Jay Kulkarni doesn't think a machine can tell your story

Jay Kulkarni started Theorem in 2002 from a spare bedroom in New Jersey. Before that, he had exactly one job: five years at DoubleClick, where he ran product management for advertiser solutions and email platforms.

"I'm the first entrepreneur in my family," he said on the CEO.com Podcast. "I came to the U.S. as an immigrant."

He never raised institutional money. "I bootstrapped the company. We've managed through multiple recessions and continued growing." Theorem grew into a global company, with teams in India, Australia, and the Dominican Republic.

It is still headquartered in Chatham, New Jersey, where Kulkarni is in the office by 6:30 or 7:00 most mornings even though the company went hybrid after COVID. He leaves by mid-afternoon for the gym, and in the evenings he practices piano. He started three years ago. "It's one of the hardest things I've ever done."

Theorem serves two kinds of customers: content companies and commerce companies. The content side is streaming platforms, publishers, media businesses, anyone selling advertising, which, as Kulkarni notes, "has increasingly overtaken subscriptions as a revenue stream, especially in streaming."

When an ad deal closes, someone has to run it: insertion orders, creative deployment, audience targeting, campaign management, reporting, around the clock, in multiple languages. Theorem spent two decades doing that work by hand before deciding to automate itself.

The result is Upward, a media monetization platform the company tested internally for 12 to 18 months before showing a customer. One of the largest audio streaming brands has since moved its ad operations onto it, retiring the spreadsheets that used to carry its order-to-cash process.

Most of Upward was built by people who have spent their careers at Theorem. "We've had at least 17 employees stay with the company for more than 15 years, which I'm incredibly proud of," Kulkarni said. The company runs on a framework it calls Ways of Working: purpose, process, people. Training sessions, client reviews, and team events happen in person, no exceptions. Kulkarni told Pulse 2.0 the approach earned Theorem the No. 3 spot on 2024's Best Place to Work in America list.

The next 20 years, as he sees them, run through video commerce. Not TikTok, not Instagram. The brand's own website. "Brands care deeply about having a one-to-one relationship with consumers, but they also want to control that interaction," he said. "If everything happens on TikTok or Instagram, they lose ownership of the experience and the data."

He has the ground truth on his side: 95 percent of digital commerce still happens on ecommerce websites, which is why Theorem partnered with Firework, the AI video commerce platform, to build shoppable video directly into brand storefronts. In August, MarTech Breakthrough named Theorem its Overall Conversion Optimization Solution of the Year, a win Kulkarni credited to the video commerce pilot.

AI runs underneath all of it. Theorem trains models that let brands write their own content rules and enforce them automatically. Partial nudity is fine for an underwear brand and a problem almost everywhere else. But on whether AI will eventually make the videos itself, with no people involved, Kulkarni is a holdout.

"I actually have a contrarian view on that. Humans still crave authenticity and human connection. Storytelling is fundamentally human. Hearing someone tell you a story is different from hearing it from a machine."

Machines reduce friction, he said. They do not build trust. "If you look at great brands throughout history, the ones that survive wars, recessions, and economic upheaval are built on trust and ethos. I don't think machines replace that." He holds his own industry to the same rule: "Consumers should know when content was generated by AI."

Every CEO.com Podcast ends with the same question: who gave you a chance?

Kulkarni had been accepted to school in the United States, but his passport had expired, and without it he would miss his visa interview and lose the opportunity. His father was a school teacher. A retired colleague of his father's offered to help and came with them to the passport office, where the officer on duty turned out to be the man's former student. The passport was expedited. Kulkarni made it to America.

When he thanked the man, he got the rest of the story. Years earlier, the man's own son had wanted to study in America, and a teacher's salary could not cover it. The son wrote letters asking for help. Princess Grace of Monaco paid for his education.

"He told me, 'Someone helped my son, so I helped you.' That's always stayed with me."

00:00:00 Introduction and Jay's Background
00:00:50 What is Theorem?
00:01:12 Theorem's Business Model
00:01:55 Upword: Theorem's Automation Solution
00:02:29 Video Commerce and Its Importance
00:03:24 Evolution and Future of Video Commerce
00:04:08 Benefits of On-Site Video Commerce
00:05:02 AI in Digital Marketing
00:06:08 AI and Brand Safety
00:07:03 AI in Advertising Processes
00:08:16 Human Touch vs. AI
00:09:38 Jay's Daily Routine
00:12:00 Hybrid Work Model
00:14:01 Building Company Culture
00:17:18 Internal Use of AI and Automation
00:19:38 Economic Environment and Future Outlook
00:20:58 The Importance of Giving Chances
00:21:13 Personal Story of Opportunity
00:22:56 Conclusion and Farewell

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of<00:04:00.200> friction<00:04:01.200> uh,<00:04:01.560> in<00:04:01.800> ability<00:04:02.240> for<00:04:02.600> a<00:04:02.680> brand<00:04:03.120> to<00:04:03.880> uh,<00:04:04.080> stand<00:04:04.480> up<00:04:04.680> a<00:04:04.720> video<00:04:05.080> commerce.

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Not<00:04:05.920> all<00:04:06.080> of<00:04:06.200> it<00:04:06.360> needs<00:04:06.600> to<00:04:06.680> be<00:04:06.800> sales<00:04:07.200> related.

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Sometimes<00:04:08.560> a<00:04:08.640> brand<00:04:09.520> typically<00:04:09.880> would<00:04:10.000> like<00:04:10.240> to<00:04:10.360> say,<00:04:10.840> "I<00:04:10.920> have<00:04:11.080> a<00:04:11.160> new<00:04:11.400> product<00:04:11.800> coming<00:04:12.080> out<00:04:12.320> Thanksgiving."

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This<00:04:13.640> is<00:04:13.760> how<00:04:13.959> we<00:04:14.840> incubated<00:04:15.600> it.

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This<00:04:15.920> is<00:04:16.040> the<00:04:16.160> thought<00:04:16.480> that<00:04:16.680> went<00:04:16.920> into<00:04:17.160> it.<00:04:17.320> So,<00:04:17.440> it's<00:04:17.560> just<00:04:17.760> not<00:04:18.079> selling<00:04:18.720> and<00:04:18.920> shopping.

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It's<00:04:20.040> also<00:04:20.359> education<00:04:21.120> and<00:04:21.239> experience.<00:04:23.000> Brands<00:04:23.640> and<00:04:23.760> D2<00:04:24.560> are<00:04:25.600> passionate<00:04:26.080> about<00:04:26.240> having<00:04:26.520> that<00:04:26.680> one-to-one<00:04:27.080> connection<00:04:27.560> with<00:04:27.680> their<00:04:27.840> end

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consumer,<00:04:28.880> but<00:04:29.040> to<00:04:29.160> have<00:04:29.440> it<00:04:29.960> on<00:04:30.280> their<00:04:30.919> site,<00:04:31.400> on<00:04:31.520> their<00:04:31.840> property<00:04:32.800> where<00:04:32.960> they<00:04:33.120> can<00:04:33.320> manage<00:04:33.800> that<00:04:34.120> interaction<00:04:34.880> and<00:04:35.000> that<00:04:35.120> experience<00:04:36.120> as

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opposed<00:04:36.680> to<00:04:37.360> having<00:04:37.760> it<00:04:38.120> happen<00:04:38.840> in<00:04:39.040> TikTok<00:04:40.000> or<00:04:40.240> Insta<00:04:41.240> where<00:04:41.360> they<00:04:41.480> don't<00:04:42.080> control<00:04:42.480> the<00:04:42.560> experience,<00:04:43.200> they<00:04:43.320> don't<00:04:43.600> control<00:04:44.040> the<00:04:44.160> data.

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So,<00:04:45.320> there's<00:04:45.640> a<00:04:45.680> loss<00:04:46.040> that<00:04:46.200> there's<00:04:46.360> a<00:04:46.400> loss<00:04:46.720> of<00:04:46.840> that<00:04:47.440> consumer<00:04:47.960> connection.

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So,<00:04:49.280> we<00:04:49.440> are<00:04:49.560> betting<00:04:50.160> that<00:04:50.840> Yes,<00:04:51.360> so<00:04:51.680> we<00:04:51.840> did<00:04:52.080> take<00:04:52.360> our<00:04:53.560> two<00:04:54.560> us<00:04:54.880> institutional<00:04:55.600> knowledge<00:04:56.040> of<00:04:56.160> marketing<00:04:56.600> cloud<00:04:57.080> digital

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marketing<00:04:57.800> technologies<00:04:58.960> and<00:04:59.160> said<00:05:00.200> what<00:05:00.480> is<00:05:01.560> need?

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Where<00:05:02.160> is<00:05:02.320> the<00:05:02.400> puck<00:05:02.680> headed?<00:05:03.000> The<00:05:03.080> puck<00:05:03.320> is<00:05:03.440> headed<00:05:03.720> because<00:05:04.160> the<00:05:04.280> D2C<00:05:04.720> brands<00:05:05.600> want<00:05:05.800> to<00:05:05.880> have<00:05:06.040> a<00:05:06.120> one-to-one<00:05:06.560> engagement<00:05:07.200> with<00:05:07.320> their<00:05:07.480> end<00:05:07.640> consumers.

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More<00:05:08.919> importantly,<00:05:10.080> they<00:05:10.240> want<00:05:10.440> to<00:05:10.480> have<00:05:10.680> it<00:05:10.880> on<00:05:11.040> their<00:05:11.640> properties,<00:05:12.560> on<00:05:12.720> their<00:05:12.960> websites<00:05:13.680> so<00:05:13.800> they<00:05:13.919> can<00:05:14.080> have<00:05:14.280> that<00:05:14.480> connection<00:05:15.640> and<00:05:15.800> the<00:05:15.880> data<00:05:16.240> as<00:05:16.400> well.

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First-party<00:05:18.000> data<00:05:18.240> is<00:05:18.360> becoming<00:05:18.760> a<00:05:18.800> big<00:05:19.040> deal.

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They<00:05:19.800> want<00:05:19.919> to<00:05:20.000> control<00:05:20.480> that<00:05:21.000> experience<00:05:21.680> and<00:05:21.800> that<00:05:21.960> engagement.

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So,<00:05:23.160> we<00:05:23.320> are<00:05:23.400> making<00:05:23.680> a<00:05:23.720> bet<00:05:23.960> on<00:05:24.080> that<00:05:24.480> and<00:05:24.640> leveraging<00:05:25.600> our<00:05:25.680> experience<00:05:26.280> to<00:05:27.000> stand<00:05:27.320> that<00:05:27.520> up<00:05:27.720> for<00:05:28.200> a<00:05:28.360> brand.

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How<00:05:29.000> is<00:05:29.200> AI<00:05:29.520> changing<00:05:30.000> all<00:05:30.160> of<00:05:30.240> this?<00:05:30.640> So,<00:05:30.800> the<00:05:31.040> underpinning<00:05:31.560> of<00:05:31.680> both<00:05:32.000> upward<00:05:32.600> and<00:05:32.880> video<00:05:33.200> commerce<00:05:35.040> I'll<00:05:35.240> assume<00:05:35.560> that<00:05:35.720> you're<00:05:35.800> using<00:05:36.200> AI<00:05:36.480> as<00:05:36.600> an<00:05:36.800> all-encompassing

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term<00:05:38.320> because<00:05:38.640> under<00:05:38.840> that<00:05:39.240> you<00:05:39.360> have<00:05:40.280> So,<00:05:40.800> I'll<00:05:41.000> give<00:05:41.160> you<00:05:41.240> a<00:05:41.320> couple<00:05:41.600> of<00:05:41.680> examples<00:05:42.280> of<00:05:42.440> how<00:05:42.600> we're<00:05:42.800> leveraging<00:05:43.560> technology<00:05:44.360> with<00:05:44.520> an<00:05:44.720> AI<00:05:45.160> toolkit.

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So,<00:05:46.760> when<00:05:48.080> content<00:05:48.600> runs<00:05:49.000> on<00:05:49.160> websites,<00:05:50.040> there's<00:05:50.240> a<00:05:50.320> brand<00:05:50.720> trust<00:05:51.240> they<00:05:51.400> want<00:05:52.200> the<00:05:52.680> content<00:05:53.280> is<00:05:54.320> okay.

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Um<00:05:55.400> and<00:05:55.520> that<00:05:55.720> okay<00:05:56.080> to<00:05:56.880> have<00:05:56.920> to<00:05:57.040> run.

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What<00:05:57.560> do<00:05:57.640> I<00:05:57.720> mean<00:05:57.960> by<00:05:58.080> that?<00:05:59.120> If<00:05:59.320> I'm<00:05:59.680> Jockey<00:06:00.160> or<00:06:00.320> Hanes,<00:06:01.400> partial<00:06:01.840> nudity<00:06:02.440> is<00:06:02.680> okay<00:06:03.240> because<00:06:03.720> I'm<00:06:03.880> showing<00:06:04.240> under<00:06:05.520> That's

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perfectly<00:06:06.240> okay.<00:06:07.040> But<00:06:07.160> partial<00:06:07.640> nudity<00:06:08.360> in<00:06:08.440> a<00:06:08.520> political<00:06:09.120> ad<00:06:10.080> context<00:06:10.600> is<00:06:10.720> not<00:06:11.040> okay.

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So,<00:06:12.160> we're<00:06:12.320> training<00:06:12.640> machine<00:06:13.000> language<00:06:13.400> models<00:06:14.880> where<00:06:15.000> a<00:06:15.040> brand<00:06:15.440> can<00:06:16.200> put<00:06:16.440> up<00:06:16.560> their<00:06:16.720> own<00:06:16.880> policies<00:06:17.480> to<00:06:17.640> say<00:06:17.880> what<00:06:18.080> is<00:06:18.200> acceptable,<00:06:19.360> what<00:06:19.520> is<00:06:19.640> not<00:06:19.840> acceptable,<00:06:20.880> and

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using<00:06:21.480> machine<00:06:21.840> language<00:06:22.240> models<00:06:22.680> to<00:06:23.160> run.

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The<00:06:24.080> reason<00:06:24.360> it's<00:06:24.480> a<00:06:24.560> big<00:06:24.760> deal<00:06:25.080> is<00:06:25.600> to<00:06:25.760> the<00:06:25.880> brand<00:06:26.960> an<00:06:27.040> appropriate<00:06:27.800> for<00:06:28.640> level<00:06:29.160> of<00:06:30.400> content<00:06:30.919> is<00:06:31.080> acceptable<00:06:31.720> for<00:06:31.880> them.

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You<00:06:32.760> want<00:06:32.919> example?<00:06:33.919> Same<00:06:34.120> thing<00:06:34.400> with<00:06:35.560> Let's<00:06:36.760> Right.

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There's<00:06:37.160> some<00:06:37.360> language<00:06:38.080> in<00:06:38.240> some<00:06:38.480> setting<00:06:39.040> that<00:06:39.240> may<00:06:39.360> be<00:06:39.520> acceptable.

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In<00:06:40.760> some<00:06:41.000> it's<00:06:41.200> not.<00:06:41.640> And<00:06:41.800> in<00:06:41.919> some<00:06:42.120> cases<00:06:42.480> it's<00:06:42.640> subjective.

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So,<00:06:44.600> [mhm].<00:06:45.320> the<00:06:45.480> act<00:06:45.840> of<00:06:46.000> taking<00:06:46.640> what<00:06:46.840> is<00:06:46.960> acceptable<00:06:47.640> to<00:06:47.760> a<00:06:47.800> brand<00:06:49.080> and<00:06:49.240> crafting<00:06:49.800> a<00:06:49.840> policy<00:06:50.360> or<00:06:50.520> an<00:06:50.640> initiative,<00:06:51.640> applying<00:06:52.080> it

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to<00:06:52.320> their<00:06:52.480> content,<00:06:53.160> and<00:06:53.280> building<00:06:53.640> large<00:06:53.919> language<00:06:54.360> models<00:06:55.440> is<00:06:55.680> one<00:06:55.840> way<00:06:56.000> we<00:06:56.280> using<00:06:57.000> large<00:06:57.240> language

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Most<00:07:00.919> of<00:07:01.040> the<00:07:01.320> advertising<00:07:02.800> process<00:07:03.760> is<00:07:04.200> unstructured.

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And<00:07:06.080> if<00:07:06.240> there's<00:07:06.400> a<00:07:06.440> lot<00:07:06.600> of<00:07:06.720> platforms<00:07:07.240> involved,<00:07:08.400> um<00:07:09.240> it's<00:07:09.320> unstructured.

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So,<00:07:10.680> we<00:07:10.840> use<00:07:11.160> robotic<00:07:11.640> process<00:07:12.120> auto<00:07:13.000> in<00:07:13.080> case<00:07:13.520> some<00:07:13.880> APIs<00:07:14.440> don't<00:07:14.720> work<00:07:15.680> to<00:07:15.840> help<00:07:16.080> facilitate<00:07:16.960> and<00:07:17.120> train<00:07:17.440> the<00:07:17.560> robot<00:07:18.040> to<00:07:18.480> do<00:07:18.600> the

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job.<00:07:19.760> So,<00:07:20.160> there<00:07:20.400> are<00:07:20.520> a<00:07:20.560> few<00:07:20.800> others<00:07:21.240> that<00:07:21.400> we<00:07:21.520> can<00:07:21.800> get<00:07:22.000> into,<00:07:22.240> but<00:07:22.440> those<00:07:22.600> would<00:07:22.760> be<00:07:23.760> two<00:07:25.040> very<00:07:25.320> bespoke<00:07:26.040> points<00:07:26.600> technologies<00:07:27.440> that

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we<00:07:27.720> are<00:07:27.800> tapping<00:07:28.240> into<00:07:28.760> that<00:07:28.919> underpins<00:07:30.080> a<00:07:30.200> core<00:07:30.600> and<00:07:30.760> elements<00:07:31.160> of<00:07:31.280> video<00:07:31.560> commerce.

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And<00:07:33.200> obviously,<00:07:34.000> content<00:07:34.400> generation.<00:07:35.960> I<00:07:36.200> give<00:07:36.360> an<00:07:36.440> example<00:07:36.880> of<00:07:37.000> how<00:07:37.120> we<00:07:37.280> using<00:07:38.240> how<00:07:38.360> we<00:07:38.480> train<00:07:39.440> to<00:07:40.200> validate<00:07:41.000> and<00:07:41.200> monitor

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But<00:07:43.160> obviously,<00:07:44.240> we<00:07:44.400> can<00:07:44.720> use<00:07:45.320> AI<00:07:45.680> to<00:07:45.800> generate,<00:07:46.640> but<00:07:46.760> the<00:07:46.840> challenge<00:07:47.280> is<00:07:48.400> that<00:07:48.760> could<00:07:49.440> to<00:07:49.640> be<00:07:49.800> told<00:07:50.600> how<00:07:50.840> that<00:07:51.080> content

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was<00:07:52.760> produced.<00:07:54.000> Uh<00:07:54.440> and<00:07:54.680> as<00:07:54.840> pure<00:07:55.080> play<00:07:55.480> AI,<00:07:55.760> I<00:07:55.880> think<00:07:56.760> very<00:07:57.320> responsible<00:07:57.960> brands<00:07:59.000> want<00:07:59.360> to<00:07:59.480> be<00:07:59.720> able

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to<00:08:00.120> tell<00:08:01.080> their<00:08:01.320> end<00:08:01.480> consumer,<00:08:02.000> this<00:08:02.200> is<00:08:02.360> how<00:08:02.600> we<00:08:02.800> produced<00:08:03.440> the<00:08:03.560> content.

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And<00:08:04.680> if<00:08:04.760> it<00:08:04.880> is<00:08:05.000> done<00:08:05.240> by<00:08:05.800> a<00:08:05.840> machine<00:08:06.360> or<00:08:06.520> an<00:08:06.680> AI,<00:08:07.480> let<00:08:07.760> us<00:08:07.880> know.

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Don't<00:08:08.520> fake<00:08:09.400> because<00:08:09.880> that<00:08:10.000> is<00:08:10.080> the<00:08:10.160> brand<00:08:10.600> trust.

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At<00:08:11.560> what<00:08:11.720> point<00:08:11.920> do<00:08:12.000> you<00:08:12.080> think<00:08:12.360> AI<00:08:12.640> just<00:08:12.880> makes<00:08:13.160> all<00:08:13.560> of<00:08:13.760> the<00:08:14.200> videos?

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Like<00:08:15.080> there's<00:08:15.240> not<00:08:15.440> even<00:08:15.680> a<00:08:15.800> real<00:08:16.040> person<00:08:16.400> in<00:08:16.520> there.

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Look,<00:08:17.120> I<00:08:17.200> think<00:08:17.560> humans<00:08:18.840> like<00:08:19.360> human<00:08:19.680> connectivity.

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They<00:08:20.880> like<00:08:21.440> authenticity.<00:08:22.840> They<00:08:23.000> like<00:08:23.440> curiosity.

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So<00:08:25.040> I<00:08:25.080> think<00:08:25.320> we're<00:08:25.440> in<00:08:25.560> a<00:08:25.600> very<00:08:25.880> early<00:08:26.200> stage<00:08:26.560> of<00:08:26.640> the<00:08:26.760> hype<00:08:27.160> where<00:08:27.520> we<00:08:27.680> think<00:08:28.640> the<00:08:28.880> human<00:08:29.200> touch<00:08:29.640> is<00:08:30.560> not<00:08:31.880> going<00:08:32.159> to<00:08:32.280> be<00:08:32.360> needed.

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I<00:08:32.880> have<00:08:33.000> a<00:08:33.039> contrarian<00:08:33.599> point<00:08:33.919> of<00:08:34.000> view.<00:08:35.400> I<00:08:35.479> think<00:08:35.960> with<00:08:36.080> a<00:08:36.159> human<00:08:37.360> is<00:08:37.599> more<00:08:37.880> powerful.

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E<00:08:40.960> you<00:08:41.320> an<00:08:41.479> audio<00:08:41.840> book.

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Oh,<00:08:43.520> like<00:08:44.240> I'm<00:08:44.480> telling<00:08:44.800> you<00:08:44.920> a<00:08:45.000> story<00:08:45.480> as<00:08:45.640> a<00:08:45.680> child<00:08:46.600> for<00:08:46.760> a<00:08:46.800> very<00:08:47.000> long<00:08:47.240> time.

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So<00:08:48.160> the<00:08:48.320> act<00:08:48.680> of<00:08:49.240> leveraging<00:08:50.760> AI<00:08:51.280> and<00:08:51.520> tech<00:08:52.440> for<00:08:52.680> those<00:08:53.160> marketing<00:08:53.640> activities<00:08:54.960> that<00:08:55.200> are<00:08:55.880> friction<00:08:56.480> prone,

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that<00:08:57.800> are<00:08:57.880> cost<00:08:58.240> centers,<00:08:59.680> that<00:09:00.400> don't<00:09:00.800> need<00:09:01.080> the<00:09:01.160> human<00:09:01.520> touch<00:09:01.800> is<00:09:01.960> okay.

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I<00:09:02.960> give<00:09:03.120> you<00:09:03.280> two<00:09:03.440> or<00:09:03.520> three<00:09:03.720> examples.<00:09:04.560> But<00:09:04.839> the<00:09:05.680> But<00:09:05.839> if<00:09:05.960> you're<00:09:06.080> a<00:09:06.160> brand<00:09:06.800> and<00:09:06.920> you<00:09:07.000> want<00:09:07.120> to<00:09:07.200> engage<00:09:08.280> in<00:09:08.400> an<00:09:08.520> authentic<00:09:09.040> way,<00:09:09.920> in<00:09:10.120> a<00:09:10.160> transparent<00:09:10.839> way,

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then<00:09:12.320> I<00:09:12.440> believe<00:09:12.839> the<00:09:12.920> human<00:09:13.280> touch<00:09:13.760> matters.

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And<00:09:14.839> look<00:09:15.080> at<00:09:15.160> the<00:09:15.200> history<00:09:15.560> of<00:09:15.880> great<00:09:16.160> brands<00:09:16.480> that<00:09:16.600> have<00:09:17.720> for<00:09:17.880> a<00:09:17.920> very,<00:09:18.160> very<00:09:18.400> long<00:09:18.600> period<00:09:18.839> of<00:09:18.960> time,<00:09:19.839> they've<00:09:20.000> navigated<00:09:20.600> world<00:09:20.839> wars,<00:09:21.160> they've<00:09:21.280> been<00:09:21.400> like<00:09:22.040> active,

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navigated<00:09:23.720> depression,<00:09:24.680> recession.

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It<00:09:25.320> is<00:09:25.560> the<00:09:26.520> e-<00:09:26.920> ethos<00:09:27.440> and<00:09:27.600> that<00:09:27.800> anchor<00:09:28.320> that<00:09:28.560> I<00:09:29.160> my<00:09:30.160> word<00:09:30.480> and<00:09:30.560> that<00:09:30.800> I<00:09:30.880> don't<00:09:31.080> think<00:09:31.280> will<00:09:31.400> come<00:09:31.640> from<00:09:32.800> uh<00:09:33.040> machines.

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Yeah.<00:09:35.360> Yeah,<00:09:35.720> I<00:09:35.800> think<00:09:36.000> that's<00:09:36.240> right.

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What<00:09:36.960> does<00:09:37.040> a<00:09:37.120> typical<00:09:37.480> day<00:09:37.640> look<00:09:37.840> like<00:09:38.000> for<00:09:38.120> you?<00:09:38.440> Well,<00:09:39.320> I<00:09:40.640> I<00:09:41.040> I<00:09:41.080> think<00:09:41.400> I<00:09:41.440> mentioned<00:09:41.840> to<00:09:41.920> you<00:09:42.040> on<00:09:42.200> base<00:09:42.440> in<00:09:42.560> Chatham<00:09:42.920> Jersey,<00:09:43.320> so<00:09:43.480> I<00:09:44.120> tend<00:09:44.320> to<00:09:44.400> come<00:09:44.560> into<00:09:44.800> work

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every<00:09:45.280> day.<00:09:45.680> We<00:09:45.800> are<00:09:45.880> hybrid<00:09:46.840> uh<00:09:46.920> company,<00:09:47.480> but<00:09:47.680> we<00:09:47.760> do<00:09:47.920> have<00:09:48.360> teams<00:09:48.640> that<00:09:48.840> come<00:09:49.040> in.

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So,<00:09:51.560> I<00:09:51.600> like<00:09:51.800> to<00:09:51.920> come<00:09:52.080> in<00:09:52.200> because<00:09:52.720> I<00:09:52.760> like<00:09:52.960> structure<00:09:53.440> and<00:09:54.240> and<00:09:54.840> my<00:09:54.960> day<00:09:55.120> start<00:09:55.440> early.

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My<00:09:55.840> calls<00:09:56.200> start<00:09:56.480> at<00:09:56.600> like<00:09:56.920> 7:00<00:09:57.160> in<00:09:57.240> the<00:09:57.320> morning.

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So,<00:09:58.360> I'm<00:09:58.440> in<00:09:58.480> the<00:09:58.600> office<00:09:58.960> by<00:09:59.200> 6:37.

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Between<00:10:03.040> 7:00<00:10:03.280> and<00:10:03.440> noon,<00:10:04.480> we<00:10:04.600> do<00:10:04.760> a<00:10:04.800> variety<00:10:05.160> of<00:10:05.280> different<00:10:05.600> stand-ups.

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Uh<00:10:06.880> so,<00:10:07.600> day<00:10:07.840> structure,<00:10:09.280> the<00:10:09.360> week<00:10:09.640> is<00:10:09.760> structured.

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So,<00:10:11.240> the<00:10:11.360> week<00:10:11.720> is<00:10:12.000> pretty<00:10:12.200> much<00:10:12.880> uh<00:10:13.080> stand-ups<00:10:13.720> for<00:10:13.880> upward<00:10:14.280> design,<00:10:14.800> user<00:10:15.080> stories,<00:10:15.760> development,<00:10:16.600> migration<00:10:17.120> of<00:10:17.240> existing<00:10:17.760> clients.

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That<00:10:19.160> happens<00:10:20.360> 3<00:10:20.520> days<00:10:20.720> a<00:10:20.800> week.

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Uh<00:10:21.440> so,<00:10:21.880> as<00:10:21.960> an<00:10:23.720> as<00:10:23.840> we<00:10:23.960> meet,<00:10:24.920> keeping<00:10:25.200> a<00:10:25.280> pulse<00:10:25.640> on<00:10:25.760> the<00:10:25.840> development.

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Same<00:10:26.840> with<00:10:26.960> video.<00:10:27.920> We<00:10:28.480> meet<00:10:29.720> three<00:10:29.880> times<00:10:30.160> a<00:10:30.200> week.

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We<00:10:30.640> meet<00:10:31.080> 90-day<00:10:31.680> sprints<00:10:32.720> when<00:10:32.880> we<00:10:32.960> meet.

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So,<00:10:34.760> we<00:10:34.880> also<00:10:35.240> do<00:10:36.080> uh<00:10:36.640> Monday<00:10:36.960> stand-ups<00:10:37.480> for<00:10:37.600> client<00:10:37.880> management,<00:10:38.880> uh<00:10:39.120> my<00:10:39.560> executive<00:10:40.080> leadership<00:10:40.600> team.

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Uh<00:10:41.960> we<00:10:42.120> meet<00:10:42.400> every<00:10:43.120> Tuesday.<00:10:43.880> Uh<00:10:44.120> all<00:10:44.320> hands<00:10:44.560> on<00:10:44.720> deck.

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They're<00:10:45.400> very<00:10:46.080> robust<00:10:46.560> agenda.<00:10:47.040> Everybody<00:10:47.480> gets<00:10:47.760> a<00:10:48.560> say.

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Uh<00:10:49.440> no<00:10:49.600> surprises.<00:10:50.200> We<00:10:50.320> come<00:10:50.520> prepared<00:10:51.160> if<00:10:51.280> there's<00:10:51.480> any<00:10:51.640> reading<00:10:51.920> material.

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That's<00:10:53.680> very,<00:10:53.839> very<00:10:54.040> structured.<00:10:55.200> And<00:10:55.280> a<00:10:55.360> couple<00:10:55.640> of<00:10:55.760> other<00:10:56.280> sales,<00:10:56.640> marketing,<00:10:57.120> pipeline<00:10:57.600> calls<00:10:57.960> on<00:10:58.160> Thursday<00:10:58.600> and<00:10:58.720> a<00:10:58.760> Friday.

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So,<00:10:59.839> it's<00:11:00.480> Every<00:11:00.760> day<00:11:00.960> is<00:11:01.080> structured.<00:11:01.720> Every<00:11:01.920> team<00:11:02.200> needs<00:11:02.480> to<00:11:02.600> know<00:11:03.440> what<00:11:03.800> their<00:11:03.960> expectation<00:11:04.720> is.

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Come<00:11:05.880> prepared<00:11:06.320> for.<00:11:07.160> So,<00:11:08.040> balance<00:11:09.320> both<00:11:09.920> the<00:11:10.360> running<00:11:10.680> of<00:11:10.760> the<00:11:10.880> business<00:11:11.400> in<00:11:11.520> the<00:11:11.600> here<00:11:11.839> and<00:11:11.960> now,<00:11:12.640> taking<00:11:13.080> pulse,<00:11:13.680> doing<00:11:14.120> all

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the<00:11:14.400> stuff<00:11:14.800> that<00:11:15.040> you<00:11:15.120> need<00:11:15.320> to<00:11:16.280> do<00:11:16.440> to<00:11:16.560> make<00:11:16.720> sure<00:11:16.839> the<00:11:16.960> trains<00:11:17.280> are<00:11:17.440> on<00:11:17.640> time.

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But<00:11:18.720> also<00:11:19.000> inside<00:11:19.400> of<00:11:19.520> that<00:11:19.880> is<00:11:20.280> planning<00:11:20.680> for<00:11:20.800> the<00:11:20.920> future<00:11:22.040> of<00:11:22.280> the<00:11:22.920> uh<00:11:23.080> company<00:11:23.680> and<00:11:23.760> the<00:11:23.839> business<00:11:24.640> uh<00:11:24.720> as<00:11:24.880> well.

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My<00:11:27.600> I<00:11:27.720> tend<00:11:28.040> to<00:11:28.280> leave<00:11:28.520> the<00:11:28.680> office<00:11:29.000> by<00:11:29.160> 2:00,<00:11:29.360> 3:00<00:11:30.000> by<00:11:30.200> 7:00<00:11:30.600> to<00:11:30.760> 2:00<00:11:30.960> is<00:11:31.280> running<00:11:33.320> at<00:11:33.480> the<00:11:33.600> gym.

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Uh,<00:11:36.880> get<00:11:37.080> back<00:11:37.360> home,<00:11:38.200> eat<00:11:39.280> dinner.

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Uh,<00:11:40.920> 8<00:11:41.120> years<00:11:41.360> old,<00:11:42.080> but<00:11:42.320> I'm<00:11:42.440> learning<00:11:42.720> the<00:11:42.840> piano.

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One<00:11:44.000> of<00:11:44.040> the<00:11:44.120> hardest<00:11:44.400> things<00:11:44.640> I've<00:11:44.880> done<00:11:45.040> in<00:11:45.120> my<00:11:45.240> life.<00:11:45.800> I<00:11:45.880> try<00:11:46.080> to<00:11:46.200> practice.

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It's<00:11:46.960> awful.<00:11:47.880> Yeah,<00:11:48.440> yeah.

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And,<00:11:49.640> uh,<00:11:50.120> I<00:11:50.240> read<00:11:50.520> that<00:11:50.880> I<00:11:50.960> read<00:11:51.200> quite<00:11:51.400> a<00:11:51.440> bit,<00:11:51.760> so<00:11:51.880> try<00:11:52.120> and<00:11:52.280> sneak<00:11:52.560> in<00:11:52.680> some<00:11:53.120> reading<00:11:53.440> in<00:11:53.520> the<00:11:53.680> evenings,<00:11:54.360> catch<00:11:54.600> up<00:11:54.720> on<00:11:55.600> work-related<00:11:56.360> emails,<00:11:56.920> and

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then<00:11:57.160> hit<00:11:57.280> the<00:11:57.400> bed<00:11:57.760> by<00:11:58.240> 10:10<00:11:58.720> to<00:11:58.840> 10:20-ish.

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Uh,<00:12:00.080> well,<00:12:00.240> tell<00:12:00.400> me<00:12:00.520> about<00:12:00.960> You<00:12:01.080> said<00:12:01.240> you're<00:12:01.360> hybrid.

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What<00:12:02.200> went<00:12:02.360> into<00:12:02.560> that<00:12:02.720> decision<00:12:03.560> and<00:12:03.760> how<00:12:03.920> have<00:12:04.040> you<00:12:04.240> built<00:12:04.560> the<00:12:04.680> culture,<00:12:06.000> uh,<00:12:06.160> cuz<00:12:06.360> obviously,<00:12:06.880> you<00:12:07.000> know,<00:12:07.120> over<00:12:07.280> the<00:12:07.400> past<00:12:07.680> 5<00:12:07.920> years,<00:12:08.280> there's<00:12:08.480> been<00:12:08.640> a<00:12:08.680> lot<00:12:08.920> of,<00:12:09.040> like,

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"Hey,<00:12:09.440> we're<00:12:09.680> going<00:12:09.800> to<00:12:09.880> be<00:12:10.240> all<00:12:10.480> in<00:12:10.600> the<00:12:10.760> office,"<00:12:11.280> or<00:12:11.480> we're<00:12:11.600> going<00:12:11.720> to<00:12:11.760> be<00:12:11.920> hybrid,<00:12:12.440> or<00:12:12.600> we're<00:12:12.680> going<00:12:12.800> to<00:12:12.880> be<00:12:12.960> all<00:12:13.160> virtual.

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And<00:12:14.360> that<00:12:14.520> debate<00:12:14.920> seems<00:12:15.320> like<00:12:15.480> it's<00:12:15.600> still<00:12:15.840> kind<00:12:16.000> of<00:12:16.080> playing<00:12:16.400> out.

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It<00:12:16.680> does<00:12:16.880> seem<00:12:17.000> like<00:12:17.160> most<00:12:17.400> people<00:12:17.720> are<00:12:17.920> landing<00:12:18.280> on<00:12:18.400> hybrid,<00:12:18.840> though.

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So,<00:12:19.760> give<00:12:20.000> give<00:12:20.120> me<00:12:20.240> a<00:12:20.320> sense<00:12:20.640> for,<00:12:21.440> um,<00:12:21.600> how<00:12:21.800> you<00:12:21.960> landed<00:12:22.320> on<00:12:22.480> that<00:12:22.640> and<00:12:22.720> how<00:12:22.840> you<00:12:23.000> thought<00:12:23.160> about<00:12:23.360> the<00:12:23.440> culture.

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Right.<00:12:24.440> So,<00:12:25.400> obviously,<00:12:26.400> post-COVID,<00:12:27.120> we<00:12:27.200> had<00:12:27.320> a<00:12:27.360> decision:<00:12:28.600> come<00:12:28.800> in<00:12:28.880> every<00:12:29.120> day<00:12:29.560> or<00:12:29.680> do<00:12:29.800> hybrid.

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Given<00:12:31.040> the<00:12:31.160> nature<00:12:31.600> of<00:12:31.800> business<00:12:32.280> and<00:12:32.360> industry<00:12:32.840> we're<00:12:33.080> in,<00:12:33.960> and<00:12:34.120> the<00:12:34.160> countries<00:12:34.680> we<00:12:34.800> operate<00:12:35.240> in,<00:12:35.839> uh,<00:12:36.000> I'm<00:12:36.160> based<00:12:36.480> in<00:12:37.320> in<00:12:37.480> Jersey.

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We<00:12:38.000> have<00:12:38.200> offices<00:12:38.680> and<00:12:38.839> teams<00:12:39.240> in<00:12:40.520> A-<00:12:40.760> in<00:12:40.920> India,<00:12:41.400> in<00:12:41.520> Australia,<00:12:42.400> in<00:12:42.480> the<00:12:42.560> Dominican<00:12:43.040> Republic.

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So,<00:12:44.320> we<00:12:44.440> had<00:12:44.680> to<00:12:45.440> discuss<00:12:45.600> the<00:12:45.839> global<00:12:46.280> remit<00:12:46.880> of<00:12:47.200> how<00:12:47.320> this<00:12:47.520> thing<00:12:47.720> would<00:12:47.880> operate.

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And<00:12:49.200> also,<00:12:49.480> the<00:12:49.600> talent<00:12:50.320> in<00:12:50.480> our<00:12:50.640> industry<00:12:51.200> is<00:12:51.880> is<00:12:52.000> an<00:12:52.120> acute,<00:12:53.240> uh,<00:12:53.600> battle<00:12:54.000> for<00:12:54.160> talent.

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Uh,<00:12:54.960> good<00:12:55.160> talent<00:12:55.480> is<00:12:55.600> hard<00:12:55.839> to<00:12:55.920> find<00:12:56.280> and<00:12:56.400> keep.

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So,<00:12:57.839> all<00:12:58.040> in,<00:12:58.240> we<00:12:59.040> landed<00:12:59.400> on<00:12:59.520> hybrid.

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It's<00:13:00.120> working<00:13:00.480> well<00:13:00.680> for<00:13:00.839> us<00:13:01.040> because<00:13:01.480> we<00:13:01.600> can<00:13:01.920> access<00:13:02.400> talent<00:13:03.320> wherever<00:13:03.680> it<00:13:03.800> may<00:13:04.000> be.

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Um,<00:13:05.760> we<00:13:06.000> do<00:13:07.080> have<00:13:07.320> people<00:13:07.640> come<00:13:07.839> in<00:13:08.640> not<00:13:08.920> on<00:13:09.040> certain<00:13:09.440> days<00:13:09.760> of<00:13:09.839> the<00:13:09.960> week,<00:13:10.839> but<00:13:11.040> we<00:13:11.160> have<00:13:11.400> certain<00:13:11.720> activities<00:13:12.440> on<00:13:12.520> a<00:13:12.560> monthly<00:13:12.960> basis,<00:13:13.400> on

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a<00:13:13.560> weekly<00:13:13.920> basis,<00:13:14.280> so<00:13:14.360> they<00:13:14.520> come<00:13:14.720> in.<00:13:14.920> So,<00:13:15.680> like<00:13:16.520> Thanksgiving,<00:13:17.280> we<00:13:17.440> have<00:13:18.200> team-building<00:13:18.720> events.

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Have<00:13:19.800> certain<00:13:20.240> trainings,<00:13:20.880> so<00:13:21.080> they<00:13:21.280> have<00:13:21.440> to<00:13:21.520> come<00:13:21.720> in.

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It's<00:13:22.560> not<00:13:22.720> neg-<00:13:23.520> So,<00:13:23.640> when<00:13:23.839> we<00:13:23.920> expect<00:13:24.880> you<00:13:24.960> to<00:13:25.040> the<00:13:25.200> office,<00:13:26.200> uh,<00:13:26.400> we<00:13:26.520> make<00:13:26.720> it<00:13:26.880> clear<00:13:27.200> we're<00:13:27.320> not<00:13:27.760> debating<00:13:28.280> that.

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Conferences<00:13:29.695> and<00:13:30.191> the<00:13:30.686> networking<00:13:31.182> events<00:13:31.677> have<00:13:32.172> opened<00:13:32.668> up<00:13:33.163> our<00:13:33.658> fair<00:13:34.154> in<00:13:34.649> the<00:13:35.145> B2B<00:13:35.640> space.

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So,<00:13:36.320> the<00:13:36.520> act<00:13:36.840> of<00:13:37.600> going<00:13:37.960> to<00:13:38.080> a<00:13:38.200> client,<00:13:38.680> meeting<00:13:39.000> a<00:13:39.040> client,<00:13:39.520> doing<00:13:39.800> QBRs<00:13:41.200> in<00:13:41.320> person<00:13:41.680> is<00:13:41.840> very,<00:13:42.080> very<00:13:42.240> important.

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So,<00:13:43.040> we<00:13:43.200> absolutely,<00:13:44.040> you<00:13:44.080> know,<00:13:44.240> do<00:13:44.400> that.

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So,<00:13:45.680> anything<00:13:46.040> to<00:13:46.160> do<00:13:46.280> with<00:13:47.320> training<00:13:48.000> and<00:13:48.160> QBRs<00:13:49.640> is<00:13:50.280> is<00:13:50.440> in<00:13:50.560> person.

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That's<00:13:51.400> not<00:13:51.720> going<00:13:51.920> away.<00:13:53.080> Uh,<00:13:53.440> so,<00:13:53.640> and<00:13:53.760> that's<00:13:54.000> actually<00:13:54.400> working<00:13:55.280> well<00:13:55.560> for<00:13:55.760> us<00:13:55.960> because<00:13:57.640> talent<00:13:58.000> is<00:13:58.160> really<00:13:58.440> good,<00:13:58.720> but<00:13:58.840> they<00:13:58.960> want<00:13:59.120> the<00:13:59.200> flexibility

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of<00:14:00.280> working<00:14:00.600> from<00:14:01.040> home.<00:14:01.840> So,<00:14:01.960> my<00:14:02.160> limit<00:14:02.560> is,<00:14:03.400> look,<00:14:03.600> as<00:14:03.720> long<00:14:03.960> as<00:14:04.080> a<00:14:04.120> client<00:14:04.440> is<00:14:04.560> happy,<00:14:05.480> projects<00:14:05.840> are<00:14:05.960> on<00:14:06.120> track,<00:14:06.760> we<00:14:06.840> are<00:14:06.920> productive,<00:14:07.960> you're<00:14:08.120> okay.

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But<00:14:09.040> within<00:14:09.320> that,<00:14:10.200> the<00:14:10.360> act<00:14:10.680> of<00:14:10.800> coming<00:14:11.160> in<00:14:11.640> when<00:14:11.800> it's<00:14:12.000> needed,<00:14:12.960> uh,<00:14:13.120> that's<00:14:13.360> absolutely<00:14:13.840> non-negotiable.

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So,<00:14:15.960> you<00:14:16.080> asked<00:14:16.280> about<00:14:16.880> culture.<00:14:18.080> Uh,<00:14:18.480> we<00:14:18.600> have<00:14:18.720> a<00:14:18.760> more<00:14:19.160> holistic<00:14:19.680> way<00:14:19.840> of<00:14:19.960> how<00:14:20.120> we<00:14:20.240> run<00:14:20.440> the<00:14:20.520> business.

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We<00:14:21.320> call<00:14:21.520> it<00:14:21.680> our<00:14:21.880> ways<00:14:22.120> of<00:14:22.240> working,<00:14:22.640> or<00:14:22.760> WOW.

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Uh,<00:14:23.880> it's<00:14:24.080> underpinned<00:14:24.640> by<00:14:25.600> pur-<00:14:26.440> is<00:14:27.080> what's<00:14:27.320> the<00:14:28.040> mission<00:14:28.360> of<00:14:28.440> the<00:14:28.560> company,<00:14:28.920> what's<00:14:29.120> the<00:14:29.200> vision,<00:14:29.560> what's<00:14:29.720> the<00:14:29.800> North<00:14:30.040> Star.

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We<00:14:31.000> spend<00:14:31.240> a<00:14:31.280> lot<00:14:31.440> of<00:14:31.560> time<00:14:32.680> involving<00:14:33.200> the<00:14:33.360> teams<00:14:33.880> in<00:14:34.000> business<00:14:34.440> planning,<00:14:35.800> in<00:14:36.200> articulating<00:14:37.280> why<00:14:37.520> we're<00:14:37.720> doing<00:14:38.000> how<00:14:38.160> we<00:14:38.320> do.

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That's<00:14:39.040> the<00:14:40.240> of<00:14:41.400> purpose.

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Then,<00:14:43.120> we<00:14:43.240> also<00:14:43.560> have<00:14:45.160> pur-<00:14:45.560> uh<00:14:45.960> process.

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So,<00:14:46.839> it's<00:14:47.000> underpinned<00:14:47.520> by<00:14:47.839> we<00:14:48.000> run<00:14:48.360> our<00:14:48.480> business<00:14:48.920> with<00:14:49.160> MBOs<00:14:49.600> and<00:14:49.760> KPIs.

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So,<00:14:50.440> everybody,<00:14:51.560> uh,<00:14:51.640> three<00:14:51.880> levels<00:14:52.240> down<00:14:52.720> knows<00:14:53.839> what<00:14:54.040> their<00:14:54.200> role<00:14:54.520> is,<00:14:54.720> what<00:14:54.960> their<00:14:55.120> remit<00:14:55.520> is.

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And<00:14:56.320> as<00:14:56.400> some<00:14:56.600> companies<00:14:57.040> call<00:14:57.240> it<00:14:57.400> OKRs,<00:14:58.040> which<00:14:58.200> is<00:14:58.360> fine,<00:14:58.640> but<00:14:58.760> the<00:14:58.839> concept<00:14:59.320> is<00:14:59.400> the<00:14:59.480> same.

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How<00:15:00.720> is<00:15:00.960> my<00:15:01.480> day-to-day<00:15:01.880> activity,<00:15:02.520> how<00:15:02.640> is<00:15:02.800> my<00:15:03.600> work<00:15:04.120> tied<00:15:04.440> to<00:15:05.320> the<00:15:05.480> mission<00:15:06.080> and<00:15:06.280> the<00:15:06.480> purpose<00:15:06.839> of<00:15:06.960> the<00:15:07.080> company.

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So,<00:15:07.880> within<00:15:08.160> that,<00:15:08.960> we<00:15:09.040> run<00:15:09.200> the<00:15:09.280> business<00:15:09.720> with<00:15:10.000> MBOs,<00:15:10.800> with<00:15:10.960> KPIs.

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We<00:15:12.440> also<00:15:12.680> have<00:15:12.800> the<00:15:12.880> concept<00:15:13.440> of<00:15:13.960> optimize<00:15:14.560> today<00:15:14.760> and<00:15:14.920> build<00:15:15.120> tomorrow.

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Uh,<00:15:16.560> we've<00:15:16.720> been<00:15:16.839> in<00:15:16.920> business<00:15:17.280> 20<00:15:18.720> You<00:15:18.839> can't<00:15:19.160> change<00:15:19.480> on<00:15:19.560> a<00:15:19.640> dime.

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So,<00:15:20.960> we<00:15:21.160> have,<00:15:21.880> uh,<00:15:22.360> uh,<00:15:23.280> little<00:15:24.480> incremental<00:15:24.920> gains<00:15:26.320> to<00:15:26.440> try<00:15:26.760> to<00:15:27.240> change<00:15:27.640> something,<00:15:28.160> things<00:15:28.400> don't<00:15:28.600> go<00:15:28.800> well.

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So,<00:15:30.040> we<00:15:30.120> try<00:15:30.320> to<00:15:30.480> optimize<00:15:31.000> today<00:15:31.960> and<00:15:32.120> build<00:15:32.320> for<00:15:32.440> tomorrow,<00:15:33.280> but<00:15:33.400> we<00:15:33.520> learn<00:15:33.760> from<00:15:33.920> mistakes.

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It's<00:15:34.600> an<00:15:34.760> iterative<00:15:35.280> process.<00:15:36.160> It's<00:15:36.320> almost<00:15:36.680> like<00:15:36.960> your<00:15:37.400> aggregation<00:15:38.200> of<00:15:38.400> incremental<00:15:39.000> gains,<00:15:39.520> and<00:15:39.640> that's<00:15:39.880> okay.

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We<00:15:40.920> spend<00:15:41.120> a<00:15:41.160> lot<00:15:41.280> of<00:15:41.360> a<00:15:41.400> lot<00:15:41.560> of<00:15:41.680> time<00:15:42.000> pushing<00:15:42.360> that<00:15:42.560> through.

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So,<00:15:43.600> there<00:15:43.720> are<00:15:43.760> other<00:15:44.400> frameworks<00:15:45.800> process<00:15:46.800> that<00:15:47.120> we<00:15:47.320> run<00:15:47.520> the<00:15:47.640> business<00:15:48.040> with.

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Spend<00:15:49.280> a<00:15:49.320> lot<00:15:49.440> of<00:15:49.560> time<00:15:50.120> pushing<00:15:50.400> it<00:15:50.520> downstream.<00:15:51.720> The<00:15:51.800> third<00:15:52.120> is<00:15:52.640> the<00:15:52.760> people<00:15:53.120> component<00:15:53.720> of<00:15:53.840> it.

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Uh,<00:15:55.200> which<00:15:55.440> is<00:15:55.680> for<00:15:55.840> us,<00:15:56.000> culture<00:15:56.440> is<00:15:57.280> how<00:15:57.360> we<00:15:57.480> run<00:15:57.640> the<00:15:57.760> business,<00:15:58.280> not<00:15:58.560> just<00:15:59.040> a<00:15:59.160> small<00:15:59.720> piece<00:16:00.200> of<00:16:00.320> the<00:16:00.480> equal<00:16:00.840> element.

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So,<00:16:01.400> within<00:16:01.640> the<00:16:01.760> people<00:16:02.120> element<00:16:02.480> of<00:16:02.600> it,<00:16:03.640> we<00:16:03.760> have<00:16:03.960> our<00:16:04.720> culture<00:16:04.960> manifesto.

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We<00:16:06.240> have<00:16:06.360> a<00:16:06.400> set<00:16:06.760> of<00:16:07.240> values<00:16:07.720> that<00:16:07.880> we<00:16:08.000> believe<00:16:08.360> in,<00:16:08.640> that<00:16:08.880> we<00:16:09.440> reinforce<00:16:10.240> on<00:16:10.320> a<00:16:10.400> regular<00:16:10.720> basis.

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We<00:16:12.240> value<00:16:12.560> a<00:16:12.640> set<00:16:12.840> of<00:16:12.960> skill<00:16:13.880> and<00:16:14.080> soft<00:16:14.360> skills<00:16:15.400> based<00:16:15.720> on<00:16:15.880> where<00:16:16.840> some<00:16:17.080> people<00:16:17.440> are<00:16:17.680> with<00:16:18.360> in<00:16:18.440> the<00:16:18.560> company,<00:16:19.120> both<00:16:19.320> in<00:16:19.440> terms<00:16:19.760> of<00:16:20.000> tenure

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and<00:16:21.960> we<00:16:22.120> proactively<00:16:22.880> have<00:16:23.120> an<00:16:23.280> L&D<00:16:23.680> program,<00:16:24.839> uh,<00:16:25.000> in<00:16:25.120> the<00:16:25.200> company<00:16:25.560> to<00:16:25.720> make<00:16:25.920> sure<00:16:26.080> that<00:16:26.280> they<00:16:26.480> are,<00:16:27.200> uh,<00:16:27.360> equipped<00:16:27.960> to<00:16:28.960> to

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do<00:16:29.200> results.<00:16:30.160> So,<00:16:30.320> we<00:16:30.480> say<00:16:30.640> that<00:16:31.040> we<00:16:31.240> exhibit<00:16:31.839> a<00:16:31.880> certain<00:16:32.240> group<00:16:32.520> of<00:16:32.640> behaviors<00:16:33.720> that<00:16:33.960> are<00:16:34.040> underpinned<00:16:34.480> by<00:16:34.640> our<00:16:34.720> values<00:16:35.120> and<00:16:35.240> skills.

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So,<00:16:37.320> it's<00:16:37.520> purpose,<00:16:38.560> it's<00:16:38.720> process,<00:16:39.640> and<00:16:39.800> it's<00:16:40.000> people<00:16:40.560> all<00:16:40.720> encompassing<00:16:41.520> that<00:16:41.720> makes<00:16:42.000> up<00:16:42.120> the<00:16:42.240> culture<00:16:42.920> of<00:16:43.120> the<00:16:43.200> company.

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I'm<00:16:44.080> proud<00:16:44.320> to<00:16:44.400> say<00:16:44.880> we<00:16:45.000> had<00:16:45.240> at<00:16:45.440> least,<00:16:46.040> I'm<00:16:46.160> going<00:16:46.360> from<00:16:46.480> memory,<00:16:47.040> at<00:16:47.080> least<00:16:47.320> 17<00:16:49.080> who<00:16:49.200> have<00:16:49.320> been<00:16:50.960> for<00:16:51.200> over<00:16:51.680> 15<00:16:52.040> years.

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We<00:16:54.440> promoted.<00:16:55.160> And<00:16:55.320> by<00:16:55.440> the<00:16:55.520> way,<00:16:55.720> I'm<00:16:55.800> very<00:16:56.000> proud<00:16:56.240> to<00:16:56.320> say,<00:16:58.200> uh,<00:16:58.520> yeah.

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Very<00:16:59.480> proud<00:16:59.720> that's<00:17:00.040> that.<00:17:00.520> It's<00:17:00.640> not<00:17:01.360> It's<00:17:01.640> not<00:17:01.800> the<00:17:01.920> EBITDA,<00:17:02.520> it's<00:17:02.680> not<00:17:02.800> the<00:17:02.880> gross<00:17:03.200> margin,<00:17:03.680> but<00:17:03.839> it's<00:17:04.720> Okay.

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Upward,<00:17:05.959> we<00:17:06.079> only<00:17:06.319> have<00:17:06.560> two<00:17:07.680> people<00:17:08.680> on<00:17:08.800> the<00:17:08.920> outside<00:17:09.680> who<00:17:09.800> are<00:17:09.920> helping.

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Otherwise,<00:17:11.680> all<00:17:12.079> of<00:17:12.240> the<00:17:12.360> core<00:17:12.720> development<00:17:13.360> of<00:17:13.560> Upward<00:17:14.120> is<00:17:14.319> being<00:17:14.600> done<00:17:15.400> by<00:17:15.720> the<00:17:16.240> team<00:17:16.480> members<00:17:17.560> who<00:17:17.600> are<00:17:17.760> learning<00:17:18.040> on<00:17:18.120> the<00:17:18.480> That's

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awesome.<00:17:19.280> I<00:17:19.400> mean,<00:17:19.800> that's<00:17:20.319> huge,<00:17:20.800> right?

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Like<00:17:21.480> if<00:17:21.680> you<00:17:21.959> if<00:17:22.120> you<00:17:22.280> can<00:17:22.680> if<00:17:22.839> you<00:17:22.959> can<00:17:23.120> figure<00:17:23.400> that<00:17:23.680> out.

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And<00:17:24.360> are<00:17:24.480> you<00:17:24.680> using<00:17:25.160> I<00:17:25.280> we<00:17:25.439> talked<00:17:25.640> about<00:17:25.839> AI<00:17:26.120> and<00:17:26.280> like<00:17:26.520> the,<00:17:27.439> uh,<00:17:28.240> you<00:17:28.400> know,<00:17:28.600> how<00:17:28.760> it's<00:17:28.880> going<00:17:29.000> to<00:17:29.200> affect<00:17:29.640> video<00:17:29.960> commerce<00:17:30.520> and<00:17:30.600> content<00:17:30.960> creation<00:17:31.320> and<00:17:31.400> things<00:17:31.600> like

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that.<00:17:32.320> But<00:17:32.480> how<00:17:32.640> are<00:17:32.800> you<00:17:33.000> using<00:17:33.360> it<00:17:33.480> internally<00:17:34.280> to<00:17:34.440> automate<00:17:34.880> some<00:17:35.040> of<00:17:35.120> this?

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Like<00:17:35.520> has<00:17:35.640> that<00:17:35.800> been<00:17:36.000> useful?<00:17:36.600> Yes,<00:17:37.000> in<00:17:37.160> fact,<00:17:37.440> that<00:17:37.640> was<00:17:37.800> the<00:17:37.920> genesis<00:17:38.440> of<00:17:38.600> Upward.

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We<00:17:39.840> didn't<00:17:40.040> just<00:17:40.360> wake<00:17:40.560> up<00:17:40.760> and<00:17:40.880> say<00:17:41.000> we<00:17:41.080> want<00:17:41.200> to<00:17:41.280> build<00:17:41.520> Upward.

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So,<00:17:42.960> we,<00:17:44.160> uh,<00:17:44.640> Remember<00:17:45.080> when<00:17:45.240> I<00:17:45.320> said<00:17:45.520> the<00:17:45.600> media<00:17:45.880> sales<00:17:46.200> person<00:17:46.840> does<00:17:47.080> a<00:17:47.120> deal,<00:17:48.000> it<00:17:48.200> triggers<00:17:48.640> an<00:17:48.760> insertion<00:17:49.280> order,<00:17:49.720> right?

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So,<00:17:50.301> it<00:17:50.562> says,<00:17:50.823> <00:17:51.084> Yeah.<00:17:51.345> the<00:17:51.606> campaign<00:17:51.867> starts<00:17:52.128> and<00:17:52.389> ends<00:17:52.650> and<00:17:52.910> then<00:17:53.171> you<00:17:53.432> have<00:17:53.693> these<00:17:53.954> creatives<00:17:54.215> and<00:17:54.476> then<00:17:54.737> you<00:17:54.998> have<00:17:55.259> certain<00:17:55.520> audience.

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That's<00:17:56.560> what<00:17:56.720> we<00:17:56.800> do<00:17:57.000> for<00:17:57.160> a<00:17:57.200> living.<00:17:58.000> We<00:17:58.120> do<00:17:58.240> it<00:17:58.400> 24/7<00:17:59.400> in<00:17:59.600> like<00:17:59.840> dozen<00:18:00.160> plus<00:18:00.480> languages<00:18:01.160> all<00:18:01.360> around<00:18:01.520> the<00:18:01.640> world.

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The<00:18:04.400> incubation<00:18:05.800> of<00:18:06.000> Upward<00:18:06.600> was<00:18:07.640> we<00:18:07.720> started<00:18:08.080> to<00:18:08.200> eat<00:18:08.440> our<00:18:08.560> own<00:18:08.680> dog<00:18:09.000> food.

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We<00:18:10.400> put<00:18:10.600> all<00:18:10.720> the<00:18:10.840> process<00:18:11.240> together<00:18:11.640> and<00:18:11.760> then<00:18:11.920> said,<00:18:12.680> "Which<00:18:12.920> pieces<00:18:13.360> can<00:18:13.600> be<00:18:13.800> automated<00:18:14.480> out?"

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And<00:18:15.680> then<00:18:15.880> we<00:18:16.360> did<00:18:16.720> almost<00:18:17.160> 12<00:18:17.680> 18-month<00:18:18.320> testing<00:18:20.480> to<00:18:20.520> see<00:18:20.560> if<00:18:20.720> this<00:18:20.920> thing<00:18:21.280> has<00:18:21.480> got<00:18:21.720> legs.

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Does<00:18:22.440> this<00:18:22.600> dog<00:18:22.920> hunt?<00:18:23.840> So,<00:18:23.920> we<00:18:24.040> said,<00:18:24.240> "Yeah,<00:18:24.440> it<00:18:24.640> might<00:18:24.920> hunt."

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Then<00:18:25.600> we<00:18:26.480> And<00:18:26.600> to<00:18:26.680> clients,<00:18:27.080> we<00:18:27.200> said,<00:18:27.400> "Hey,<00:18:27.480> look,<00:18:27.880> this<00:18:28.120> is<00:18:28.280> our<00:18:28.440> approach."

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And<00:18:29.640> that's<00:18:29.840> how<00:18:29.960> we<00:18:30.120> start<00:18:30.880> save,<00:18:31.680> uh,<00:18:32.440> the<00:18:33.040> solution<00:18:34.160> can<00:18:34.920> And<00:18:35.040> then<00:18:35.360> we<00:18:35.480> came<00:18:35.760> up<00:18:35.880> with<00:18:36.040> the<00:18:36.320> holistic<00:18:36.800> nature<00:18:37.960> of

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how<00:18:38.280> we<00:18:38.400> would<00:18:38.560> build<00:18:38.840> it<00:18:39.360> and<00:18:39.520> purpose<00:18:40.120> design<00:18:40.520> it<00:18:40.680> for<00:18:40.840> this<00:18:41.040> specific<00:18:41.640> market<00:18:42.040> segment.

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Proud<00:18:43.000> to<00:18:43.080> say<00:18:43.240> that<00:18:43.960> at<00:18:44.080> least<00:18:44.320> 50%<00:18:46.120> dozen<00:18:46.520> customers<00:18:47.320> are<00:18:47.600> actively<00:18:48.320> migrating<00:18:49.000> to<00:18:49.160> Upward<00:18:49.520> as<00:18:49.640> we<00:18:49.800> speak.

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And<00:18:51.200> we<00:18:51.360> have<00:18:51.560> a<00:18:51.680> road<00:18:51.960> map<00:18:52.280> that<00:18:52.960> extends<00:18:54.040> next,<00:18:54.600> you<00:18:54.640> know,<00:18:55.120> two<00:18:55.280> to<00:18:55.440> three<00:18:55.880> years<00:18:56.200> out<00:18:56.400> is<00:18:56.520> a<00:18:56.560> lot<00:18:56.960> of<00:18:57.200> potential<00:18:57.720> because<00:18:58.080> like<00:18:58.240> I<00:18:58.280> said<00:18:58.520> early<00:18:58.760> on,<00:18:59.200> marketing

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as<00:18:59.880> a<00:19:00.080> Excuse<00:19:00.440> me,<00:19:00.600> advertising<00:19:01.440> as<00:19:01.560> a<00:19:01.600> revenue<00:19:01.920> model<00:19:02.360> is<00:19:02.480> not<00:19:02.680> going<00:19:02.920> away.

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If<00:19:03.400> anything,<00:19:04.440> it<00:19:04.640> is<00:19:04.760> attracting<00:19:05.400> more<00:19:06.080> and<00:19:06.200> more<00:19:06.400> industries.

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Go<00:19:08.240> to<00:19:08.400> Target<00:19:09.320> and<00:19:09.480> you<00:19:10.040> see,<00:19:11.240> uh,<00:19:11.480> quarterly<00:19:11.840> reports,<00:19:12.960> the<00:19:13.040> line<00:19:13.280> item<00:19:13.600> is<00:19:14.040> ad<00:19:14.240> revenue.

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So,<00:19:14.880> it's<00:19:15.040> a<00:19:15.280> it's<00:19:15.440> a<00:19:15.480> retail<00:19:16.320> do<00:19:16.640> have<00:19:16.800> a<00:19:16.840> retail<00:19:17.520> media<00:19:17.800> network,<00:19:18.360> but<00:19:18.480> they're<00:19:18.600> generating<00:19:19.200> a<00:19:19.240> lot<00:19:19.440> of<00:19:20.000> ad<00:19:20.280> revenue.

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So,<00:19:21.440> it<00:19:21.560> is<00:19:21.680> attracting<00:19:22.320> retail<00:19:22.680> media<00:19:22.920> networks,<00:19:23.920> gaming<00:19:24.320> ad<00:19:24.480> networks,<00:19:25.040> so,<00:19:25.720> uh,<00:19:25.960> the<00:19:26.120> advertising<00:19:26.800> component<00:19:27.840> is<00:19:28.040> not<00:19:28.240> going<00:19:28.480> away.

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So,<00:19:28.920> we<00:19:29.080> feel<00:19:29.400> that,<00:19:30.160> uh,<00:19:30.960> building<00:19:31.280> a<00:19:31.360> purpose-built<00:19:32.200> solution<00:19:33.040> that<00:19:33.480> enables<00:19:34.440> media<00:19:34.760> sales<00:19:35.080> people<00:19:36.000> to<00:19:36.720> Yeah,

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it's<00:19:37.280> like<00:19:38.040> us.<00:19:38.480> Yeah.<00:19:39.240> Yeah.

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That<00:19:40.160> make<00:19:40.360> That<00:19:40.520> makes<00:19:40.720> a<00:19:40.760> ton<00:19:40.920> How<00:19:41.040> are<00:19:41.120> you<00:19:41.240> feeling<00:19:41.480> about<00:19:41.680> like<00:19:41.840> the<00:19:41.960> economic<00:19:42.480> environment?

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Obviously,<00:19:43.200> the<00:19:43.280> first<00:19:43.560> half<00:19:43.720> of<00:19:43.760> the<00:19:43.880> year,<00:19:44.760> um,<00:19:45.080> volatile,<00:19:46.080> tariffs,<00:19:46.680> all<00:19:46.840> these<00:19:47.000> types<00:19:47.240> of<00:19:47.320> things.

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Does<00:19:47.760> seem<00:19:47.880> like<00:19:48.080> we<00:19:48.200> There's<00:19:48.360> a<00:19:48.400> little<00:19:48.560> bit<00:19:48.680> more,<00:19:49.120> uh,<00:19:49.320> reliability<00:19:50.080> in<00:19:50.240> some<00:19:50.400> of<00:19:50.480> this<00:19:50.600> stuff<00:19:50.840> in<00:19:50.920> some<00:19:51.120> ways,<00:19:51.360> maybe<00:19:51.840> not<00:19:52.160> in<00:19:52.520> others.

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How<00:19:53.400> did<00:19:53.600> you<00:19:53.880> think<00:19:54.200> about<00:19:54.440> it<00:19:54.520> this<00:19:54.720> year,<00:19:54.880> and<00:19:55.000> how<00:19:55.120> are<00:19:55.240> you<00:19:55.400> thinking<00:19:55.760> about<00:19:56.080> it<00:19:56.200> going<00:19:56.480> into<00:19:56.680> 2026?

00:19:57.600 --> 00:20:05.600
<00:19:57.958> So,<00:19:58.316> given<00:19:58.674> we're<00:19:59.032> in<00:19:59.390> mostly<00:19:59.748> the<00:20:00.106> technology<00:20:00.464> services,<00:20:00.822> uh,<00:20:01.180> area,<00:20:01.538> then<00:20:01.896> that's<00:20:02.254> a<00:20:02.612> big<00:20:02.970> chunk<00:20:03.328> of<00:20:03.686> our<00:20:04.044> revenue,<00:20:04.402> global<00:20:04.760> footprint.

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So,<00:20:05.920> we<00:20:06.120> are<00:20:06.280> kind<00:20:06.480> of<00:20:07.440> obviously,<00:20:08.000> US<00:20:08.280> is<00:20:08.480> our<00:20:08.680> biggest,<00:20:09.280> uh,<00:20:09.480> revenue<00:20:09.760> concentration.

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It<00:20:11.520> hasn't<00:20:11.880> hit<00:20:12.040> us<00:20:12.200> directly<00:20:12.640> because<00:20:13.000> we're<00:20:13.120> in<00:20:13.200> the<00:20:13.280> tech<00:20:13.720> services<00:20:14.240> space<00:20:14.600> as<00:20:14.720> opposed<00:20:15.080> to<00:20:15.400> tangible<00:20:15.920> things<00:20:16.640> goods<00:20:17.000> and<00:20:17.160> services.

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And<00:20:18.920> also,<00:20:19.400> our<00:20:19.600> client<00:20:20.000> base<00:20:20.280> is<00:20:20.560> content<00:20:21.040> and<00:20:21.200> commerce.

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Uh,<00:20:22.360> so,<00:20:22.680> you<00:20:22.800> could<00:20:22.960> argue<00:20:23.280> that<00:20:24.040> there<00:20:24.160> might<00:20:24.360> be<00:20:24.520> some<00:20:25.760> commerce<00:20:26.160> side<00:20:26.400> in<00:20:26.520> terms<00:20:26.880> of<00:20:27.240> you<00:20:27.280> know,<00:20:27.400> the<00:20:27.520> shopping<00:20:27.920> season,<00:20:28.400> but<00:20:28.680> most<00:20:28.920> of<00:20:29.040> it<00:20:29.240> is,<00:20:30.120> uh,<00:20:30.440> so

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far,<00:20:30.920> we've<00:20:31.080> been<00:20:31.280> kind<00:20:31.480> of<00:20:32.240> alerted<00:20:32.680> from<00:20:32.840> it,<00:20:33.120> but<00:20:33.320> most<00:20:33.640> of<00:20:33.760> the<00:20:34.160> impact<00:20:34.640> for<00:20:34.840> us<00:20:35.000> has<00:20:35.160> been<00:20:35.960> in<00:20:36.120> the<00:20:36.240> transition<00:20:37.080> and<00:20:37.240> adoption<00:20:38.360> of<00:20:38.600> AI<00:20:39.240> automation,

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how<00:20:40.320> it<00:20:40.440> impacts<00:20:40.880> businesses.<00:20:41.400> So,<00:20:42.320> uh,<00:20:42.720> between<00:20:43.160> the<00:20:43.320> tariff<00:20:44.720> piece<00:20:45.360> and<00:20:45.600> the<00:20:45.760> migration<00:20:47.120> and<00:20:47.360> evaluation<00:20:48.000> of<00:20:48.160> how

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we<00:20:49.560> as<00:20:49.720> a<00:20:49.760> company<00:20:50.440> and<00:20:50.600> how<00:20:50.880> our<00:20:51.040> clients<00:20:51.840> are<00:20:52.080> adapting<00:20:52.760> AI<00:20:53.240> and<00:20:53.440> automation,<00:20:54.080> that's<00:20:54.440> the<00:20:54.520> bigger<00:20:54.800> impact<00:20:55.520> for<00:20:55.680> our<00:20:55.840> business<00:20:56.280> model<00:20:57.400> tariffs

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itself.<00:20:58.035> <00:20:58.310> Uh,<00:20:58.585> that's<00:20:58.860> interesting.<00:20:59.135> Yeah,<00:20:59.410> that<00:20:59.685> makes<00:20:59.960> sense.

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Uh,<00:21:01.240> finally,<00:21:01.600> we<00:21:01.760> end<00:21:01.920> every<00:21:02.080> interview<00:21:02.360> with<00:21:02.480> the<00:21:02.560> same<00:21:02.760> question,<00:21:03.160> and<00:21:03.280> that<00:21:03.440> is<00:21:03.520> at<00:21:03.680> ceo.com,<00:21:04.440> we<00:21:04.560> believe<00:21:04.800> the<00:21:04.920> chances<00:21:05.360> one<00:21:05.600> gives<00:21:06.120> is<00:21:06.320> just<00:21:06.560> as<00:21:06.640> important<00:21:06.960> as<00:21:07.120> the

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chances<00:21:07.640> one<00:21:07.840> takes.<00:21:08.760> When<00:21:08.960> you<00:21:09.160> hear<00:21:09.400> that,<00:21:09.680> who<00:21:09.840> gave<00:21:10.040> you<00:21:10.160> a<00:21:10.240> chance<00:21:10.600> to<00:21:10.680> get<00:21:10.880> you<00:21:10.960> to<00:21:11.080> where<00:21:11.240> you<00:21:11.400> are<00:21:11.560> today?

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Um,<00:21:13.200> there<00:21:13.360> are<00:21:14.160> quite<00:21:14.360> a<00:21:14.440> few<00:21:14.760> people<00:21:15.600> who<00:21:15.800> jump<00:21:16.120> to<00:21:16.240> mind,<00:21:17.360> but<00:21:17.560> over<00:21:17.760> the<00:21:17.880> years,<00:21:18.680> there's<00:21:18.920> one<00:21:19.240> specific<00:21:19.840> instance<00:21:20.400> that

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has<00:21:20.720> stuck,<00:21:21.280> and<00:21:21.360> it's<00:21:21.480> a<00:21:21.520> very<00:21:23.240> long<00:21:23.440> story.

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So,<00:21:24.400> I<00:21:24.440> came<00:21:24.720> to<00:21:24.800> the<00:21:24.920> US<00:21:25.320> as<00:21:25.480> an<00:21:25.600> immigrant.<00:21:26.040> I<00:21:26.080> came<00:21:26.280> as<00:21:26.400> a<00:21:26.440> student.

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And,<00:21:28.280> uh,<00:21:28.360> I<00:21:29.160> Yeah,<00:21:29.520> and<00:21:30.120> I<00:21:30.600> applied<00:21:31.000> to<00:21:31.120> universities<00:21:31.800> to<00:21:31.920> come<00:21:32.200> to<00:21:32.320> the<00:21:32.440> US.

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A<00:21:33.160> paper,<00:21:33.800> but<00:21:34.680> my<00:21:35.040> passport<00:21:35.640> had<00:21:36.600> expired.

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And<00:21:37.960> if<00:21:38.200> I<00:21:39.160> couldn't<00:21:39.400> go<00:21:39.560> for<00:21:39.720> my<00:21:39.840> visa<00:21:40.160> interview<00:21:40.840> without<00:21:41.080> my<00:21:41.240> passport,<00:21:41.760> then<00:21:42.160> I<00:21:42.320> lost<00:21:42.640> the<00:21:42.680> opportunity<00:21:43.160> to,<00:21:44.400> uh,<00:21:44.600> come<00:21:44.760> to<00:21:44.840> the<00:21:44.960> US.

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So,<00:21:47.960> we<00:21:48.080> were<00:21:48.760> giving<00:21:49.000> up<00:21:49.160> hope,<00:21:49.520> and<00:21:49.640> then<00:21:50.560> I<00:21:50.960> asked<00:21:51.160> some<00:21:51.320> of<00:21:51.400> his<00:21:51.560> colleagues,<00:21:52.000> "Say,<00:21:52.440> this<00:21:52.640> is<00:21:52.720> the<00:21:52.800> situation.

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Anybody?"<00:21:55.560> And<00:21:55.720> one<00:21:55.800> of<00:21:55.880> his<00:21:56.000> colleagues<00:21:56.360> said,<00:21:56.600> "My<00:21:56.760> dad's<00:21:57.040> a<00:21:57.120> school<00:21:58.440> He<00:21:58.520> knows<00:21:58.720> a<00:21:58.800> lot<00:21:59.040> of<00:21:59.120> people<00:21:59.920> in<00:22:00.160> the<00:22:00.560> government."

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He<00:22:01.840> He<00:22:01.920> had<00:22:02.040> He<00:22:02.080> had<00:22:02.200> He<00:22:02.280> was<00:22:02.400> a<00:22:02.440> retired<00:22:02.840> school<00:22:03.200> school<00:22:03.520> teacher,<00:22:04.040> and<00:22:04.280> he<00:22:04.600> came<00:22:05.480> to<00:22:05.560> the<00:22:05.680> passport<00:22:06.240> office,<00:22:06.880> and<00:22:07.320> as<00:22:07.520> luck<00:22:07.760> would<00:22:07.920> have<00:22:08.160> it,<00:22:08.960> the<00:22:09.120> passport<00:22:09.520> officer

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was<00:22:10.080> a<00:22:10.400> former<00:22:10.680> student<00:22:11.040> of<00:22:11.160> his.<00:22:12.360> Put<00:22:12.440> in<00:22:12.520> a<00:22:12.600> word<00:22:12.800> for<00:22:12.920> me,<00:22:13.120> and<00:22:13.200> got<00:22:13.400> my<00:22:13.640> passport,<00:22:14.480> and,<00:22:15.520> uh,<00:22:15.960> managed<00:22:16.240> to<00:22:16.320> come<00:22:16.520> to<00:22:16.640> US.

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So,<00:22:17.760> I<00:22:17.880> thanked<00:22:18.240> him,<00:22:19.200> the<00:22:19.280> retired<00:22:19.640> school<00:22:19.880> teacher.

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He<00:22:20.640> had<00:22:20.760> two<00:22:20.920> sons.<00:22:22.520> And<00:22:22.720> his<00:22:22.880> younger<00:22:23.160> son<00:22:23.720> wanted<00:22:24.000> to<00:22:24.080> come<00:22:24.320> to<00:22:24.440> America<00:22:25.720> to<00:22:25.800> study,<00:22:26.240> but<00:22:26.840> on<00:22:26.960> a<00:22:27.000> school<00:22:27.320> teacher's<00:22:27.680> salary,<00:22:28.360> his<00:22:28.560> son

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couldn't<00:22:29.160> afford.<00:22:30.400> So,<00:22:30.520> his<00:22:30.680> son<00:22:30.880> had<00:22:31.040> written<00:22:31.480> a<00:22:31.560> lot<00:22:31.760> of<00:22:31.880> letters,<00:22:33.320> uh,<00:22:33.440> to<00:22:33.600> foundations<00:22:34.440> and<00:22:34.640> charitable<00:22:35.120> organizations<00:22:36.240> asking<00:22:36.640> for<00:22:36.800> financial

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help.<00:22:38.320> And<00:22:38.520> guess<00:22:38.760> who<00:22:38.880> had<00:22:39.080> sponsored<00:22:39.560> him?

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Princess<00:22:40.160> Grace<00:22:40.560> of<00:22:40.680> Monaco<00:22:41.280> had<00:22:41.440> funded<00:22:42.160> his<00:22:42.560> education<00:22:43.080> in<00:22:43.160> America.

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So,<00:22:44.360> the<00:22:44.440> retired<00:22:44.760> school<00:22:46.040> "Somebody<00:22:46.400> help<00:22:46.560> my<00:22:46.720> son,<00:22:47.680> I<00:22:47.840> help<00:22:48.080> you."

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So,<00:22:49.040> I<00:22:49.120> guess<00:22:49.960> "pay<00:22:50.160> it<00:22:50.240> forward"<00:22:50.600> was<00:22:50.760> our<00:22:50.920> phrase<00:22:51.320> he<00:22:51.440> knew,<00:22:51.800> but<00:22:52.480> you<00:22:52.600> could<00:22:53.240> call<00:22:53.440> it<00:22:53.560> "pay<00:22:53.760> it<00:22:53.840> forward."

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So,<00:22:55.160> it<00:22:55.280> comes<00:22:55.520> to<00:22:55.600> mind.<00:22:56.000> That's<00:22:56.240> beautiful,<00:22:56.760> man.

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That's<00:22:57.480> incredible.<00:22:58.080> Jay,<00:22:58.400> thank<00:22:58.640> you<00:22:58.760> so<00:22:58.880> much<00:22:59.040> for<00:22:59.160> joining<00:22:59.560> us.

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What<00:22:59.920> an<00:23:00.000> incredible<00:23:00.440> company<00:23:00.800> you've<00:23:01.000> built.<00:23:02.200> Um,<00:23:02.360> let's<00:23:02.520> have<00:23:02.680> you<00:23:02.760> back<00:23:03.000> on,<00:23:03.160> too.

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I'd<00:23:03.480> love<00:23:03.640> to<00:23:03.760> even<00:23:04.040> go<00:23:04.160> deeper<00:23:04.480> on<00:23:04.560> some<00:23:04.720> of<00:23:04.800> this<00:23:04.960> stuff.

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But<00:23:05.440> yeah,<00:23:05.600> what<00:23:05.720> a<00:23:05.800> pleasure.<00:23:06.360> Really,<00:23:06.680> really<00:23:06.880> great<00:23:07.080> to<00:23:07.160> meet<00:23:07.320> you.

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Yes,<00:23:08.000> all<00:23:08.120> the<00:23:08.200> best.