<00:11:51.433> knew<00:11:51.577> that<00:11:51.673> wasn't<00:11:51.897> going<00:11:51.993> to<00:11:52.058> exist.

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That<00:11:52.458> was<00:11:52.554> a<00:11:52.570> race<00:11:52.779> to<00:11:52.811> the<00:11:52.939> bottom<00:11:53.195> for<00:11:53.356> us.

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So<00:11:54.461> we<00:11:54.621> looked<00:11:54.734> at<00:11:54.798> it<00:11:54.878> and<00:11:54.942> said,<00:11:55.038> let's<00:11:55.182> just<00:11:55.342> flip<00:11:55.535> it.

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We'll<00:11:55.919> turn<00:11:56.096> it<00:11:56.144> into<00:11:56.336> a<00:11:56.480> product<00:11:56.865> that<00:11:56.945> looks<00:11:57.121> and<00:11:57.201> feels<00:11:57.426> more<00:11:57.538> like<00:11:57.682> a<00:11:57.698> magazine,<00:11:58.387> has<00:11:58.643> the<00:11:58.788> elements<00:11:59.060> of<00:11:59.188> those<00:11:59.364> two<00:11:59.589> products<00:11:59.909> that<00:12:00.005> I<00:12:00.021> spoke<00:12:00.342> about,<00:12:00.903> tells<00:12:01.143> a<00:12:01.207> story<00:12:01.512> effectively,<00:12:02.649> and<00:12:02.746> the<00:12:02.890> button<00:12:03.130> says<00:12:03.306> explore.

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And<00:12:04.172> the<00:12:04.332> deeper<00:12:04.652> you<00:12:04.813> get<00:12:05.037> into<00:12:05.197> the<00:12:05.293> product,<00:12:05.918> the<00:12:05.998> more<00:12:06.158> it<00:12:06.239> becomes,<00:12:06.815> you<00:12:06.895> know,<00:12:07.392> some<00:12:07.616> of<00:12:07.681> the<00:12:07.761> imagery<00:12:08.017> strips<00:12:08.482> out<00:12:09.219> and<00:12:09.283> then<00:12:09.347> you<00:12:09.379> get<00:12:09.539> to<00:12:09.683> a<00:12:09.699> point<00:12:09.892> that<00:12:10.004> you<00:12:10.036> can<00:12:10.116> make<00:12:10.276> a<00:12:10.324> purchase<00:12:11.045> and<00:12:11.125> invest<00:12:11.766> in<00:12:11.862> any<00:12:12.023> of<00:12:12.087> these<00:12:12.247> individual<00:12:12.728> assets.

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But<00:12:13.705> that's,<00:12:14.089> you<00:12:14.170> know,<00:12:14.586> 6<00:12:15.051> clicks<00:12:15.371> away<00:12:15.724> from<00:12:16.092> the<00:12:16.188> front<00:12:16.509> page,<00:12:16.893> from<00:12:17.054> the<00:12:17.230> initial<00:12:17.614> experience,<00:12:18.351> which<00:12:18.512> is<00:12:18.672> the<00:12:18.976> worst<00:12:19.377> thing<00:12:19.553> that<00:12:19.793> anybody<00:12:20.098> could<00:12:20.178> do<00:12:20.258> in<00:12:20.338> a<00:12:20.354> transactional<00:12:21.059> app<00:12:21.300> is<00:12:21.396> make<00:12:21.572> it<00:12:21.620> so<00:12:21.700> they<00:12:21.764> have<00:12:21.876> to<00:12:21.940> go<00:12:22.037> find<00:12:22.437> the<00:12:22.517> place<00:12:22.758> to<00:12:22.918> purchase<00:12:23.158> something.

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But<00:12:24.119> that<00:12:24.216> for<00:12:24.424> us<00:12:24.584> wound<00:12:24.696> up<00:12:24.776> being<00:12:24.921> the<00:12:25.001> magic<00:12:25.337> early<00:12:25.626> on<00:12:25.802> because<00:12:26.683> we<00:12:26.747> weren't<00:12:26.907> trying<00:12:27.020> to<00:12:27.148> push<00:12:27.260> people<00:12:27.500> into<00:12:27.580> an<00:12:27.628> investment.

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We<00:12:28.221> were<00:12:28.285> trying<00:12:28.446> to<00:12:28.750> lay<00:12:28.910> out<00:12:29.022> as<00:12:29.167> much<00:12:29.327> information<00:12:29.968> in<00:12:30.048> the<00:12:30.112> most<00:12:30.432> interesting,<00:12:31.089> visually<00:12:31.410> appealing<00:12:31.794> way<00:12:31.970> as<00:12:32.115> possible.

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And<00:12:33.236> answer<00:12:33.589> some<00:12:33.781> of<00:12:33.813> your<00:12:33.973> questions<00:12:34.390> to<00:12:34.518> reinforce<00:12:34.999> your<00:12:35.111> intuition,<00:12:36.056> and<00:12:36.121> then<00:12:36.281> you<00:12:36.361> can<00:12:36.409> make<00:12:36.537> the<00:12:36.617> purchase.

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So<00:12:37.579> we<00:12:37.723> kind<00:12:37.899> of<00:12:37.963> developed<00:12:38.364> the<00:12:38.460> product<00:12:39.005> knowing<00:12:39.245> that<00:12:39.341> that<00:12:39.485> was<00:12:39.582> going<00:12:39.678> to<00:12:39.742> be<00:12:39.822> the<00:12:39.982> archetype<00:12:40.527> who<00:12:40.607> we<00:12:40.687> were<00:12:40.767> going<00:12:41.008> after<00:12:41.729> with<00:12:41.889> the<00:12:41.937> same<00:12:42.290> thought<00:12:42.466> process.

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Make<00:12:43.283> it<00:12:43.347> as<00:12:43.572> interesting<00:12:44.132> visually<00:12:44.533> as<00:12:44.693> possible,<00:12:45.575> give<00:12:45.735> them<00:12:45.831> the<00:12:45.975> opportunity<00:12:46.472> to<00:12:46.616> explore<00:12:47.033> and<00:12:47.113> go<00:12:47.273> deeper<00:12:47.658> into<00:12:47.834> the<00:12:47.914> product.

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But<00:12:48.795> by<00:12:48.891> the<00:12:49.036> time<00:12:49.260> they<00:12:49.436> get<00:12:49.677> to<00:12:49.757> the<00:12:49.901> purchase<00:12:50.237> decision,<00:12:50.702> we're<00:12:50.782> probably<00:12:51.103> going<00:12:51.279> to<00:12:51.359> be<00:12:51.455> able<00:12:51.551> to<00:12:51.664> capture<00:12:52.641> the<00:12:52.721> majority<00:12:53.298> of<00:12:53.442> those<00:12:53.667> potential<00:12:54.019> investors<00:12:54.628> because<00:12:54.868> they've<00:12:55.045> gotten<00:12:55.365> this<00:12:55.589> far<00:12:55.830> with<00:12:56.006> us.

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Today's<00:12:57.769> Robinhood's<00:12:58.233> probably<00:12:58.506> something<00:12:58.810> like<00:12:59.034> OpenAI.

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Or<00:13:00.173> ChatGPT,<00:13:00.959> right?

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How<00:13:02.019> are<00:13:02.244> you<00:13:02.340> thinking<00:13:02.677> about<00:13:03.447> AI<00:13:04.667> and<00:13:04.812> integrating<00:13:05.309> that<00:13:05.470> into<00:13:05.695> your<00:13:05.791> platform?

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I<00:13:07.460> think<00:13:07.621> that,<00:13:07.958> again,<00:13:08.423> going<00:13:08.600> back<00:13:08.761> to<00:13:09.387> the<00:13:09.483> common<00:13:09.884> theme<00:13:10.045> that<00:13:10.189> we've<00:13:10.302> always<00:13:10.510> had<00:13:10.623> here<00:13:10.767> is<00:13:10.831> that<00:13:10.944> we<00:13:11.072> want<00:13:11.152> to<00:13:11.233> reinforce<00:13:11.730> intuition.

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You<00:13:12.228> want<00:13:12.372> people<00:13:12.677> to<00:13:12.854> have<00:13:13.335> a<00:13:13.496> well-formed<00:13:14.138> investment<00:13:14.619> thesis<00:13:14.940> by<00:13:15.037> the<00:13:15.117> time<00:13:15.342> they<00:13:15.567> get<00:13:15.743> to<00:13:15.904> Rally,<00:13:16.867> but<00:13:16.947> then<00:13:17.091> you<00:13:17.188> want<00:13:17.348> them<00:13:17.412> to<00:13:17.445> sort<00:13:17.653> of<00:13:17.750> get<00:13:17.926> in<00:13:18.006> and<00:13:18.135> maybe<00:13:18.311> see<00:13:18.713> something,<00:13:19.274> some<00:13:19.579> wrinkle<00:13:19.836> they<00:13:19.933> didn't<00:13:20.238> know<00:13:20.478> existed<00:13:20.960> before<00:13:21.233> making<00:13:21.586> that<00:13:21.762> purchase<00:13:22.164> that<00:13:22.244> kind<00:13:22.469> of<00:13:22.501> says<00:13:22.677> like,<00:13:22.870> all<00:13:22.902> right,<00:13:23.127> I<00:13:23.191> was<00:13:23.432> right,<00:13:23.641> I'm<00:13:23.833> directionally<00:13:24.395> correct,<00:13:25.214> and<00:13:25.358> here's<00:13:25.551> the<00:13:25.679> details<00:13:26.032> to<00:13:26.161> fill<00:13:26.337> in<00:13:26.417> those<00:13:26.658> blanks<00:13:26.963> that<00:13:27.043> I<00:13:27.060> didn't<00:13:27.365> have.

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That's<00:13:28.167> where,<00:13:28.488> for<00:13:28.584> me,<00:13:28.905> that's<00:13:29.066> how<00:13:29.210> I<00:13:29.290> use<00:13:29.451> AI<00:13:29.627> right<00:13:29.788> now.

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That's<00:13:30.173> how<00:13:30.253> I<00:13:30.334> want<00:13:30.430> it<00:13:30.478> to<00:13:30.510> be<00:13:30.590> in<00:13:30.687> our<00:13:30.815> product.

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I<00:13:31.232> think<00:13:31.393> at<00:13:31.473> a<00:13:31.489> certain<00:13:31.858> point<00:13:32.340> we'll<00:13:32.580> have<00:13:32.741> no<00:13:32.853> choice<00:13:33.174> but<00:13:33.319> to<00:13:33.479> integrate<00:13:33.736> it<00:13:33.880> into<00:13:34.057> the<00:13:34.185> process.

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But<00:13:35.228> I've<00:13:35.341> never<00:13:35.726> thought<00:13:35.951> about<00:13:36.191> AI<00:13:36.432> and<00:13:36.528> I've<00:13:36.609> never<00:13:36.914> wanted<00:13:37.315> AI<00:13:37.491> to<00:13:37.652> be<00:13:37.812> like<00:13:37.973> a<00:13:38.037> creative<00:13:38.454> crutch.

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I<00:13:38.936> think<00:13:39.080> that<00:13:39.337> a<00:13:39.401> lot<00:13:39.514> of<00:13:39.546> what<00:13:39.658> we<00:13:39.738> see<00:13:39.963> right<00:13:40.139> now<00:13:41.086> is<00:13:41.504> visuals<00:13:42.547> and<00:13:42.868> imagery<00:13:43.670> and<00:13:43.766> it's,<00:13:44.055> you<00:13:44.087> know,<00:13:44.473> it's,<00:13:44.874> it's,<00:13:45.419> you<00:13:45.500> know,<00:13:45.676> thesis<00:13:45.981> papers<00:13:46.559> and<00:13:46.639> it's<00:13:46.784> kind<00:13:47.024> of<00:13:47.105> like,<00:13:47.361> you<00:13:47.393> know,<00:13:47.682> pumping<00:13:47.987> out<00:13:48.068> a<00:13:48.084> bunch<00:13:48.260> of<00:13:48.469> articles.

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To<00:13:49.624> me,<00:13:49.849> that's<00:13:50.025> a<00:13:50.074> little<00:13:50.250> bit,<00:13:50.732> you<00:13:50.828> see<00:13:51.149> it<00:13:51.293> and<00:13:51.374> it<00:13:51.438> feels<00:13:52.240> a<00:13:52.336> little<00:13:52.577> bit<00:13:52.722> soulless.

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And<00:13:53.380> I<00:13:53.524> think<00:13:53.765> I've<00:13:53.941> never<00:13:54.246> wanted<00:13:54.583> that<00:13:54.824> to<00:13:54.920> be<00:13:55.065> the<00:13:55.129> way<00:13:55.241> it<00:13:55.322> integrates<00:13:55.691> into<00:13:55.867> Rally<00:13:56.365> or<00:13:56.429> into<00:13:56.525> my<00:13:56.814> life.

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I've<00:13:57.552> wanted<00:13:57.776> to<00:13:57.873> pick<00:13:58.097> up<00:13:58.498> on<00:13:58.818> the<00:13:58.915> things<00:13:59.139> that<00:13:59.219> I<00:13:59.235> just,<00:13:59.780> A,<00:13:59.876> can't<00:14:00.181> find,<00:14:00.502> or<00:14:00.598> B,<00:14:00.758> don't<00:14:00.918> want<00:14:01.063> to<00:14:01.159> do.

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And<00:14:01.479> I<00:14:01.560> think<00:14:01.720> that<00:14:02.361> that<00:14:02.618> deep<00:14:02.986> research<00:14:03.483> that<00:14:03.563> goes<00:14:03.804> along<00:14:04.044> with<00:14:04.188> so<00:14:04.445> many<00:14:04.669> of<00:14:04.701> these<00:14:04.846> individual<00:14:05.471> assets,<00:14:05.888> not<00:14:06.048> the<00:14:06.128> storytelling<00:14:06.833> part,<00:14:07.491> but<00:14:07.587> the<00:14:07.715> actual<00:14:07.988> nuts<00:14:08.212> and<00:14:08.372> bolts<00:14:08.773> of<00:14:08.853> the<00:14:08.933> way<00:14:09.030> something<00:14:09.414> is<00:14:09.559> made,<00:14:10.360> a<00:14:10.376> little<00:14:10.552> bit<00:14:10.681> of<00:14:10.713> a<00:14:10.841> nuance<00:14:11.274> around<00:14:11.578> sort<00:14:11.803> of<00:14:11.835> the<00:14:11.963> authenticity<00:14:12.396> mark<00:14:12.636> or<00:14:12.684> the<00:14:12.781> provenance<00:14:13.278> around<00:14:13.502> an<00:14:13.598> individual<00:14:14.047> asset.

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I<00:14:15.009> think<00:14:15.169> having<00:14:15.490> those,<00:14:15.826> and<00:14:15.907> along<00:14:16.147> with<00:14:16.227> some<00:14:16.387> of<00:14:16.419> the<00:14:16.612> price<00:14:17.093> action,<00:14:17.654> and<00:14:17.750> being<00:14:17.894> able<00:14:17.974> to<00:14:18.055> sort<00:14:18.231> of<00:14:18.375> get,<00:14:18.696> A,<00:14:19.289> some<00:14:19.433> predictive<00:14:19.978> analytics<00:14:20.395> that<00:14:20.539> you<00:14:20.619> can<00:14:20.700> apply<00:14:21.036> to<00:14:21.116> your<00:14:21.213> investment<00:14:21.742> thesis,<00:14:22.703> or<00:14:22.960> fill<00:14:23.200> in<00:14:23.280> some<00:14:23.457> of<00:14:23.521> those<00:14:23.761> blanks<00:14:24.226> on<00:14:24.403> data<00:14:24.883> that<00:14:25.060> maybe<00:14:25.461> might<00:14:25.701> have<00:14:25.845> escaped<00:14:26.486> you<00:14:26.967> or<00:14:27.272> us<00:14:27.593> in<00:14:27.689> that<00:14:27.913> process,<00:14:28.298> because<00:14:28.490> it's<00:14:28.651> either<00:14:28.907> super<00:14:29.212> new,<00:14:29.933> maybe<00:14:30.173> it's<00:14:30.285> super<00:14:30.718> old,<00:14:31.038> or<00:14:31.118> maybe<00:14:31.294> it<00:14:31.359> got<00:14:31.599> lost<00:14:31.855> along<00:14:32.096> the<00:14:32.176> way,<00:14:32.416> but<00:14:32.640> AI<00:14:32.881> can<00:14:32.977> kind<00:14:33.137> of<00:14:33.217> fill<00:14:33.377> in<00:14:33.458> those<00:14:33.698> blanks<00:14:34.403> and<00:14:34.483> create<00:14:34.739> that<00:14:34.900> bridge.

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I<00:14:35.797> think<00:14:35.941> it's<00:14:36.021> going<00:14:36.101> to<00:14:36.165> be<00:14:36.246> a<00:14:36.326> really<00:14:36.502> interesting<00:14:36.806> part<00:14:36.967> of<00:14:36.999> the<00:14:37.063> way<00:14:37.159> it<00:14:37.223> works<00:14:37.463> in<00:14:37.543> finance<00:14:38.104> because<00:14:38.345> right<00:14:38.521> now<00:14:38.761> it's<00:14:39.546> so<00:14:39.674> much<00:14:39.851> of<00:14:40.011> AI<00:14:40.652> when<00:14:40.748> I<00:14:40.828> see<00:14:41.084> it<00:14:41.132> and<00:14:41.229> I<00:14:41.245> see<00:14:41.469> friends,<00:14:41.693> the<00:14:41.725> way<00:14:41.870> friends<00:14:42.126> use<00:14:42.350> it,<00:14:42.430> it's<00:14:42.542> like,<00:14:43.376> you<00:14:43.408> know,<00:14:44.577> give<00:14:44.738> me<00:14:45.298> a<00:14:45.459> winning<00:14:45.715> parlay<00:14:46.196> for<00:14:46.372> 6<00:14:46.756> teams<00:14:47.141> tonight<00:14:47.622> in<00:14:47.798> the<00:14:48.423> AL<00:14:48.743> and<00:14:48.823> the<00:14:48.984> NL<00:14:49.544> in<00:14:49.721> baseball.

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And<00:14:50.346> that's<00:14:50.586> like,<00:14:51.083> to<00:14:51.179> me,<00:14:51.547> it's<00:14:51.948> a<00:14:51.964> very<00:14:52.364> front-of-house<00:14:52.989> way<00:14:53.085> to<00:14:53.166> do<00:14:53.390> it.

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And<00:14:53.935> then<00:14:54.031> the<00:14:54.191> other<00:14:54.303> side<00:14:54.688> is<00:14:54.784> like,<00:14:54.992> make<00:14:55.104> a<00:14:55.168> pretty<00:14:55.409> picture<00:14:55.889> of<00:14:55.986> a<00:14:56.114> kid<00:14:56.354> in<00:14:56.450> a<00:14:56.514> field,<00:14:56.995> you<00:14:57.027> know,<00:14:57.492> playing<00:14:57.652> with<00:14:57.748> a<00:14:57.813> kite<00:14:58.615> and<00:14:58.695> it<00:14:58.727> spits<00:14:59.080> out<00:14:59.176> something<00:14:59.481> that<00:14:59.577> has<00:14:59.737> like<00:14:59.914> 7<00:15:00.219> fingers<00:15:00.684> on<00:15:00.796> it<00:15:00.876> or<00:15:00.940> something<00:15:01.245> crazy.

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There's<00:15:02.384> somewhere<00:15:02.785> in<00:15:02.865> between<00:15:03.411> that<00:15:03.507> feels<00:15:03.908> a<00:15:04.052> lot<00:15:04.293> more<00:15:04.614> like<00:15:04.934> application<00:15:05.736> to<00:15:05.833> my,<00:15:06.378> to<00:15:06.731> my<00:15:06.875> knowledge<00:15:07.196> base<00:15:07.421> right<00:15:07.597> now<00:15:07.822> and<00:15:07.918> expanding<00:15:08.559> my<00:15:08.656> knowledge<00:15:09.041> base<00:15:09.345> on<00:15:09.426> something<00:15:09.762> that<00:15:09.907> I<00:15:09.923> know<00:15:10.388> 80%<00:15:10.869> about.

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Give<00:15:11.848> me<00:15:11.928> the<00:15:12.072> other<00:15:12.168> 20%.

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And<00:15:12.650> that's<00:15:13.035> where<00:15:13.115> I<00:15:13.147> see<00:15:13.371> it<00:15:13.436> fitting<00:15:13.628> into<00:15:13.917> our<00:15:14.013> product.

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That's<00:15:14.398> how<00:15:14.430> I'm<00:15:14.575> trying<00:15:14.799> to<00:15:14.879> use<00:15:15.056> it<00:15:15.136> more<00:15:15.280> every<00:15:15.457> day.

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What<00:15:16.596> does<00:15:16.676> a<00:15:16.740> typical<00:15:17.141> day<00:15:17.285> look<00:15:17.462> like<00:15:17.638> for<00:15:17.783> you?

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How<00:15:18.504> do<00:15:18.552> you<00:15:18.649> decide<00:15:18.969> where<00:15:19.066> to<00:15:19.146> spend<00:15:19.370> your<00:15:19.451> time?

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Yeah,<00:15:20.333> I<00:15:20.349> mean,<00:15:20.493> I<00:15:20.590> wake<00:15:20.894> up,<00:15:21.151> I<00:15:21.231> think<00:15:21.376> about<00:15:21.616> every<00:15:21.793> single<00:15:22.097> regret<00:15:22.434> in<00:15:22.514> my<00:15:22.595> entire<00:15:22.980> life,<00:15:23.172> and<00:15:23.284> that's<00:15:23.461> like<00:15:23.637> 30<00:15:23.878> to<00:15:23.958> 40<00:15:24.215> minutes<00:15:24.519> to<00:15:24.584> start<00:15:24.840> the<00:15:24.920> day.

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But<00:15:25.690> then<00:15:25.870> I<00:15:25.910> get<00:15:26.110> to<00:15:26.190> it,<00:15:26.370> you<00:15:26.410> know<00:15:26.470> what<00:15:26.590> I<00:15:26.670> mean?

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I'm<00:15:26.810> hitting<00:15:26.950> these<00:15:27.130> streets.

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I'm<00:15:27.730> trying<00:15:27.731> to<00:15:27.890> sort<00:15:27.891> of—<00:15:28.570> I<00:15:28.571> try<00:15:28.790> to<00:15:28.870> take<00:15:29.110> in<00:15:29.330> as<00:15:29.510> much<00:15:29.650> of<00:15:29.750> what's<00:15:29.910> going<00:15:30.050> on<00:15:30.230> around<00:15:30.370> me<00:15:30.510> as<00:15:30.670> possible<00:15:31.130> and<00:15:31.770> trying<00:15:31.970> to<00:15:32.030> start<00:15:32.210> the<00:15:32.350> day<00:15:32.450> creatively.

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I<00:15:32.950> think<00:15:33.030> I've<00:15:33.210> been—<00:15:33.510> I've<00:15:33.511> tried<00:15:33.610> to<00:15:33.710> do<00:15:33.810> more<00:15:34.150> where,<00:15:35.070> you<00:15:35.190> know,<00:15:35.250> our<00:15:35.470> product<00:15:35.770> right<00:15:35.990> now<00:15:36.770> lives<00:15:37.130> in<00:15:37.290> a<00:15:37.450> place<00:15:37.610> that's<00:15:37.950> very—<00:15:39.560> it's<00:15:40.010> super<00:15:40.390> useful<00:15:40.770> for<00:15:40.930> the<00:15:41.010> people<00:15:41.190> who<00:15:41.350> use<00:15:41.410> it<00:15:41.589> every<00:15:41.690> day.

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And<00:15:42.050> I<00:15:42.070> think<00:15:42.210> that<00:15:42.450> we<00:15:42.690> have<00:15:43.110> tend—<00:15:43.590> as<00:15:43.870> humans,<00:15:44.350> we<00:15:44.570> tend<00:15:44.730> to<00:15:44.810> get<00:15:44.890> lost<00:15:45.170> in<00:15:45.330> our<00:15:45.430> routines<00:15:45.790> and<00:15:45.930> our<00:15:46.130> ceremonies,<00:15:46.900> and<00:15:47.250> it<00:15:47.350> has<00:15:47.430> to<00:15:47.570> get<00:15:47.610> changed<00:15:47.810> up<00:15:47.970> every<00:15:48.130> now<00:15:48.310> and<00:15:48.390> then.

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So<00:15:48.830> for<00:15:48.850> me,<00:15:49.090> on<00:15:49.310> a<00:15:49.530> regular<00:15:49.710> day,<00:15:50.530> you<00:15:50.690> know,<00:15:50.870> after<00:15:51.150> going<00:15:51.290> through<00:15:51.410> all<00:15:51.570> the<00:15:51.571> regrets,<00:15:51.970> I'm<00:15:52.230> sitting<00:15:52.450> down,<00:15:52.790> I'm<00:15:52.910> going<00:15:53.030> through<00:15:53.170> some<00:15:53.350> email,<00:15:53.650> but<00:15:53.810> I'm<00:15:53.950> really<00:15:54.110> thinking<00:15:54.350> about<00:15:55.052> the,<00:15:55.293> the<00:15:55.437> product<00:15:55.871> and<00:15:55.935> the<00:15:56.015> pieces<00:15:56.416> that<00:15:56.513> are<00:15:56.577> missing<00:15:56.962> right<00:15:57.203> now,<00:15:57.475> not<00:15:57.764> for<00:15:58.101> a<00:15:58.246> week<00:15:58.358> from<00:15:58.487> now<00:15:58.663> or<00:15:58.743> 2<00:15:58.904> weeks<00:15:59.016> from<00:15:59.177> now,<00:15:59.385> but<00:15:59.530> trying<00:15:59.722> to<00:15:59.771> think<00:15:59.883> about<00:16:00.108> big<00:16:00.268> picture.

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I'll<00:16:01.263> sketch<00:16:01.488> some<00:16:01.648> stuff<00:16:02.017> out,<00:16:02.290> I'll<00:16:02.419> throw<00:16:02.531> some<00:16:02.675> ideas<00:16:02.996> on<00:16:03.077> paper,<00:16:03.333> I'll<00:16:03.478> share<00:16:03.719> that<00:16:03.799> with<00:16:03.879> some<00:16:04.056> of<00:16:04.120> our<00:16:04.264> product<00:16:04.601> team,<00:16:04.938> usually<00:16:05.259> probably<00:16:05.901> around<00:16:06.206> midday.

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And<00:16:07.330> then<00:16:07.635> the<00:16:07.699> majority<00:16:08.228> of<00:16:08.293> what<00:16:08.357> I'm<00:16:08.453> trying<00:16:08.678> to<00:16:08.774> do<00:16:09.175> is,<00:16:09.721> for<00:16:09.881> the<00:16:10.122> rest<00:16:10.379> of<00:16:10.411> these<00:16:10.620> days,<00:16:11.085> is<00:16:11.326> really<00:16:11.583> sort<00:16:11.759> of<00:16:11.823> work<00:16:12.000> on<00:16:12.128> relationships.

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And<00:16:12.818> that's<00:16:12.995> something<00:16:13.188> that<00:16:13.894> for<00:16:14.054> 3,<00:16:14.247> 4<00:16:14.616> years<00:16:14.776> when<00:16:14.873> we<00:16:14.969> were<00:16:15.033> putting<00:16:15.210> this<00:16:15.354> business<00:16:15.659> together,<00:16:16.413> so<00:16:16.654> much<00:16:16.943> of<00:16:17.039> it<00:16:17.120> was<00:16:17.264> hammer<00:16:17.521> to<00:16:17.585> nail.

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It<00:16:18.099> was<00:16:18.307> find<00:16:18.548> some<00:16:18.708> assets,<00:16:19.591> get<00:16:19.752> some<00:16:19.912> demand<00:16:20.233> pools<00:16:20.506> going,<00:16:21.132> make<00:16:21.228> sure<00:16:21.453> we're,<00:16:21.773> you<00:16:21.854> know,<00:16:22.014> pushing<00:16:22.255> this<00:16:22.399> across<00:16:22.656> content,<00:16:23.538> that<00:16:23.682> we're<00:16:23.779> doing<00:16:23.955> enough<00:16:24.324> to<00:16:24.404> make<00:16:24.500> sure<00:16:24.725> people<00:16:24.918> know<00:16:25.062> who<00:16:25.222> we<00:16:25.447> are,<00:16:25.784> what<00:16:25.944> we<00:16:26.089> have,<00:16:26.361> and<00:16:26.425> how<00:16:26.522> to<00:16:26.586> get<00:16:26.746> your<00:16:26.891> hands<00:16:27.131> on<00:16:27.228> these<00:16:27.372> individual<00:16:27.853> assets<00:16:28.110> and<00:16:28.254> shares<00:16:28.607> of<00:16:28.735> those<00:16:28.976> assets.

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And<00:16:29.955> now<00:16:30.211> it's<00:16:30.356> about<00:16:30.660> sort<00:16:30.837> of<00:16:30.901> scaling<00:16:31.238> the<00:16:31.318> business.

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I<00:16:31.880> think<00:16:32.040> that<00:16:32.746> we've<00:16:32.842> been<00:16:33.083> lucky<00:16:33.580> in<00:16:33.708> that<00:16:33.805> a<00:16:33.821> lot<00:16:34.029> of<00:16:34.061> people<00:16:34.254> have<00:16:34.302> invested<00:16:34.671> in<00:16:34.751> our<00:16:34.847> company,<00:16:35.569> a<00:16:35.633> lot<00:16:35.746> of<00:16:35.826> individual<00:16:36.355> investors<00:16:36.756> who've<00:16:36.852> come<00:16:37.013> in<00:16:37.093> and<00:16:37.189> invested<00:16:37.558> in<00:16:37.799> assets.

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They<00:16:38.793> know<00:16:38.938> that<00:16:39.082> we're<00:16:39.243> here<00:16:39.483> for<00:16:39.884> the<00:16:40.045> long<00:16:40.301> term,<00:16:40.606> and<00:16:40.767> they<00:16:40.927> look<00:16:41.039> at<00:16:41.168> it<00:16:41.248> like<00:16:41.424> it's<00:16:41.585> not<00:16:41.745> that<00:16:41.841> flash<00:16:42.082> in<00:16:42.226> the<00:16:42.371> pan,<00:16:42.852> 2<00:16:43.012> years,<00:16:43.269> 3<00:16:43.510> years,<00:16:43.895> everyone<00:16:44.023> makes<00:16:44.215> a<00:16:44.231> ton<00:16:44.408> of<00:16:44.456> money,<00:16:44.697> we<00:16:44.729> sell<00:16:44.953> the<00:16:45.034> business<00:16:45.354> and<00:16:45.499> get<00:16:45.659> out.

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They<00:16:46.477> see<00:16:46.782> it<00:16:46.862> as<00:16:46.910> something<00:16:47.199> that's<00:16:47.424> developing<00:16:47.921> not<00:16:48.226> just<00:16:48.482> for<00:16:48.627> Rally<00:16:48.948> as<00:16:49.044> a<00:16:49.108> platform<00:16:49.605> but<00:16:49.686> for<00:16:49.798> these<00:16:49.990> asset<00:16:50.327> classes<00:16:50.744> that<00:16:50.889> are<00:16:51.033> relatively<00:16:51.546> new.

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So<00:16:52.429> a<00:16:52.493> lot<00:16:52.653> of<00:16:52.717> what<00:16:52.765> my<00:16:52.958> day's<00:16:53.294> been<00:16:53.455> is<00:16:53.487> sort<00:16:53.679> of<00:16:53.776> thinking<00:16:54.016> about<00:16:54.241> how<00:16:54.401> we<00:16:54.433> scale<00:16:54.722> this<00:16:54.898> business.

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And<00:16:55.379> that's<00:16:55.780> talking<00:16:56.165> to—<00:16:56.822> whether<00:16:56.967> it's<00:16:57.047> talking<00:16:57.255> to<00:16:57.288> individual<00:16:57.624> sports<00:16:57.945> leagues<00:16:58.266> or<00:16:58.346> it's<00:16:58.490> talking<00:16:58.763> to<00:16:58.827> sort<00:16:59.003> of<00:16:59.132> asset<00:16:59.452> owners<00:16:59.709> or<00:16:59.853> auction<00:17:00.094> houses,<00:17:00.992> thinking<00:17:01.249> about<00:17:01.457> a<00:17:01.537> way<00:17:01.714> that<00:17:01.858> we<00:17:01.954> can<00:17:02.050> acquire<00:17:02.612> and<00:17:02.740> having<00:17:02.884> the<00:17:02.916> conversations<00:17:03.638> for<00:17:03.702> the<00:17:03.798> best<00:17:04.103> way<00:17:04.199> that<00:17:04.279> we<00:17:04.360> can<00:17:04.456> acquire<00:17:04.905> assets,<00:17:05.803> that<00:17:05.947> we<00:17:06.027> can<00:17:06.108> make<00:17:06.300> money<00:17:06.508> on<00:17:06.541> those<00:17:06.749> assets<00:17:07.086> for<00:17:07.246> our<00:17:07.567> investors,<00:17:08.128> for<00:17:08.224> ourselves,<00:17:08.609> for<00:17:08.689> the<00:17:08.834> business,<00:17:09.571> and<00:17:09.652> then<00:17:09.892> exit<00:17:10.133> those<00:17:10.357> assets<00:17:10.678> when<00:17:10.726> the<00:17:10.790> time<00:17:11.095> is<00:17:11.239> right<00:17:11.576> and<00:17:11.736> doing<00:17:12.121> all<00:17:12.153> of<00:17:12.217> that<00:17:12.378> with<00:17:12.522> the<00:17:12.682> right<00:17:12.859> people.

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And<00:17:13.821> this<00:17:13.997> is<00:17:14.062> an<00:17:14.142> industry,<00:17:15.585> considering<00:17:16.002> that<00:17:16.146> we're<00:17:16.226> in<00:17:16.307> 23,<00:17:16.868> 24<00:17:17.205> different<00:17:17.413> categories<00:17:17.910> right<00:17:18.071> now,<00:17:18.568> It's<00:17:18.696> got<00:17:18.808> so<00:17:19.048> many<00:17:19.193> different<00:17:19.513> players,<00:17:19.914> and<00:17:19.962> a<00:17:19.994> lot<00:17:20.058> of<00:17:20.154> those<00:17:20.378> relationships<00:17:21.035> we've<00:17:21.420> kind<00:17:21.564> of<00:17:21.596> been<00:17:21.676> forging<00:17:22.077> for<00:17:22.221> the<00:17:22.301> better<00:17:22.478> part<00:17:22.654> of<00:17:22.718> 5<00:17:23.038> or<00:17:23.103> 6<00:17:23.359> years,<00:17:24.160> and<00:17:24.224> they're<00:17:24.304> at<00:17:24.384> a<00:17:24.481> point<00:17:24.721> now<00:17:25.041> that<00:17:25.682> the<00:17:25.763> cream<00:17:26.003> has<00:17:26.099> kind<00:17:26.243> of<00:17:26.275> risen<00:17:26.484> to<00:17:26.564> the<00:17:26.644> top,<00:17:26.900> and<00:17:27.044> the<00:17:27.077> people<00:17:27.221> that<00:17:27.301> are<00:17:27.365> going<00:17:27.445> to<00:17:27.589> be<00:17:27.685> around<00:17:28.326> are<00:17:28.407> still<00:17:28.663> here.

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And<00:17:29.608> those<00:17:29.865> are<00:17:29.913> the<00:17:29.993> conversations<00:17:30.426> I'm<00:17:30.570> trying<00:17:30.730> to<00:17:30.810> have<00:17:31.051> for<00:17:31.115> the<00:17:31.371> bulk<00:17:31.627> of<00:17:31.708> the<00:17:31.820> middle<00:17:32.012> of<00:17:32.108> each<00:17:32.332> day.

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And<00:17:33.214> those<00:17:33.390> are<00:17:33.454> the<00:17:33.534> ones<00:17:33.759> that<00:17:33.839> I<00:17:33.935> think<00:17:34.319> they<00:17:34.416> don't<00:17:34.576> necessarily<00:17:34.976> pay<00:17:35.137> dividends<00:17:35.537> right<00:17:35.762> now,<00:17:35.938> but<00:17:36.018> in<00:17:36.098> the<00:17:36.194> future<00:17:36.515> they'll<00:17:36.723> be<00:17:37.060> incredibly<00:17:37.604> impactful<00:17:38.021> and<00:17:38.165> meaningful<00:17:38.678> for<00:17:38.902> our<00:17:39.047> user<00:17:39.303> base,<00:17:39.543> for<00:17:39.688> our<00:17:39.752> investors,<00:17:40.280> and<00:17:40.409> for<00:17:40.457> the<00:17:40.505> future<00:17:40.745> of<00:17:40.825> this<00:17:40.969> platform.

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That's<00:17:41.626> what<00:17:41.771> a<00:17:41.851> lot<00:17:42.027> of<00:17:42.059> my<00:17:42.187> focus<00:17:42.492> has<00:17:42.668> been<00:17:43.453> outside<00:17:43.870> of<00:17:43.950> trying<00:17:44.158> to<00:17:44.190> make<00:17:44.335> sure<00:17:44.591> that<00:17:45.088> I'm<00:17:45.232> doing<00:17:45.409> as<00:17:45.537> much<00:17:45.713> design<00:17:46.259> and<00:17:46.355> doing<00:17:46.516> it<00:17:46.596> and<00:17:46.740> getting<00:17:47.221> as<00:17:47.382> many<00:17:47.639> thoughts<00:17:47.959> on<00:17:48.120> paper<00:17:48.938> so<00:17:49.082> you<00:17:49.163> don't<00:17:49.323> lose<00:17:49.564> that<00:17:49.788> edge.

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Because,<00:17:50.205> man,<00:17:50.398> I'm,<00:17:50.863> I'm<00:17:51.328> getting<00:17:51.473> a<00:17:51.489> little<00:17:51.633> bit<00:17:51.794> older<00:17:51.986> now<00:17:52.114> and<00:17:52.355> I<00:17:52.371> see<00:17:52.531> these<00:17:52.772> young<00:17:52.997> kids<00:17:53.269> now,<00:17:53.494> these,<00:17:53.735> these<00:17:53.959> 18,<00:17:54.248> 19-year-old,<00:17:54.761> 20-year-olds,<00:17:55.178> they're<00:17:55.323> running<00:17:55.596> circles<00:17:56.301> around<00:17:56.622> me<00:17:56.767> when<00:17:56.863> it<00:17:56.927> comes<00:17:57.168> to<00:17:57.424> the<00:17:57.649> actual<00:17:58.130> design.

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So<00:17:58.788> I<00:17:58.932> can't<00:17:59.269> lose<00:17:59.510> that.

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I'm<00:17:59.831> trying<00:18:00.055> to<00:18:00.087> stay—<00:18:00.376> I'm<00:18:00.793> trying<00:18:00.954> to<00:18:00.986> do<00:18:01.082> as<00:18:01.178> much<00:18:01.355> of<00:18:01.419> that<00:18:01.531> as<00:18:01.676> possible<00:18:02.221> early<00:18:02.381> in<00:18:02.430> the<00:18:02.478> day<00:18:02.799> when<00:18:02.863> my<00:18:02.959> brain<00:18:03.216> is<00:18:03.264> still<00:18:03.440> firing,<00:18:03.921> you<00:18:03.986> know?

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Yeah.

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And<00:18:06.472> what<00:18:06.568> is<00:18:06.713> your<00:18:06.809> relationship<00:18:07.371> like<00:18:07.531> with<00:18:07.675> the<00:18:07.756> leagues<00:18:08.012> and<00:18:08.157> how<00:18:08.253> did<00:18:08.429> you<00:18:08.574> build<00:18:09.039> that<00:18:09.215> relationship?

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I<00:18:10.515> mean,<00:18:10.900> we<00:18:11.060> got<00:18:11.542> We<00:18:11.622> got<00:18:11.862> lucky<00:18:12.262> early<00:18:12.503> on<00:18:12.823> when<00:18:12.983> we<00:18:13.144> sort<00:18:13.400> of<00:18:13.448> started,<00:18:13.929> when<00:18:14.009> the<00:18:14.169> platform<00:18:14.505> started<00:18:14.730> growing,<00:18:15.146> the<00:18:15.371> asset<00:18:15.707> class<00:18:16.108> that<00:18:16.332> worked<00:18:16.652> best<00:18:16.909> for<00:18:17.133> us<00:18:17.309> and<00:18:17.373> the<00:18:17.453> one<00:18:17.870> that<00:18:18.030> generated<00:18:18.350> the<00:18:18.431> most<00:18:18.655> interest,<00:18:19.055> generated<00:18:19.312> the<00:18:19.392> biggest<00:18:19.632> returns<00:18:20.273> and<00:18:20.353> got<00:18:20.513> the<00:18:20.577> most<00:18:20.754> investors<00:18:21.218> involved<00:18:22.195> was<00:18:22.356> in<00:18:22.436> the<00:18:22.516> sports<00:18:22.836> category<00:18:23.397> because<00:18:23.653> it's<00:18:24.583> a<00:18:24.599> huge<00:18:25.239> pool<00:18:25.784> with<00:18:25.960> massive<00:18:26.521> fandom<00:18:27.242> and<00:18:27.386> then<00:18:27.482> a<00:18:27.498> lot<00:18:27.899> of<00:18:28.043> collectibility<00:18:28.844> that<00:18:29.004> goes<00:18:29.309> with<00:18:29.485> it<00:18:29.629> in<00:18:29.709> a<00:18:29.805> bunch<00:18:29.982> of<00:18:30.046> different<00:18:30.286> places.

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So<00:18:30.863> whether<00:18:31.071> it's<00:18:31.231> trading<00:18:31.568> cards<00:18:32.465> or<00:18:32.609> game<00:18:32.930> worn<00:18:33.042> memorabilia<00:18:33.827> or<00:18:33.955> tickets<00:18:34.932> or<00:18:35.012> it's<00:18:35.237> IP<00:18:35.797> that<00:18:35.957> right<00:18:36.198> now<00:18:36.614> when<00:18:36.694> Top<00:18:37.015> Shot<00:18:37.319> came<00:18:37.576> out,<00:18:37.672> when<00:18:37.800> NBA<00:18:37.976> Top<00:18:38.216> Shot<00:18:38.457> came<00:18:38.617> out,<00:18:38.697> that<00:18:38.841> kind<00:18:38.985> of<00:18:39.017> changed<00:18:39.322> the<00:18:39.354> dynamic<00:18:39.754> around<00:18:39.979> what<00:18:40.203> IP<00:18:40.523> actually<00:18:40.860> is<00:18:40.940> and<00:18:41.020> what<00:18:41.164> it<00:18:41.260> means<00:18:41.437> in<00:18:41.485> the<00:18:41.565> future.

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It<00:18:42.607> had<00:18:42.945> the<00:18:43.025> attention<00:18:43.507> of<00:18:43.587> the<00:18:43.668> collective<00:18:44.053> masses,<00:18:44.551> of<00:18:44.712> retail,<00:18:45.676> of<00:18:45.756> institutions,<00:18:46.559> and<00:18:46.704> of<00:18:46.864> these<00:18:47.041> massive<00:18:47.507> leagues<00:18:47.748> that<00:18:47.828> wanted<00:18:48.053> to<00:18:48.150> foster<00:18:48.487> the<00:18:48.631> relationship<00:18:49.033> with<00:18:49.274> all<00:18:49.354> of<00:18:49.435> those<00:18:49.611> people.

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So<00:18:50.656> when<00:18:50.800> we<00:18:50.880> were<00:18:51.282> raising<00:18:51.684> our<00:18:52.262> Series<00:18:52.664> B,<00:18:53.611> we<00:18:53.788> immediately<00:18:54.270> started<00:18:54.447> thinking<00:18:54.639> about<00:18:54.816> what<00:18:54.993> leagues<00:18:55.153> can<00:18:55.218> we<00:18:55.250> talk<00:18:55.555> to?

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And<00:18:56.198> we<00:18:56.278> got<00:18:56.422> a<00:18:56.439> bunch<00:18:56.744> of<00:18:57.145> athletes<00:18:57.483> involved<00:18:58.045> in<00:18:58.125> the<00:18:58.206> NBA<00:18:58.848> and<00:18:58.993> in<00:18:59.089> Major<00:18:59.314> League<00:18:59.410> Baseball.

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MLB<00:19:00.953> as<00:19:01.033> an<00:19:01.113> organization<00:19:01.724> came<00:19:01.965> in<00:19:02.077> and<00:19:02.125> was<00:19:02.286> part<00:19:02.479> of<00:19:02.543> that<00:19:02.703> round<00:19:03.025> as<00:19:03.169> well.

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So<00:19:04.085> it's<00:19:04.294> always<00:19:04.551> been,<00:19:05.193> when<00:19:05.338> the<00:19:05.418> time<00:19:05.659> is<00:19:05.756> right,<00:19:05.916> let's<00:19:06.109> talk<00:19:06.302> about<00:19:07.041> doing<00:19:07.266> something<00:19:07.603> together.

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And<00:19:08.181> I<00:19:08.229> think<00:19:08.326> that<00:19:08.487> that<00:19:08.727> was<00:19:08.968> to<00:19:09.354> us<00:19:09.996> started<00:19:10.477> over<00:19:10.589> the<00:19:10.653> course<00:19:10.893> of<00:19:10.973> the<00:19:11.054> last<00:19:11.438> year,<00:19:11.855> and<00:19:11.935> we've<00:19:12.095> gotten<00:19:12.400> way<00:19:12.576> more<00:19:12.800> focused<00:19:13.441> as<00:19:13.618> GameMore<00:19:13.954> memorabilia<00:19:14.499> has<00:19:14.659> taken<00:19:15.044> off,<00:19:15.765> as<00:19:15.941> sort<00:19:16.085> of<00:19:16.566> us<00:19:16.742> and<00:19:16.822> our<00:19:16.983> relationships<00:19:17.688> with<00:19:18.088> athletes<00:19:18.505> and<00:19:18.601> individuals<00:19:19.130> who<00:19:19.210> love<00:19:19.322> sports<00:19:19.707> and<00:19:19.771> the<00:19:19.851> fans<00:19:20.124> of<00:19:20.188> sports<00:19:20.508> has<00:19:20.668> grown.

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The<00:19:22.255> assets<00:19:22.511> on<00:19:22.591> the<00:19:22.672> platform<00:19:23.216> that<00:19:23.377> matter<00:19:23.601> most<00:19:23.938> are<00:19:23.970> the<00:19:24.034> ones<00:19:24.178> that<00:19:24.274> matter<00:19:24.450> most<00:19:24.659> to<00:19:24.755> fans<00:19:25.171> as<00:19:25.316> well.

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I<00:19:25.796> think<00:19:25.957> that<00:19:26.117> for<00:19:26.341> us,<00:19:26.582> we've<00:19:26.758> gone<00:19:27.142> to<00:19:27.623> each<00:19:27.719> of<00:19:27.783> these<00:19:27.944> leagues<00:19:28.104> individually<00:19:29.322> and<00:19:29.386> we<00:19:29.466> talked<00:19:29.739> about<00:19:29.963> what<00:19:30.107> it<00:19:30.139> could<00:19:30.363> be<00:19:30.604> to<00:19:30.684> sort<00:19:30.908> of<00:19:31.245> open<00:19:31.469> up<00:19:31.629> access<00:19:32.030> to<00:19:32.190> fans<00:19:32.687> in<00:19:32.767> a<00:19:32.831> more<00:19:33.072> meaningful<00:19:33.568> way<00:19:33.889> to<00:19:34.049> the<00:19:34.209> past<00:19:34.690> and<00:19:34.786> to<00:19:34.915> the<00:19:34.995> future.

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So<00:19:36.615> we<00:19:36.776> started<00:19:37.001> talking<00:19:37.209> to<00:19:37.258> a<00:19:37.322> few<00:19:37.482> people<00:19:37.723> about<00:19:37.884> like<00:19:38.141> what<00:19:38.365> that<00:19:38.542> looks<00:19:38.767> like.

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And<00:19:39.505> it's<00:19:39.666> likely,<00:19:40.212> you<00:19:40.244> know,<00:19:40.533> the<00:19:40.613> way<00:19:40.790> I<00:19:41.095> hope<00:19:41.352> to<00:19:41.448> see<00:19:41.609> it<00:19:41.673> in<00:19:41.753> the<00:19:41.834> future<00:19:42.171> is<00:19:42.315> that<00:19:42.958> right<00:19:43.054> now<00:19:43.134> I'm<00:19:43.295> in<00:19:43.375> our<00:19:43.455> museum<00:19:43.841> space<00:19:44.082> here<00:19:44.226> in<00:19:44.258> SoHo,<00:19:44.884> which<00:19:45.045> is<00:19:45.109> like<00:19:45.206> a<00:19:45.270> physical<00:19:45.607> space,<00:19:45.912> has<00:19:46.024> a<00:19:46.089> bunch<00:19:46.233> of<00:19:46.313> our<00:19:46.394> stuff<00:19:46.651> on<00:19:46.731> display.

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It's<00:19:47.357> open<00:19:47.534> during<00:19:47.694> the<00:19:47.775> weekends.

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We<00:19:48.272> have<00:19:48.353> a<00:19:48.369> little<00:19:48.577> coffee<00:19:48.883> shop<00:19:49.139> in<00:19:49.204> the<00:19:49.284> front.

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I<00:19:50.328> would<00:19:50.408> love<00:19:50.601> to<00:19:50.649> take<00:19:50.906> this<00:19:51.387> and<00:19:51.484> have<00:19:51.709> this<00:19:51.949> be<00:19:52.030> a<00:19:52.110> carve-out<00:19:52.672> in<00:19:52.752> a<00:19:52.768> stadium<00:19:53.154> at<00:19:53.234> some<00:19:53.475> point<00:19:53.651> or<00:19:53.780> have<00:19:53.940> it<00:19:54.037> be<00:19:54.117> in<00:19:54.278> arenas.

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And<00:19:55.707> you<00:19:55.739> see<00:19:56.060> now<00:19:56.445> when,<00:19:56.911> when<00:19:57.248> gambling<00:19:57.810> sort<00:19:58.051> of,<00:19:58.436> you<00:19:58.468> know,<00:19:58.677> when,<00:19:59.335> when<00:19:59.480> sports<00:19:59.801> gambling<00:20:00.122> became<00:20:01.166> less<00:20:01.406> faux<00:20:01.583> pas<00:20:02.144> and<00:20:02.545> not<00:20:02.770> just<00:20:03.011> accepted<00:20:03.460> by<00:20:03.572> everybody,<00:20:03.893> but<00:20:04.133> also<00:20:04.390> integrated<00:20:04.775> with<00:20:04.936> the<00:20:05.096> leagues.

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That<00:20:06.074> to<00:20:06.171> me<00:20:06.395> was<00:20:06.572> a<00:20:06.877> pretty<00:20:07.181> obvious<00:20:07.582> moment<00:20:08.721> in<00:20:08.802> that,<00:20:09.828> you<00:20:09.860> know,<00:20:10.229> every<00:20:10.422> fan<00:20:10.727> is<00:20:10.791> a<00:20:10.807> speculator<00:20:11.352> in<00:20:11.384> some<00:20:11.609> capacity.

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Every<00:20:12.491> fan,<00:20:13.357> you<00:20:13.389> know,<00:20:13.534> cares<00:20:13.855> about,<00:20:14.256> you<00:20:14.352> know,<00:20:14.657> having<00:20:14.897> them<00:20:15.138> putting<00:20:15.298> their<00:20:15.363> money<00:20:15.523> where<00:20:15.619> their<00:20:15.715> mouth<00:20:16.020> is.

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There's<00:20:17.047> a<00:20:17.127> way<00:20:17.223> to<00:20:17.320> do<00:20:17.464> that<00:20:17.608> with<00:20:17.785> gambling<00:20:18.282> and<00:20:18.362> there's<00:20:18.523> a<00:20:18.571> way<00:20:18.683> to<00:20:18.731> do<00:20:18.827> that<00:20:18.924> with<00:20:19.068> investing.

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And<00:20:19.790> I<00:20:19.870> see<00:20:20.191> this<00:20:20.977> as<00:20:21.154> not<00:20:21.314> just<00:20:21.474> a<00:20:21.555> compliment<00:20:22.036> to<00:20:22.116> what<00:20:22.276> the<00:20:22.421> leagues<00:20:22.838> and<00:20:22.918> what<00:20:23.078> teams<00:20:23.335> are<00:20:23.463> doing<00:20:23.704> right<00:20:23.881> now,<00:20:24.586> but<00:20:24.667> as<00:20:24.763> a<00:20:24.843> way<00:20:24.923> to<00:20:25.084> grow<00:20:25.405> fandom<00:20:26.030> and<00:20:26.110> to<00:20:26.191> sort<00:20:26.367> of<00:20:26.672> have<00:20:26.848> something<00:20:27.249> where<00:20:27.634> when<00:20:27.795> I,<00:20:28.132> when<00:20:28.276> people<00:20:28.533> walk<00:20:28.758> into<00:20:28.934> this<00:20:29.095> museum,<00:20:29.978> I<00:20:29.994> see<00:20:30.155> it<00:20:30.283> all<00:20:30.315> the<00:20:30.379> time,<00:20:30.700> and<00:20:30.765> they<00:20:31.005> own<00:20:31.327> assets,<00:20:31.583> they<00:20:31.728> own<00:20:31.824> shares<00:20:32.226> in<00:20:32.370> any<00:20:32.450> of<00:20:32.499> these<00:20:32.691> assets,<00:20:33.494> they're<00:20:33.590> with<00:20:33.735> their<00:20:33.831> family,<00:20:34.233> they're<00:20:34.377> telling<00:20:34.554> them<00:20:34.698> all<00:20:34.794> about<00:20:34.971> it,<00:20:35.116> they're<00:20:35.196> saying<00:20:35.437> when<00:20:35.597> they<00:20:35.758> bought<00:20:35.934> it,<00:20:35.983> they're<00:20:36.159> talking<00:20:36.480> through<00:20:36.577> the<00:20:36.705> history<00:20:37.042> of<00:20:37.122> the<00:20:37.203> individual<00:20:37.684> item.

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To<00:20:38.487> be<00:20:38.567> able<00:20:38.728> to<00:20:38.792> do<00:20:38.888> that<00:20:39.129> in<00:20:39.226> a<00:20:39.274> stadium,<00:20:39.627> in<00:20:39.772> an<00:20:39.868> arena,<00:20:40.799> for<00:20:40.895> a<00:20:40.960> team<00:20:41.216> that<00:20:41.377> you<00:20:41.538> follow<00:20:42.003> generationally<00:20:42.661> for<00:20:42.758> your<00:20:42.886> entire<00:20:43.223> family<00:20:43.721> and<00:20:43.801> it's<00:20:43.930> been<00:20:44.090> passed<00:20:44.347> down<00:20:44.572> to<00:20:44.733> you,<00:20:45.375> I<00:20:45.455> think<00:20:45.567> is<00:20:45.712> a<00:20:45.856> really<00:20:46.129> important<00:20:46.595> unlock.

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We've<00:20:47.478> seen<00:20:47.719> it<00:20:47.815> a<00:20:47.944> little<00:20:48.200> bit<00:20:48.361> in<00:20:48.441> kind<00:20:48.618> of<00:20:48.682> fantasy<00:20:49.260> sports<00:20:50.031> and<00:20:50.191> gambling<00:20:50.609> parlors<00:20:51.331> in<00:20:51.411> individual<00:20:51.893> stadiums<00:20:52.439> worldwide.

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I<00:20:53.017> think<00:20:53.177> the<00:20:53.274> next<00:20:53.579> step<00:20:53.820> for<00:20:53.964> that<00:20:54.560> is<00:20:54.706> collectibles<00:20:55.353> and<00:20:55.434> the<00:20:55.499> idea<00:20:55.757> of,<00:20:56.389> you<00:20:56.421> know,<00:20:56.631> Yankees<00:20:56.955> having<00:20:57.133> Monument<00:20:57.538> Park<00:20:57.861> and<00:20:57.942> also<00:20:58.120> having<00:20:58.347> the<00:20:58.428> space<00:20:58.832> where<00:20:58.978> there's<00:20:59.091> a<00:20:59.156> bunch<00:20:59.334> of<00:20:59.399> collectibles<00:20:59.884> that<00:21:00.030> you<00:21:00.111> can<00:21:00.208> invest<00:21:00.612> in<00:21:00.693> on<00:21:00.774> the<00:21:00.855> spot<00:21:01.260> or<00:21:01.292> that<00:21:01.405> you<00:21:01.567> own<00:21:01.664> shares<00:21:02.053> in<00:21:02.134> when<00:21:02.215> you<00:21:02.296> go<00:21:02.393> to<00:21:02.474> that<00:21:02.635> game<00:21:02.975> is<00:21:03.121> where<00:21:03.267> I<00:21:03.347> want<00:21:03.428> to<00:21:03.461> see<00:21:03.687> this<00:21:03.849> going.

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What<00:21:05.495> do<00:21:05.528> you<00:21:05.627> know<00:21:05.874> now<00:21:06.352> that<00:21:06.517> you<00:21:06.616> wish<00:21:06.780> you<00:21:06.846> would<00:21:06.945> have<00:21:07.093> known<00:21:07.373> at<00:21:07.439> the<00:21:07.538> beginning<00:21:07.933> of<00:21:08.016> your<00:21:08.181> career?

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Oh,<00:21:10.584> man.

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There's<00:21:11.295> a<00:21:11.311> lot<00:21:11.376> of<00:21:11.473> different<00:21:11.700> ways<00:21:11.861> to<00:21:11.894> get<00:21:12.039> money,<00:21:12.298> I<00:21:12.363> think<00:21:12.525> is<00:21:12.606> the<00:21:12.751> big<00:21:12.913> one.

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Like,<00:21:13.253> we<00:21:13.430> immediately<00:21:14.142> went<00:21:14.369> for<00:21:14.450> VC<00:21:14.773> money.

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Some<00:21:15.841> of<00:21:15.938> it's<00:21:16.083> been<00:21:16.245> good,<00:21:16.488> some<00:21:16.649> of<00:21:16.746> it's<00:21:16.876> been<00:21:16.973> bad.

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Some<00:21:17.329> of<00:21:17.361> our<00:21:17.458> relationships,<00:21:18.105> for<00:21:18.218> the<00:21:18.267> most<00:21:18.510> part,<00:21:18.768> relationships<00:21:19.237> are<00:21:19.383> great.

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But<00:21:20.168> in<00:21:20.232> reality,<00:21:20.954> you<00:21:21.002> know,<00:21:21.178> I<00:21:21.210> see<00:21:21.595> a<00:21:21.611> lot<00:21:21.772> of<00:21:21.820> people<00:21:22.044> who<00:21:22.156> bootstrap<00:21:22.638> start<00:21:22.862> to<00:21:22.958> finish.

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At<00:21:23.536> this<00:21:23.744> point<00:21:23.984> for<00:21:24.161> us,<00:21:24.337> it<00:21:24.706> probably<00:21:25.027> wasn't<00:21:25.267> an<00:21:25.428> option.

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But<00:21:27.031> there's<00:21:27.288> a,<00:21:27.448> there's<00:21:27.753> a,<00:21:28.250> there's<00:21:28.554> much<00:21:28.875> more<00:21:29.036> to<00:21:29.132> be<00:21:29.228> said<00:21:29.773> and<00:21:29.853> we're<00:21:29.934> starting<00:21:30.222> to<00:21:30.254> see<00:21:30.415> it<00:21:30.495> now<00:21:31.296> in<00:21:31.521> having<00:21:31.858> independence<00:21:32.499> and<00:21:32.579> not<00:21:32.820> being<00:21:33.060> beholden<00:21:33.541> to<00:21:33.606> somebody<00:21:33.942> else's<00:21:34.199> view<00:21:34.407> of<00:21:34.504> your<00:21:34.648> product.

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As<00:21:36.492> much<00:21:36.668> conviction<00:21:37.390> as<00:21:37.534> I've<00:21:37.646> always<00:21:37.855> had<00:21:37.967> about<00:21:38.176> this<00:21:38.336> business<00:21:38.849> and<00:21:38.897> about<00:21:39.074> what<00:21:39.154> we've<00:21:39.458> built,<00:21:40.661> I'm,<00:21:41.094> I'm<00:21:41.318> not<00:21:41.559> impervious<00:21:41.976> to<00:21:42.104> other<00:21:42.264> people's<00:21:42.505> opinions.

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And<00:21:43.563> especially<00:21:44.189> when<00:21:44.301> someone's<00:21:44.670> given<00:21:44.910> you<00:21:45.167> $10<00:21:45.423> or<00:21:45.568> $15<00:21:45.904> or<00:21:45.985> $20<00:21:46.289> million,<00:21:47.428> it's<00:21:47.572> kind<00:21:47.797> of<00:21:47.829> like<00:21:48.439> the<00:21:48.535> conversation<00:21:49.161> starts<00:21:49.578> and<00:21:49.659> their<00:21:49.803> opinion<00:21:50.156> is<00:21:50.381> right.

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There's<00:21:51.264> no<00:21:51.568> world<00:21:51.825> where<00:21:51.906> I'm<00:21:52.066> telling<00:21:52.387> them,<00:21:53.494> "Nah,<00:21:53.751> get<00:21:53.896> out<00:21:53.928> of<00:21:53.976> my<00:21:54.072> face.

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You're<00:21:54.939> wrong.

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You<00:21:55.420> have<00:21:55.693> to<00:21:55.821> listen<00:21:56.078> to<00:21:56.239> it."<00:21:56.881> I'm<00:21:56.961> a<00:21:57.121> bad<00:21:57.346> listener<00:21:57.683> at<00:21:57.763> times.

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Someone<00:21:58.389> talks<00:21:58.646> to<00:21:58.726> me<00:21:58.790> and<00:21:58.887> tells<00:21:59.111> me<00:21:59.208> what<00:21:59.352> I<00:21:59.368> should<00:21:59.609> be<00:21:59.689> doing,<00:21:59.914> what<00:22:00.010> I<00:22:00.026> shouldn't<00:22:00.379> be<00:22:00.476> doing,<00:22:00.732> I'm<00:22:00.813> immediately<00:22:01.294> on<00:22:01.455> defense.

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Like,<00:22:01.936> that<00:22:02.080> happens<00:22:02.642> all<00:22:02.738> the<00:22:02.835> time<00:22:03.059> in<00:22:03.220> my<00:22:03.364> regular<00:22:03.701> life,<00:22:03.958> in<00:22:04.022> my<00:22:04.103> personal<00:22:04.568> life,<00:22:04.889> in<00:22:04.937> my<00:22:05.130> work<00:22:05.306> life.

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But<00:22:06.285> when<00:22:06.414> someone's<00:22:06.751> giving<00:22:06.975> you<00:22:07.056> money,<00:22:07.858> I<00:22:07.890> think<00:22:08.035> that<00:22:08.532> I'm<00:22:08.901> always<00:22:09.543> way<00:22:09.736> more<00:22:10.185> open<00:22:10.442> to<00:22:10.602> what<00:22:10.763> they're<00:22:10.923> telling<00:22:11.244> me,<00:22:12.031> as<00:22:12.143> it<00:22:12.207> kind<00:22:12.448> of<00:22:12.480> should<00:22:12.769> be,<00:22:12.929> and<00:22:13.010> as<00:22:13.170> I<00:22:13.250> expect<00:22:13.571> from<00:22:13.668> some<00:22:13.812> of<00:22:13.876> the<00:22:13.957> investments<00:22:14.358> that<00:22:14.438> I<00:22:14.534> have<00:22:14.936> in<00:22:15.080> other<00:22:15.240> platforms,<00:22:15.674> other<00:22:15.882> companies,<00:22:16.219> other<00:22:16.380> products.

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But<00:22:17.327> I<00:22:17.423> think<00:22:17.567> I<00:22:17.664> would<00:22:17.744> have,<00:22:17.968> I<00:22:18.049> would<00:22:18.129> have<00:22:18.289> probably<00:22:18.642> stuck<00:22:19.107> to<00:22:19.204> my<00:22:19.428> guns<00:22:19.685> a<00:22:19.733> little<00:22:19.910> bit<00:22:20.054> more<00:22:20.295> along<00:22:20.535> the<00:22:20.632> way<00:22:20.872> with<00:22:20.969> a<00:22:21.033> couple<00:22:21.289> of<00:22:21.418> bumpy<00:22:21.674> spots<00:22:22.076> in<00:22:22.220> the,<00:22:22.477> in<00:22:22.557> the<00:22:22.701> trajectory<00:22:23.118> of<00:22:23.199> this<00:22:23.359> business.

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And<00:22:24.466> I<00:22:24.562> think<00:22:24.707> that<00:22:24.803> for<00:22:24.963> new<00:22:25.268> entrepreneurs,<00:22:26.712> it's<00:22:26.873> just,<00:22:27.065> it's,<00:22:27.370> it's<00:22:27.514> almost<00:22:27.835> cooler<00:22:28.172> to<00:22:28.332> be<00:22:28.573> independent.

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It<00:22:29.295> feels<00:22:29.760> way<00:22:29.953> more<00:22:31.060> impactful<00:22:32.247> and<00:22:32.343> like<00:22:32.728> way<00:22:32.905> and<00:22:33.065> way<00:22:33.226> more<00:22:33.450> accomplished<00:22:34.253> when<00:22:34.349> you've<00:22:34.830> raised<00:22:35.215> no<00:22:35.408> money,<00:22:36.274> you've<00:22:36.434> grown<00:22:36.691> a<00:22:36.755> business<00:22:37.012> to<00:22:37.140> $20<00:22:37.461> or<00:22:37.638> $30<00:22:37.894> million,<00:22:38.664> which<00:22:38.761> in<00:22:38.857> the<00:22:38.985> VC<00:22:39.547> world,<00:22:39.788> that's<00:22:39.964> such<00:22:40.140> a<00:22:40.205> small,<00:22:40.622> small<00:22:40.943> amount<00:22:41.183> of<00:22:41.215> money<00:22:41.408> and<00:22:41.488> such<00:22:41.633> a<00:22:41.665> small<00:22:41.953> potential<00:22:42.371> exit.

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But<00:22:43.040> when<00:22:43.140> you<00:22:43.240> own<00:22:43.420> 100%<00:22:43.900> of<00:22:44.000> that<00:22:44.180> business,<00:22:44.620> that's<00:22:44.720> a<00:22:45.020> massive,<00:22:45.440> massive<00:22:45.680> opportunity.

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Really<00:22:46.420> built<00:22:46.660> it<00:22:46.840> from<00:22:46.980> scratch.

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I<00:22:47.800> think<00:22:48.540> early<00:22:48.780> on,<00:22:49.100> I<00:22:49.101> probably<00:22:49.320> would<00:22:49.440> have<00:22:49.660> explored<00:22:50.260> maybe<00:22:51.120> skipping<00:22:51.560> a<00:22:51.780> round<00:22:51.940> or<00:22:52.100> two<00:22:52.400> more<00:22:52.500> than<00:22:52.640> anything<00:22:52.900> else,<00:22:53.180> but<00:22:53.280> also<00:22:53.680> alternative<00:22:54.260> financing<00:22:54.660> methods<00:22:55.060> or<00:22:55.220> thinking<00:22:55.400> about<00:22:55.620> starting<00:22:56.000> smaller<00:22:56.460> and<00:22:56.600> not<00:22:56.760> having<00:22:56.920> to<00:22:57.100> accelerate<00:22:57.660> immediately,<00:22:58.380> which<00:22:58.480> would<00:22:58.640> have<00:22:58.780> allowed<00:22:58.979> us<00:22:59.160> to<00:22:59.260> think<00:22:59.380> a<00:22:59.480> little<00:22:59.560> bit<00:22:59.660> differently<00:22:59.880> about<00:23:00.040> the<00:23:00.140> way<00:23:00.200> we<00:23:00.340> raise<00:23:00.460> money.

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What<00:23:01.880> are<00:23:01.940> you<00:23:02.080> reading<00:23:02.440> or<00:23:02.660> what<00:23:03.000> reading<00:23:03.360> recommendations<00:23:03.860> would<00:23:04.060> you<00:23:04.200> have<00:23:04.340> for<00:23:04.540> us?

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Man,<00:23:05.920> I<00:23:06.460> don't<00:23:06.600> read<00:23:06.880> enough.

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Like<00:23:07.580> what<00:23:07.640> I've<00:23:07.880> been<00:23:08.060> doing<00:23:08.680> more<00:23:09.020> of,<00:23:09.440> like<00:23:09.700> I<00:23:10.020> took<00:23:10.260> off<00:23:10.580> from<00:23:10.780> podcasts<00:23:11.260> for<00:23:11.660> a<00:23:11.920> while<00:23:12.260> and<00:23:12.620> then<00:23:12.720> I<00:23:12.740> started<00:23:12.760> reading<00:23:12.780> a<00:23:12.800> little<00:23:12.820> bit<00:23:12.840> more.

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Now<00:23:12.880> I<00:23:12.900> got<00:23:12.920> back<00:23:12.940> to<00:23:14.640> podcasts<00:23:15.008> again.

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I<00:23:15.939> think<00:23:16.099> that<00:23:16.821> when<00:23:16.917> you're<00:23:17.013> in<00:23:17.158> tech,<00:23:17.447> you<00:23:17.479> get<00:23:17.623> caught<00:23:17.896> up<00:23:18.040> in<00:23:18.104> a<00:23:18.120> lot<00:23:18.297> of<00:23:18.361> like<00:23:18.585> the<00:23:18.666> Malcolm<00:23:19.003> Gladwell-esque<00:23:20.109> kind<00:23:20.366> of<00:23:21.008> like<00:23:21.874> mix<00:23:22.066> of<00:23:22.195> self-help<00:23:22.852> and<00:23:23.013> business,<00:23:23.430> and<00:23:23.558> you're<00:23:23.638> trying<00:23:23.799> to<00:23:23.895> pull<00:23:24.055> little<00:23:24.312> idioms<00:23:25.098> and<00:23:25.178> analogies<00:23:25.804> out<00:23:25.900> of<00:23:25.964> those<00:23:26.141> individual<00:23:26.542> books<00:23:26.766> to<00:23:26.862> talk<00:23:27.119> on<00:23:27.247> podcasts<00:23:27.729> and<00:23:27.889> have<00:23:27.985> conversations<00:23:28.531> like<00:23:28.627> that<00:23:28.803> as<00:23:28.932> well.

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But<00:23:30.006> for<00:23:30.231> me,<00:23:30.888> I'm<00:23:31.033> trying<00:23:31.257> to,<00:23:31.530> I'm<00:23:31.674> trying<00:23:31.851> to<00:23:31.915> think<00:23:32.236> more<00:23:32.541> about<00:23:33.583> what<00:23:33.760> we've<00:23:34.145> built<00:23:34.642> and<00:23:34.738> the<00:23:34.818> nostalgia<00:23:35.268> that<00:23:35.364> goes<00:23:35.604> with<00:23:35.781> it.

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I<00:23:35.989> actually<00:23:36.182> started,<00:23:36.904> I<00:23:36.968> started<00:23:37.208> reading<00:23:37.593> old<00:23:37.770> Goosebumps<00:23:38.251> books<00:23:38.476> again<00:23:38.716> because<00:23:38.893> they're,<00:23:39.197> they're<00:23:39.358> all<00:23:39.454> over<00:23:39.614> our<00:23:39.839> office.

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And<00:23:40.481> that<00:23:40.641> to<00:23:40.673> me<00:23:40.818> is<00:23:40.882> like<00:23:41.042> this<00:23:41.203> nostalgia,<00:23:41.620> but<00:23:41.700> it's<00:23:41.860> also<00:23:42.662> when<00:23:42.758> we<00:23:42.983> bought<00:23:43.240> them<00:23:43.528> for<00:23:43.769> this<00:23:43.945> company,<00:23:44.908> for<00:23:45.004> the<00:23:45.068> museum<00:23:45.453> that<00:23:45.550> we're<00:23:45.646> in<00:23:45.774> right<00:23:45.951> now,<00:23:46.817> all<00:23:46.849> of<00:23:46.913> a<00:23:46.929> sudden<00:23:47.154> they<00:23:47.234> were<00:23:47.330> like,<00:23:47.571> it<00:23:47.619> was<00:23:47.795> $1,200<00:23:48.517> for<00:23:48.661> all<00:23:48.694> 63<00:23:49.175> editions<00:23:49.624> of<00:23:49.720> that.

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I'm<00:23:50.442> thinking<00:23:50.602> in<00:23:50.634> my<00:23:50.747> head<00:23:50.907> like,<00:23:51.164> this<00:23:51.388> is—<00:23:52.206> it<00:23:52.287> goes<00:23:52.527> back<00:23:52.688> to<00:23:52.784> like<00:23:52.992> the<00:23:53.073> Scholastic<00:23:53.650> Book<00:23:53.891> Fair<00:23:54.196> days<00:23:54.773> and<00:23:54.869> it<00:23:54.917> goes<00:23:55.078> back<00:23:55.190> to<00:23:55.270> summer<00:23:55.655> reading.

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And<00:23:56.297> it's<00:23:56.441> these<00:23:56.698> things<00:23:57.019> that<00:23:57.243> now<00:23:57.420> we're<00:23:57.644> on<00:23:57.805> this<00:23:57.901> cycle<00:23:58.382> where<00:23:58.543> Gen<00:23:58.863> Z<00:23:59.810> and<00:24:00.050> Generation<00:24:00.532> Alpha<00:24:01.414> are<00:24:01.510> so<00:24:01.991> in<00:24:02.136> tune<00:24:02.312> with<00:24:02.392> what<00:24:02.537> happened<00:24:02.713> in<00:24:02.793> the<00:24:02.858> '90s<00:24:03.018> and<00:24:03.210> the<00:24:03.355> 2000s.

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There<00:24:04.959> are<00:24:05.264> all<00:24:05.440> these<00:24:05.761> things<00:24:06.002> around<00:24:06.387> that<00:24:06.483> I<00:24:06.627> kind<00:24:06.820> of<00:24:06.964> missed<00:24:07.269> early<00:24:07.445> on.

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It's<00:24:07.670> not<00:24:07.846> just<00:24:07.943> like<00:24:08.087> catching<00:24:08.344> the<00:24:08.424> ride<00:24:08.648> type<00:24:08.873> stuff.

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It<00:24:09.274> is<00:24:09.402> like<00:24:09.611> these<00:24:09.932> weird<00:24:10.253> little<00:24:10.574> goose-bumpy<00:24:11.136> type<00:24:11.377> of<00:24:11.458> books<00:24:11.763> that<00:24:11.875> are<00:24:12.036> 75<00:24:12.582> pages<00:24:13.530> that<00:24:13.642> are<00:24:13.867> written<00:24:14.108> in<00:24:14.204> such<00:24:14.654> a<00:24:14.735> unique<00:24:15.152> way.

00:24:15.875 --> 00:24:18.204
You<00:24:16.020> look<00:24:16.196> at<00:24:16.277> it<00:24:16.357> now<00:24:16.502> and<00:24:16.678> I<00:24:16.823> realize<00:24:17.096> it<00:24:17.160> was<00:24:17.385> telling<00:24:17.722> the<00:24:17.803> future.

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It's<00:24:18.606> the<00:24:18.766> same<00:24:19.088> movies,<00:24:19.489> the<00:24:19.570> same<00:24:19.811> IP<00:24:20.132> that's<00:24:20.309> getting<00:24:20.533> rehashed<00:24:20.999> right<00:24:21.192> now.

00:24:21.979 --> 00:24:27.152
And<00:24:22.059> that<00:24:22.300> to<00:24:22.381> me<00:24:22.541> is<00:24:22.622> what<00:24:22.766> I've<00:24:22.847> been<00:24:22.943> doing<00:24:23.184> just<00:24:23.505> from<00:24:23.682> a<00:24:23.826> business<00:24:24.132> perspective<00:24:24.614> to<00:24:24.710> better<00:24:24.951> understand<00:24:25.352> what<00:24:25.417> was<00:24:25.513> going<00:24:25.674> on<00:24:25.738> in<00:24:25.818> the<00:24:25.850> '90s<00:24:26.172> and<00:24:26.381> the<00:24:26.477> early<00:24:26.654> 2000s.

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'Cause<00:24:27.280> I<00:24:27.360> forgot<00:24:27.746> so<00:24:27.858> much<00:24:28.099> of<00:24:28.180> it<00:24:28.244> at<00:24:28.340> this<00:24:28.565> point.

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And<00:24:29.433> there<00:24:29.529> was<00:24:29.641> so<00:24:30.027> much<00:24:30.396> cultural<00:24:30.814> currency<00:24:31.537> in<00:24:31.698> those<00:24:31.858> individual<00:24:32.404> titles<00:24:32.806> and<00:24:32.886> the<00:24:33.047> things<00:24:33.224> that<00:24:33.304> I<00:24:33.465> think<00:24:34.171> me<00:24:34.364> as<00:24:34.444> someone<00:24:34.734> who<00:24:34.814> kind<00:24:34.958> of<00:24:34.991> grew<00:24:35.215> up<00:24:35.312> and<00:24:35.376> came<00:24:35.488> of<00:24:35.617> age<00:24:35.778> in<00:24:35.858> the<00:24:35.890> '90s<00:24:36.276> took<00:24:36.500> completely<00:24:37.079> for<00:24:37.239> granted.

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And<00:24:38.202> now<00:24:38.362> when<00:24:38.507> I<00:24:38.587> walk<00:24:38.779> around<00:24:39.019> in<00:24:39.083> SoHo<00:24:39.468> and<00:24:39.628> I<00:24:39.644> see<00:24:40.125> people,<00:24:40.510> I<00:24:40.606> know<00:24:40.670> I<00:24:40.766> see<00:24:41.167> 18-year-olds<00:24:41.647> dressed<00:24:41.968> the<00:24:42.032> same<00:24:42.272> way<00:24:42.513> I<00:24:42.593> was<00:24:42.753> dressed<00:24:43.090> in<00:24:43.394> 2005.

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It's<00:24:44.612> crazy<00:24:44.868> to<00:24:44.948> me,<00:24:45.573> but<00:24:45.637> I'm<00:24:45.734> trying<00:24:45.958> to<00:24:46.214> read<00:24:46.759> and,<00:24:47.176> and<00:24:47.256> take<00:24:47.512> as<00:24:47.672> much<00:24:48.137> of<00:24:48.233> that<00:24:48.458> culture<00:24:48.922> back<00:24:49.243> in<00:24:49.403> right<00:24:49.579> now<00:24:49.900> so<00:24:50.076> I<00:24:50.300> don't<00:24:50.605> lose<00:24:50.861> it.

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Because<00:24:51.598> if<00:24:51.727> you<00:24:51.823> don't<00:24:52.047> pay<00:24:52.207> attention<00:24:52.544> to<00:24:52.624> the<00:24:52.704> past,<00:24:52.944> you<00:24:53.025> can<00:24:53.105> have<00:24:53.329> no<00:24:53.489> idea<00:24:53.746> what's<00:24:53.906> happening<00:24:54.162> in<00:24:54.226> the<00:24:54.306> future.

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And<00:24:55.268> that<00:24:55.572> window<00:24:55.973> right<00:24:56.165> now<00:24:56.470> of<00:24:56.630> what<00:24:56.870> matters<00:24:57.351> and<00:24:57.415> the<00:24:57.511> cultural<00:24:57.832> currency<00:24:58.168> that<00:24:58.329> matters<00:24:59.194> is<00:24:59.274> this<00:24:59.514> really<00:24:59.835> tight<00:25:00.155> timeframe<00:25:00.588> from<00:25:00.780> the<00:25:00.860> late<00:25:01.053> '90s<00:25:01.277> and<00:25:01.373> early<00:25:01.533> 2000s.

00:25:02.142 --> 00:25:04.113
So<00:25:02.222> I've<00:25:02.303> been,<00:25:02.399> I've<00:25:02.479> been<00:25:02.559> trying<00:25:02.719> to<00:25:02.783> pay<00:25:02.863> attention<00:25:03.344> way<00:25:03.520> more<00:25:03.697> to<00:25:03.921> that.

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What<00:25:04.852> have<00:25:04.964> you<00:25:05.125> learned<00:25:05.382> about<00:25:05.606> the<00:25:05.751> power<00:25:06.233> of<00:25:06.329> nostalgia?

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There's<00:25:08.658> two<00:25:08.883> parts<00:25:09.140> of<00:25:09.220> it,<00:25:09.268> man.

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Nostalgia,<00:25:10.409> it<00:25:10.585> could<00:25:10.682> be<00:25:10.810> fantastic<00:25:11.613> and<00:25:11.693> it<00:25:11.774> opens<00:25:12.031> up<00:25:12.191> this—<00:25:12.593> these<00:25:12.914> parts<00:25:13.155> of<00:25:13.219> your<00:25:13.380> brain<00:25:13.621> that<00:25:13.717> you<00:25:13.862> kind<00:25:14.022> of<00:25:14.054> forgot<00:25:14.440> existed.

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But<00:25:15.708> it<00:25:15.741> can<00:25:15.885> also<00:25:16.062> be<00:25:16.190> toxic.

00:25:16.752 --> 00:25:19.515
And<00:25:16.801> I'm<00:25:16.913> trying<00:25:17.090> to<00:25:17.154> avoid<00:25:17.555> that,<00:25:17.812> that,<00:25:18.214> that<00:25:18.455> toxic<00:25:19.017> nostalgia.

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And<00:25:19.643> when<00:25:19.740> I<00:25:19.756> say<00:25:20.237> toxic<00:25:20.607> nostalgia,<00:25:21.024> it's<00:25:21.185> more<00:25:21.410> about<00:25:22.791> implanting<00:25:23.417> these<00:25:23.578> moments<00:25:23.915> that<00:25:24.076> never<00:25:24.542> actually<00:25:24.879> happened<00:25:25.441> or<00:25:25.666> weren't<00:25:26.003> as<00:25:26.164> good<00:25:26.405> as<00:25:26.485> they<00:25:26.646> kind<00:25:26.887> of<00:25:26.919> seem.

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It's<00:25:27.690> one<00:25:27.850> of<00:25:27.930> those<00:25:28.075> things<00:25:28.236> where,<00:25:28.396> you<00:25:28.428> know,<00:25:29.215> a<00:25:29.231> memory<00:25:29.777> is<00:25:30.083> only<00:25:31.062> is<00:25:31.368> only<00:25:31.544> surfaced<00:25:32.974> related<00:25:33.311> to<00:25:33.392> the<00:25:33.536> last<00:25:33.777> time<00:25:34.018> you<00:25:34.115> remembered<00:25:34.581> it.

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It's<00:25:35.062> really—<00:25:35.303> for<00:25:35.368> me<00:25:35.480> to<00:25:35.577> remember<00:25:35.785> what<00:25:35.882> happened<00:25:36.187> when<00:25:36.283> I<00:25:36.364> was<00:25:36.524> like<00:25:36.990> 3<00:25:37.231> or<00:25:37.312> 4<00:25:37.553> years<00:25:37.794> old<00:25:37.954> right<00:25:38.131> now,<00:25:39.095> I<00:25:39.175> have<00:25:39.721> little<00:25:39.962> flashes<00:25:40.541> of<00:25:40.685> it,<00:25:41.007> but<00:25:41.103> I<00:25:41.183> don't<00:25:41.344> remember<00:25:41.730> anything<00:25:42.388> in<00:25:43.095> real<00:25:43.352> detail<00:25:43.754> from<00:25:43.914> before<00:25:44.171> I<00:25:44.220> was<00:25:44.316> 17<00:25:44.637> or<00:25:44.718> 18<00:25:44.943> years<00:25:45.264> old<00:25:45.441> other<00:25:45.601> than<00:25:45.826> little<00:25:46.003> moments.

00:25:47.031 --> 00:26:04.560
But<00:25:47.111> when<00:25:47.224> I<00:25:47.272> think<00:25:47.384> about<00:25:47.609> like<00:25:48.252> Christmas<00:25:48.654> Eve<00:25:48.830> at<00:25:48.911> my<00:25:49.200> aunt's<00:25:49.360> house,<00:25:49.778> who<00:25:49.923> was<00:25:50.099> two<00:25:50.196> doors<00:25:50.485> down<00:25:50.726> from<00:25:50.838> my<00:25:50.983> apartment,<00:25:52.011> or<00:25:52.091> when<00:25:52.252> I<00:25:52.268> think<00:25:52.429> about,<00:25:52.734> you<00:25:52.766> know,<00:25:53.055> what<00:25:53.152> was<00:25:53.296> happening<00:25:53.634> in<00:25:53.714> high<00:25:53.891> school<00:25:54.357> and<00:25:54.453> certain<00:25:54.710> moments<00:25:55.176> and<00:25:55.256> certain<00:25:55.562> like<00:25:55.803> things<00:25:56.043> that<00:25:56.124> I<00:25:56.284> bought<00:25:56.461> with<00:25:56.590> my<00:25:56.686> own<00:25:56.847> money<00:25:57.088> for<00:25:57.200> the<00:25:57.329> first<00:25:57.570> time,<00:25:58.452> I<00:25:58.532> think<00:25:58.693> about<00:25:58.885> nostalgia<00:25:59.815> as<00:25:59.975> a<00:26:00.136> way<00:26:00.296> of<00:26:00.921> reconnecting<00:26:01.418> with<00:26:01.578> like<00:26:01.803> good<00:26:01.963> times,<00:26:02.781> but<00:26:02.925> I<00:26:03.005> want<00:26:03.085> to<00:26:03.117> make<00:26:03.326> sure<00:26:03.662> I<00:26:03.678> don't<00:26:03.823> get<00:26:04.127> lost<00:26:04.384> in<00:26:04.464> it.

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And<00:26:05.009> the<00:26:05.105> business<00:26:05.410> that<00:26:05.586> we're<00:26:05.891> in<00:26:06.388> with<00:26:06.548> Rally,<00:26:07.093> it's<00:26:07.269> really<00:26:07.734> easy<00:26:07.910> to<00:26:07.991> get<00:26:08.231> lost<00:26:08.696> in<00:26:08.792> nostalgia<00:26:09.898> and<00:26:09.994> make<00:26:10.171> up<00:26:10.251> an<00:26:10.331> entire<00:26:10.812> story<00:26:11.181> about<00:26:11.293> something<00:26:11.517> that<00:26:11.662> happened<00:26:11.982> in<00:26:12.078> 1997<00:26:12.864> that<00:26:12.960> probably<00:26:13.361> never<00:26:13.762> even<00:26:13.986> happened.

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And<00:26:14.884> now<00:26:14.980> I'm<00:26:15.188> chasing<00:26:15.685> that<00:26:15.766> moment<00:26:16.102> in<00:26:16.134> my<00:26:16.311> real<00:26:16.471> life<00:26:16.808> now.

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I'm<00:26:17.689> trying<00:26:18.090> to<00:26:18.122> do<00:26:18.250> a<00:26:18.314> little<00:26:18.491> bit<00:26:18.795> less<00:26:19.693> deep<00:26:20.014> nostalgia<00:26:20.559> dives<00:26:21.056> and<00:26:21.216> do<00:26:21.296> a<00:26:21.312> little<00:26:21.537> bit<00:26:21.681> more—<00:26:22.482> use<00:26:22.739> it<00:26:22.883> as<00:26:22.995> a<00:26:23.011> little<00:26:23.172> bit<00:26:23.236> of<00:26:23.316> a<00:26:23.380> platform<00:26:23.941> to<00:26:24.166> get<00:26:24.326> to<00:26:24.422> the<00:26:24.502> future,<00:26:24.983> but<00:26:25.079> sparingly,<00:26:25.945> because<00:26:26.121> I<00:26:26.137> don't<00:26:26.330> want<00:26:26.410> to<00:26:26.442> get<00:26:26.731> lost<00:26:27.292> in<00:26:27.612> a<00:26:27.628> time<00:26:27.869> that's<00:26:28.093> never<00:26:28.254> going<00:26:28.334> to<00:26:28.366> be<00:26:28.494> recreated,<00:26:28.991> you<00:26:29.087> know?

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What<00:26:30.289> are<00:26:30.369> some<00:26:30.513> products,<00:26:31.058> apps,<00:26:31.330> or<00:26:31.474> tools<00:26:32.019> that<00:26:32.276> you<00:26:33.461> have<00:26:33.653> to<00:26:33.798> use<00:26:34.038> every<00:26:34.262> day<00:26:34.743> that<00:26:34.839> are<00:26:34.871> like<00:26:35.159> integral<00:26:36.025> to<00:26:36.105> your<00:26:36.265> daily<00:26:36.585> life?

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Yeah,<00:26:38.364> I've<00:26:38.508> gone<00:26:39.229> way<00:26:39.485> back<00:26:39.790> to<00:26:40.030> analog.

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So<00:26:41.023> I'm<00:26:41.167> at<00:26:41.248> a<00:26:41.312> point<00:26:41.488> now<00:26:41.648> that<00:26:41.808> like<00:26:41.985> I'm<00:26:42.289> not<00:26:42.513> wearing<00:26:42.770> a<00:26:42.850> watch<00:26:43.154> today<00:26:43.330> and<00:26:43.426> I<00:26:43.491> feel<00:26:43.875> absolutely<00:26:44.452> naked<00:26:44.852> right<00:26:45.061> now.

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Like<00:26:45.413> I<00:26:45.493> forgot<00:26:45.653> to<00:26:45.734> put<00:26:45.814> a<00:26:45.878> watch<00:26:46.134> on<00:26:46.278> walking<00:26:46.519> out<00:26:46.599> the<00:26:46.695> door.

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And<00:26:47.576> that<00:26:47.736> to<00:26:47.864> me<00:26:48.041> has<00:26:48.233> like<00:26:48.681> always<00:26:49.178> been<00:26:49.418> this<00:26:49.643> mix<00:26:49.963> of<00:26:50.043> like,<00:26:50.220> I<00:26:50.284> want<00:26:50.380> to<00:26:50.444> show<00:26:50.700> people<00:26:51.021> the<00:26:51.165> things<00:26:51.277> that<00:26:51.405> I<00:26:51.485> care<00:26:51.726> about,<00:26:52.046> but<00:26:52.286> also<00:26:53.023> I<00:26:53.103> want<00:26:53.264> to<00:26:53.440> stay<00:26:53.824> back<00:26:54.225> in<00:26:54.465> an<00:26:54.770> analog<00:26:55.170> world<00:26:55.427> because<00:26:55.651> I<00:26:55.731> can't<00:26:56.212> even<00:26:56.372> pay<00:26:56.452> attention<00:26:57.029> to<00:26:57.269> everything.

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It's<00:26:57.910> so<00:26:58.150> digital<00:26:58.455> at<00:26:58.551> this<00:26:58.791> point.

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But<00:26:59.737> outside<00:26:59.994> of<00:27:00.074> that,<00:27:00.315> like<00:27:00.476> I've<00:27:00.556> gotten<00:27:00.877> to,<00:27:01.439> you<00:27:01.519> know,<00:27:01.840> as<00:27:03.268> horrible<00:27:03.750> as<00:27:03.846> a<00:27:03.910> phone<00:27:04.488> is<00:27:04.649> to<00:27:04.793> have<00:27:05.114> on<00:27:05.210> you<00:27:05.291> at<00:27:05.435> all<00:27:05.531> times,<00:27:05.836> I<00:27:05.852> do<00:27:05.997> start<00:27:06.334> and<00:27:06.398> end<00:27:06.494> my<00:27:06.655> day<00:27:06.799> and<00:27:06.912> everything<00:27:07.377> in<00:27:07.457> between<00:27:07.843> when<00:27:07.923> it<00:27:08.003> comes<00:27:08.131> to<00:27:08.485> everything<00:27:08.677> from<00:27:08.886> video<00:27:09.127> editing<00:27:10.106> to<00:27:10.330> emails.

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All<00:27:11.133> of<00:27:11.165> it<00:27:11.197> has<00:27:11.325> gotten<00:27:11.550> so<00:27:11.855> comfy<00:27:12.192> on<00:27:12.224> my<00:27:12.417> phone<00:27:12.658> at<00:27:12.738> this<00:27:12.850> point.

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I'm<00:27:13.155> trying<00:27:13.332> to<00:27:13.412> get<00:27:13.637> further<00:27:13.958> away<00:27:14.198> from<00:27:14.375> it<00:27:14.439> now.

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We<00:27:14.840> have<00:27:16.124> on<00:27:16.205> a<00:27:16.285> day-to-day<00:27:16.622> now,<00:27:16.927> like<00:27:17.168> we<00:27:17.232> have<00:27:17.328> digital<00:27:17.633> timers<00:27:17.970> that<00:27:18.066> I<00:27:18.131> keep<00:27:18.371> in<00:27:18.436> the<00:27:18.596> office<00:27:18.933> that<00:27:19.078> are<00:27:19.110> like<00:27:19.334> really<00:27:19.575> well<00:27:19.800> designed<00:27:20.201> and<00:27:20.362> pretty<00:27:20.618> from<00:27:20.763> like<00:27:20.859> the<00:27:20.939> MoMA<00:27:21.180> store<00:27:21.517> that<00:27:21.662> count<00:27:21.983> down<00:27:22.223> 20<00:27:22.464> and<00:27:22.544> 30<00:27:22.785> minutes<00:27:23.042> at<00:27:23.122> a<00:27:23.170> time<00:27:23.443> so<00:27:23.507> you<00:27:23.588> can<00:27:23.668> get<00:27:23.812> relentless<00:27:24.294> focus.

00:27:25.112 --> 00:27:26.397
I<00:27:25.177> use<00:27:25.337> that<00:27:25.514> on<00:27:25.658> a<00:27:25.674> day-to-day<00:27:25.995> basis.

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I'm<00:27:27.600> still<00:27:28.002> very,<00:27:28.243> very<00:27:28.483> deep<00:27:28.660> in<00:27:28.724> Photoshop.

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I<00:27:29.446> think<00:27:29.527> that<00:27:29.671> for<00:27:29.832> me,<00:27:30.410> the<00:27:30.474> ability<00:27:30.891> to<00:27:31.036> edit<00:27:31.758> and<00:27:31.918> do<00:27:32.095> it<00:27:32.175> in<00:27:32.255> a<00:27:32.272> non-angular<00:27:33.379> kind<00:27:33.556> of<00:27:33.620> freeform<00:27:34.246> way,<00:27:34.599> I'll<00:27:34.727> probably<00:27:34.904> be<00:27:35.049> one<00:27:35.161> of<00:27:35.225> the<00:27:35.305> dinosaurs<00:27:35.787> that's<00:27:35.947> using<00:27:36.429> the<00:27:36.509> Creative<00:27:36.814> Suite<00:27:37.135> forever<00:27:37.488> into<00:27:37.713> the<00:27:37.793> future.

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But<00:27:38.773> that's<00:27:38.997> a<00:27:39.013> must.

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There's<00:27:39.655> never<00:27:39.960> a<00:27:40.121> day<00:27:40.281> that<00:27:40.442> Photoshop<00:27:41.004> doesn't<00:27:41.212> get<00:27:41.325> open<00:27:41.485> on<00:27:41.517> my<00:27:41.646> computer,<00:27:42.930> on<00:27:43.026> my<00:27:43.171> phone,<00:27:43.508> or<00:27:43.588> somewhere<00:27:43.973> in<00:27:44.054> between.

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And<00:27:45.900> then<00:27:46.461> in<00:27:46.606> terms<00:27:46.879> of<00:27:47.007> like<00:27:47.826> getting<00:27:48.051> from<00:27:48.147> point<00:27:48.372> A<00:27:48.388> to<00:27:48.468> point<00:27:48.789> B,<00:27:49.110> I've<00:27:49.255> also<00:27:49.431> gone<00:27:49.656> back<00:27:49.913> a<00:27:49.977> little<00:27:50.153> bit<00:27:50.298> analog<00:27:50.651> and<00:27:50.699> I'm<00:27:50.779> just<00:27:50.940> taking<00:27:51.117> city<00:27:51.357> bikes<00:27:51.743> everywhere<00:27:52.064> lately.

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I've<00:27:52.465> kind<00:27:52.625> of<00:27:52.706> tried<00:27:52.866> the<00:27:52.963> sunset<00:27:53.508> Uber<00:27:53.845> from<00:27:54.006> my<00:27:54.231> life<00:27:54.568> and<00:27:54.632> I've<00:27:54.728> taken<00:27:54.953> the<00:27:55.033> train<00:27:55.354> less.

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I'm<00:27:56.092> trying<00:27:56.268> to<00:27:56.333> sort<00:27:56.509> of<00:27:56.653> be,<00:27:56.894> now<00:27:57.054> that<00:27:57.198> we<00:27:57.278> have<00:27:57.390> a<00:27:57.599> little<00:27:57.775> bit<00:27:57.855> better<00:27:58.080> weather<00:27:58.320> in<00:27:58.368> New<00:27:58.480> York,<00:27:59.282> that's<00:27:59.458> been<00:27:59.554> my<00:27:59.699> day-to-day.

00:28:00.179 --> 00:28:04.267
And<00:28:00.260> the<00:28:00.340> way<00:28:00.484> that<00:28:00.580> that<00:28:00.757> system<00:28:01.221> works<00:28:01.462> in<00:28:01.542> New<00:28:01.686> York<00:28:01.863> has<00:28:02.007> always<00:28:02.167> been<00:28:02.263> really<00:28:02.488> interesting<00:28:02.808> to<00:28:02.840> me,<00:28:02.968> the<00:28:03.001> Citi<00:28:03.225> Bike<00:28:03.449> system<00:28:03.722> in<00:28:03.866> New<00:28:03.946> York.

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And<00:28:05.213> the<00:28:05.245> way<00:28:05.389> that<00:28:05.485> it<00:28:05.549> hasn't<00:28:06.014> somehow,<00:28:07.312> it's<00:28:07.473> avoided,<00:28:08.098> knock<00:28:08.338> on<00:28:08.579> wood,<00:28:08.915> what<00:28:09.059> happened<00:28:09.380> with<00:28:09.556> like<00:28:09.797> Bird<00:28:10.117> and<00:28:10.262> Lime<00:28:10.502> scooters<00:28:11.480> where<00:28:11.576> they<00:28:11.704> just<00:28:11.864> became<00:28:12.506> a<00:28:12.602> disaster<00:28:13.227> in<00:28:13.323> every<00:28:13.564> city<00:28:14.205> and<00:28:14.349> you<00:28:14.509> wind<00:28:14.686> up<00:28:14.750> seeing<00:28:14.990> them<00:28:15.150> thrown<00:28:15.263> in<00:28:15.327> the<00:28:15.407> garbage<00:28:15.808> and<00:28:15.872> set<00:28:16.032> on<00:28:16.128> fire<00:28:16.609> and<00:28:17.026> the<00:28:17.154> docks<00:28:17.475> never<00:28:17.715> work.

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That's<00:28:18.532> a<00:28:18.549> system<00:28:18.933> that's<00:28:19.158> been<00:28:19.318> really<00:28:19.494> interesting<00:28:19.799> to<00:28:19.831> see<00:28:20.039> come<00:28:20.216> together<00:28:20.520> in<00:28:20.568> New<00:28:20.696> York<00:28:21.161> and<00:28:21.498> over<00:28:21.642> the<00:28:21.722> course<00:28:21.979> of,<00:28:22.203> you<00:28:22.235> know,<00:28:22.444> half<00:28:22.620> a<00:28:22.684> decade<00:28:22.940> at<00:28:23.085> this<00:28:23.261> point.

00:28:23.822 --> 00:28:25.057
To<00:28:23.886> be<00:28:24.047> as<00:28:24.207> relevant<00:28:24.512> as<00:28:24.560> it<00:28:24.624> still<00:28:24.929> is.

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That's<00:28:25.266> the<00:28:25.346> one<00:28:25.507> piece<00:28:25.667> of<00:28:25.747> technology<00:28:26.309> that<00:28:26.886> is<00:28:26.966> this<00:28:27.191> mix<00:28:27.416> of<00:28:27.576> analog<00:28:27.977> and<00:28:28.073> digital<00:28:28.378> that's<00:28:28.699> always<00:28:29.020> really—<00:28:29.758> I've<00:28:29.902> always<00:28:30.094> paid<00:28:30.239> attention<00:28:30.544> to,<00:28:30.640> but<00:28:30.720> I've<00:28:30.784> been<00:28:30.864> using<00:28:31.426> way<00:28:31.538> more,<00:28:31.923> way<00:28:32.084> more<00:28:32.308> often<00:28:32.966> lately.

00:28:34.169 --> 00:28:39.110
What<00:28:34.394> role<00:28:34.554> has<00:28:34.730> New<00:28:34.875> York<00:28:35.035> City<00:28:35.292> played<00:28:35.533> in<00:28:35.757> your<00:28:35.934> whole<00:28:37.121> journey<00:28:37.843> and<00:28:38.083> in<00:28:38.179> the<00:28:38.260> journey<00:28:38.564> of<00:28:38.596> the<00:28:38.725> company?

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Yeah,<00:28:39.768> it's—<00:28:40.104> I<00:28:40.169> mean,<00:28:40.249> it's<00:28:40.489> all<00:28:40.586> of<00:28:40.682> it.

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Like,<00:28:40.987> to<00:28:41.083> me,<00:28:42.270> it's,<00:28:42.831> it's<00:28:42.976> such<00:28:43.152> a,<00:28:43.537> it's<00:28:43.617> such<00:28:43.794> a<00:28:43.810> New<00:28:44.019> York-centric<00:28:44.436> thing<00:28:44.596> to<00:28:44.676> say,<00:28:44.853> like,<00:28:44.981> this<00:28:45.045> is<00:28:45.141> the<00:28:45.222> greatest<00:28:45.542> place<00:28:45.719> in<00:28:45.799> the<00:28:45.879> world.

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But<00:28:46.377> it's<00:28:46.585> really<00:28:46.826> hard.

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It<00:28:47.628> is.

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It<00:28:48.510> absolutely<00:28:49.072> is.

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And<00:28:49.457> it's<00:28:49.633> hard<00:28:49.874> for<00:28:49.986> me<00:28:50.840> coming<00:28:51.240> from<00:28:51.540> Brooklyn<00:28:51.980> and<00:28:52.800> now<00:28:53.100> like<00:28:53.360> live<00:28:53.480> in<00:28:53.580> Manhattan<00:28:53.860> now,<00:28:54.160> and<00:28:54.200> obviously<00:28:54.440> our<00:28:54.580> business<00:28:54.780> in<00:28:54.940> Manhattan,<00:28:55.820> you're<00:28:56.180> in<00:28:56.220> this<00:28:56.420> world<00:28:56.700> where,<00:28:57.460> you<00:28:57.660> know,<00:28:57.920> Brooklyn<00:28:58.360> is<00:28:58.560> part<00:28:58.820> of<00:28:58.940> New<00:28:59.080> York<00:28:59.220> City.

00:29:00.080 --> 00:29:02.350
But<00:29:00.240> when<00:29:00.500> we<00:29:00.580> were<00:29:00.760> younger,<00:29:01.020> it'd<00:29:01.200> always<00:29:01.220> be<00:29:01.360> like,<00:29:01.500> we're<00:29:01.600> going<00:29:01.740> to<00:29:01.860> the<00:29:02.000> city.

00:29:02.480 --> 00:29:03.640
That<00:29:02.500> was<00:29:02.620> always<00:29:02.840> like<00:29:02.980> the<00:29:03.080> way<00:29:03.200> you<00:29:03.340> said<00:29:03.500> it.

00:29:03.640 --> 00:29:05.500
And<00:29:03.760> it's<00:29:03.840> like<00:29:03.920> the<00:29:04.000> city<00:29:04.180> just<00:29:04.340> meant<00:29:04.440> Manhattan<00:29:04.800> at<00:29:05.080> that<00:29:05.280> point.

00:29:05.500 --> 00:29:09.220
You<00:29:05.501> tell<00:29:05.660> anybody<00:29:05.840> outside<00:29:06.220> of<00:29:06.380> New<00:29:06.500> York,<00:29:07.220> like,<00:29:07.380> yeah,<00:29:07.440> the<00:29:07.580> city,<00:29:07.920> they're<00:29:07.960> like,<00:29:08.080> the<00:29:08.120> whole,<00:29:08.520> what's<00:29:08.760> the<00:29:08.880> city?

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It's<00:29:09.221> the<00:29:09.280> whole<00:29:09.480> thing.

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It's<00:29:09.800> like,<00:29:09.940> yeah,<00:29:10.040> there's<00:29:10.200> 11<00:29:10.400> million,<00:29:10.720> 12<00:29:10.820> million<00:29:10.960> people<00:29:11.200> here.

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It's<00:29:11.461> the<00:29:11.580> whole<00:29:11.760> thing<00:29:11.920> and<00:29:12.040> includes<00:29:12.300> Brooklyn.

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But<00:29:13.420> this<00:29:13.660> to<00:29:13.880> me<00:29:14.060> is<00:29:14.360> this<00:29:14.540> aspirational<00:29:15.240> thing<00:29:15.440> that<00:29:15.580> I've<00:29:15.940> come<00:29:16.080> to<00:29:16.220> appreciate<00:29:16.600> more<00:29:17.040> over<00:29:17.340> the<00:29:17.480> course<00:29:17.640> of<00:29:17.780> the<00:29:17.900> last,<00:29:18.492> probably<00:29:18.716> 5<00:29:18.957> to<00:29:18.989> 10<00:29:19.213> years,<00:29:19.438> especially<00:29:19.694> in<00:29:19.839> starting<00:29:20.079> this<00:29:20.256> business.

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Because<00:29:21.619> when<00:29:21.763> we<00:29:22.003> launched,<00:29:22.581> in<00:29:22.661> my<00:29:22.757> mind,<00:29:23.142> it<00:29:23.222> was,<00:29:23.543> it<00:29:23.623> was<00:29:23.783> the<00:29:23.863> taste<00:29:24.264> level<00:29:24.905> and<00:29:24.986> a<00:29:25.050> curation<00:29:26.429> and<00:29:26.509> this<00:29:26.814> density<00:29:27.230> of<00:29:27.311> population<00:29:28.032> and<00:29:28.096> of<00:29:28.257> things<00:29:28.433> that<00:29:28.577> people<00:29:28.818> care<00:29:28.994> about<00:29:29.315> that<00:29:29.459> we<00:29:29.700> needed<00:29:29.940> to<00:29:30.036> represent<00:29:30.678> on<00:29:30.822> Rally.

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And<00:29:31.319> that<00:29:31.479> to<00:29:31.560> me<00:29:31.640> was<00:29:31.800> a<00:29:31.880> direct<00:29:32.201> representation<00:29:32.698> of<00:29:32.842> New<00:29:32.987> York.

00:29:33.868 --> 00:29:50.437
So<00:29:33.965> when<00:29:34.109> we<00:29:34.269> launched<00:29:34.670> in<00:29:34.766> California<00:29:35.632> and<00:29:35.712> particularly<00:29:36.065> Northern<00:29:36.370> California<00:29:36.915> became<00:29:37.396> our<00:29:37.572> biggest<00:29:37.877> market<00:29:38.759> and<00:29:38.839> then<00:29:38.999> Los<00:29:39.240> Angeles<00:29:39.576> became<00:29:39.817> our<00:29:39.897> second<00:29:40.218> biggest<00:29:40.522> market<00:29:40.795> and<00:29:40.843> New<00:29:41.003> York<00:29:41.260> was<00:29:41.501> third,<00:29:42.302> to<00:29:42.366> me<00:29:42.447> it<00:29:42.543> was<00:29:42.687> almost<00:29:43.008> like<00:29:43.665> not<00:29:43.825> a<00:29:43.841> failure,<00:29:44.306> but<00:29:44.387> I<00:29:44.451> felt<00:29:44.611> like,<00:29:44.948> I<00:29:45.028> was<00:29:45.204> like,<00:29:45.349> how<00:29:45.445> do<00:29:45.573> we<00:29:45.669> not<00:29:45.990> have<00:29:46.824> 10,000<00:29:48.076> users<00:29:48.462> from<00:29:48.638> New<00:29:48.863> York<00:29:49.200> knocking<00:29:49.521> the<00:29:49.602> door<00:29:49.842> down<00:29:50.083> right<00:29:50.244> now.

00:29:50.806 --> 00:29:52.861
We<00:29:50.966> built<00:29:51.207> this<00:29:51.528> in<00:29:51.689> this<00:29:51.849> city<00:29:52.106> for<00:29:52.411> this<00:29:52.572> city.

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Everybody,<00:29:53.953> myself,<00:29:54.338> my<00:29:54.418> co-founders<00:29:54.980> are<00:29:55.044> from<00:29:55.285> this<00:29:55.366> city.

00:29:56.249 --> 00:29:59.524
Me<00:29:56.345> and<00:29:56.489> Chris,<00:29:56.827> my<00:29:57.084> CEO,<00:29:57.565> my<00:29:57.934> original<00:29:58.272> co-founder<00:29:58.753> are<00:29:58.834> from<00:29:59.155> Brooklyn.

00:30:00.343 --> 00:30:02.542
All<00:30:00.423> of<00:30:00.471> our<00:30:00.584> friends<00:30:00.921> are<00:30:00.985> from<00:30:01.146> Brooklyn<00:30:01.643> and<00:30:01.804> parts<00:30:02.045> of<00:30:02.189> Manhattan.

00:30:02.591 --> 00:30:04.549
How<00:30:02.767> is<00:30:02.847> this<00:30:03.008> not<00:30:03.249> something<00:30:03.554> that's<00:30:03.795> winning<00:30:04.036> in<00:30:04.132> New<00:30:04.276> York?

00:30:05.240 --> 00:30:12.449
And<00:30:05.320> you<00:30:05.416> realize<00:30:05.818> that<00:30:06.123> the,<00:30:06.540> what<00:30:06.781> we've<00:30:07.022> done<00:30:07.279> here,<00:30:07.568> I<00:30:07.584> think<00:30:07.728> what<00:30:07.825> the<00:30:07.905> city<00:30:08.146> has<00:30:08.306> built<00:30:09.334> is<00:30:10.474> mimicked<00:30:10.956> in<00:30:11.100> a<00:30:11.261> lot<00:30:11.453> of<00:30:11.662> different<00:30:11.999> cities.

00:30:12.830 --> 00:30:14.920
But<00:30:13.230> it's<00:30:13.610> kind<00:30:13.790> of<00:30:13.870> like<00:30:13.950> New<00:30:14.090> York<00:30:14.270> goes<00:30:14.470> everywhere.

00:30:15.250 --> 00:30:17.450
And<00:30:15.270> that's<00:30:15.570> anywhere<00:30:15.830> you<00:30:16.070> are,<00:30:16.350> you're<00:30:16.410> going<00:30:16.411> to<00:30:16.550> find<00:30:16.630> somebody<00:30:16.830> from<00:30:17.050> New<00:30:17.210> York.

00:30:17.450 --> 00:30:18.910
You're<00:30:17.530> going<00:30:17.531> to<00:30:17.650> have<00:30:17.651> a<00:30:17.730> conversation<00:30:18.090> about<00:30:18.430> New<00:30:18.610> York.

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It's<00:30:19.470> going<00:30:19.570> to<00:30:19.610> be<00:30:19.810> about,<00:30:19.950> you<00:30:20.010> know,<00:30:20.250> New<00:30:20.310> York<00:30:20.470> versus<00:30:20.630> Paris.

00:30:21.150 --> 00:30:22.240
If<00:30:21.170> you're<00:30:21.330> from<00:30:21.410> Paris,<00:30:21.670> it's<00:30:21.790> going<00:30:21.791> to<00:30:21.792> be<00:30:21.890> that<00:30:21.990> fight.

00:30:22.450 --> 00:30:24.270
It's<00:30:22.550> going<00:30:22.590> to<00:30:22.591> be<00:30:22.650> New<00:30:22.730> York<00:30:22.850> versus<00:30:23.010> Berlin<00:30:23.370> if<00:30:23.530> you're<00:30:23.670> talking<00:30:23.790> to<00:30:23.970> them.

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It's<00:30:24.750> a<00:30:24.910> creative<00:30:25.250> outlet.

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It's<00:30:25.870> a<00:30:25.990> place<00:30:26.110> where<00:30:26.270> you<00:30:26.271> can<00:30:26.450> walk<00:30:26.610> outside<00:30:27.170> and<00:30:27.750> see<00:30:28.170> all<00:30:28.590> the<00:30:28.769> things<00:30:28.990> that<00:30:29.130> we<00:30:29.270> have<00:30:29.450> on<00:30:29.550> this<00:30:29.690> platform.

00:30:30.610 --> 00:30:31.690
You'll<00:30:30.790> see<00:30:30.970> them<00:30:31.110> one<00:30:31.250> way<00:30:31.390> or<00:30:31.450> another.

00:30:31.690 --> 00:30:34.930
You'll<00:30:31.870> see<00:30:32.070> a,<00:30:32.270> you<00:30:32.450> know,<00:30:33.170> a<00:30:33.190> Lamborghini<00:30:33.670> drive<00:30:33.910> down<00:30:34.110> the<00:30:34.270> street<00:30:34.430> randomly.

00:30:35.090 --> 00:30:38.010
You'll<00:30:35.250> see<00:30:35.390> somebody,<00:30:35.810> you<00:30:35.930> know,<00:30:36.130> at<00:30:36.210> a<00:30:36.290> restaurant<00:30:36.530> that<00:30:36.690> has<00:30:36.790> a<00:30:36.830> $100,000<00:30:37.410> watch<00:30:37.650> on.

00:30:38.493 --> 00:30:40.661
You<00:30:38.573> could<00:30:38.653> see<00:30:38.814> these<00:30:39.119> things<00:30:39.521> everywhere<00:30:40.018> and<00:30:40.243> anywhere.

00:30:40.805 --> 00:30:45.993
And<00:30:40.886> that<00:30:41.062> to<00:30:41.159> me<00:30:41.464> was<00:30:41.769> always<00:30:42.026> the<00:30:42.171> indicator<00:30:43.150> when<00:30:43.247> we<00:30:43.456> built<00:30:43.632> this<00:30:43.793> platform,<00:30:44.339> what<00:30:44.435> we<00:30:44.516> should<00:30:44.676> put<00:30:45.062> on<00:30:45.142> the<00:30:45.239> platform<00:30:45.720> first.

00:30:46.042 --> 00:30:50.073
And<00:30:46.138> that's<00:30:46.347> why<00:30:46.507> it<00:30:46.668> was,<00:30:47.407> it<00:30:47.471> was<00:30:47.632> cars<00:30:48.290> and<00:30:48.435> then<00:30:48.531> it<00:30:48.595> was,<00:30:48.756> you<00:30:48.788> know,<00:30:48.868> sports<00:30:49.350> and<00:30:49.559> trading<00:30:49.880> cards.

00:30:50.137 --> 00:30:51.310
It's<00:30:50.218> such<00:30:50.378> a<00:30:50.394> massive<00:30:50.764> sports<00:30:51.085> city.

00:30:51.824 --> 00:30:53.799
It<00:30:51.888> went<00:30:51.984> into<00:30:52.225> watches,<00:30:52.868> wine,<00:30:53.334> handbags.

00:30:53.928 --> 00:30:56.546
It<00:30:53.976> was<00:30:54.217> all<00:30:54.249> these<00:30:54.458> trappings<00:30:54.940> of<00:30:55.100> wealth<00:30:55.823> in<00:30:56.000> New<00:30:56.161> York.

00:30:56.642 --> 00:30:58.843
And<00:30:56.707> we<00:30:56.803> want<00:30:56.964> to<00:30:56.996> sort<00:30:57.205> of<00:30:57.285> knock<00:30:57.590> the<00:30:57.686> door<00:30:57.927> down<00:30:58.184> first<00:30:58.634> here.

00:30:59.469 --> 00:31:11.524
It<00:30:59.534> was<00:30:59.630> surprising<00:31:00.176> that<00:31:00.321> we,<00:31:00.658> we<00:31:00.802> got<00:31:00.979> to<00:31:01.124> this<00:31:01.365> one<00:31:01.541> third,<00:31:02.489> but<00:31:02.601> now<00:31:02.890> we<00:31:03.051> realize<00:31:03.453> like<00:31:03.565> it's<00:31:03.774> all<00:31:03.870> part<00:31:04.111> of<00:31:04.191> the<00:31:04.497> idea<00:31:04.738> that<00:31:04.834> New<00:31:04.914> York<00:31:05.171> is<00:31:05.316> everywhere<00:31:05.701> and<00:31:05.782> the<00:31:05.878> concept<00:31:06.376> is<00:31:06.504> not<00:31:07.228> The<00:31:07.308> concept<00:31:07.646> of<00:31:07.727> like,<00:31:07.952> you<00:31:08.306> know,<00:31:09.014> investing<00:31:09.416> in<00:31:09.481> culture<00:31:09.819> and<00:31:09.899> only<00:31:10.076> the<00:31:10.124> things<00:31:10.221> you<00:31:10.301> care<00:31:10.527> about<00:31:10.688> is<00:31:10.784> not<00:31:11.009> New<00:31:11.090> York-centric.

00:31:11.589 --> 00:31:15.515
As<00:31:11.669> much<00:31:11.894> as<00:31:11.927> I<00:31:11.991> think<00:31:12.152> New<00:31:12.232> Yorkers<00:31:12.619> want<00:31:12.780> it<00:31:12.860> to<00:31:12.940> be,<00:31:13.101> as<00:31:13.182> much<00:31:13.262> as<00:31:13.359> I<00:31:13.504> want<00:31:13.616> it<00:31:13.681> to<00:31:13.761> be<00:31:13.986> ours,<00:31:14.260> it<00:31:14.389> is<00:31:14.485> something<00:31:14.711> that<00:31:14.791> translates<00:31:15.209> everywhere.

00:31:16.490 --> 00:31:17.606
Yeah,<00:31:16.748> yeah,<00:31:16.829> yeah,<00:31:17.315> for<00:31:17.412> sure.

00:31:19.256 --> 00:31:27.690
What<00:31:19.418> advice<00:31:19.758> would<00:31:19.903> you<00:31:20.065> have<00:31:20.324> for<00:31:20.486> entrepreneurs<00:31:21.683> and<00:31:22.408> leaders<00:31:23.855> now<00:31:24.115> that<00:31:24.261> you've<00:31:24.488> been<00:31:24.732> in<00:31:24.830> this<00:31:25.073> game<00:31:25.382> for<00:31:26.211> as<00:31:26.308> long<00:31:26.438> as<00:31:26.520> you<00:31:26.552> have<00:31:26.715> and<00:31:26.763> you've<00:31:26.926> seen<00:31:27.105> some<00:31:27.283> success?

00:31:27.755 --> 00:31:28.697
What<00:31:27.852> advice<00:31:28.226> would<00:31:28.323> you<00:31:28.470> have?

00:31:29.503 --> 00:31:35.180
Yeah,<00:31:29.616> I'll<00:31:29.762> say,<00:31:30.554> you<00:31:30.651> know,<00:31:31.347> I've<00:31:31.428> had<00:31:31.589> so<00:31:31.864> much<00:31:32.172> failure<00:31:32.560> along<00:31:32.754> the<00:31:32.883> way<00:31:33.304> and<00:31:33.611> I've<00:31:34.194> always<00:31:34.420> kind<00:31:34.533> of<00:31:34.614> embraced<00:31:35.083> it.

00:31:35.407 --> 00:31:38.671
I<00:31:35.488> think<00:31:35.649> I<00:31:35.730> try<00:31:35.973> and<00:31:36.054> make<00:31:36.216> sure<00:31:36.474> that<00:31:37.307> Everybody<00:31:37.564> here<00:31:37.740> understands<00:31:38.206> that<00:31:38.366> too.

00:31:39.104 --> 00:31:43.116
I<00:31:39.168> do<00:31:39.313> a<00:31:39.409> bad<00:31:39.570> job<00:31:39.874> a<00:31:39.890> bit<00:31:40.035> at<00:31:40.163> times<00:31:40.356> because<00:31:41.014> I<00:31:41.158> let<00:31:41.319> my<00:31:41.415> passion<00:31:41.816> and<00:31:41.880> my<00:31:41.912> temper<00:31:42.217> get<00:31:42.314> the<00:31:42.442> best<00:31:42.635> of<00:31:42.683> me<00:31:42.779> at<00:31:42.859> times.

00:31:43.164 --> 00:31:46.518
I've<00:31:43.421> been<00:31:43.501> trying<00:31:43.662> to<00:31:43.726> fight<00:31:43.982> that<00:31:44.127> for<00:31:45.170> almost<00:31:45.748> 40<00:31:45.988> years<00:31:46.165> at<00:31:46.213> this<00:31:46.389> point.

00:31:46.566 --> 00:31:50.770
I'm<00:31:46.614> trying<00:31:46.791> to—<00:31:46.935> how<00:31:47.031> long<00:31:47.208> I've<00:31:47.352> been<00:31:48.058> in<00:31:48.732> the<00:31:48.941> workforce<00:31:49.374> now<00:31:49.583> for<00:31:50.241> 20<00:31:50.562> years.

00:31:50.883 --> 00:31:57.157
And<00:31:51.187> a<00:31:51.204> lot<00:31:51.380> of<00:31:51.444> what<00:31:51.524> I<00:31:51.605> think<00:31:51.781> about<00:31:52.022> is<00:31:52.953> how<00:31:53.691> to<00:31:53.932> be<00:31:54.092> a<00:31:54.156> little<00:31:54.397> less<00:31:54.573> emotional,<00:31:55.055> but<00:31:55.600> I<00:31:55.841> really<00:31:56.082> have<00:31:56.258> trouble<00:31:56.740> doing<00:31:57.061> it.

00:31:57.221 --> 00:32:07.459
I<00:31:57.366> think<00:31:57.606> that<00:31:58.585> that's<00:31:58.810> the<00:31:58.970> biggest<00:31:59.307> thing<00:31:59.468> that<00:32:00.270> along<00:32:00.655> the<00:32:00.751> way,<00:32:01.072> having<00:32:01.297> gotten<00:32:01.457> fired<00:32:01.875> so<00:32:01.971> many<00:32:02.196> times<00:32:02.757> and<00:32:02.918> sort<00:32:03.094> of<00:32:03.463> had<00:32:03.720> projects<00:32:04.137> that<00:32:04.282> just<00:32:04.362> didn't<00:32:04.522> take<00:32:04.763> off<00:32:04.924> the<00:32:04.988> way<00:32:05.148> I<00:32:05.229> wanted<00:32:05.469> it<00:32:05.565> to,<00:32:05.886> you<00:32:05.967> get<00:32:06.111> hit<00:32:06.223> in<00:32:06.288> the<00:32:06.352> head<00:32:06.592> over<00:32:06.737> and<00:32:06.833> over<00:32:06.929> and<00:32:06.994> over<00:32:07.234> again.

00:32:07.892 --> 00:32:09.304
You<00:32:07.940> have<00:32:08.053> no<00:32:08.133> choice<00:32:08.454> but<00:32:08.534> to<00:32:08.614> use<00:32:08.791> it<00:32:08.871> as<00:32:09.080> fuel.

00:32:09.401 --> 00:32:11.439
I've<00:32:09.497> always<00:32:09.658> kind<00:32:09.818> of<00:32:09.898> enjoyed<00:32:10.781> getting<00:32:11.005> fired.

00:32:11.503 --> 00:32:17.120
Like<00:32:11.904> in<00:32:11.984> the<00:32:12.129> last<00:32:12.466> 2<00:32:12.707> jobs<00:32:13.092> I<00:32:13.172> had,<00:32:14.215> getting<00:32:14.424> shown<00:32:14.632> the<00:32:14.793> door<00:32:15.033> is<00:32:15.178> just<00:32:15.354> like<00:32:15.916> this<00:32:16.141> freeing<00:32:16.558> moment<00:32:16.863> for<00:32:16.943> me.

00:32:17.360 --> 00:32:18.532
It's<00:32:17.505> like<00:32:17.681> weight<00:32:17.842> off<00:32:17.986> the<00:32:18.066> shoulders.

00:32:18.660 --> 00:32:20.409
It's<00:32:18.788> like<00:32:18.949> this<00:32:19.125> wasn't<00:32:19.366> the<00:32:19.446> place<00:32:19.751> for<00:32:19.848> me<00:32:20.088> anyway.

00:32:20.650 --> 00:32:22.078
And<00:32:20.891> I<00:32:20.971> tried<00:32:21.131> to<00:32:21.212> use<00:32:21.372> that<00:32:21.468> as<00:32:21.597> best<00:32:21.789> I<00:32:21.918> can.

00:32:22.881 --> 00:32:25.785
But<00:32:23.282> I<00:32:23.458> got<00:32:24.196> fired<00:32:24.726> maybe<00:32:24.983> 2<00:32:25.223> jobs<00:32:25.625> ago.

00:32:25.881 --> 00:32:28.240
This<00:32:26.106> is<00:32:26.347> in<00:32:26.443> 2012<00:32:27.470> or<00:32:27.550> 2013.

00:32:28.898 --> 00:32:34.611
And<00:32:29.075> I'm<00:32:29.380> talking<00:32:29.588> to<00:32:29.620> my<00:32:29.781> dad<00:32:30.198> and<00:32:30.278> he<00:32:30.776> said<00:32:31.000> something<00:32:31.161> that<00:32:31.257> stuck<00:32:31.562> with<00:32:31.626> me<00:32:31.707> that<00:32:31.819> I've<00:32:31.883> been<00:32:32.044> using,<00:32:32.525> that<00:32:32.990> I<00:32:33.006> stole<00:32:33.311> from<00:32:33.408> him<00:32:33.504> and<00:32:33.552> I<00:32:33.648> use<00:32:33.969> all<00:32:34.049> the<00:32:34.130> time<00:32:34.451> now.

00:32:35.189 --> 00:32:38.497
It's<00:32:35.301> like<00:32:35.414> whether<00:32:35.574> you're<00:32:35.735> right<00:32:35.976> or<00:32:36.201> wrong,<00:32:37.100> if<00:32:37.244> you're<00:32:37.341> an<00:32:37.485> asshole,<00:32:38.063> you're<00:32:38.368> wrong.

00:32:38.706 --> 00:32:43.651
Like<00:32:38.802> it<00:32:38.866> doesn't<00:32:39.043> matter<00:32:39.332> how<00:32:39.589> good<00:32:39.765> your<00:32:39.974> point<00:32:40.231> is<00:32:40.472> and<00:32:40.520> it<00:32:40.552> doesn't<00:32:40.713> matter<00:32:40.937> how<00:32:41.515> smooth<00:32:41.997> you<00:32:42.077> get<00:32:42.222> it<00:32:42.254> across<00:32:42.639> or<00:32:42.704> how<00:32:42.816> it's<00:32:42.961> articulated.

00:32:44.149 --> 00:32:45.305
That's<00:32:44.341> the<00:32:44.550> absolute<00:32:44.968> truth.

00:32:45.353 --> 00:32:47.312
I'm<00:32:45.530> guilty<00:32:45.851> of<00:32:45.995> it<00:32:46.333> on<00:32:46.429> a<00:32:46.493> weekly<00:32:46.798> basis<00:32:47.167> still.

00:32:47.473 --> 00:32:48.516
I'm<00:32:47.617> trying<00:32:47.794> to<00:32:47.874> knock<00:32:48.163> that<00:32:48.340> down.

00:32:48.564 --> 00:32:49.351
It<00:32:48.597> used<00:32:48.709> to<00:32:48.741> be<00:32:48.789> on<00:32:48.821> a<00:32:48.982> daily<00:32:49.223> basis.

00:32:49.399 --> 00:32:56.464
I'm<00:32:49.608> trying<00:32:49.737> to<00:32:49.785> knock<00:32:50.026> that<00:32:50.186> down<00:32:50.283> to<00:32:50.427> like<00:32:50.588> a<00:32:50.604> monthly<00:32:51.053> basis<00:32:51.551> and<00:32:51.631> then<00:32:51.936> get<00:32:52.193> that<00:32:53.237> kind<00:32:53.494> of<00:32:53.703> attitude<00:32:54.200> when<00:32:54.361> things<00:32:54.586> don't<00:32:54.682> go<00:32:54.907> your<00:32:55.003> way<00:32:55.308> out<00:32:55.421> of<00:32:55.485> my<00:32:55.581> system<00:32:55.967> entirely.

00:32:57.155 --> 00:33:12.045
But<00:32:57.251> for<00:32:57.396> a<00:32:57.428> 19<00:32:57.893> or<00:32:57.958> a<00:32:57.974> 20-year-old<00:32:58.616> now<00:32:59.017> who's<00:32:59.258> just<00:32:59.499> getting<00:32:59.676> started,<00:33:00.045> especially<00:33:00.446> as<00:33:00.543> a<00:33:00.607> designer<00:33:01.281> or<00:33:01.346> as<00:33:01.378> somebody<00:33:01.731> who<00:33:01.892> has<00:33:02.020> to<00:33:02.165> take<00:33:02.454> critique,<00:33:03.433> I<00:33:03.514> think<00:33:03.739> being<00:33:03.899> able<00:33:04.060> to<00:33:04.156> understand<00:33:04.638> that<00:33:04.815> someone<00:33:05.104> who's<00:33:05.265> telling<00:33:05.506> you<00:33:05.602> something<00:33:06.100> is<00:33:06.325> wrong<00:33:06.711> or<00:33:06.743> telling<00:33:06.968> you<00:33:07.048> that<00:33:07.193> you<00:33:07.289> didn't<00:33:07.594> do<00:33:07.691> something<00:33:08.157> right<00:33:08.896> is<00:33:09.056> not,<00:33:09.394> especially<00:33:09.876> in<00:33:09.956> a<00:33:10.020> job,<00:33:10.438> is<00:33:10.583> not<00:33:10.824> telling<00:33:11.129> you<00:33:11.161> their<00:33:11.306> personal<00:33:11.707> belief.

00:33:12.125 --> 00:33:15.338
It's<00:33:12.254> telling<00:33:12.430> you<00:33:12.511> something<00:33:12.752> that<00:33:12.896> represents<00:33:13.394> the<00:33:13.475> future<00:33:13.716> of<00:33:13.780> the<00:33:13.860> company<00:33:14.117> or<00:33:14.182> the<00:33:14.278> business<00:33:14.680> or<00:33:14.824> your<00:33:14.985> future.

00:33:15.403 --> 00:33:17.106
It's<00:33:15.949> just<00:33:16.077> maybe<00:33:16.447> not<00:33:16.543> the<00:33:16.608> right<00:33:16.768> place<00:33:16.977> for<00:33:17.074> you.

00:33:17.170 --> 00:33:29.557
And<00:33:17.250> any<00:33:17.411> conversation,<00:33:18.054> any<00:33:18.375> deal,<00:33:18.937> any<00:33:19.034> sort<00:33:19.242> of<00:33:19.275> sales<00:33:19.532> cycle<00:33:19.901> you<00:33:20.046> go<00:33:20.223> through<00:33:21.026> where<00:33:21.106> you<00:33:21.187> can't<00:33:21.411> appreciate<00:33:22.070> that<00:33:23.114> even<00:33:23.275> when<00:33:23.420> you're<00:33:23.661> right,<00:33:23.854> sometimes<00:33:24.175> you<00:33:24.239> gotta<00:33:24.384> take<00:33:24.480> a<00:33:24.560> backseat<00:33:24.962> to<00:33:25.042> the<00:33:25.107> conversation<00:33:25.942> is<00:33:26.022> something<00:33:26.247> that<00:33:26.392> I<00:33:26.553> learned<00:33:26.810> the<00:33:26.954> hard<00:33:27.292> way<00:33:27.693> without<00:33:28.159> question,<00:33:28.497> and<00:33:28.641> I'm<00:33:28.754> still<00:33:29.059> working<00:33:29.364> on<00:33:29.525> it.

00:33:30.166 --> 00:33:35.821
But<00:33:30.246> that<00:33:30.743> to<00:33:30.887> me<00:33:31.079> is<00:33:31.143> something<00:33:31.384> that<00:33:31.876> I<00:33:31.896> don't<00:33:32.249> want<00:33:32.329> to<00:33:32.361> be<00:33:32.505> the<00:33:32.585> guy<00:33:32.906> who's<00:33:33.082> saying<00:33:33.386> the<00:33:33.434> next<00:33:33.611> generation,<00:33:34.428> they<00:33:34.540> don't<00:33:35.085> appreciate<00:33:35.469> anything.

00:33:35.870 --> 00:33:39.234
I<00:33:35.886> don't<00:33:36.030> want<00:33:36.174> to<00:33:36.302> talk<00:33:36.430> like<00:33:36.590> the<00:33:36.671> way<00:33:36.815> the<00:33:36.975> previous<00:33:37.231> generation<00:33:37.616> did<00:33:37.728> about<00:33:37.888> millennials,<00:33:38.385> because<00:33:38.513> that's<00:33:38.737> not<00:33:38.913> true.

00:33:39.699 --> 00:33:42.614
These<00:33:39.875> new<00:33:40.035> kids<00:33:40.291> are<00:33:40.355> the<00:33:40.435> most—<00:33:40.676> they're<00:33:40.932> going<00:33:41.028> to<00:33:41.060> be<00:33:41.092> the<00:33:41.156> most<00:33:41.317> successful<00:33:41.957> generation<00:33:42.438> ever.

00:33:42.662 --> 00:33:45.658
And<00:33:42.742> they're<00:33:42.839> so<00:33:43.303> creative<00:33:43.800> and<00:33:43.864> they're<00:33:43.960> so<00:33:44.441> on<00:33:44.585> point<00:33:44.921> with<00:33:45.065> the<00:33:45.146> way<00:33:45.242> they<00:33:45.482> think.

00:33:46.427 --> 00:33:51.378
But<00:33:46.539> I<00:33:46.587> think<00:33:46.684> they've<00:33:47.324> gotten<00:33:47.565> really<00:33:47.869> used<00:33:48.045> to<00:33:49.087> kind<00:33:49.327> of<00:33:49.984> accepting<00:33:50.352> criticism<00:33:50.769> from<00:33:50.913> a<00:33:51.009> distance.

00:33:51.794 --> 00:33:56.456
And<00:33:51.890> when<00:33:52.035> they<00:33:52.275> get<00:33:52.435> it<00:33:52.515> face<00:33:52.771> to<00:33:52.916> face,<00:33:54.053> it<00:33:54.133> triggers<00:33:54.614> a<00:33:54.678> lot<00:33:54.918> of<00:33:54.950> emotion<00:33:55.479> from<00:33:55.639> them<00:33:55.799> one<00:33:55.912> way<00:33:56.040> or<00:33:56.120> the<00:33:56.280> other.

00:33:56.761 --> 00:34:00.317
And<00:33:56.857> they<00:33:56.937> want<00:33:57.081> to<00:33:57.161> kind<00:33:57.321> of<00:33:57.353> mobilize<00:33:57.978> and<00:33:58.058> like<00:33:58.219> protest<00:33:58.635> against<00:33:59.020> it,<00:33:59.100> literally<00:33:59.420> and<00:33:59.484> figuratively<00:33:59.901> at<00:33:59.981> times.

00:34:00.718 --> 00:34:02.563
And<00:34:00.846> sometimes<00:34:01.071> it's<00:34:01.247> not<00:34:01.408> the<00:34:01.488> right<00:34:01.664> way<00:34:01.761> to<00:34:01.841> get<00:34:01.985> the<00:34:02.130> point<00:34:02.242> across.

00:34:02.627 --> 00:34:15.587
Sometimes<00:34:03.028> taking<00:34:03.349> that<00:34:03.733> confrontation<00:34:05.097> and<00:34:05.193> turning<00:34:05.530> it<00:34:05.578> into<00:34:05.835> sort<00:34:06.011> of<00:34:06.091> a<00:34:06.156> positive<00:34:06.653> and<00:34:06.797> thinking<00:34:07.022> about,<00:34:07.503> you<00:34:07.535> know,<00:34:08.144> how<00:34:08.225> do<00:34:08.305> I<00:34:08.401> present<00:34:08.658> this<00:34:08.786> conversation<00:34:09.283> in<00:34:09.315> a<00:34:09.347> way<00:34:09.508> where<00:34:09.668> if<00:34:09.764> I<00:34:09.829> need<00:34:10.470> to<00:34:10.566> be<00:34:10.727> around<00:34:11.048> these<00:34:11.288> people<00:34:11.850> or<00:34:11.994> have<00:34:12.090> this<00:34:12.251> conversation<00:34:12.812> again<00:34:13.053> in<00:34:13.133> a<00:34:13.277> year<00:34:13.454> or<00:34:13.534> 2<00:34:13.839> years,<00:34:14.079> it's<00:34:14.175> not<00:34:14.272> something<00:34:14.560> where<00:34:14.657> I<00:34:14.721> burn<00:34:14.961> this<00:34:15.138> bridge<00:34:15.378> down.

00:34:15.715 --> 00:34:19.886
It's<00:34:16.164> an<00:34:16.196> important<00:34:16.646> part<00:34:17.063> of<00:34:18.105> a<00:34:18.169> creative<00:34:18.570> journey<00:34:19.068> and<00:34:19.132> of<00:34:19.212> a<00:34:19.292> career<00:34:19.549> journey.

00:34:20.495 --> 00:34:21.730
I<00:34:20.511> learned<00:34:20.671> that<00:34:20.832> the<00:34:20.896> hard<00:34:21.072> way<00:34:21.217> a<00:34:21.233> bunch<00:34:21.473> of<00:34:21.538> times.

00:34:21.778 --> 00:34:29.769
So<00:34:21.891> like,<00:34:22.179> I've<00:34:22.420> always<00:34:22.757> preached<00:34:22.981> to<00:34:23.061> that<00:34:23.238> next<00:34:23.462> generation,<00:34:23.944> like,<00:34:24.746> whether<00:34:24.890> you're<00:34:25.050> right<00:34:25.147> or<00:34:25.227> wrong,<00:34:25.548> again,<00:34:25.868> like,<00:34:26.061> if<00:34:26.189> you're<00:34:26.751> saying<00:34:27.087> it<00:34:27.152> the<00:34:27.232> wrong<00:34:27.408> way,<00:34:27.569> you're<00:34:27.649> talking<00:34:27.970> crazy,<00:34:28.755> you<00:34:28.916> already<00:34:29.157> lost<00:34:29.350> that<00:34:29.495> battle.

00:34:29.817 --> 00:34:30.510
It's<00:34:30.043> not<00:34:30.204> worth<00:34:30.445> it.

00:34:32.136 --> 00:34:36.531
How<00:34:32.216> do<00:34:32.297> you<00:34:32.458> think<00:34:32.635> about,<00:34:33.424> um,<00:34:34.229> your<00:34:34.309> mental<00:34:34.712> health<00:34:35.452> and<00:34:35.597> staying<00:34:35.935> grounded?

00:34:36.901 --> 00:34:43.158
And<00:34:37.127> what,<00:34:37.384> what<00:34:37.465> do<00:34:37.529> you<00:34:37.626> kind<00:34:37.803> of<00:34:37.948> do<00:34:38.189> throughout<00:34:38.431> the<00:34:38.511> day<00:34:38.753> to<00:34:38.995> kind<00:34:39.173> of<00:34:39.237> make<00:34:39.463> sure<00:34:39.721> that<00:34:40.592> you<00:34:40.625> don't<00:34:40.931> completely<00:34:41.480> lose<00:34:41.722> it,<00:34:41.980> given<00:34:42.367> the<00:34:42.464> times<00:34:42.851> we<00:34:42.948> live<00:34:43.109> in?

00:34:43.738 --> 00:34:44.900
I<00:34:43.771> mean,<00:34:44.142> I<00:34:44.303> do<00:34:44.496> sometimes.

00:34:44.948 --> 00:34:48.579
Like,<00:34:45.110> there<00:34:45.271> is—<00:34:45.513> there<00:34:45.690> are<00:34:45.771> times<00:34:46.158> where<00:34:46.255> it's—<00:34:46.658> it<00:34:46.803> is<00:34:47.868> too<00:34:48.029> rough<00:34:48.159> to<00:34:48.272> handle.

00:34:49.388 --> 00:34:53.757
And<00:34:49.485> it's—<00:34:49.647> I<00:34:49.663> don't<00:34:50.294> ever<00:34:50.440> want<00:34:50.521> to<00:34:50.602> be<00:34:50.683> like<00:34:50.796> a<00:34:50.861> poor<00:34:51.119> me,<00:34:51.508> but<00:34:51.605> there<00:34:51.734> are<00:34:51.831> times<00:34:52.074> which<00:34:52.252> is—<00:34:52.656> it's,<00:34:52.964> it's<00:34:53.126> walking<00:34:53.530> away.

00:34:53.870 --> 00:34:59.669
A<00:34:53.919> lot<00:34:54.113> of<00:34:54.161> time<00:34:54.339> I<00:34:54.420> think<00:34:54.582> what<00:34:54.663> I've<00:34:54.808> done<00:34:54.970> is<00:34:55.067> literally<00:34:56.091> trying<00:34:56.268> to<00:34:56.332> be<00:34:56.557> outside<00:34:57.054> more<00:34:57.375> and<00:34:57.455> trying<00:34:57.631> to<00:34:57.680> change<00:34:57.936> the<00:34:58.016> environment<00:34:58.562> up<00:34:58.674> and<00:34:58.802> change<00:34:59.043> the<00:34:59.123> routines.

00:35:00.583 --> 00:35:07.641
Those<00:35:00.759> ceremonies<00:35:01.931> and<00:35:02.332> the<00:35:02.428> kind<00:35:02.652> of<00:35:02.749> things<00:35:03.053> that<00:35:03.134> you<00:35:03.230> do<00:35:03.390> on<00:35:03.470> a<00:35:03.615> day-to-day<00:35:04.032> to<00:35:04.112> ground<00:35:04.497> yourself<00:35:04.994> that<00:35:05.139> you<00:35:05.235> want<00:35:05.363> to<00:35:05.395> remain<00:35:05.700> consistent<00:35:06.278> with<00:35:06.518> are<00:35:06.599> super<00:35:07.080> important.

00:35:08.123 --> 00:35:12.919
But<00:35:08.203> changing<00:35:08.668> the<00:35:08.700> scenery<00:35:09.630> literally<00:35:10.368> and<00:35:10.513> figuratively<00:35:11.315> is<00:35:11.411> a<00:35:11.475> super<00:35:11.908> important<00:35:12.357> part<00:35:12.470> of<00:35:12.534> that<00:35:12.710> too.

00:35:14.298 --> 00:35:18.774
There<00:35:14.716> are<00:35:14.924> days<00:35:15.245> where<00:35:15.325> it's<00:35:15.502> just<00:35:15.662> not—<00:35:16.047> working<00:35:16.191> from<00:35:16.304> the<00:35:16.528> office<00:35:16.705> is<00:35:16.785> not<00:35:16.945> the<00:35:17.090> right<00:35:17.587> place<00:35:17.828> to<00:35:17.908> be<00:35:18.309> for<00:35:18.421> that<00:35:18.630> day.

00:35:18.870 --> 00:35:20.972
There's<00:35:18.967> going<00:35:19.047> to<00:35:19.095> be,<00:35:19.352> you<00:35:19.432> know,<00:35:19.672> very<00:35:19.977> hyperfocused<00:35:20.635> work.

00:35:21.036 --> 00:35:32.514
You<00:35:21.116> want<00:35:21.260> to<00:35:21.341> get<00:35:21.501> rid<00:35:21.597> of<00:35:21.742> all<00:35:21.838> the<00:35:21.998> distraction<00:35:22.480> around<00:35:22.800> you,<00:35:22.945> but<00:35:23.041> also<00:35:23.266> you<00:35:23.362> want<00:35:23.490> to<00:35:23.522> be<00:35:23.619> in<00:35:23.699> a<00:35:23.747> different<00:35:23.971> mental<00:35:24.244> state<00:35:24.437> because<00:35:24.629> I<00:35:24.645> want<00:35:24.806> to<00:35:24.886> sort<00:35:25.030> of<00:35:25.126> open<00:35:25.303> up<00:35:25.431> my<00:35:25.527> ideas<00:35:25.929> and<00:35:26.009> open<00:35:26.233> up<00:35:26.330> the<00:35:27.133> The<00:35:27.230> ability<00:35:27.454> for<00:35:27.551> me<00:35:27.615> to<00:35:27.695> design<00:35:28.097> and<00:35:28.177> create<00:35:28.739> in<00:35:28.820> a<00:35:28.900> way<00:35:29.060> that's<00:35:29.301> different<00:35:29.558> than<00:35:29.703> that<00:35:29.799> standard<00:35:30.185> ceremony,<00:35:30.731> that<00:35:30.827> standard<00:35:31.229> kind<00:35:31.470> of<00:35:31.566> the<00:35:31.646> typical<00:35:32.096> day-to-day.

00:35:32.995 --> 00:35:41.331
I<00:35:33.076> think<00:35:33.236> getting<00:35:33.477> away<00:35:33.782> from<00:35:34.023> it,<00:35:34.585> I'm<00:35:35.067> as<00:35:35.228> guilty<00:35:35.501> as<00:35:35.629> any<00:35:35.870> entrepreneur,<00:35:36.914> any<00:35:37.348> CEO<00:35:38.071> or<00:35:38.199> founder<00:35:38.536> or<00:35:38.617> whatever,<00:35:39.002> where<00:35:39.050> it's<00:35:39.195> you<00:35:39.259> don't<00:35:39.404> take<00:35:39.580> vacations,<00:35:40.287> every<00:35:40.448> single<00:35:40.705> day<00:35:40.881> is<00:35:41.090> work.

00:35:41.379 --> 00:35:43.066
There's<00:35:41.524> never<00:35:41.813> a<00:35:41.829> day<00:35:41.990> where<00:35:42.134> the<00:35:42.214> computer<00:35:42.536> doesn't<00:35:42.857> open.

00:35:43.274 --> 00:35:44.977
There's<00:35:43.371> never<00:35:43.596> a<00:35:43.676> day<00:35:43.821> where<00:35:43.997> emails<00:35:44.302> don't<00:35:44.463> get<00:35:44.624> answered.

00:35:45.443 --> 00:35:52.927
I<00:35:45.523> kind<00:35:45.668> of<00:35:45.764> expect<00:35:46.069> the<00:35:46.101> same<00:35:46.406> at<00:35:46.471> a<00:35:46.487> lot<00:35:46.663> of<00:35:46.728> people<00:35:46.952> that<00:35:47.049> are<00:35:47.113> at<00:35:47.145> our<00:35:47.290> company,<00:35:48.028> especially<00:35:48.639> the<00:35:48.671> senior<00:35:49.056> people<00:35:49.378> who<00:35:49.442> I've<00:35:49.619> been<00:35:49.779> with<00:35:50.020> over<00:35:50.165> the<00:35:50.261> course<00:35:50.438> of<00:35:50.486> the<00:35:50.566> last<00:35:50.743> 4<00:35:50.887> or<00:35:50.984> 5<00:35:51.321> years<00:35:51.530> who<00:35:51.562> know<00:35:51.787> what<00:35:51.931> the<00:35:52.012> expectations<00:35:52.815> are.

00:35:53.714 --> 00:36:02.799
But<00:35:53.794> stepping<00:35:54.115> away<00:35:54.340> from<00:35:54.516> it<00:35:55.704> and<00:35:55.865> literally<00:35:56.362> going<00:35:56.667> for<00:35:56.796> like<00:35:56.988> that<00:35:57.165> 45-minute<00:35:57.951> walk<00:35:58.208> where<00:35:58.369> it<00:35:58.401> feels<00:35:58.690> like<00:35:58.866> I'm<00:35:58.914> going<00:35:58.995> to<00:35:59.075> be<00:35:59.171> doing<00:35:59.412> something<00:35:59.733> that's<00:35:59.974> counterproductive<00:36:01.338> is<00:36:01.402> the<00:36:01.563> only<00:36:01.739> way<00:36:01.836> to<00:36:02.044> be<00:36:02.285> productive.

00:36:02.927 --> 00:36:04.404
It's<00:36:03.425> conversations<00:36:03.970> like<00:36:04.131> this<00:36:04.291> too.

00:36:04.468 --> 00:36:10.551
It's<00:36:04.661> talking<00:36:04.821> to<00:36:04.869> people<00:36:05.174> who<00:36:05.447> are<00:36:05.913> creative<00:36:06.458> in<00:36:06.555> the<00:36:06.619> space<00:36:07.438> that<00:36:07.534> you<00:36:07.742> don't<00:36:07.935> necessarily<00:36:08.465> see<00:36:08.786> on<00:36:08.882> a<00:36:08.962> day-to-day<00:36:09.524> is<00:36:09.620> a<00:36:09.685> huge<00:36:09.925> part<00:36:10.150> of<00:36:10.246> it<00:36:10.311> too.

00:36:11.129 --> 00:36:13.344
I<00:36:11.210> tried<00:36:11.434> to<00:36:11.466> say<00:36:11.755> yes<00:36:12.494> to<00:36:12.590> more<00:36:12.975> things.

00:36:14.019 --> 00:36:28.730
You<00:36:14.083> know,<00:36:14.131> saying<00:36:14.500> no<00:36:14.661> is<00:36:14.741> important<00:36:15.142> too,<00:36:15.222> but<00:36:15.287> I've<00:36:15.367> tried<00:36:15.543> to<00:36:15.608> say<00:36:15.784> yes<00:36:16.025> to<00:36:16.153> more<00:36:17.149> dinners<00:36:18.176> and<00:36:18.336> more<00:36:18.593> events<00:36:19.219> and<00:36:19.315> speaking<00:36:19.556> on<00:36:19.636> more<00:36:19.797> panels<00:36:20.279> and<00:36:20.359> doing<00:36:20.600> things<00:36:20.905> that<00:36:21.546> put<00:36:21.642> me<00:36:21.739> in<00:36:21.803> a<00:36:21.883> room<00:36:22.108> with<00:36:22.220> a<00:36:22.364> bunch<00:36:22.589> of<00:36:22.669> people<00:36:22.909> I'd<00:36:23.006> never<00:36:23.166> met<00:36:23.326> before,<00:36:23.952> or<00:36:24.128> people<00:36:24.353> that<00:36:24.417> I'm<00:36:24.529> not<00:36:24.769> necessarily<00:36:25.812> comfy<00:36:26.197> with<00:36:26.373> to<00:36:26.453> the<00:36:26.533> point<00:36:26.694> that<00:36:26.742> I'm<00:36:26.918> texting<00:36:27.239> them<00:36:27.399> all<00:36:27.496> day,<00:36:27.640> or<00:36:27.672> I'm<00:36:27.832> in<00:36:27.961> group<00:36:28.137> chats<00:36:28.458> with<00:36:28.618> them.

00:36:28.794 --> 00:36:36.572
I<00:36:28.875> think<00:36:29.019> that's<00:36:29.179> an<00:36:29.259> important<00:36:29.580> part<00:36:29.757> from<00:36:29.917> a<00:36:29.933> mental<00:36:30.206> health<00:36:30.302> perspective<00:36:30.863> too,<00:36:31.264> because<00:36:31.986> if<00:36:32.066> you're<00:36:32.226> doing<00:36:32.451> the<00:36:32.531> same<00:36:32.948> thing<00:36:33.333> over<00:36:33.669> and<00:36:33.814> over<00:36:34.150> and<00:36:34.231> over<00:36:34.471> again,<00:36:34.872> there's<00:36:35.016> just,<00:36:35.433> there's<00:36:35.658> diminishing<00:36:36.075> returns<00:36:36.476> there.

00:36:36.636 --> 00:36:49.801
It's<00:36:36.716> not<00:36:36.876> gonna<00:36:37.021> be<00:36:37.053> something<00:36:37.438> that,<00:36:38.400> that<00:36:38.544> provides<00:36:39.105> you<00:36:39.603> with<00:36:39.827> what<00:36:40.003> you<00:36:40.180> need<00:36:40.565> to<00:36:40.725> be<00:36:40.885> successful<00:36:41.543> in<00:36:41.607> the<00:36:41.687> future,<00:36:42.585> especially<00:36:43.114> if<00:36:43.195> you're<00:36:43.371> already<00:36:43.756> in<00:36:43.836> a<00:36:43.852> mindset<00:36:44.959> that's<00:36:45.295> a<00:36:45.456> little<00:36:45.776> bit<00:36:46.257> tight<00:36:46.739> or<00:36:46.819> it's<00:36:46.979> a<00:36:46.995> little<00:36:47.620> bit,<00:36:48.086> you<00:36:48.118> know,<00:36:48.342> complex<00:36:49.208> at<00:36:49.320> the<00:36:49.416> moment.

00:36:49.865 --> 00:36:57.726
Getting<00:36:50.090> away<00:36:50.266> from<00:36:50.427> that<00:36:50.523> complexity<00:36:51.148> with<00:36:51.293> new<00:36:51.453> people,<00:36:51.790> new<00:36:52.014> places,<00:36:52.688> something<00:36:53.009> as<00:36:53.073> simple<00:36:53.314> as<00:36:53.346> taking<00:36:53.618> a<00:36:53.634> walk<00:36:53.875> in<00:36:53.939> the<00:36:53.971> sun<00:36:54.196> for<00:36:54.340> 45<00:36:54.741> minutes<00:36:55.062> has<00:36:55.159> changed<00:36:55.720> the<00:36:55.864> way<00:36:55.961> that<00:36:56.137> I<00:36:56.185> think<00:36:56.346> about<00:36:56.522> the<00:36:56.602> day<00:36:56.923> on<00:36:57.004> a<00:36:57.068> day-to-day<00:36:57.405> basis.

00:36:58.913 --> 00:37:06.694
Finally,<00:36:59.250> we<00:36:59.410> ask<00:36:59.875> and<00:37:00.196> end<00:37:00.357> every<00:37:00.774> interview<00:37:01.063> with<00:37:01.159> the<00:37:01.239> same<00:37:01.496> question,<00:37:01.913> and<00:37:02.041> that<00:37:02.218> is<00:37:02.362> at<00:37:02.458> CEO.com,<00:37:03.261> we<00:37:03.405> believe<00:37:03.646> the<00:37:03.742> chances<00:37:04.143> one<00:37:04.368> gives<00:37:04.785> is<00:37:04.865> just<00:37:05.089> as<00:37:05.122> important<00:37:05.426> as<00:37:05.571> the<00:37:05.651> chances<00:37:06.052> one<00:37:06.229> takes.

00:37:07.352 --> 00:37:10.336
When<00:37:07.512> you<00:37:07.737> hear<00:37:07.913> that,<00:37:08.154> who<00:37:08.314> gave<00:37:08.539> you<00:37:08.651> a<00:37:08.715> chance<00:37:09.357> to<00:37:09.453> get<00:37:09.598> you<00:37:09.694> to<00:37:09.758> where<00:37:09.919> you<00:37:10.079> are<00:37:10.159> today?

00:37:11.603 --> 00:37:16.705
Yeah,<00:37:11.748> I<00:37:11.844> got,<00:37:12.084> I<00:37:12.149> have,<00:37:13.143> I<00:37:13.191> have<00:37:13.288> two<00:37:13.512> people<00:37:13.769> that<00:37:13.817> have<00:37:13.929> done<00:37:14.154> that,<00:37:14.331> something<00:37:14.716> I've<00:37:14.812> tried<00:37:15.052> to<00:37:15.117> do<00:37:15.213> more<00:37:15.389> of,<00:37:15.470> especially<00:37:15.855> with<00:37:15.999> young<00:37:16.240> designers.

00:37:16.962 --> 00:37:17.892
I<00:37:17.042> was,<00:37:17.299> I<00:37:17.363> got<00:37:17.475> out<00:37:17.555> of<00:37:17.603> school.

00:37:17.940 --> 00:37:22.273
I<00:37:18.021> was<00:37:18.117> a<00:37:18.390> a<00:37:18.422> super<00:37:18.807> raw<00:37:19.047> designer<00:37:19.689> and<00:37:19.930> I<00:37:19.946> was<00:37:20.026> skipping<00:37:20.508> so<00:37:20.765> many<00:37:20.989> steps,<00:37:21.310> which<00:37:21.455> I<00:37:21.487> still<00:37:21.775> do<00:37:21.872> to<00:37:21.952> this<00:37:22.193> day.

00:37:22.337 --> 00:37:24.134
It's<00:37:22.498> the<00:37:22.738> worst<00:37:22.995> thing<00:37:23.156> you<00:37:23.236> do<00:37:23.396> as<00:37:23.493> a<00:37:23.621> designer.

00:37:24.600 --> 00:37:34.084
And<00:37:24.680> I<00:37:24.744> was<00:37:24.905> going<00:37:25.081> straight<00:37:25.643> to<00:37:25.787> like,<00:37:26.269> you<00:37:26.317> know,<00:37:26.590> the<00:37:26.750> printouts<00:37:27.328> at<00:37:27.408> that<00:37:27.569> point<00:37:28.371> back<00:37:28.676> in<00:37:28.708> the<00:37:28.852> early<00:37:29.013> 2000s<00:37:29.639> when<00:37:29.735> it<00:37:29.799> was<00:37:29.960> all<00:37:30.120> logos<00:37:30.698> and<00:37:30.778> like<00:37:31.019> package<00:37:31.404> design<00:37:32.046> and<00:37:32.222> you<00:37:32.303> were<00:37:32.447> literally<00:37:32.784> drawing<00:37:33.169> fonts<00:37:33.570> by<00:37:33.731> hand.

00:37:34.148 --> 00:37:36.427
This,<00:37:34.469> I<00:37:34.549> sound<00:37:34.742> like<00:37:34.806> a<00:37:34.870> dinosaur<00:37:35.255> right<00:37:35.368> now,<00:37:35.592> but<00:37:35.656> that's<00:37:35.753> what<00:37:35.833> it<00:37:35.977> actually<00:37:36.234> was.

00:37:36.956 --> 00:37:37.871
I<00:37:37.020> had<00:37:37.197> no<00:37:37.422> portfolio.

00:37:37.919 --> 00:37:39.347
I<00:37:37.967> had<00:37:38.064> a<00:37:38.144> bunch<00:37:38.320> of<00:37:38.384> loose<00:37:38.641> pieces<00:37:38.898> of<00:37:39.026> paper.

00:37:39.861 --> 00:37:40.936
I<00:37:39.893> had<00:37:39.941> a<00:37:39.989> couple<00:37:40.246> things<00:37:40.422> in<00:37:40.487> an<00:37:40.711> email.

00:37:41.113 --> 00:37:41.658
It<00:37:41.193> was<00:37:41.353> messy.

00:37:42.332 --> 00:37:49.986
The<00:37:42.412> first<00:37:42.733> person<00:37:43.359> was<00:37:44.322> a<00:37:44.338> guy<00:37:44.499> named<00:37:44.643> John<00:37:44.771> Monopoly<00:37:45.221> who's<00:37:45.510> Kanye<00:37:45.782> West's<00:37:46.023> manager<00:37:46.344> now,<00:37:46.665> and<00:37:46.745> that<00:37:46.793> was<00:37:46.857> like<00:37:46.986> my<00:37:47.082> first<00:37:47.371> job<00:37:47.627> out<00:37:47.708> of<00:37:47.740> school<00:37:48.734> was<00:37:48.831> doing<00:37:48.975> a<00:37:48.991> bunch<00:37:49.168> of<00:37:49.232> design<00:37:49.472> for<00:37:49.553> Kanye.

00:37:50.339 --> 00:37:59.099
And<00:37:50.660> he<00:37:50.900> looked<00:37:51.221> at,<00:37:51.478> he<00:37:51.638> saw<00:37:52.200> an<00:37:52.280> actual<00:37:52.665> printed<00:37:53.066> piece<00:37:53.323> of<00:37:53.387> material<00:37:53.740> that<00:37:53.868> I<00:37:53.949> had<00:37:54.141> at<00:37:54.221> a<00:37:54.350> print<00:37:54.526> shop<00:37:54.831> in<00:37:54.927> Queens<00:37:55.890> and<00:37:56.195> asked<00:37:56.371> the<00:37:56.516> owner<00:37:56.676> of<00:37:56.708> the<00:37:56.853> place,<00:37:57.254> I<00:37:57.318> was<00:37:57.414> gonna<00:37:57.575> pick<00:37:57.735> that,<00:37:58.056> all<00:37:58.136> this<00:37:58.216> stuff<00:37:58.521> up<00:37:58.617> in<00:37:58.682> a<00:37:58.698> box.

00:37:59.500 --> 00:38:00.527
And<00:37:59.564> he<00:37:59.660> said,<00:37:59.805> who<00:38:00.045> designed<00:38:00.382> this?

00:38:00.783 --> 00:38:03.222
And<00:38:00.864> the<00:38:01.008> owner<00:38:01.168> gave<00:38:01.313> him<00:38:01.409> my<00:38:01.441> number<00:38:01.826> and<00:38:01.922> said,<00:38:02.372> you<00:38:02.404> know,<00:38:02.532> we're<00:38:02.628> starting<00:38:02.853> this<00:38:02.949> label.

00:38:03.270 --> 00:38:04.570
I<00:38:03.286> want<00:38:03.431> you<00:38:03.479> to<00:38:03.511> come<00:38:03.735> in<00:38:03.848> and<00:38:03.912> meet<00:38:04.072> a<00:38:04.136> few<00:38:04.297> people.

00:38:05.260 --> 00:38:10.955
And<00:38:05.436> he<00:38:05.580> gave<00:38:05.693> me<00:38:05.757> the<00:38:05.821> first<00:38:06.062> chance<00:38:06.383> where<00:38:06.559> even<00:38:06.703> to<00:38:06.784> this<00:38:06.944> day,<00:38:07.121> I<00:38:07.137> still,<00:38:07.586> he<00:38:07.698> still<00:38:07.987> asks<00:38:08.067> me<00:38:08.115> for<00:38:08.244> stuff<00:38:08.468> every<00:38:08.581> now<00:38:08.709> and<00:38:08.869> then,<00:38:08.966> like<00:38:09.126> files<00:38:09.672> from<00:38:10.169> 20<00:38:10.474> years<00:38:10.666> ago.

00:38:11.100 --> 00:38:13.910
And<00:38:11.460> I'm<00:38:11.600> like,<00:38:11.860> I<00:38:11.861> make<00:38:12.040> sure<00:38:12.220> he<00:38:12.300> gets<00:38:12.440> his<00:38:12.660> stuff<00:38:12.820> all<00:38:13.120> the<00:38:13.300> time<00:38:13.460> now.

00:38:14.160 --> 00:38:19.860
He<00:38:14.240> was<00:38:14.340> the<00:38:14.440> first<00:38:14.620> person<00:38:14.940> who<00:38:15.360> allowed<00:38:15.880> me<00:38:16.160> to<00:38:16.340> sort<00:38:16.460> of<00:38:17.300> say<00:38:17.520> like,<00:38:17.820> listen,<00:38:17.900> here's<00:38:18.080> the<00:38:18.260> budget,<00:38:18.940> here's<00:38:19.020> what<00:38:19.139> we're<00:38:19.240> trying<00:38:19.380> to<00:38:19.580> do.

00:38:19.860 --> 00:38:23.880
It's<00:38:19.861> a<00:38:20.320> tour<00:38:20.620> for<00:38:20.800> John<00:38:21.020> Legend<00:38:21.320> or<00:38:21.460> whatever<00:38:21.720> it's<00:38:21.940> gonna<00:38:22.020> wind<00:38:22.100> up<00:38:22.300> being,<00:38:22.940> throw<00:38:23.040> some<00:38:23.180> ideas<00:38:23.480> together.

00:38:23.880 --> 00:38:30.440
And<00:38:24.000> that<00:38:24.120> was<00:38:24.180> the<00:38:24.380> first<00:38:24.600> time<00:38:24.860> that<00:38:24.980> I<00:38:25.040> was<00:38:25.060> allowed<00:38:25.300> to<00:38:25.440> sort<00:38:25.520> of<00:38:25.700> think<00:38:25.760> about<00:38:26.060> not<00:38:26.320> just<00:38:26.880> here's<00:38:27.560> the<00:38:28.040> nail,<00:38:28.740> here's<00:38:29.020> the<00:38:29.080> hammer,<00:38:29.460> just<00:38:29.620> get<00:38:29.860> that<00:38:30.100> done.

00:38:30.440 --> 00:38:34.360
It<00:38:30.500> was<00:38:30.560> the<00:38:30.700> first<00:38:30.880> person<00:38:31.140> who<00:38:31.280> said<00:38:31.440> like,<00:38:31.700> do<00:38:31.760> whatever<00:38:32.180> you<00:38:32.500> want<00:38:32.680> and<00:38:32.800> if<00:38:32.920> it<00:38:33.120> works,<00:38:33.560> you<00:38:33.561> get<00:38:33.700> rewarded<00:38:34.000> for<00:38:34.240> it.

00:38:34.360 --> 00:38:35.790
If<00:38:34.440> not,<00:38:34.680> we'll<00:38:34.800> go<00:38:34.880> back<00:38:35.020> to<00:38:35.180> the<00:38:35.240> drawing<00:38:35.440> board.

00:38:36.080 --> 00:38:38.020
And<00:38:36.280> that<00:38:36.420> was<00:38:36.500> like<00:38:36.620> a<00:38:36.700> really<00:38:36.900> important<00:38:37.160> part<00:38:37.320> of<00:38:37.420> my<00:38:37.480> early<00:38:37.700> career.

00:38:38.586 --> 00:38:48.576
Then<00:38:38.698> the<00:38:38.779> second<00:38:39.228> was<00:38:39.468> once<00:38:39.709> I<00:38:39.725> sort<00:38:39.901> of<00:38:39.949> got<00:38:40.061> into<00:38:40.190> startups<00:38:40.687> and<00:38:40.751> started<00:38:40.927> working<00:38:41.152> on<00:38:41.248> products,<00:38:42.435> a<00:38:42.531> previous<00:38:42.932> CEO,<00:38:43.397> John<00:38:43.653> Lima,<00:38:44.198> who<00:38:44.230> is<00:38:44.311> somebody<00:38:44.776> that<00:38:44.856> I<00:38:45.000> just<00:38:45.177> talked<00:38:45.481> to,<00:38:45.577> I<00:38:45.658> reconnected<00:38:46.443> for<00:38:46.572> the<00:38:46.620> first<00:38:46.844> time<00:38:46.940> like<00:38:47.117> a<00:38:47.325> year,<00:38:47.502> like<00:38:47.678> a<00:38:47.742> week<00:38:47.902> ago<00:38:48.127> by<00:38:48.223> chance.

00:38:49.682 --> 00:38:50.436
Same<00:38:49.907> situation.

00:38:50.628 --> 00:38:51.606
I<00:38:50.709> didn't<00:38:50.853> have<00:38:51.093> digital<00:38:51.350> design.

00:38:51.687 --> 00:38:57.363
I<00:38:51.751> had<00:38:51.895> a<00:38:51.975> lot<00:38:52.152> of<00:38:52.184> physical,<00:38:52.633> tangible<00:38:53.178> design<00:38:53.531> at<00:38:53.595> that<00:38:53.899> point,<00:38:54.557> but<00:38:54.637> he<00:38:54.717> kind<00:38:54.942> of<00:38:54.974> saw<00:38:55.198> something<00:38:55.583> in<00:38:55.679> me<00:38:56.064> and<00:38:56.706> he's<00:38:56.882> not<00:38:57.042> a<00:38:57.106> designer.

00:38:57.427 --> 00:39:05.653
He's<00:38:57.539> an<00:38:57.603> entrepreneur<00:38:58.165> and<00:38:58.437> he's<00:38:58.566> a<00:38:58.582> money<00:38:58.886> guy,<00:38:59.752> but<00:38:59.832> he<00:38:59.912> looked<00:39:00.153> at<00:39:00.313> it<00:39:00.378> and<00:39:00.426> said<00:39:00.650> like,<00:39:01.051> you<00:39:01.147> know,<00:39:01.356> this<00:39:01.532> is<00:39:01.564> something<00:39:01.853> that<00:39:02.157> even<00:39:02.254> though<00:39:02.334> we're<00:39:02.494> making<00:39:02.879> apps,<00:39:03.216> where<00:39:03.360> does<00:39:03.536> it—<00:39:03.617> they<00:39:03.761> were<00:39:03.937> at<00:39:04.017> that<00:39:04.178> point,<00:39:04.418> it<00:39:04.450> was<00:39:04.514> a<00:39:04.579> company<00:39:04.819> called<00:39:04.996> Scroll<00:39:05.284> Motion.

00:39:06.166 --> 00:39:11.168
We<00:39:06.198> were<00:39:06.262> designing<00:39:06.807> for,<00:39:07.144> you<00:39:07.224> know,<00:39:07.449> Vogue<00:39:07.865> and<00:39:08.026> for<00:39:08.507> Esquire<00:39:08.907> and<00:39:09.052> these<00:39:09.148> huge<00:39:09.388> magazines<00:39:09.869> that<00:39:10.014> really<00:39:10.190> cared<00:39:10.430> about<00:39:10.655> the<00:39:10.735> aesthetic.

00:39:11.713 --> 00:39:18.462
He<00:39:11.793> saw<00:39:12.114> that<00:39:12.274> the<00:39:12.370> aesthetic,<00:39:12.995> even<00:39:13.156> though<00:39:13.300> it<00:39:13.460> wasn't<00:39:13.781> digital,<00:39:14.198> it<00:39:14.342> wasn't<00:39:14.583> for<00:39:14.903> apps,<00:39:15.080> it<00:39:15.160> wasn't<00:39:15.641> for<00:39:15.785> iPad<00:39:15.881> or<00:39:16.266> iPhone,<00:39:16.442> could<00:39:16.603> translate<00:39:17.725> to<00:39:17.869> digital<00:39:18.190> design.

00:39:18.510 --> 00:39:19.905
It<00:39:18.542> could<00:39:18.671> translate<00:39:19.152> to<00:39:19.312> product<00:39:19.665> design.

00:39:19.969 --> 00:39:24.538
And<00:39:20.049> that<00:39:20.129> was<00:39:20.370> literally<00:39:20.675> the<00:39:20.755> first<00:39:20.947> time<00:39:21.155> I<00:39:21.188> even<00:39:21.332> heard<00:39:21.636> the<00:39:21.668> term<00:39:21.957> product<00:39:22.246> designer<00:39:23.095> when<00:39:23.240> in<00:39:23.272> my<00:39:23.416> mind<00:39:23.640> I<00:39:23.672> was<00:39:23.817> a<00:39:23.881> graphic<00:39:24.137> designer.

00:39:25.003 --> 00:39:32.794
And<00:39:25.051> I<00:39:25.083> think<00:39:25.260> that's—<00:39:25.901> those<00:39:26.141> are<00:39:26.221> two<00:39:26.462> people<00:39:26.847> who<00:39:26.943> kind<00:39:27.119> of<00:39:27.183> saw<00:39:28.305> what<00:39:28.546> the<00:39:28.786> work<00:39:29.107> and<00:39:29.187> the<00:39:29.267> potential<00:39:30.069> and<00:39:30.229> didn't<00:39:30.470> think<00:39:30.646> about<00:39:30.935> it<00:39:31.015> in<00:39:31.047> terms<00:39:31.287> of<00:39:31.351> fitting<00:39:31.608> into<00:39:31.752> the<00:39:31.913> box<00:39:32.249> of<00:39:32.394> title.

00:39:32.971 --> 00:39:47.595
So<00:39:33.195> every<00:39:33.371> time<00:39:33.580> that<00:39:33.660> I've<00:39:33.820> hired<00:39:34.221> now<00:39:34.397> to<00:39:34.622> this<00:39:34.798> point,<00:39:35.039> based<00:39:35.279> on<00:39:35.343> those<00:39:35.456> two<00:39:35.664> experiences,<00:39:36.866> has<00:39:36.963> been<00:39:37.187> more<00:39:37.364> about<00:39:38.342> is<00:39:38.422> it<00:39:38.502> a<00:39:38.566> cultural<00:39:38.983> fit<00:39:39.528> and<00:39:39.593> is<00:39:39.689> it<00:39:39.769> somebody<00:39:40.026> that<00:39:40.154> I<00:39:40.170> could<00:39:40.330> work<00:39:40.555> with<00:39:40.715> on<00:39:40.795> a<00:39:40.875> day-to-day,<00:39:41.773> but<00:39:41.854> is<00:39:41.950> it<00:39:42.078> somebody<00:39:42.495> with<00:39:42.655> a<00:39:42.720> refined<00:39:43.281> level<00:39:43.537> of<00:39:43.698> taste<00:39:44.099> that<00:39:44.195> could<00:39:44.339> be<00:39:44.564> executing<00:39:45.606> in<00:39:45.686> a<00:39:45.847> bunch<00:39:46.103> of<00:39:46.264> different<00:39:46.664> various<00:39:47.146> verticals?

00:39:47.707 --> 00:39:58.499
And<00:39:47.803> if<00:39:47.931> I<00:39:47.963> needed<00:39:48.268> a<00:39:48.284> t-shirt<00:39:49.294> or<00:39:49.375> a<00:39:49.455> website<00:39:50.128> or<00:39:50.192> an<00:39:50.417> app<00:39:50.593> design<00:39:51.090> or<00:39:51.155> interactive<00:39:51.636> design<00:39:52.101> or<00:39:52.261> augmented<00:39:52.678> reality,<00:39:53.720> this<00:39:53.881> person<00:39:54.153> has<00:39:54.282> enough<00:39:54.602> of<00:39:54.699> a<00:39:54.763> design<00:39:55.308> eye<00:39:55.564> to<00:39:55.805> build<00:39:55.965> that<00:39:56.126> from<00:39:56.350> scratch<00:39:56.687> without<00:39:56.928> worrying<00:39:57.184> about<00:39:57.874> what<00:39:57.970> the<00:39:58.050> discipline<00:39:58.451> is.

00:39:58.772 --> 00:40:01.386
And<00:39:59.557> you<00:39:59.638> know,<00:39:59.750> those<00:39:59.910> are,<00:40:00.119> those<00:40:00.231> are<00:40:00.295> two<00:40:00.455> people<00:40:00.696> who<00:40:00.776> did<00:40:00.937> that<00:40:01.097> for<00:40:01.193> me.

00:40:01.434 --> 00:40:03.037
So<00:40:01.562> I've<00:40:01.610> been<00:40:01.658> trying<00:40:01.899> to<00:40:01.963> do<00:40:02.043> that<00:40:02.123> as<00:40:02.219> much<00:40:02.380> as<00:40:02.444> I<00:40:02.524> can<00:40:02.636> in<00:40:02.684> my<00:40:02.845> career.

00:40:04.160 --> 00:40:05.890
Rob,<00:40:04.610> thank<00:40:04.611> you<00:40:04.710> so<00:40:04.910> much<00:40:05.070> for<00:40:05.170> coming<00:40:05.390> on.

00:40:05.930 --> 00:40:07.270
Seriously,<00:40:06.070> an<00:40:06.170> incredible<00:40:06.530> product.

00:40:07.270 --> 00:40:10.130
I<00:40:07.271> mean,<00:40:07.590> everybody<00:40:08.050> knows<00:40:08.310> who<00:40:08.490> you<00:40:08.610> are,<00:40:08.990> but<00:40:08.991> everybody<00:40:09.230> should<00:40:09.430> check<00:40:09.570> it<00:40:09.750> out.

00:40:10.130 --> 00:40:14.430
It's<00:40:10.510> an<00:40:10.610> incredible,<00:40:11.050> incredible,<00:40:11.610> incredible<00:40:12.010> product,<00:40:12.990> and,<00:40:12.991> um,<00:40:13.590> it's<00:40:13.690> genius.

00:40:14.430 --> 00:40:16.630
And,<00:40:14.490> and<00:40:14.690> well<00:40:14.850> done<00:40:15.070> on<00:40:15.250> everything<00:40:15.510> you've<00:40:15.790> done,<00:40:16.530> man.

00:40:16.630 --> 00:40:17.390
Sincerely<00:40:16.970> appreciate<00:40:17.190> it.

00:40:17.390 --> 00:40:18.070
Thank<00:40:17.391> you<00:40:17.470> so<00:40:17.610> much<00:40:17.650> for<00:40:17.770> having<00:40:17.930> me.

00:40:18.070 --> 00:40:18.580
A<00:40:18.090> great<00:40:18.230> conversation.

00:40:18.790 --> 00:40:20.210
This<00:40:18.810> was<00:40:18.910> the<00:40:19.030> therapy<00:40:19.310> session<00:40:19.590> for<00:40:19.750> today,<00:40:20.050> dude.

00:40:20.210 --> 00:40:21.550
You<00:40:20.330> asked<00:40:20.550> about—<00:40:20.890> this<00:40:20.891> was<00:40:21.070> it.

00:40:21.550 --> 00:40:24.430
This<00:40:21.630> was<00:40:21.750> the—<00:40:21.910> this<00:40:21.970> is<00:40:22.190> the<00:40:22.191> 45-minute<00:40:22.670> walk<00:40:22.930> with—<00:40:23.150> sit<00:40:23.170> with<00:40:23.290> you<00:40:23.410> and<00:40:23.510> talking<00:40:23.730> through<00:40:23.930> life.

00:40:25.550 --> 00:40:25.890
Perfect.

00:40:25.890 --> 00:40:26.590
Let's<00:40:26.030> do<00:40:26.150> it<00:40:26.270> again.

00:40:26.590 --> 00:40:27.780
Let's<00:40:26.730> do<00:40:26.830> it<00:40:26.950> every<00:40:27.090> day,<00:40:27.430> man.

00:40:27.990 --> 00:40:28.480
For<00:40:28.030> sure.

```