The baby monitor company that sued for its money back

On March 5, 2026, Nanit filed suit in the Court of International Trade to recover the tariffs it paid on baby monitor cameras imported from Malaysia. The company has 150 employees. It retained outside counsel. Anushka Salinas, its CEO, told Fortune the decision was not obvious, that the legal bill had to be weighed against the size of the refund, and that if the money comes back, it goes into hiring.

A year earlier, she had said something on the CEO.com Podcast that makes the lawsuit more interesting than it looks.

The subject was whether CEOs should have public opinions. She said the last four years had gone badly. Leaders were expected to comment on everything, whether it touched their business or not, and whether they knew anything about it. She was glad the pendulum had swung back.

"If you run a baby monitor business, you shouldn't necessarily have an opinion on wars that are happening all over the world to communicate to your customers," she said. "There might be one or two specific topics that it makes sense for you to weigh in on, and you should weigh in on those as they make sense to your brand and your consumer set. But otherwise, it's kind of like it's not really your place."

Then the tariffs came. A 19 percent levy on the hard-to-manufacture cameras Nanit imports from Malaysia. The company ate the cost rather than raise the $290 price of its monitor, and the margin it lost came out of product investment. Salinas went on television in May 2025 and said the tariffs would add to the already astronomical cost of raising a child, at the same moment the administration was trying to encourage more births. When the Supreme Court struck the tariffs down in February, she sued. She told Fortune the suit is not political, just a company using a legal remedy that exists. Trump has since reimposed a 15 percent tariff, so the cost is back.

One issue. The one that touched her customers.

Nanit launched in 2014. Salinas told the CEO.com Podcast that its founders were engineers who built computer vision systems to inspect silicon wafers. They had children, and they pointed the same cameras at the crib. A decade later, the product reads sleep, breathing, coughing, and developmental milestones, and Nanit says babies who sleep under it sleep 10 percent longer than babies who don't, which the company converts into 36 extra nights of sleep a year for the parents. Salinas has four words for anyone who doubts the number matters: what would you have given?

She came to Nanit from fashion. Eleven years at Rent the Runway, in two stretches, ending as president and chief operating officer through the 2021 IPO, with a $300 million P&L at Hudson's Bay Company in between. Nanit hired her in March 2024 for her record with subscription businesses. She built Rent the Runway's first machine learning team in 2017, so the algorithms under Nanit's hood were not foreign. What she said drew her was simpler than that. She likes businesses that sit on a lot of data and use it to make someone's life easier, and modern parents, two of them working, holding themselves to a standard she considers too high, could use the help.

The AI question comes up because a camera over an infant, run by software, sounds like something to fear. She did not dodge it. The data is sensitive; it is locked down and used only by the family it belongs to. "Not all AI is the same," she told the CEO.com Podcast. She also pointed out the technology predates the current excitement. The founders were running computer vision in factories long before anyone called it AI. What changed is the app is fast, and the connection holds from the other side of the world.

Nanit is now betting the same approach can go further than sleep. In December 2025, the company closed a $50 million growth round led by Springcoast Partners, with Upfront Ventures and JVP, to build what it calls a Parenting Intelligence System: software that looks for early signals in speech, motor skills, and cognition. Salinas told Forbes the models will eventually cover children through age 10, and that the point is not to turn parenting into medicine but to make early development visible. The company says more than one million families have used the product and that its research arm holds more than five billion hours of infant sleep data from more than 100 countries.

She took over a fully remote company and moved it to two or three days a week in the office. Her argument is that remote work ran on trust people had built in person before 2020, and the trust ran out after about two years. "The more leadership roles I've had, the more I realize there's no way I can ever win if I don't have trust in my leadership team," she said. She keeps a quarter of her calendar open for the outside world so she doesn't lose perspective inside her own building. When things get hard, she sleeps more, not less, and walks to work.

The CEO.com Podcast ends every conversation with the same question, built on the idea that the chances one gives are just as important as the chances one takes. Salinas did not have to think. Jenn Hyman, co-founder and CEO of Rent the Runway, hired her in her late twenties and kept giving her jobs she would not have raised her hand for.

"She just saw something in me that, honestly, I never even totally saw in myself," Salinas said. "She pushed me up the ladder instead of me having to claw my way to the top."

00:00:00 Introduction
00:00:23 Overview of Nanit's Smart Baby Monitor
00:01:21 How Nanit's Technology Works
00:02:06 The Founding Story of Nanit
00:02:28 Anushka's Career at Rent the Runway
00:03:50 The Future of AI in Consumer Tech
00:06:29 Integrating AI Across Product and Business
00:07:41 Expanding Nanit Beyond Baby Monitoring
00:08:44 A Day in the Life of a CEO
00:09:40 Reading Recommendations
00:10:55 Building Culture and Hybrid Work Models
00:14:07 State of Consumer Tech and Economic Outlook
00:17:28 Balancing Product Development and Customer Feedback
00:19:00 Staying Grounded as a Leader
00:21:25 Giving and Receiving Opportunities

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The<00:03:29.361> expectations<00:03:30.307> that<00:03:30.403> parents<00:03:30.803> put<00:03:30.884> on<00:03:31.028> themselves<00:03:31.989> in<00:03:32.069> this<00:03:32.181> day<00:03:32.310> and<00:03:32.470> age,<00:03:32.646> I<00:03:32.726> think,<00:03:32.902> is<00:03:33.031> very—<00:03:34.232> too<00:03:34.329> much,<00:03:34.873> I<00:03:34.905> would<00:03:35.050> almost<00:03:35.290> say.

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But<00:03:36.492> tools<00:03:36.828> like<00:03:36.988> Nanit,<00:03:37.597> I<00:03:37.613> think,<00:03:38.879> really<00:03:39.120> help<00:03:39.440> ease<00:03:39.600> that<00:03:40.417> for<00:03:40.578> parents<00:03:41.619> and<00:03:41.779> bring<00:03:42.420> what<00:03:42.581> we<00:03:42.661> like<00:03:42.821> to<00:03:42.981> call<00:03:43.157> a<00:03:43.302> digital<00:03:43.702> village<00:03:44.327> of<00:03:44.840> support<00:03:45.625> into<00:03:45.945> the<00:03:46.170> app<00:03:47.067> and<00:03:47.788> really<00:03:48.029> provide<00:03:48.269> the<00:03:48.429> insights<00:03:49.615> to<00:03:49.711> help.

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So<00:03:51.154> what<00:03:51.314> is<00:03:51.475> the<00:03:51.555> future<00:03:51.940> of<00:03:52.036> consumer<00:03:52.517> tech,<00:03:52.918> particularly<00:03:53.383> as<00:03:53.479> it<00:03:53.559> relates<00:03:53.960> to<00:03:54.425> AI<00:03:55.387> in<00:03:55.564> various<00:03:56.029> business<00:03:56.366> models?

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Like,<00:03:56.766> how,<00:03:57.071> how<00:03:57.247> is<00:03:57.328> this<00:03:57.488> going<00:03:57.584> to<00:03:57.648> shake<00:03:58.033> out?

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I<00:03:58.370> know<00:03:58.530> that's<00:03:58.851> probably<00:03:59.332> the,<00:04:00.118> you<00:04:00.150> know,<00:04:00.294> $60<00:04:00.615> million<00:04:01.176> question.

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Yeah,<00:04:02.363> probably<00:04:02.764> more.

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Um,<00:04:04.143> you<00:04:04.223> know,<00:04:04.528> listen,<00:04:04.864> I<00:04:05.009> think<00:04:05.570> when<00:04:05.666> I<00:04:05.746> think<00:04:05.891> about<00:04:06.003> a<00:04:06.067> product<00:04:06.452> like<00:04:06.628> Nanit,<00:04:06.885> right,<00:04:07.125> people<00:04:07.350> don't<00:04:07.574> think<00:04:07.847> about<00:04:08.873> AI<00:04:09.194> in<00:04:09.274> baby<00:04:09.579> monitors<00:04:10.076> or<00:04:10.381> AI<00:04:10.782> in<00:04:11.038> children,<00:04:11.680> right?

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It<00:04:12.000> could<00:04:12.241> sound<00:04:12.706> super<00:04:12.978> scary.

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I<00:04:14.101> think<00:04:14.566> if<00:04:14.662> you<00:04:14.807> look<00:04:15.031> at<00:04:15.111> us<00:04:15.528> as<00:04:15.624> an<00:04:15.769> example<00:04:16.314> of<00:04:16.410> how<00:04:17.853> leveraging<00:04:18.415> the<00:04:19.202> AI<00:04:19.861> and<00:04:19.941> technology<00:04:20.423> tools<00:04:20.663> in<00:04:20.760> the<00:04:20.968> right<00:04:21.225> way<00:04:21.707> can<00:04:22.205> seriously<00:04:22.751> change<00:04:23.136> the<00:04:23.232> game<00:04:23.634> for<00:04:23.859> people.

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I<00:04:24.678> think<00:04:24.838> it's<00:04:24.983> a<00:04:25.063> great<00:04:25.256> example<00:04:26.107> of<00:04:26.203> how<00:04:27.247> used<00:04:27.648> correctly,<00:04:28.515> right?

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So<00:04:29.334> for<00:04:29.639> us,<00:04:29.976> that<00:04:30.217> means<00:04:31.020> we<00:04:31.164> have,<00:04:31.726> um,<00:04:32.545> we<00:04:32.642> have<00:04:32.770> very<00:04:32.963> sensitive<00:04:33.364> and<00:04:33.509> personal<00:04:33.830> data,<00:04:34.311> but<00:04:34.713> we<00:04:34.793> have<00:04:35.355> a<00:04:35.500> very<00:04:35.837> high<00:04:36.142> level<00:04:36.399> of<00:04:36.463> security,<00:04:37.523> and<00:04:37.603> that<00:04:37.764> data<00:04:38.085> is<00:04:38.310> only<00:04:38.727> used<00:04:39.112> to<00:04:39.353> benefit<00:04:40.172> that<00:04:40.477> individual<00:04:41.136> family<00:04:41.698> and<00:04:41.778> child.

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And<00:04:43.143> so<00:04:43.239> that's<00:04:43.689> obviously<00:04:44.025> different<00:04:44.346> than,<00:04:44.507> say,<00:04:44.908> the<00:04:44.988> way<00:04:45.550> LLMs<00:04:46.255> are<00:04:46.817> used<00:04:47.074> or<00:04:47.298> other<00:04:47.539> applications<00:04:48.518> of<00:04:48.742> AI.

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So<00:04:49.705> I<00:04:49.721> think<00:04:50.122> there's<00:04:50.362> tailored<00:04:50.780> solutions<00:04:51.485> for<00:04:51.582> different<00:04:51.871> problem<00:04:52.272> spaces<00:04:52.929> that<00:04:53.090> can<00:04:53.314> hugely<00:04:53.972> benefit<00:04:54.309> consumers.

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And<00:04:55.256> I<00:04:55.336> think<00:04:56.058> it's<00:04:56.154> important<00:04:56.699> that<00:04:57.165> folks<00:04:57.566> remember<00:04:58.063> that<00:04:58.368> not<00:04:58.609> all<00:04:58.769> AI<00:04:59.026> is<00:04:59.106> the<00:04:59.202> same,<00:04:59.908> right?

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And<00:05:01.176> the<00:05:01.256> way<00:05:01.512> that<00:05:01.673> companies<00:05:02.138> like<00:05:02.315> Nanit<00:05:02.780> use<00:05:03.181> AI<00:05:03.903> is<00:05:04.865> unique<00:05:05.218> and<00:05:05.363> different.

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And<00:05:06.325> our<00:05:06.566> goal<00:05:06.887> is<00:05:07.176> 100%<00:05:07.946> to<00:05:09.294> to<00:05:09.599> make<00:05:09.775> parents'<00:05:10.080> lives<00:05:10.257> easier,<00:05:10.818> right?

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Yeah.

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Um,<00:05:12.022> and<00:05:12.102> so<00:05:12.182> I<00:05:12.263> think<00:05:12.423> there's<00:05:12.584> a<00:05:12.648> huge<00:05:12.905> amount<00:05:13.210> of,<00:05:13.611> of<00:05:13.868> opportunity<00:05:14.494> there<00:05:14.750> over<00:05:15.023> time,<00:05:16.179> um,<00:05:16.516> in<00:05:16.660> the<00:05:16.741> way<00:05:17.142> kind<00:05:17.334> of<00:05:17.704> technology<00:05:18.281> advances<00:05:18.843> to<00:05:18.939> benefit<00:05:19.244> consumers.

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Yeah,<00:05:20.849> not<00:05:21.010> only<00:05:21.331> is<00:05:21.876> all<00:05:22.117> AI<00:05:22.775> not<00:05:23.000> the<00:05:23.096> same,<00:05:23.915> it's<00:05:24.139> not<00:05:24.525> all<00:05:24.942> new.

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Like,<00:05:26.130> this<00:05:26.290> has<00:05:26.531> been<00:05:27.093> happening<00:05:27.494> for<00:05:27.654> quite<00:05:27.831> some<00:05:28.072> time,<00:05:29.115> and<00:05:29.259> I<00:05:29.356> imagine<00:05:29.917> you've<00:05:30.238> learned<00:05:30.623> a<00:05:30.784> lot<00:05:31.121> over<00:05:31.362> the<00:05:31.522> years<00:05:31.907> to<00:05:32.004> get<00:05:32.164> to<00:05:32.244> the<00:05:32.389> point<00:05:32.710> where<00:05:32.790> you<00:05:32.951> can<00:05:33.127> really<00:05:33.448> integrate<00:05:33.994> AI<00:05:34.315> with<00:05:34.411> the<00:05:34.540> product,<00:05:34.892> right?

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Definitely.

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Yeah,<00:05:37.119> I<00:05:37.135> mean,<00:05:37.360> as<00:05:37.600> the<00:05:38.001> company<00:05:38.321> was<00:05:38.433> founded<00:05:38.802> 10<00:05:38.978> years<00:05:39.218> ago,<00:05:39.459> that's<00:05:39.779> when<00:05:40.180> the,<00:05:40.500> the<00:05:40.581> two<00:05:40.741> founders<00:05:41.189> sort<00:05:41.302> of<00:05:41.382> came<00:05:41.606> up<00:05:41.702> with<00:05:41.782> this<00:05:42.007> concept.

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But<00:05:43.064> they<00:05:43.224> were<00:05:43.449> using<00:05:43.769> computer<00:05:44.250> vision<00:05:44.522> for<00:05:44.667> similar<00:05:45.131> purposes<00:05:45.612> in<00:05:45.708> the<00:05:45.788> business<00:05:46.189> world,<00:05:46.990> you<00:05:47.086> know,<00:05:47.246> for<00:05:47.391> several<00:05:47.711> years<00:05:48.016> before<00:05:48.352> that.

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So<00:05:48.993> it's<00:05:49.137> not<00:05:49.410> new.

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The<00:05:50.195> advances<00:05:50.756> in<00:05:50.836> the<00:05:50.916> technology<00:05:51.541> have<00:05:51.701> been<00:05:51.861> really,<00:05:52.102> really<00:05:52.294> significant.

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Obviously,<00:05:53.800> we're<00:05:54.025> able<00:05:54.185> to<00:05:54.265> serve<00:05:54.682> that<00:05:55.018> through<00:05:55.803> a<00:05:55.964> really<00:05:56.220> slick,<00:05:56.685> fast<00:05:57.470> app.

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The<00:05:58.271> connectivity<00:05:59.008> is<00:05:59.152> really<00:05:59.409> fast<00:06:00.114> and<00:06:00.210> strong.

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You<00:06:01.396> know,<00:06:01.492> such<00:06:01.813> that<00:06:02.037> you<00:06:02.117> could<00:06:02.213> be<00:06:02.454> halfway<00:06:02.791> across<00:06:03.160> the<00:06:03.256> world<00:06:03.657> and<00:06:03.753> still<00:06:04.041> check<00:06:04.282> in<00:06:04.378> on<00:06:04.458> your<00:06:04.619> child,<00:06:05.164> right?

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So<00:06:05.918> some<00:06:06.126> of<00:06:06.238> those,<00:06:07.008> you<00:06:07.104> know,<00:06:07.280> advances<00:06:07.745> in<00:06:07.826> technology<00:06:08.307> have<00:06:08.467> been<00:06:08.692> pretty<00:06:08.868> significant,<00:06:09.589> but<00:06:10.151> the<00:06:10.295> core,<00:06:11.177> um,<00:06:11.674> the<00:06:11.754> core<00:06:12.460> computer<00:06:12.732> vision<00:06:13.021> applications<00:06:13.518> and<00:06:13.742> algorithms,<00:06:14.544> that's<00:06:14.801> not—<00:06:15.105> that<00:06:15.202> wasn't<00:06:15.442> developed<00:06:15.747> yesterday,<00:06:16.164> right?

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That's<00:06:16.581> actually<00:06:16.869> been<00:06:16.965> around<00:06:17.350> for<00:06:17.447> a<00:06:17.463> long,<00:06:17.751> long<00:06:17.928> time.

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Yeah.

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How<00:06:19.707> much<00:06:20.108> are<00:06:20.317> you<00:06:20.637> putting<00:06:21.199> AI<00:06:21.519> into<00:06:21.712> your<00:06:21.856> product<00:06:22.658> versus,<00:06:23.684> uh,<00:06:23.860> integrating<00:06:24.406> AI<00:06:24.646> inside<00:06:24.999> of<00:06:25.063> the<00:06:25.223> business<00:06:25.704> around<00:06:26.009> customer<00:06:26.426> service<00:06:27.067> and<00:06:27.212> customer<00:06:27.613> support<00:06:28.110> and<00:06:28.254> things<00:06:28.414> like<00:06:28.655> that?

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I<00:06:29.633> mean,<00:06:29.793> I'd<00:06:29.937> say<00:06:30.034> both.

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Listen,<00:06:31.092> the<00:06:31.236> core<00:06:31.556> of<00:06:31.637> the<00:06:31.717> product<00:06:32.422> has<00:06:32.759> been<00:06:33.320> an<00:06:33.544> AI-driven<00:06:34.105> product<00:06:34.506> from<00:06:34.746> the<00:06:34.843> beginning.

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All<00:06:36.670> the<00:06:36.830> algorithms<00:06:37.311> that<00:06:37.407> we<00:06:37.568> develop,<00:06:39.395> which<00:06:39.732> really<00:06:39.908> started<00:06:40.357> with<00:06:40.469> sleep<00:06:40.934> at<00:06:41.030> the<00:06:41.158> core<00:06:41.719> of<00:06:42.457> what<00:06:42.601> the<00:06:42.697> business<00:06:43.018> was<00:06:43.178> founded<00:06:43.563> on,<00:06:43.739> but<00:06:43.900> we've<00:06:44.557> expanded<00:06:45.326> into<00:06:45.567> breathing<00:06:46.208> and<00:06:46.769> health<00:06:47.106> and<00:06:47.186> developmental<00:06:47.667> milestones<00:06:48.228> and<00:06:48.372> things<00:06:48.548> like<00:06:48.709> that<00:06:48.949> as<00:06:49.093> well.

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And<00:06:50.376> of<00:06:50.456> course,<00:06:50.857> memories.

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I<00:06:51.354> don't<00:06:51.514> want<00:06:52.075> to<00:06:52.315> not<00:06:52.556> talk<00:06:52.796> about<00:06:53.037> that.

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We<00:06:53.438> capture<00:06:54.415> some<00:06:54.576> of<00:06:54.640> the<00:06:54.704> most<00:06:54.960> amazing,<00:06:55.521> adorable<00:06:55.938> memories<00:06:56.483> that<00:06:56.563> you<00:06:56.724> otherwise<00:06:57.189> would<00:06:57.237> not<00:06:57.429> have<00:06:57.589> your<00:06:57.750> eyes<00:06:57.910> on.

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So<00:06:58.231> that's<00:06:58.583> super<00:06:58.888> important<00:06:59.208> too.

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So<00:07:00.892> that's<00:07:01.052> been<00:07:01.196> the<00:07:01.276> core<00:07:01.757> of<00:07:01.933> what<00:07:02.109> our<00:07:02.478> actual<00:07:02.798> product<00:07:03.215> has<00:07:03.375> been<00:07:03.600> since<00:07:03.840> the<00:07:03.872> beginning.

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I<00:07:04.481> think<00:07:05.042> in<00:07:05.138> the<00:07:05.298> business<00:07:05.683> side,<00:07:06.099> we<00:07:06.260> are<00:07:06.500> also<00:07:06.804> evaluating<00:07:07.862> more<00:07:08.102> and<00:07:08.182> more<00:07:08.423> ways<00:07:08.888> to<00:07:09.048> use<00:07:09.256> kind<00:07:11.227> of<00:07:11.323> some<00:07:11.547> of<00:07:11.628> these<00:07:11.788> advanced<00:07:12.188> tools.

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Customer<00:07:12.749> service<00:07:13.166> is,<00:07:13.390> of<00:07:13.534> course,<00:07:13.711> an<00:07:13.935> obvious<00:07:14.256> application.

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We've<00:07:15.618> had<00:07:15.954> sort<00:07:16.178> of<00:07:17.252> a<00:07:17.316> system<00:07:17.637> in<00:07:17.797> place<00:07:18.117> there<00:07:18.518> for,<00:07:19.095> I<00:07:19.159> think,<00:07:19.255> about<00:07:19.479> 18<00:07:19.800> months<00:07:20.104> already,<00:07:20.441> but<00:07:20.585> we're<00:07:20.745> looking<00:07:21.018> at<00:07:21.178> new<00:07:21.386> ways<00:07:22.508> to<00:07:22.684> integrate<00:07:24.190> AI,<00:07:24.511> right?

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So<00:07:24.847> we've<00:07:24.992> got<00:07:25.232> an<00:07:25.472> AI<00:07:25.793> email<00:07:26.049> responder<00:07:26.674> that<00:07:26.850> actually<00:07:27.171> has<00:07:27.748> some<00:07:27.957> of<00:07:27.989> the<00:07:28.118> highest<00:07:28.776> scores<00:07:29.483> from<00:07:29.724> customers<00:07:30.367> in<00:07:30.463> terms<00:07:30.768> of<00:07:30.881> the<00:07:30.961> service<00:07:31.347> they<00:07:31.507> receive<00:07:32.311> out<00:07:32.407> of<00:07:32.616> any<00:07:32.793> way<00:07:33.034> that<00:07:33.178> we<00:07:33.275> communicate<00:07:33.676> with<00:07:33.757> customers.

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So<00:07:34.319> I<00:07:34.480> think<00:07:34.640> it<00:07:34.721> actually<00:07:34.962> tells<00:07:35.202> you<00:07:35.363> a<00:07:35.427> lot<00:07:35.829> that<00:07:36.793> things<00:07:36.954> like<00:07:37.050> speed<00:07:37.436> matter<00:07:37.693> a<00:07:37.709> lot,<00:07:38.239> and<00:07:38.480> AI<00:07:38.898> can<00:07:39.299> give<00:07:39.396> a<00:07:39.460> response<00:07:40.022> in<00:07:40.103> like<00:07:40.263> 1<00:07:40.424> minute.

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Yeah,<00:07:42.336> yeah,<00:07:42.593> that,<00:07:42.978> that<00:07:43.155> part<00:07:43.396> is<00:07:43.476> super<00:07:43.878> incredible.

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Given<00:07:44.826> all<00:07:44.922> the<00:07:45.067> data<00:07:45.388> and<00:07:45.485> everything<00:07:45.870> that<00:07:45.966> you<00:07:46.111> can<00:07:46.288> do<00:07:46.593> for<00:07:47.653> babies,<00:07:49.421> have<00:07:49.565> you<00:07:49.662> thought<00:07:49.903> about<00:07:51.027> broadening<00:07:51.654> this<00:07:51.895> out<00:07:52.377> for<00:07:52.794> everyone,<00:07:53.437> like<00:07:53.678> to<00:07:53.823> track<00:07:54.224> every<00:07:54.622> I<00:07:54.642> mean,<00:07:54.722> and<00:07:54.882> there's<00:07:55.043> a<00:07:55.123> lot<00:07:55.428> of<00:07:55.588> companies<00:07:55.925> that<00:07:56.085> do<00:07:56.246> this,<00:07:56.550> right?

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A<00:07:56.871> lot<00:07:56.967> of<00:07:57.047> wearables,<00:07:58.395> even<00:07:58.651> beds,<00:07:59.116> like<00:07:59.293> high-tech<00:07:59.694> beds,<00:07:59.918> things<00:08:00.047> like<00:08:00.239> that.

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But<00:08:00.832> it<00:08:00.897> seems<00:08:01.153> like<00:08:01.298> your<00:08:01.442> technology<00:08:02.083> is<00:08:02.180> unique<00:08:02.581> enough<00:08:03.286> and<00:08:04.088> probably<00:08:04.329> provides<00:08:04.650> a<00:08:04.666> different<00:08:04.938> type<00:08:05.083> of<00:08:05.227> insights<00:08:05.708> that<00:08:06.350> it<00:08:06.430> may<00:08:06.590> be<00:08:06.735> useful<00:08:07.071> even<00:08:07.312> beyond<00:08:07.873> the<00:08:07.953> baby<00:08:08.274> category.

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Oh,<00:08:09.702> 100%.

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I<00:08:10.439> think<00:08:10.664> the<00:08:10.824> power<00:08:11.386> of<00:08:11.546> the<00:08:11.642> platform<00:08:12.123> that<00:08:12.284> we've<00:08:12.524> built<00:08:13.021> extends<00:08:14.208> way<00:08:14.369> beyond<00:08:14.930> baby<00:08:15.171> monitoring.

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I<00:08:15.892> think<00:08:16.117> that's<00:08:16.373> the<00:08:16.454> market<00:08:16.774> that<00:08:16.871> we<00:08:17.015> started<00:08:17.480> in<00:08:17.657> and<00:08:17.801> one<00:08:17.913> that<00:08:18.041> we're<00:08:18.202> really<00:08:18.378> passionate<00:08:18.843> about,<00:08:19.100> right?

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I<00:08:19.501> think<00:08:20.046> I've<00:08:20.142> said<00:08:20.287> it<00:08:20.463> probably<00:08:20.944> a<00:08:20.976> dozen<00:08:21.249> times<00:08:21.570> already<00:08:22.548> in<00:08:22.628> the<00:08:22.709> time<00:08:22.949> we've<00:08:23.109> been<00:08:23.190> talking,<00:08:23.591> but<00:08:24.056> it's<00:08:24.217> very<00:08:24.554> important<00:08:25.020> to<00:08:25.181> us,<00:08:25.357> the<00:08:25.438> mission<00:08:26.064> of<00:08:26.241> sort<00:08:26.466> of<00:08:26.498> furthering<00:08:27.526> family<00:08:27.848> wellness<00:08:28.410> and,<00:08:28.651> and<00:08:28.876> really<00:08:29.133> being<00:08:29.294> that<00:08:29.470> support<00:08:29.856> system<00:08:30.258> for<00:08:30.402> parents.

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So<00:08:31.623> we<00:08:31.768> are<00:08:31.880> focused<00:08:32.266> on<00:08:32.346> that<00:08:32.523> right<00:08:32.732> now,<00:08:32.973> but<00:08:33.134> we<00:08:33.310> believe<00:08:33.712> that<00:08:33.857> the<00:08:34.017> opportunity<00:08:34.676> and<00:08:34.740> the<00:08:34.901> applications<00:08:35.640> for<00:08:35.801> what<00:08:35.945> we've<00:08:36.186> built<00:08:36.524> are<00:08:36.588> massive<00:08:37.713> into<00:08:38.195> other<00:08:38.371> verticals<00:08:38.853> and<00:08:38.998> other<00:08:39.159> spaces.

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Certainly.

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What<00:08:41.183> does<00:08:41.344> a<00:08:41.424> typical<00:08:41.826> day<00:08:42.067> look<00:08:42.308> like<00:08:42.549> for<00:08:42.693> you<00:08:42.886> as<00:08:43.031> CEO?

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Oh<00:08:44.895> my<00:08:45.104> God,<00:08:45.425> I<00:08:45.505> think<00:08:45.762> everyone<00:08:46.068> would<00:08:46.244> probably<00:08:46.871> say<00:08:47.128> this.

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There<00:08:47.594> is<00:08:47.771> no<00:08:47.931> typical<00:08:48.333> day.

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Um,<00:08:49.458> you<00:08:49.538> know,<00:08:49.859> I<00:08:50.004> think<00:08:50.582> A<00:08:50.662> typical<00:08:51.064> day<00:08:51.545> for<00:08:51.706> me<00:08:52.252> is,<00:08:53.777> you<00:08:53.857> know,<00:08:54.098> could<00:08:54.355> be<00:08:55.222> really<00:08:55.462> heads<00:08:55.719> down<00:08:55.960> internally,<00:08:56.522> spending<00:08:56.843> time<00:08:57.084> with<00:08:57.244> the<00:08:57.389> team<00:08:58.208> in<00:08:58.368> meetings,<00:08:58.850> strategy<00:08:59.428> sessions,<00:09:00.600> really<00:09:00.840> going<00:09:01.177> deep<00:09:01.483> on<00:09:01.820> various<00:09:02.205> parts<00:09:02.462> of<00:09:02.542> the<00:09:02.687> business.

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And<00:09:03.264> that,<00:09:03.746> you<00:09:03.842> know,<00:09:04.372> really<00:09:04.629> depends<00:09:05.175> on<00:09:05.817> what<00:09:05.978> area<00:09:06.250> needs<00:09:06.716> me<00:09:06.860> the<00:09:06.893> most<00:09:07.278> or<00:09:07.358> where<00:09:07.519> I<00:09:07.599> have<00:09:07.759> the<00:09:07.840> most<00:09:08.145> questions<00:09:08.723> or<00:09:09.943> see<00:09:10.151> the<00:09:10.184> most<00:09:10.473> opportunity.

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And<00:09:11.355> then<00:09:12.014> there's<00:09:12.190> the<00:09:12.351> external<00:09:12.768> side,<00:09:13.458> you<00:09:13.539> know,<00:09:14.325> conferences,<00:09:15.289> meeting<00:09:15.610> other<00:09:15.867> leaders<00:09:16.188> and<00:09:16.284> CEOs,<00:09:17.472> investors,<00:09:18.194> things<00:09:18.435> like<00:09:18.595> that.

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And,<00:09:19.478> you<00:09:19.558> know,<00:09:19.799> I<00:09:19.879> think<00:09:20.040> my<00:09:20.136> mental<00:09:20.521> model<00:09:20.923> is<00:09:21.227> like<00:09:21.564> at<00:09:21.789> least<00:09:22.046> 25%<00:09:22.752> of<00:09:22.832> my<00:09:22.993> time<00:09:23.250> should<00:09:23.410> be<00:09:23.506> spent<00:09:23.956> externally<00:09:24.534> because<00:09:24.855> it<00:09:25.240> really<00:09:25.497> helps<00:09:25.802> bring<00:09:26.058> perspective.

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I<00:09:26.781> think<00:09:26.957> as<00:09:27.102> a<00:09:27.182> leader,<00:09:28.305> if<00:09:28.386> you're<00:09:28.482> spending<00:09:28.787> too<00:09:28.963> much<00:09:29.188> time<00:09:29.445> internally,<00:09:30.055> then<00:09:30.151> I<00:09:30.231> think<00:09:30.536> you<00:09:30.584> can<00:09:30.713> lose<00:09:30.954> some<00:09:31.114> of<00:09:31.274> that<00:09:31.435> perspective.

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That's<00:09:32.318> super,<00:09:32.591> super<00:09:32.863> important<00:09:34.163> for<00:09:34.324> you<00:09:34.420> to<00:09:34.549> bring<00:09:34.725> back<00:09:34.966> to<00:09:35.110> the<00:09:35.207> team.

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Yeah.

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What<00:09:37.534> do<00:09:37.598> you<00:09:37.775> read?

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What<00:09:38.561> reading<00:09:38.818> recommendations<00:09:39.444> would<00:09:39.604> you<00:09:39.684> have<00:09:39.781> for<00:09:39.941> us?

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Oh<00:09:40.920> my<00:09:41.065> God.

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All<00:09:41.305> right.

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Well,<00:09:41.947> I<00:09:42.028> just<00:09:42.413> finished<00:09:42.814> last<00:09:43.135> night.

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I<00:09:43.408> stayed<00:09:43.713> up<00:09:43.873> late,<00:09:44.034> which<00:09:44.194> I<00:09:44.275> don't<00:09:44.435> normally<00:09:44.820> do,<00:09:45.061> but<00:09:45.157> I've<00:09:45.703> been<00:09:45.880> reading<00:09:46.201> this<00:09:46.490> beautiful<00:09:47.019> fiction<00:09:47.708> book<00:09:48.606> called<00:09:48.783> The<00:09:48.911> Covenant<00:09:49.248> of<00:09:49.328> Water<00:09:49.889> by<00:09:50.274> Abraham<00:09:50.611> Varghese.

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Highly<00:09:51.798> recommend.

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It's<00:09:52.439> very<00:09:52.696> sad<00:09:53.017> though.

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So,<00:09:54.781> in<00:09:54.925> the<00:09:55.005> fall<00:09:55.503> and<00:09:55.567> the<00:09:55.663> winter,<00:09:55.984> I<00:09:56.128> tend<00:09:56.304> to<00:09:56.449> read<00:09:56.930> more<00:09:57.090> fiction,<00:09:57.732> and<00:09:57.892> in<00:09:57.988> kind<00:09:58.149> of<00:09:58.213> the<00:09:58.309> beginning<00:09:58.614> of<00:09:58.694> the<00:09:58.774> year,<00:09:58.951> I<00:09:59.031> tend<00:09:59.352> to<00:09:59.416> read<00:09:59.512> nonfiction.

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So,<00:10:00.442> my<00:10:00.570> nonfiction<00:10:01.340> kind<00:10:01.453> of<00:10:01.661> work<00:10:01.998> pick<00:10:02.383> would<00:10:02.543> be<00:10:03.602> a<00:10:03.682> book<00:10:03.762> called<00:10:04.002> Working<00:10:04.307> Backwards.

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I<00:10:04.836> don't<00:10:04.949> know<00:10:05.029> if<00:10:05.141> you've<00:10:05.590> read<00:10:05.783> this.

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It's<00:10:06.889> written<00:10:07.130> by<00:10:07.515> early<00:10:07.916> Amazon<00:10:08.718> leaders,<00:10:09.279> and<00:10:09.359> it<00:10:09.439> kind<00:10:09.920> of<00:10:09.952> talks<00:10:10.161> about<00:10:10.498> Amazon<00:10:10.899> operating<00:10:11.219> principles<00:10:11.701> and<00:10:11.781> the<00:10:11.861> way<00:10:12.021> they<00:10:12.166> do<00:10:12.262> business.

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And<00:10:13.384> even<00:10:13.641> if<00:10:13.785> you're<00:10:14.090> a<00:10:14.331> tiny<00:10:14.892> company<00:10:15.694> and<00:10:15.774> like<00:10:16.015> you're,<00:10:16.752> not<00:10:17.073> ready<00:10:17.378> for<00:10:17.635> it,<00:10:17.859> I<00:10:17.875> think<00:10:18.052> it's<00:10:18.260> so<00:10:18.437> valuable<00:10:19.142> to<00:10:19.303> just<00:10:20.025> go<00:10:20.201> deep<00:10:20.458> and<00:10:20.602> really<00:10:20.907> understand<00:10:22.046> at<00:10:22.206> what<00:10:22.383> point<00:10:22.752> in<00:10:22.848> their<00:10:23.008> business<00:10:23.329> they<00:10:23.425> started<00:10:23.810> adopting<00:10:24.292> some<00:10:24.452> of<00:10:24.596> these<00:10:24.773> principles<00:10:25.398> like<00:10:25.575> monthly<00:10:25.896> business<00:10:26.281> reviews<00:10:27.002> and,<00:10:27.885> you<00:10:28.045> know,<00:10:28.302> just<00:10:28.639> the<00:10:28.783> way<00:10:29.088> they<00:10:29.328> think<00:10:29.569> about,<00:10:29.810> you<00:10:29.890> know,<00:10:30.050> writing<00:10:30.307> documents<00:10:31.029> and<00:10:31.125> stuff<00:10:31.350> like<00:10:31.510> that.

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So<00:10:32.216> I<00:10:32.537> highly<00:10:32.857> recommend<00:10:33.274> that<00:10:33.435> one<00:10:33.595> for<00:10:33.756> any<00:10:33.900> business<00:10:34.237> leader.

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So<00:10:36.226> as<00:10:36.402> you<00:10:36.948> have,<00:10:37.445> you<00:10:37.525> know,<00:10:37.766> been<00:10:37.926> a<00:10:37.942> leader<00:10:38.247> for<00:10:38.408> all<00:10:38.472> this<00:10:38.632> time,<00:10:38.728> like,<00:10:38.953> how<00:10:39.129> do<00:10:39.274> you<00:10:39.450> think<00:10:39.851> about<00:10:40.092> culture,<00:10:40.733> building<00:10:41.231> a<00:10:41.359> culture<00:10:41.920> within<00:10:42.963> your<00:10:43.204> company?

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And<00:10:44.888> how<00:10:44.985> do<00:10:45.129> you<00:10:45.161> manage<00:10:45.707> in<00:10:45.787> terms<00:10:46.172> from<00:10:46.429> like,<00:10:46.750> like<00:10:46.927> the<00:10:47.055> big<00:10:47.232> debate<00:10:47.537> right<00:10:47.697> now<00:10:48.034> outside<00:10:48.355> of<00:10:48.435> AI<00:10:48.997> in<00:10:49.141> the<00:10:49.238> business<00:10:50.040> community<00:10:50.682> is<00:10:50.907> work<00:10:51.083> from<00:10:51.308> home,<00:10:51.629> hybrid,<00:10:52.528> everybody<00:10:52.929> in<00:10:53.073> office.

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Like,<00:10:53.651> how<00:10:53.731> are<00:10:53.892> you<00:10:54.052> managing<00:10:54.614> all<00:10:54.694> of<00:10:54.855> that?

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Yeah,<00:10:56.540> I<00:10:56.556> mean,<00:10:56.861> I<00:10:57.005> have<00:10:57.182> a<00:10:57.423> pretty<00:10:57.663> strong<00:10:58.065> point<00:10:58.289> of<00:10:58.369> view<00:10:58.931> on<00:10:59.364> this<00:10:59.669> personally,<00:11:00.311> which<00:11:00.552> is<00:11:00.777> that<00:11:01.676> I<00:11:01.756> think<00:11:02.638> people<00:11:02.895> made<00:11:03.104> it<00:11:03.264> work<00:11:03.746> during<00:11:04.067> COVID<00:11:04.548> and<00:11:04.628> it<00:11:04.661> was<00:11:04.821> a<00:11:04.966> very<00:11:05.222> specific<00:11:05.768> moment<00:11:06.089> in<00:11:06.169> time<00:11:06.651> where<00:11:07.999> I<00:11:08.015> think<00:11:08.737> more<00:11:08.962> often<00:11:09.218> than<00:11:09.379> not<00:11:09.684> for<00:11:09.860> businesses,<00:11:10.567> the<00:11:10.647> sort<00:11:10.823> of<00:11:10.984> mandate<00:11:11.305> of<00:11:11.369> what<00:11:11.481> had<00:11:11.626> to<00:11:11.770> happen<00:11:12.091> was,<00:11:12.508> was<00:11:12.669> pretty<00:11:12.910> clear.

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And<00:11:14.836> people<00:11:15.061> had<00:11:15.173> the<00:11:15.301> political<00:11:15.638> capital<00:11:16.056> of<00:11:16.184> having<00:11:16.425> worked<00:11:16.618> together<00:11:16.987> previously.

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So,<00:11:17.789> I<00:11:17.886> think<00:11:18.110> like<00:11:18.271> the<00:11:18.351> first<00:11:18.769> 18<00:11:19.090> to<00:11:19.154> 24<00:11:19.571> months<00:11:19.812> of<00:11:19.892> COVID<00:11:20.133> people<00:11:20.390> sort<00:11:20.615> of—<00:11:21.658> it<00:11:21.738> was<00:11:21.899> pretty<00:11:22.140> effective.

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And<00:11:22.846> then<00:11:23.263> the<00:11:23.359> wheels<00:11:23.568> started<00:11:23.889> falling<00:11:24.210> off<00:11:24.371> the<00:11:24.467> bus<00:11:24.772> a<00:11:24.788> little<00:11:25.029> bit.

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And,<00:11:27.100> you<00:11:27.196> know,<00:11:28.464> growth<00:11:29.267> and<00:11:29.764> new<00:11:29.941> strategies<00:11:30.824> and<00:11:31.032> creativity<00:11:32.092> and<00:11:32.573> building<00:11:32.814> consensus<00:11:33.697> and<00:11:33.922> all<00:11:34.018> those<00:11:34.179> different<00:11:34.419> things<00:11:34.644> I<00:11:34.676> think<00:11:34.821> are<00:11:34.901> very<00:11:35.142> hard<00:11:35.318> to<00:11:35.463> do<00:11:36.009> when<00:11:36.169> you're<00:11:36.265> not<00:11:37.229> in<00:11:37.453> person<00:11:37.855> with<00:11:38.031> people.

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And<00:11:38.689> so,<00:11:38.914> I<00:11:39.075> am<00:11:39.155> a<00:11:39.235> believer<00:11:39.620> in<00:11:39.781> person.

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When<00:11:40.455> I<00:11:40.519> came<00:11:40.824> in<00:11:41.406> When<00:11:41.426> I<00:11:41.446> came<00:11:41.466> to<00:11:41.498> Nanit,<00:11:42.059> they<00:11:42.267> were<00:11:43.389> remote,<00:11:44.527> and<00:11:44.607> so<00:11:44.767> we've<00:11:44.912> transitioned<00:11:45.729> into<00:11:45.985> a<00:11:46.049> hybrid<00:11:46.530> model.

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So,<00:11:47.155> we're<00:11:47.251> in<00:11:47.332> the<00:11:47.476> office<00:11:48.678> 2<00:11:48.790> to<00:11:48.854> 3<00:11:49.014> days<00:11:49.239> a<00:11:49.255> week<00:11:49.671> and<00:11:50.056> work<00:11:50.441> remote<00:11:51.514> 2<00:11:52.284> to<00:11:52.476> 3<00:11:52.700> days<00:11:52.941> a<00:11:53.005> week.

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And<00:11:53.309> I<00:11:53.341> think<00:11:53.758> it's<00:11:54.127> going<00:11:54.383> really<00:11:54.543> well.

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I've<00:11:54.848> actually<00:11:55.104> gotten<00:11:55.345> very<00:11:55.585> positive<00:11:55.922> feedback<00:11:56.467> from<00:11:56.691> folks<00:11:57.011> that<00:11:57.092> have<00:11:57.172> said,<00:11:58.294> "Wow,<00:11:58.470> I<00:11:58.486> feel<00:11:58.694> like<00:11:58.935> I<00:11:59.031> actually<00:11:59.576> really<00:12:00.698> have<00:12:00.858> built<00:12:01.034> a<00:12:01.098> ton<00:12:01.274> of<00:12:01.355> trust<00:12:01.899> with<00:12:02.060> people<00:12:02.396> and<00:12:02.541> we're<00:12:02.637> coming<00:12:02.877> up<00:12:03.021> with<00:12:03.198> way<00:12:03.342> better<00:12:03.582> ideas."<00:12:04.303> So,<00:12:05.137> successful<00:12:05.602> so<00:12:05.762> far.

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Yeah,<00:12:06.579> there's<00:12:06.788> nothing<00:12:07.108> quite<00:12:07.364> like<00:12:07.605> being<00:12:07.845> in<00:12:08.070> person,<00:12:08.647> right?

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Being<00:12:09.288> in<00:12:09.368> an<00:12:09.512> office<00:12:09.913> with<00:12:09.993> someone<00:12:10.329> building<00:12:10.730> together.

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I<00:12:11.932> mean,<00:12:12.238> obviously<00:12:12.591> it<00:12:12.655> can<00:12:12.960> work<00:12:13.137> and<00:12:13.201> a<00:12:13.217> lot<00:12:13.394> of<00:12:13.458> companies<00:12:13.843> do<00:12:13.923> make<00:12:14.116> it<00:12:14.245> work<00:12:14.421> fully<00:12:14.807> remote.

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It<00:12:15.385> does<00:12:15.481> seem<00:12:15.706> like<00:12:15.866> hybrid<00:12:16.348> is<00:12:16.493> kind<00:12:16.669> of<00:12:16.814> where<00:12:17.215> a<00:12:17.376> lot<00:12:17.568> of<00:12:17.713> companies<00:12:18.195> are<00:12:18.339> landing,<00:12:19.319> like,<00:12:19.559> like<00:12:19.800> you<00:12:20.025> have,<00:12:21.004> but<00:12:21.149> what,<00:12:21.470> yeah,<00:12:21.711> like<00:12:21.888> this<00:12:22.112> idea<00:12:22.369> of<00:12:22.450> like<00:12:22.610> building<00:12:23.012> trust<00:12:23.317> with<00:12:23.429> each<00:12:23.638> other,<00:12:23.975> working<00:12:24.360> side<00:12:24.617> by<00:12:24.778> side<00:12:25.083> with<00:12:25.243> each<00:12:25.420> other.

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Like<00:12:26.464> if,<00:12:26.688> if<00:12:26.929> there<00:12:27.026> are<00:12:27.250> leaders<00:12:27.572> out<00:12:27.732> there<00:12:27.893> who<00:12:28.005> are<00:12:28.134> like<00:12:28.310> trying<00:12:28.551> to<00:12:28.631> figure<00:12:28.856> out<00:12:29.017> like,<00:12:29.274> which<00:12:29.514> one<00:12:29.675> of<00:12:29.755> these<00:12:30.076> should<00:12:30.237> we<00:12:30.398> do?

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We're<00:12:31.265> trying<00:12:31.522> to<00:12:31.666> pick<00:12:31.987> this.

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What,<00:12:33.432> uh,<00:12:34.091> give<00:12:34.251> them<00:12:34.412> the<00:12:34.492> case<00:12:34.893> for<00:12:35.038> why<00:12:35.198> this<00:12:35.439> is,<00:12:35.921> uh,<00:12:36.258> the<00:12:36.339> right<00:12:36.579> approach.

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Yeah,<00:12:38.264> you<00:12:38.360> know,<00:12:38.825> I,<00:12:39.290> I<00:12:39.450> used<00:12:39.626> to<00:12:39.770> sort<00:12:39.947> of<00:12:40.027> think,<00:12:40.508> okay,<00:12:40.764> maybe<00:12:41.053> it's<00:12:41.213> more<00:12:41.374> of<00:12:41.470> a<00:12:41.486> startup<00:12:42.095> thing.

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You<00:12:43.409> know,<00:12:44.355> I<00:12:44.499> think<00:12:44.692> it's<00:12:44.836> an<00:12:45.061> every<00:12:45.301> company<00:12:45.734> thing<00:12:46.215> is,<00:12:46.503> is<00:12:47.096> sort<00:12:47.337> of<00:12:47.465> my<00:12:47.642> assessment.

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There<00:12:48.267> probably<00:12:48.748> are<00:12:48.860> some<00:12:49.405> exceptions<00:12:50.030> to<00:12:50.126> that,<00:12:50.527> maybe<00:12:50.832> where<00:12:51.072> the<00:12:51.104> mandate<00:12:51.633> is<00:12:52.355> very,<00:12:52.531> very<00:12:52.771> clear<00:12:53.092> and<00:12:53.220> the<00:12:53.268> majority<00:12:53.653> of<00:12:53.733> people<00:12:53.974> are<00:12:54.134> individual<00:12:54.615> contributors.

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I<00:12:56.058> think<00:12:56.442> there's<00:12:56.699> maybe<00:12:56.923> some<00:12:57.164> edge<00:12:57.340> cases,<00:12:57.805> but<00:12:57.917> for<00:12:58.013> the<00:12:58.077> most<00:12:58.382> part,<00:12:58.863> I<00:12:58.943> think<00:12:59.584> in<00:12:59.681> a<00:12:59.745> business<00:13:00.129> that<00:13:00.290> requires<00:13:01.011> strong<00:13:01.268> collaboration,<00:13:02.213> which<00:13:02.390> is<00:13:02.710> most,<00:13:03.805> creative<00:13:04.298> thinking<00:13:04.790> and<00:13:04.873> problem<00:13:05.283> solving,<00:13:05.859> which<00:13:06.023> is<00:13:06.105> most<00:13:06.269> businesses,<00:13:08.700> building<00:13:08.974> trust,<00:13:09.540> which<00:13:09.702> I<00:13:09.847> think<00:13:10.009> to<00:13:10.122> me<00:13:10.268> is<00:13:10.413> actually<00:13:10.995> one<00:13:11.141> of<00:13:11.238> the<00:13:11.319> most<00:13:11.642> important<00:13:12.111> things.

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And,<00:13:12.612> you<00:13:12.936> know,<00:13:13.986> the<00:13:14.229> more<00:13:14.391> leadership<00:13:14.795> roles<00:13:15.102> I've<00:13:15.199> had,<00:13:15.442> the<00:13:15.522> more<00:13:15.765> I<00:13:15.927> realize,<00:13:16.557> like,<00:13:17.058> there's<00:13:17.236> no<00:13:17.382> way<00:13:17.608> I<00:13:17.705> can<00:13:17.867> ever<00:13:18.109> win<00:13:18.433> if<00:13:18.513> I<00:13:18.594> don't<00:13:18.836> have<00:13:18.998> trust<00:13:19.385> among<00:13:19.563> my<00:13:19.659> leadership<00:13:20.192> team.

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And<00:13:20.531> I<00:13:20.612> think<00:13:20.773> that's<00:13:21.015> true<00:13:21.322> for<00:13:22.145> every<00:13:22.387> team.

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So,<00:13:23.744> you<00:13:23.937> know,<00:13:24.163> to<00:13:24.325> me,<00:13:24.486> the<00:13:24.567> case<00:13:24.954> is<00:13:25.132> it<00:13:25.196> doesn't<00:13:25.422> have<00:13:25.535> to<00:13:25.600> be<00:13:25.697> 5<00:13:25.874> days<00:13:26.100> a<00:13:26.165> week.

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I<00:13:26.827> do<00:13:27.053> think<00:13:27.230> that<00:13:27.360> that<00:13:27.477> model<00:13:28.312> is<00:13:29.197> you<00:13:29.374> know,<00:13:29.551> not<00:13:29.761> required<00:13:30.502> anymore.

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But<00:13:31.403> there<00:13:31.548> has<00:13:31.854> to<00:13:31.967> be<00:13:32.257> a<00:13:32.418> real<00:13:34.946> significant<00:13:35.494> amount<00:13:35.719> of<00:13:35.800> time<00:13:36.396> that<00:13:36.541> people<00:13:36.702> are<00:13:36.847> spending<00:13:37.265> together<00:13:37.813> doing<00:13:38.055> the<00:13:38.200> work<00:13:38.394> together<00:13:39.445> so<00:13:39.607> that<00:13:39.914> when<00:13:40.092> you're<00:13:40.238> not<00:13:40.497> together,<00:13:40.998> there's<00:13:41.225> enough<00:13:41.694> trust<00:13:42.277> built<00:13:42.584> up<00:13:43.005> that,<00:13:43.878> you<00:13:43.975> know,<00:13:44.380> the<00:13:44.784> misinterpretation<00:13:45.674> that<00:13:45.820> happens<00:13:46.143> over<00:13:46.305> a<00:13:46.337> Slack<00:13:46.807> message<00:13:47.760> or<00:13:48.244> a<00:13:48.260> Zoom<00:13:48.647> call<00:13:48.905> where<00:13:49.050> you're<00:13:49.147> not<00:13:49.309> getting<00:13:49.534> the<00:13:49.615> full<00:13:49.857> person's<00:13:50.196> body<00:13:50.519> language,<00:13:51.551> like,<00:13:52.197> that<00:13:52.293> you<00:13:52.390> can<00:13:52.535> sort<00:13:52.713> of<00:13:52.842> like<00:13:53.262> put<00:13:53.423> that<00:13:53.600> aside<00:13:54.149> because<00:13:54.375> you<00:13:54.472> spent<00:13:54.859> enough<00:13:55.504> real<00:13:55.682> time<00:13:56.021> together<00:13:56.488> to<00:13:56.714> build<00:13:56.892> that<00:13:57.122> relationship<00:13:57.711> and<00:13:57.793> build<00:13:58.023> that<00:13:58.203> trust.

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So,<00:13:59.769> you<00:13:59.801> know,<00:13:59.929> to<00:14:00.026> me<00:14:00.186> it's<00:14:00.732> very,<00:14:00.973> it's<00:14:01.214> few<00:14:01.375> and<00:14:01.471> far<00:14:01.631> between<00:14:02.033> that<00:14:02.177> I<00:14:02.258> can<00:14:02.354> think<00:14:02.531> of<00:14:02.611> a<00:14:02.675> company<00:14:03.237> that<00:14:03.398> wouldn't<00:14:03.703> benefit<00:14:04.216> from<00:14:04.827> some<00:14:05.003> amount<00:14:05.244> of<00:14:05.356> time<00:14:05.485> together.

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What<00:14:07.251> is<00:14:07.412> the<00:14:07.492> state<00:14:08.038> of<00:14:08.407> consumer<00:14:09.322> tech<00:14:09.884> right<00:14:10.125> now<00:14:10.623> economically<00:14:11.811> and<00:14:11.923> its<00:14:12.148> future?

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And,<00:14:13.417> and<00:14:13.513> part<00:14:13.754> of<00:14:13.818> that<00:14:14.139> is<00:14:14.380> a<00:14:14.476> broader<00:14:14.862> question<00:14:15.279> around<00:14:15.681> like,<00:14:15.905> you<00:14:15.937> know,<00:14:16.082> like<00:14:16.243> now<00:14:16.483> CEOs<00:14:17.270> are<00:14:17.350> expected<00:14:17.993> to<00:14:18.282> comment<00:14:19.133> and<00:14:19.277> talk<00:14:19.534> about<00:14:19.839> things<00:14:20.080> that<00:14:20.176> are<00:14:20.257> well<00:14:20.497> beyond<00:14:21.284> what<00:14:21.445> they<00:14:21.605> do<00:14:22.023> at<00:14:22.167> their<00:14:22.328> company.

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Right.

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And<00:14:23.773> so<00:14:23.949> like,<00:14:24.495> as<00:14:24.592> you're<00:14:24.736> looking<00:14:25.073> to<00:14:25.218> 2025<00:14:26.438> and<00:14:26.663> thinking<00:14:27.000> about<00:14:27.402> kind<00:14:27.626> of<00:14:27.723> the<00:14:28.285> marketplace<00:14:29.248> and<00:14:29.409> economics<00:14:29.890> of<00:14:29.970> that.

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How<00:14:30.612> are<00:14:30.837> you<00:14:30.949> thinking<00:14:31.991> things<00:14:32.312> are<00:14:32.360> going<00:14:32.472> to<00:14:32.537> shake<00:14:32.857> out?

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Well,<00:14:34.701> you<00:14:34.782> know,<00:14:35.102> there's<00:14:35.583> a<00:14:35.648> couple<00:14:35.840> of<00:14:35.968> questions<00:14:36.321> wrapped<00:14:36.610> up<00:14:36.722> in<00:14:36.786> there,<00:14:36.962> but<00:14:37.251> if<00:14:37.347> I<00:14:37.492> can<00:14:37.588> just<00:14:37.812> comment<00:14:38.245> on<00:14:38.374> your<00:14:38.534> question<00:14:38.935> around<00:14:39.256> sort<00:14:39.432> of<00:14:39.753> leaders<00:14:40.057> being<00:14:40.250> expected<00:14:40.715> to<00:14:40.795> weigh<00:14:41.036> in<00:14:41.180> on<00:14:41.420> things,<00:14:42.318> you<00:14:42.415> know,<00:14:43.665> it's<00:14:43.842> been<00:14:43.938> such<00:14:44.307> a<00:14:44.627> challenging<00:14:45.189> time<00:14:45.365> to<00:14:45.445> be<00:14:45.542> a<00:14:45.590> leader<00:14:45.926> over<00:14:46.103> the<00:14:46.263> last<00:14:46.728> like<00:14:46.969> 4<00:14:47.193> years.

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I<00:14:48.107> think<00:14:48.412> that<00:14:48.492> we<00:14:48.652> went<00:14:48.829> through<00:14:49.053> a<00:14:49.198> real<00:14:49.438> period<00:14:49.711> of<00:14:49.775> time<00:14:50.176> where<00:14:50.978> leaders<00:14:51.282> were<00:14:51.379> expected<00:14:51.860> to<00:14:51.940> have<00:14:52.116> an<00:14:52.196> opinion<00:14:53.046> on<00:14:53.223> every<00:14:53.399> single<00:14:53.704> topic,<00:14:54.249> regardless<00:14:54.746> of<00:14:54.826> whether<00:14:55.067> it<00:14:55.131> was<00:14:55.243> relevant<00:14:55.628> for<00:14:55.740> their<00:14:55.933> business<00:14:56.334> or<00:14:56.366> not.

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Right.

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And<00:14:57.456> regardless<00:14:57.793> of<00:14:57.857> whether<00:14:58.033> they<00:14:58.178> had<00:14:58.338> an<00:14:58.418> educated<00:14:58.819> opinion<00:14:59.220> on<00:14:59.476> it,<00:14:59.621> which<00:14:59.781> I<00:14:59.877> think<00:15:00.053> is<00:15:00.663> oftentimes<00:15:01.545> folks<00:15:01.721> don't,<00:15:02.026> right?

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And<00:15:02.988> so<00:15:03.388> I'm<00:15:03.805> happy<00:15:04.126> that<00:15:04.270> we've<00:15:04.431> come<00:15:04.527> back<00:15:04.687> to<00:15:04.848> a<00:15:04.912> place<00:15:05.232> where<00:15:05.393> I<00:15:05.489> think,<00:15:06.355> you<00:15:06.451> know,<00:15:06.531> the<00:15:06.611> pendulum<00:15:07.076> has<00:15:07.188> swung<00:15:07.493> back.

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And<00:15:08.038> I<00:15:08.134> think<00:15:09.177> leaders<00:15:09.722> and<00:15:10.042> consumers<00:15:10.539> too<00:15:10.844> have<00:15:10.892> sort<00:15:11.101> of<00:15:11.181> come<00:15:11.421> to<00:15:11.582> realize<00:15:12.143> that,<00:15:13.009> you<00:15:13.041> know,<00:15:13.249> if<00:15:13.409> you<00:15:13.506> run<00:15:13.746> a<00:15:13.987> baby<00:15:14.227> monitor<00:15:14.628> business,<00:15:15.093> you<00:15:15.173> shouldn't<00:15:15.494> necessarily<00:15:16.215> have<00:15:16.408> an<00:15:16.536> opinion<00:15:17.274> on,<00:15:17.739> you<00:15:17.771> know,<00:15:17.979> wars<00:15:18.220> that<00:15:18.316> are<00:15:18.380> happening<00:15:18.797> all<00:15:18.941> over<00:15:19.117> the<00:15:19.262> world<00:15:20.079> to<00:15:20.160> communicate<00:15:20.641> to<00:15:20.705> your<00:15:20.865> customers,<00:15:21.426> right?

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Or<00:15:22.468> you<00:15:22.549> shouldn't<00:15:22.805> take<00:15:22.982> a<00:15:23.030> side<00:15:23.366> politically<00:15:23.863> necessarily<00:15:24.505> because<00:15:24.954> you<00:15:25.050> probably<00:15:25.435> have<00:15:26.317> customers<00:15:26.799> that<00:15:27.281> are<00:15:27.762> 50/50<00:15:28.324> on<00:15:28.404> both<00:15:28.501> sides<00:15:28.838> of<00:15:28.918> the<00:15:29.127> aisle.

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And<00:15:29.769> so<00:15:30.427> I'm<00:15:30.668> personally,<00:15:31.150> as<00:15:31.246> a<00:15:31.294> leader,<00:15:31.616> really<00:15:31.792> happy<00:15:32.097> that<00:15:32.595> the<00:15:32.691> pendulum<00:15:33.060> has<00:15:33.237> come<00:15:33.462> back<00:15:33.735> to<00:15:33.815> the<00:15:33.895> center.

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And<00:15:34.522> I<00:15:34.602> think<00:15:34.762> that<00:15:34.987> expectation<00:15:35.645> is<00:15:35.758> now<00:15:35.950> reasonable.

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And<00:15:37.331> back<00:15:37.588> to<00:15:38.600> what<00:15:39.081> does<00:15:39.402> your<00:15:39.563> brand<00:15:39.820> stand<00:15:40.061> for?

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What<00:15:40.526> does<00:15:40.623> your<00:15:40.783> company<00:15:41.088> stand<00:15:41.345> for?

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What<00:15:41.682> is<00:15:41.811> the<00:15:41.843> mission?

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And<00:15:43.015> then<00:15:43.175> there<00:15:43.336> might<00:15:43.513> be<00:15:43.737> 1<00:15:43.850> or<00:15:43.994> 2<00:15:44.412> specific<00:15:44.958> topics<00:15:45.519> that<00:15:45.664> it<00:15:45.744> makes<00:15:45.953> sense<00:15:46.146> for<00:15:46.242> you<00:15:46.322> to<00:15:46.403> weigh<00:15:46.643> in<00:15:46.788> on.

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And<00:15:47.446> you<00:15:47.542> should<00:15:47.751> weigh<00:15:47.928> in<00:15:48.072> on<00:15:48.249> those<00:15:48.731> as<00:15:48.891> it<00:15:49.052> makes<00:15:49.325> sense<00:15:49.517> to<00:15:49.598> your<00:15:49.774> brand<00:15:50.095> and<00:15:50.159> your<00:15:50.208> consumer<00:15:50.673> set.

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But<00:15:51.444> otherwise,<00:15:52.006> it's<00:15:52.744> not<00:15:52.969> really<00:15:53.467> your<00:15:53.627> place.

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And<00:15:54.189> I<00:15:54.270> think<00:15:54.800> Building<00:15:55.216> culture,<00:15:55.665> to<00:15:55.857> your<00:15:56.194> question<00:15:56.659> there,<00:15:56.996> like<00:15:58.422> internally<00:15:59.240> for<00:15:59.400> your<00:15:59.641> team,<00:16:00.282> there<00:16:00.426> may<00:16:00.602> be<00:16:00.923> beliefs<00:16:01.789> and<00:16:02.911> values<00:16:03.328> that<00:16:03.472> you<00:16:03.632> uphold<00:16:04.113> internally<00:16:04.850> that<00:16:05.556> mean<00:16:05.812> you<00:16:05.956> might<00:16:06.213> speak<00:16:06.534> to<00:16:06.758> more<00:16:06.950> things<00:16:07.335> internally<00:16:07.816> than<00:16:07.976> externally.

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And<00:16:09.163> I<00:16:09.179> think<00:16:09.403> that<00:16:09.579> nuance<00:16:10.060> is<00:16:10.140> really,<00:16:10.381> really<00:16:10.701> important.

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You<00:16:12.320> know,<00:16:12.385> the<00:16:12.465> state<00:16:12.721> of<00:16:12.849> consumer<00:16:13.266> tech<00:16:13.571> broadly,<00:16:14.533> I<00:16:14.613> would<00:16:14.773> say,<00:16:15.270> I<00:16:15.334> think<00:16:15.430> it<00:16:15.526> depends.

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You<00:16:16.312> know,<00:16:16.456> we've<00:16:16.777> been<00:16:16.889> in<00:16:17.017> this<00:16:17.258> like<00:16:17.819> malaise<00:16:18.380> of,<00:16:18.540> are<00:16:18.636> we<00:16:18.797> going,<00:16:19.422> you<00:16:19.454> know,<00:16:19.614> is<00:16:19.742> the<00:16:19.823> economy<00:16:20.143> booming<00:16:20.416> or<00:16:20.480> are<00:16:20.576> we<00:16:20.704> going<00:16:20.881> into<00:16:21.041> a<00:16:21.121> recession?

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This<00:16:21.794> sort<00:16:21.939> of<00:16:22.067> like,<00:16:22.724> you<00:16:22.788> know,<00:16:22.964> uncertainty<00:16:23.606> that<00:16:23.766> we've<00:16:23.990> been<00:16:24.103> sort<00:16:24.311> of<00:16:24.391> navigating<00:16:25.032> for<00:16:25.145> the<00:16:25.225> last<00:16:25.529> couple<00:16:25.786> of<00:16:25.930> years.

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Like,<00:16:28.239> you<00:16:28.272> know,<00:16:28.480> maybe<00:16:29.362> cautiously<00:16:30.100> we'll<00:16:30.341> be<00:16:30.421> in<00:16:30.501> the<00:16:30.581> soft<00:16:30.822> landing<00:16:31.223> scenario<00:16:31.945> and<00:16:32.089> things<00:16:32.266> will<00:16:32.410> kind<00:16:32.651> of<00:16:33.132> continue.

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But<00:16:33.950> what<00:16:34.094> I've<00:16:34.335> observed<00:16:34.832> personally<00:16:35.233> in<00:16:35.298> the<00:16:35.394> consumer<00:16:35.731> space<00:16:36.035> over<00:16:36.100> the<00:16:36.180> last<00:16:36.356> couple<00:16:36.661> of<00:16:36.757> years<00:16:37.142> is<00:16:37.303> that<00:16:37.864> because<00:16:38.201> of<00:16:38.281> this<00:16:38.442> kind<00:16:38.602> of<00:16:38.682> uncertainty<00:16:39.404> on<00:16:39.484> the<00:16:39.565> consumer<00:16:39.982> side,<00:16:41.104> there's<00:16:41.329> like<00:16:41.489> winners<00:16:41.810> and<00:16:41.890> losers,<00:16:42.308> right?

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There's<00:16:42.773> some<00:16:42.997> brands<00:16:43.318> that<00:16:43.382> are<00:16:43.479> continuing<00:16:43.896> to<00:16:43.992> do<00:16:44.216> really,<00:16:44.457> really<00:16:44.698> well.

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And<00:16:45.099> I<00:16:45.195> think<00:16:45.404> those<00:16:45.596> are<00:16:45.660> the<00:16:45.740> brands<00:16:46.125> that<00:16:46.222> have<00:16:46.478> extraordinary<00:16:47.344> product<00:16:47.649> market<00:16:47.986> fit<00:16:48.371> and<00:16:49.173> product<00:16:49.526> is<00:16:49.670> matched<00:16:50.136> to<00:16:50.328> the<00:16:50.408> new<00:16:50.633> future<00:16:51.114> that<00:16:51.259> we're<00:16:51.435> living<00:16:51.820> in.

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Right.

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And<00:16:52.622> I<00:16:52.718> think<00:16:52.959> Nanit<00:16:53.216> is<00:16:53.360> one<00:16:53.456> of<00:16:53.585> those.

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Those<00:16:54.387> companies.

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If<00:16:54.981> you<00:16:55.109> think<00:16:55.286> about<00:16:55.542> the<00:16:56.393> adoption<00:16:57.677> and<00:16:57.774> ubiquity<00:16:58.496> of<00:16:59.363> wellness<00:16:59.684> tracking<00:17:00.181> and<00:17:00.245> smart<00:17:00.422> tools,<00:17:00.647> I'm<00:17:00.759> an<00:17:00.839> Oura<00:17:01.128> Ring<00:17:01.305> user<00:17:01.546> myself,<00:17:02.107> but<00:17:02.268> you<00:17:02.348> know,<00:17:02.573> you<00:17:02.669> can<00:17:02.894> think<00:17:03.006> about<00:17:03.295> Apple<00:17:03.472> Watch<00:17:03.809> or<00:17:04.017> Whoop<00:17:04.354> or<00:17:04.435> things<00:17:04.659> like<00:17:04.756> that.

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You<00:17:05.959> know,<00:17:06.088> a<00:17:06.104> product<00:17:06.457> like<00:17:06.666> Nanit,<00:17:06.939> I<00:17:07.003> think,<00:17:07.179> is<00:17:07.308> really<00:17:07.549> well<00:17:07.725> matched<00:17:08.046> to<00:17:08.191> the<00:17:08.271> future<00:17:08.768> and<00:17:08.865> adoption<00:17:09.266> of<00:17:09.394> technology.

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And<00:17:10.518> then<00:17:10.630> I<00:17:10.694> think<00:17:10.919> there's,<00:17:11.337> there's<00:17:11.561> the<00:17:11.658> losers<00:17:11.979> to<00:17:12.203> the<00:17:12.284> companies<00:17:12.701> that<00:17:12.861> just<00:17:13.086> maybe<00:17:13.263> don't<00:17:13.487> have<00:17:13.664> that<00:17:14.386> quite<00:17:14.627> strong<00:17:14.932> product<00:17:15.189> market<00:17:15.510> fit<00:17:15.895> or<00:17:16.794> aren't<00:17:17.115> necessarily<00:17:17.677> matched<00:17:17.982> to<00:17:18.094> the<00:17:18.174> moment<00:17:18.479> in<00:17:18.559> time.

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And<00:17:19.185> so<00:17:19.282> I<00:17:19.362> think<00:17:19.522> the<00:17:19.683> answer<00:17:19.924> is<00:17:20.004> sort<00:17:20.148> of<00:17:20.229> like,<00:17:20.341> it<00:17:20.469> depends.

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And<00:17:21.047> I<00:17:21.192> expect<00:17:21.529> 2025<00:17:22.732> to<00:17:22.828> be<00:17:22.908> similar,<00:17:23.774> a<00:17:23.790> similar<00:17:24.190> story<00:17:24.719> of<00:17:24.911> it<00:17:24.991> depends.

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I<00:17:25.536> don't<00:17:25.696> think<00:17:25.857> it's<00:17:25.953> going<00:17:26.081> to<00:17:26.113> be<00:17:26.337> everything's<00:17:26.722> booming<00:17:27.058> or<00:17:27.138> everything's<00:17:27.459> busting.

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Yeah,<00:17:29.141> by<00:17:29.238> the<00:17:29.366> way,<00:17:29.558> Oura<00:17:29.862> Ring,<00:17:30.407> uh,<00:17:30.968> we're—<00:17:31.689> oh<00:17:31.785> yes,<00:17:32.490> yes.

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So,<00:17:33.163> so<00:17:33.388> I'm<00:17:33.692> on<00:17:33.788> board<00:17:34.029> with<00:17:34.189> you<00:17:34.269> there.

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Um,<00:17:36.336> as<00:17:36.512> CEO,<00:17:37.153> how<00:17:37.249> much<00:17:37.474> time<00:17:37.618> are<00:17:37.650> you<00:17:37.858> thinking<00:17:38.179> about<00:17:39.236> product<00:17:39.541> development,<00:17:40.598> launching<00:17:40.999> new<00:17:41.159> features,<00:17:42.024> digging<00:17:42.345> in<00:17:42.425> on<00:17:42.521> that,<00:17:43.482> versus<00:17:44.284> customers,<00:17:45.181> interacting<00:17:45.726> with<00:17:45.886> customers,<00:17:46.447> getting<00:17:46.687> their<00:17:46.912> feedback?

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I<00:17:47.424> mean,<00:17:47.568> there's<00:17:47.729> this<00:17:47.889> interesting<00:17:48.370> balance<00:17:48.754> that<00:17:48.850> you<00:17:48.914> have<00:17:49.091> to<00:17:49.171> do<00:17:49.331> between<00:17:49.892> as<00:17:49.988> a<00:17:50.052> CEO?

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How<00:17:50.693> do<00:17:50.853> you<00:17:51.238> approach<00:17:51.639> that?

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Yeah,<00:17:52.857> I<00:17:52.937> think<00:17:53.177> it<00:17:53.321> has<00:17:53.514> to<00:17:53.658> be<00:17:53.738> a<00:17:53.818> balance.

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Um,<00:17:55.020> you<00:17:55.100> know,<00:17:55.244> I<00:17:55.324> think<00:17:55.661> you—<00:17:56.446> I'm<00:17:56.542> a<00:17:56.702> big<00:17:56.943> believer<00:17:57.648> in<00:17:58.129> develop—<00:17:58.465> we're<00:17:58.545> developing<00:17:58.930> the<00:17:58.962> product<00:17:59.250> for<00:17:59.411> customers,<00:17:59.843> so<00:18:00.084> you<00:18:00.228> have<00:18:00.404> to<00:18:00.532> listen<00:18:00.789> to<00:18:00.885> what<00:18:01.029> they<00:18:01.125> say,<00:18:01.750> you<00:18:01.895> have<00:18:01.991> to<00:18:02.135> hear<00:18:02.311> their<00:18:02.471> concerns,<00:18:03.193> but<00:18:03.337> you<00:18:03.417> don't<00:18:03.561> necessarily<00:18:03.978> have<00:18:04.074> to<00:18:04.154> build<00:18:04.330> exactly<00:18:04.699> what<00:18:04.795> they<00:18:05.019> ask<00:18:05.196> for,<00:18:05.676> right?

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I<00:18:06.157> think<00:18:06.782> you<00:18:06.862> have<00:18:06.990> to<00:18:07.183> listen<00:18:07.680> really<00:18:08.000> carefully,<00:18:08.561> you<00:18:08.657> have<00:18:08.801> to<00:18:09.202> dog<00:18:09.506> food<00:18:09.827> all<00:18:09.923> the<00:18:10.067> data<00:18:10.564> and<00:18:10.660> see<00:18:10.884> what<00:18:11.029> people<00:18:11.269> are<00:18:11.365> saying<00:18:11.702> about<00:18:12.070> you<00:18:12.407> and<00:18:12.567> read<00:18:12.807> the<00:18:13.032> app<00:18:13.208> comments<00:18:13.849> and<00:18:13.913> the<00:18:14.073> Amazon<00:18:14.394> comments<00:18:14.730> and<00:18:14.875> all<00:18:14.955> of<00:18:14.987> that,<00:18:15.856> And<00:18:15.937> then<00:18:16.423> you<00:18:16.520> have<00:18:16.585> to<00:18:16.682> put<00:18:16.908> that<00:18:17.313> through<00:18:17.475> a<00:18:17.540> filter<00:18:17.944> of<00:18:18.057> like,<00:18:18.219> how<00:18:18.365> can<00:18:18.527> I<00:18:18.608> uniquely<00:18:18.948> solve<00:18:19.174> that<00:18:19.401> problem<00:18:20.048> based<00:18:20.291> on<00:18:20.339> the<00:18:20.388> capabilities<00:18:21.035> we<00:18:21.181> have<00:18:21.359> as<00:18:21.521> a<00:18:21.602> business?

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And<00:18:22.233> so<00:18:22.508> it's<00:18:23.123> not<00:18:23.301> just<00:18:23.786> building<00:18:24.029> what<00:18:24.175> they<00:18:24.240> say,<00:18:24.673> right?

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It's<00:18:25.300> often<00:18:25.798> hearing<00:18:26.184> the<00:18:26.216> problems<00:18:26.682> and<00:18:26.843> thinking<00:18:27.068> about<00:18:27.309> what<00:18:27.469> is<00:18:27.566> the<00:18:27.727> best,<00:18:29.719> you<00:18:29.816> know,<00:18:30.121> most<00:18:30.635> exciting<00:18:31.262> and<00:18:31.423> innovative<00:18:31.905> way<00:18:32.146> that<00:18:32.290> we<00:18:32.387> can<00:18:32.531> solve<00:18:32.789> that<00:18:32.949> challenge<00:18:33.415> for<00:18:33.480> consumers.

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And<00:18:34.251> so<00:18:34.379> I<00:18:34.476> think<00:18:34.636> we<00:18:34.781> do<00:18:34.877> that<00:18:35.038> pretty<00:18:35.263> well<00:18:35.504> here.

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We<00:18:36.548> have<00:18:36.660> a<00:18:36.789> really<00:18:37.046> good<00:18:37.287> rigor<00:18:37.608> around<00:18:39.215> tuning<00:18:39.616> in<00:18:39.761> and<00:18:39.857> listening<00:18:40.259> to<00:18:40.403> customers.

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We've<00:18:41.126> got<00:18:41.239> a<00:18:41.303> bunch<00:18:41.480> of<00:18:41.544> different<00:18:41.849> mechanisms<00:18:42.492> for<00:18:42.588> doing<00:18:42.829> that.

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So.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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That,<00:18:46.305> that<00:18:46.498> is<00:18:46.707> really<00:18:46.947> interesting.

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Like<00:18:47.911> the<00:18:48.087> balance<00:18:48.489> is<00:18:48.649> so<00:18:49.131> hard<00:18:49.548> to<00:18:49.677> strike<00:18:50.640> right<00:18:51.620> between,<00:18:52.647> uh,<00:18:53.129> you<00:18:53.209> know,<00:18:53.627> internal<00:18:54.429> and<00:18:54.574> external<00:18:55.393> and<00:18:56.035> everything<00:18:56.437> else<00:18:56.597> in<00:18:56.677> between.

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It's,<00:18:57.239> it's<00:18:57.384> really<00:18:57.576> fascinating.

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Like,<00:18:58.283> how<00:18:58.444> do<00:18:58.508> you,<00:18:59.327> how<00:18:59.423> do<00:18:59.487> you<00:18:59.728> keep<00:19:00.049> grounded?

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How<00:19:00.932> do<00:19:01.077> you,<00:19:01.719> uh,<00:19:01.960> like,<00:19:02.201> what<00:19:02.313> is<00:19:02.442> the,<00:19:02.859> you<00:19:02.955> know,<00:19:03.100> from,<00:19:03.341> from<00:19:03.565> that<00:19:03.742> perspective,<00:19:04.368> how<00:19:04.545> do<00:19:04.625> you,<00:19:05.091> uh,<00:19:05.267> kind<00:19:05.428> of<00:19:05.508> keep<00:19:05.749> sane?

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Yeah.

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I<00:19:07.820> love,<00:19:08.703> I<00:19:08.784> love<00:19:08.944> that<00:19:09.121> question<00:19:09.747> because<00:19:10.325> I<00:19:10.502> think<00:19:10.662> about<00:19:10.887> it<00:19:11.032> all<00:19:11.112> the<00:19:11.192> time.

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Um,<00:19:12.653> for<00:19:12.798> me,<00:19:12.974> and<00:19:13.135> I<00:19:13.215> think<00:19:13.376> it's<00:19:13.520> different<00:19:13.777> for<00:19:14.002> everyone,<00:19:14.580> but<00:19:15.142> For<00:19:15.286> me,<00:19:15.463> it's<00:19:16.603> sleep<00:19:17.374> and<00:19:17.471> movement.

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And<00:19:18.595> so<00:19:19.061> often<00:19:19.703> I<00:19:20.378> talk<00:19:20.683> to<00:19:20.779> people<00:19:21.100> that<00:19:21.309> have<00:19:21.486> a<00:19:21.566> different<00:19:21.968> sort<00:19:22.144> of<00:19:22.208> way<00:19:22.433> of<00:19:22.530> thinking<00:19:22.787> about<00:19:23.076> this.

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When<00:19:23.493> things<00:19:23.734> are<00:19:23.879> really<00:19:24.055> busy<00:19:24.361> at<00:19:24.441> work,<00:19:25.260> they<00:19:25.340> sleep<00:19:25.661> less<00:19:26.304> and<00:19:26.384> they<00:19:26.545> cut<00:19:26.770> out<00:19:26.930> exercise.

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And<00:19:27.669> for<00:19:27.813> me,<00:19:28.151> it's<00:19:28.311> the<00:19:28.536> opposite.

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It's<00:19:29.050> like<00:19:29.998> when<00:19:30.239> things<00:19:30.479> are<00:19:30.640> really<00:19:30.945> crazy<00:19:31.266> and<00:19:31.347> I'm<00:19:31.443> really<00:19:31.684> stressed,<00:19:32.150> I<00:19:32.230> make<00:19:32.407> sure<00:19:32.632> I'm<00:19:32.792> in<00:19:32.889> bed<00:19:33.129> by<00:19:33.515> like<00:19:33.756> 11:15<00:19:34.414> at<00:19:34.495> the<00:19:34.575> latest.

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And<00:19:36.020> I<00:19:36.101> have<00:19:36.422> to<00:19:36.518> find<00:19:36.807> a<00:19:36.823> way<00:19:37.048> to<00:19:37.209> do<00:19:37.305> movement<00:19:37.691> in<00:19:37.771> the<00:19:37.867> morning,<00:19:38.333> even<00:19:38.510> if<00:19:38.654> it<00:19:38.751> means<00:19:39.136> like<00:19:39.939> walk,<00:19:40.276> get<00:19:40.421> off<00:19:40.533> the<00:19:40.614> subway<00:19:40.999> 2<00:19:41.786> stops<00:19:42.139> early<00:19:42.509> and<00:19:42.750> walk<00:19:43.006> the<00:19:43.151> extra<00:19:43.408> 15<00:19:43.874> minutes.

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I<00:19:44.629> think<00:19:45.174> that's<00:19:45.480> kind<00:19:45.656> of<00:19:45.753> how—<00:19:46.347> that's<00:19:47.005> my<00:19:47.166> version<00:19:47.503> of<00:19:47.583> meditation.

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It's<00:19:48.209> like<00:19:48.370> moving<00:19:48.627> meditation<00:19:49.446> is<00:19:49.574> walking.

00:19:50.473 --> 00:19:52.994
For<00:19:50.553> some<00:19:50.730> people,<00:19:51.035> they<00:19:51.196> can<00:19:51.517> sit<00:19:51.742> there<00:19:51.999> for<00:19:52.095> 20<00:19:52.320> minutes<00:19:52.561> and<00:19:52.641> meditate.

00:19:53.042 --> 00:19:54.728
I<00:19:53.123> just<00:19:53.428> have<00:19:53.524> never<00:19:53.829> been<00:19:54.231> great<00:19:54.423> at<00:19:54.487> that.

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Yeah,<00:19:55.868> same,<00:19:56.880> same.

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What<00:19:58.405> role<00:19:58.726> do<00:19:58.807> you<00:19:58.967> think<00:19:59.304> empathy<00:19:59.706> plays<00:20:00.043> in<00:20:00.172> leadership?

00:20:00.653 --> 00:20:04.250
You've<00:20:00.990> kind<00:20:01.151> of<00:20:01.231> described<00:20:01.713> it<00:20:01.825> a<00:20:01.857> lot<00:20:01.970> in<00:20:02.034> a<00:20:02.098> lot<00:20:02.275> of<00:20:02.355> your<00:20:02.516> answers<00:20:02.917> here,<00:20:03.078> but<00:20:03.238> how<00:20:03.335> do<00:20:03.383> you<00:20:03.543> think<00:20:03.656> about<00:20:03.881> empathy?

00:20:05.486 --> 00:20:12.471
I<00:20:05.567> think<00:20:05.743> it's<00:20:06.064> important<00:20:07.237> and<00:20:07.397> needs<00:20:07.734> to<00:20:07.895> be<00:20:09.324> present<00:20:09.902> in<00:20:09.998> everything<00:20:10.368> that<00:20:10.480> you<00:20:10.608> do,<00:20:10.769> but<00:20:10.930> also<00:20:11.042> needs<00:20:11.267> to<00:20:11.347> be<00:20:11.492> checked,<00:20:12.134> right?

00:20:12.793 --> 00:20:22.808
I<00:20:12.874> think,<00:20:15.456> too<00:20:15.698> much,<00:20:16.811> and<00:20:16.972> it<00:20:17.005> can<00:20:17.231> paralyze<00:20:17.795> you<00:20:17.957> from<00:20:18.199> making<00:20:18.522> decisions<00:20:19.006> that<00:20:19.151> are<00:20:20.030> ultimately<00:20:20.950> good<00:20:21.095> for<00:20:21.192> the<00:20:21.273> business<00:20:21.596> and<00:20:21.677> good<00:20:21.822> for<00:20:21.903> the<00:20:22.000> people,<00:20:22.484> right?

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An<00:20:23.696> example<00:20:24.035> of<00:20:24.116> that<00:20:24.423> is<00:20:24.681> if<00:20:24.762> someone's<00:20:25.133> really<00:20:25.311> not<00:20:25.618> right<00:20:25.796> for<00:20:25.941> the<00:20:26.038> team<00:20:26.458> and,<00:20:27.314> you<00:20:27.346> know,<00:20:27.653> too<00:20:27.814> much<00:20:27.976> empathy<00:20:28.299> might<00:20:28.460> be<00:20:28.541> like,<00:20:28.767> okay,<00:20:28.929> I'm<00:20:29.026> not<00:20:29.171> going<00:20:29.236> to<00:20:29.268> let<00:20:29.413> them<00:20:29.510> go<00:20:29.640> because<00:20:29.769> it's<00:20:29.914> going<00:20:30.011> to<00:20:30.076> be<00:20:30.302> hard<00:20:30.464> for<00:20:30.561> them<00:20:30.641> to<00:20:30.787> find<00:20:30.981> another<00:20:31.272> job,<00:20:32.015> when<00:20:32.193> in<00:20:32.403> reality<00:20:32.920> that's<00:20:33.146> not<00:20:33.372> right<00:20:33.614> for<00:20:33.873> the<00:20:34.051> teammates,<00:20:34.681> it's<00:20:34.826> not<00:20:35.004> right<00:20:35.166> for<00:20:35.311> the<00:20:35.392> person,<00:20:35.893> it's<00:20:36.038> not<00:20:36.200> right<00:20:36.313> for<00:20:36.539> the<00:20:36.620> business.

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So,<00:20:37.492> I<00:20:37.670> think<00:20:38.162> Like<00:20:38.787> empathy<00:20:39.349> has<00:20:40.729> a<00:20:40.793> place<00:20:41.435> in<00:20:41.611> business<00:20:42.718> and<00:20:42.878> in<00:20:42.975> management,<00:20:43.600> but<00:20:43.697> it<00:20:43.841> needs<00:20:44.178> to<00:20:44.274> be<00:20:44.419> sort<00:20:44.643> of<00:20:45.285> modulated<00:20:45.943> against<00:20:47.050> business<00:20:47.387> needs<00:20:47.868> and<00:20:48.093> ultimately<00:20:48.590> thinking<00:20:48.911> about<00:20:49.296> what's<00:20:49.473> going<00:20:49.585> to<00:20:49.633> be<00:20:50.018> right<00:20:50.259> for<00:20:50.419> the<00:20:50.515> team.

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I<00:20:52.040> think<00:20:52.360> customer<00:20:52.922> empathy<00:20:53.869> always<00:20:54.286> has<00:20:54.526> to<00:20:54.687> be<00:20:54.783> there,<00:20:55.248> right?

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It<00:20:55.874> has<00:20:56.195> to<00:20:56.291> be<00:20:56.387> at<00:20:56.452> the<00:20:56.596> core<00:20:56.933> of<00:20:57.093> every<00:20:57.270> single<00:20:57.575> thing<00:20:57.799> that<00:20:57.960> you<00:20:58.056> do,<00:20:58.377> and<00:20:58.457> you<00:20:58.537> have<00:20:58.762> to<00:20:58.858> be<00:20:58.938> thinking<00:20:59.275> about<00:21:00.447> how<00:21:00.623> do<00:21:00.767> I<00:21:00.800> make<00:21:01.104> things<00:21:01.345> better<00:21:01.586> for<00:21:01.698> the<00:21:01.810> customer<00:21:02.227> every<00:21:02.404> single<00:21:02.709> day?

00:21:03.110 --> 00:21:06.412
And<00:21:03.190> that's<00:21:03.896> a<00:21:04.232> big<00:21:04.393> piece<00:21:04.633> of<00:21:04.729> the<00:21:04.809> way<00:21:05.018> we<00:21:05.178> think<00:21:05.354> here<00:21:05.915> at<00:21:06.059> Nanit.

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It's<00:21:06.636> like,<00:21:07.342> you<00:21:07.374> know,<00:21:07.758> if—<00:21:07.919> like,<00:21:08.223> what<00:21:08.319> can<00:21:08.463> we<00:21:08.560> do<00:21:08.704> to<00:21:08.784> make<00:21:09.024> the<00:21:09.185> app<00:21:09.281> just<00:21:09.585> like<00:21:09.842> even<00:21:10.403> 3<00:21:10.579> milliseconds<00:21:11.268> faster?

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Like,<00:21:12.150> what<00:21:12.326> can<00:21:12.486> we—<00:21:12.630> you<00:21:12.663> know,<00:21:13.191> what<00:21:13.304> are<00:21:13.384> those<00:21:13.608> biggest<00:21:13.993> pain<00:21:14.329> points<00:21:14.650> that<00:21:14.970> they<00:21:15.131> are<00:21:15.291> feeling<00:21:15.692> at<00:21:15.916> 3<00:21:16.172> a.m.<00:21:16.637> when<00:21:16.797> they're<00:21:17.038> up<00:21:17.134> with<00:21:17.358> their<00:21:17.535> baby?

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Like,<00:21:18.160> what<00:21:18.256> could<00:21:18.480> we<00:21:18.576> possibly<00:21:19.057> be<00:21:19.202> doing<00:21:20.003> to<00:21:20.083> make<00:21:20.179> this<00:21:20.355> experience<00:21:20.820> better?

00:21:21.157 --> 00:21:24.410
So<00:21:21.285> I<00:21:21.381> think<00:21:21.606> that<00:21:21.846> has<00:21:22.086> to<00:21:22.183> be<00:21:22.407> like<00:21:23.048> in<00:21:23.144> and<00:21:23.240> around<00:21:23.849> all<00:21:24.010> the<00:21:24.090> time.

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Finally,<00:21:26.189> we<00:21:26.414> end<00:21:26.654> every<00:21:26.911> interview<00:21:27.215> with<00:21:27.327> the<00:21:27.407> same<00:21:27.696> question,<00:21:28.353> and<00:21:28.433> that<00:21:28.657> is<00:21:28.770> at<00:21:28.850> CEO.com,<00:21:29.715> we<00:21:29.875> believe<00:21:30.116> the<00:21:30.260> chances<00:21:30.677> one<00:21:30.997> gives<00:21:31.542> is<00:21:31.622> just<00:21:31.767> as<00:21:31.879> important<00:21:32.183> as<00:21:32.264> the<00:21:32.360> chances<00:21:32.744> one<00:21:32.921> takes.

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When<00:21:33.867> you<00:21:34.044> hear<00:21:34.285> that,<00:21:34.509> who<00:21:34.670> gave<00:21:34.847> you<00:21:34.943> a<00:21:35.007> chance<00:21:35.329> to<00:21:35.473> get<00:21:35.634> you<00:21:35.714> to<00:21:35.794> where<00:21:35.955> you<00:21:36.132> are<00:21:36.212> today?

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Oh<00:21:37.593> my<00:21:37.722> God,<00:21:37.882> this<00:21:38.043> is<00:21:38.123> an<00:21:38.284> easy<00:21:38.525> one<00:21:38.765> for<00:21:38.878> me.

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The<00:21:40.291> founder,<00:21:41.030> co-founder<00:21:41.753> and<00:21:41.849> CEO<00:21:42.475> of<00:21:42.620> Rent<00:21:42.781> the<00:21:42.861> Runway,<00:21:43.278> who<00:21:43.423> I<00:21:43.503> worked<00:21:43.744> for<00:21:43.921> for<00:21:44.081> 11<00:21:44.403> years,<00:21:45.768> hands<00:21:46.105> down,<00:21:46.715> probably<00:21:47.695> one<00:21:47.920> of<00:21:48.081> the<00:21:48.659> people<00:21:48.916> that<00:21:49.060> I'm<00:21:49.381> most<00:21:49.638> appreciative<00:21:50.104> to<00:21:50.345> in<00:21:50.490> my<00:21:50.650> career<00:21:51.630> that<00:21:52.256> I<00:21:52.353> started<00:21:52.818> with<00:21:53.075> when<00:21:53.220> I<00:21:53.316> was<00:21:53.573> like,<00:21:53.959> you<00:21:54.039> know,<00:21:54.424> in<00:21:54.521> my<00:21:54.746> late<00:21:55.003> 20s.

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And<00:21:56.127> she<00:21:56.432> just<00:21:56.753> saw<00:21:56.930> something<00:21:57.235> in<00:21:57.331> me<00:21:57.492> that<00:21:57.636> honestly,<00:21:57.974> I<00:21:57.990> never<00:21:58.231> even<00:21:58.520> totally<00:21:58.793> saw<00:21:59.018> in<00:21:59.098> myself.

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And<00:22:00.222> continued<00:22:00.767> to<00:22:00.927> create<00:22:01.248> opportunities<00:22:02.130> for<00:22:02.226> me<00:22:02.547> that<00:22:03.830> I<00:22:03.974> wouldn't<00:22:04.199> have<00:22:04.327> even<00:22:04.856> raised<00:22:05.113> my<00:22:05.273> hand<00:22:05.498> for<00:22:05.610> necessarily<00:22:06.316> and<00:22:06.476> gone<00:22:06.732> for.

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And<00:22:07.358> so,<00:22:08.063> I've<00:22:08.625> said<00:22:08.801> this<00:22:08.945> publicly<00:22:09.266> before,<00:22:09.523> but<00:22:09.619> it's<00:22:09.747> like<00:22:09.843> she<00:22:10.004> pushed<00:22:10.308> me<00:22:10.405> up<00:22:10.565> the<00:22:10.645> ladder<00:22:11.046> instead<00:22:11.383> of<00:22:11.511> me<00:22:11.607> having<00:22:12.730> to<00:22:12.954> claw<00:22:13.227> my<00:22:13.435> way<00:22:13.692> to<00:22:13.852> the<00:22:13.932> top.

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And<00:22:15.055> so,<00:22:15.520> I'm<00:22:15.841> really<00:22:16.017> grateful,<00:22:16.418> and<00:22:16.498> I<00:22:16.578> think<00:22:16.739> it's<00:22:16.899> shaped<00:22:17.380> the<00:22:17.460> way<00:22:18.342> I<00:22:18.422> think<00:22:18.647> about<00:22:18.904> giving<00:22:19.144> people<00:22:19.529> opportunities<00:22:20.251> as<00:22:20.427> well.

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Sometimes,<00:22:23.650> maybe<00:22:23.955> earlier<00:22:24.276> in<00:22:24.340> my<00:22:24.500> career,<00:22:24.901> I<00:22:24.997> was<00:22:25.639> a<00:22:25.655> little<00:22:25.831> more<00:22:26.039> literal<00:22:26.521> about<00:22:27.965> what<00:22:28.527> experience<00:22:29.089> you<00:22:29.185> needed<00:22:29.554> for<00:22:29.651> this<00:22:29.731> specific<00:22:30.357> role.

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And<00:22:30.758> I<00:22:30.855> think<00:22:31.818> it's<00:22:31.962> shaped<00:22:32.444> me<00:22:32.685> to<00:22:32.862> be<00:22:33.343> a<00:22:33.407> bit<00:22:33.568> more,<00:22:35.270> to<00:22:35.366> give<00:22:35.511> people<00:22:36.056> opportunities<00:22:36.795> that<00:22:37.020> maybe<00:22:37.196> they're<00:22:37.293> not<00:22:37.437> 100%<00:22:37.919> ready<00:22:38.079> for<00:22:38.320> yet,<00:22:39.026> but<00:22:39.283> I<00:22:39.364> know<00:22:39.524> they're<00:22:39.685> going<00:22:39.781> to<00:22:39.845> get<00:22:40.086> there.

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Yeah,<00:22:41.451> that's<00:22:41.692> incredible.

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Thank<00:22:42.896> you<00:22:42.976> so<00:22:43.152> much<00:22:43.361> for<00:22:43.458> coming<00:22:43.682> on.

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Seriously,<00:22:44.180> Nana<00:22:44.886> is<00:22:44.983> just<00:22:45.111> an<00:22:45.288> incredible<00:22:45.850> company,<00:22:46.347> an<00:22:46.428> incredible<00:22:46.990> product.

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I<00:22:48.258> love<00:22:48.916> the<00:22:48.996> whole<00:22:49.157> mission<00:22:49.639> and<00:22:49.719> everything<00:22:50.104> you're<00:22:50.281> doing.

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It<00:22:50.762> really<00:22:51.083> is<00:22:51.308> wonderful.

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Thank<00:22:52.288> you<00:22:52.368> for<00:22:52.512> coming<00:22:52.689> on<00:22:52.785> and<00:22:52.865> talking<00:22:53.171> to<00:22:53.331> us.

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Thank<00:22:54.316> you.

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Thanks<00:22:54.652> for<00:22:54.720> having<00:22:54.988> me.