The case for running toward the disruption

Joe Grover has been a founder, venture capitalist, four-time chief marketing officer, and turnaround CEO. Ten years ago, he sat across from investors and told them their money was gone. He is now Chief Growth Officer of Amplēo, a Utah firm that places fractional executives inside small and midsize businesses.

"I'm obsessed with failure because I think most entrepreneurial lessons come from failure, not success," Grover told the CEO.com Podcast. "We celebrate successful CEOs constantly, but some of the most valuable lessons come from mistakes, collapses, and setbacks."

Grover started as an entrepreneur running an ad agency. He spent seven years at Mercato Partners, the Salt Lake City venture firm, where he supported investments in Skullcandy, Stance, Fusion-io, and Goal Zero, then went operational: about a decade as a venture-backed CMO in Denver and New York, a stretch as a turnaround CEO, and the CMO seat at Homie, where he grew the venture-backed real estate company into five markets. After Homie, he took a sabbatical. He played guitar, skied, and picked up fractional CMO work that led him to Amplēo, where he is now a partner and owner.

Kent Thomas founded Amplēo 30 years ago as a fractional finance shop. Startups that could not afford a full-time CFO or controller called Kent. Grover launched the firm's marketing and HR practices three years ago. Amplēo raised private equity in June 2025, has acquired five companies including Avalaunch Media, and runs seven divisions serving roughly 14,000 clients. It also partners with Silicon Slopes on Start School, a free entrepreneurship program. "More than 80% of small businesses fail, and we believe that's simply unacceptable," Grover said when the Avalaunch deal closed.

Professional services sits squarely in AI's path. At a recent board meeting in Dallas, after hours on acquisitions and go-to-market strategy, the managing partner asked the room what the firm was doing about AI. Grover's answer is to run at the disruption rather than away from it. "If we're on the forefront of disruption, we can provide significantly more value with fewer resources and lower costs. That's an attractive position to be in."

A client hiring a fractional CFO is not paying for reconciliations, he argues. "They're hiring us for 20 or 30 years of executive experience. They're buying judgment, confidence, clarity, and wisdom. Can AI automate activities? Absolutely. Can it replace trust and executive counsel? I'm not sure."

Grover estimates he spends 80% of his AI time in Claude, with ChatGPT, Grok, and Perplexity filling gaps. He recently had Claude review a week of meeting notes and identify every commitment he had made. It found 65 in five days. "That was a little terrifying," he said. He has started declining more meetings.

He has also worked with the same executive assistant, Michelle, for 16 years across four companies. She triages his inbox, Slack, and calendar every morning before he calls her on his 7:45 drive to the office. "Obsessive prioritization becomes critical," he said. "There are always more things to do than time allows."

Grover hosts a podcast called The Real F Word. The F stands for failure. There is no business objective. He calls it entrepreneur therapy. His guests are founders who lost millions, shut down companies, and lost relationships along the way. When he had to deliver the worst news of his career to his own investors a decade ago, he did not know anyone he could talk to about it.

"What I wish I'd known earlier in my career is that failure doesn't define you," he said. "A bad quarter doesn't define you. A failed company doesn't define you. What actually defines you is the accumulation of those experiences."

Asked who gave him a chance, Grover named Alan Hall and Greg Warnock, who ran an early startup incubator he joined in 2005 alongside Lendio founder Brock Blake. Most of the cohort's companies failed. Hall and Warnock later brought Grover into venture capital anyway, where he spent six months working for free, calling institutional investors on the East Coast.

"They saw something in me before I saw it in myself," he said.

00:00:00 Introduction and Joe's Background
00:00:14 Early Career and Venture Capital Experience
00:00:35 Turnaround CEO and Homey Experience
00:00:56 Sabbatical and Joining Amplio
00:01:17 Amplio's History and Services
00:01:55 Impact of AI on Business
00:02:11 AI in Board Meetings and Strategy
00:02:42 AI Adoption in Small to Mid-Sized Businesses
00:03:04 Early Adoption of ChatGPT and Custom GPTs
00:03:47 AI in Professional Services
00:04:50 M&A Strategy and AI Integration
00:05:11 Value of Executive Experience vs. AI
00:06:04 Identifying AI-Disruptable Verticals
00:07:10 Preference for Claude and Co-Work Over ChatGPT
00:07:39 Use of Various AI Tools for Content Creation
00:08:54 Automating Daily Work Life with AI
00:09:47 Typical Workday Routine
00:10:20 Use of ClickUp and AI for Team Management
00:11:54 Reducing the Need for Meetings
00:12:32 Integration of Various SaaS Products
00:13:04 Future of SaaS and AI Integration
00:14:56 SaaS Market Trends and HubSpot's Position
00:16:11 Uncertainty in SaaS Platforms' Long-Term Position
00:17:15 Technology Adoption in SMBs
00:18:08 HubSpot's Market Penetration
00:19:12 Leadership Philosophy
00:22:08 Recommended Reading
00:25:29 Common Marketing Mistakes
00:27:19 Effectiveness of Billboards and Owned Media
00:29:09 Owned, Earned, and Paid Media Strategies
00:31:02 Experience with Homey and Billboards
00:31:27 Launching a Podcast on Failure
00:34:55 Mental Health and Entrepreneurship
00:36:04 The Fail Club Concept
00:36:46 Final Question: Who Gave You a Chance?
00:39:02 Junto Program and Early Entrepreneurship
00:40:13 Equity and Investment in Junto Program
00:40:44 Closing Remarks and Gratitude

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I<00:03:13.812> was<00:03:14.184> an<00:03:14.557> early<00:03:14.929> adopter<00:03:15.301> of<00:03:15.673> ChatGPT<00:03:16.045> and<00:03:16.417> doing<00:03:16.790> a<00:03:17.162> lot<00:03:17.534> of<00:03:17.906> automation<00:03:18.278> around<00:03:18.650> content<00:03:19.023> creation<00:03:19.395> with<00:03:19.767> custom<00:03:20.139> GPTs<00:03:20.511> and<00:03:20.883> built,<00:03:21.256> you<00:03:21.628> know,<00:03:22.000> many

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custom<00:03:23.280> GPTs<00:03:23.959> to<00:03:24.480> write<00:03:24.760> social<00:03:25.239> media<00:03:25.600> copy<00:03:26.160> and<00:03:26.720> help<00:03:26.959> us<00:03:27.080> social<00:03:27.440> media<00:03:27.680> response<00:03:28.120> for<00:03:28.239> clients.

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And<00:03:29.840> I<00:03:29.880> mean<00:03:30.000> it<00:03:30.239> feels<00:03:30.480> like<00:03:30.640> every<00:03:30.800> 6<00:03:31.080> months<00:03:31.360> I'm<00:03:32.120> evolving<00:03:32.720> and<00:03:32.840> now<00:03:33.080> I'm<00:03:33.280> like<00:03:33.920> Claude<00:03:34.360> is<00:03:34.480> where<00:03:34.600> I'm<00:03:34.720> spending<00:03:35.440> 80%<00:03:36.160> of<00:03:36.239> my<00:03:36.400> time<00:03:36.840> and<00:03:37.000> Coda<00:03:37.480> is

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something<00:03:38.000> that<00:03:38.160> I've<00:03:38.239> been<00:03:38.400> really<00:03:38.600> leveraging<00:03:39.640> in<00:03:39.680> the<00:03:39.760> last<00:03:40.400> month<00:03:40.680> or<00:03:40.800> two<00:03:41.160> to<00:03:41.320> really<00:03:41.519> try<00:03:41.640> to<00:03:41.800> automate<00:03:42.320> things<00:03:42.600> outside<00:03:43.040> of<00:03:43.120> the<00:03:43.239> prompting<00:03:43.800> engine.

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And,<00:03:45.640> and<00:03:45.760> so<00:03:45.880> I<00:03:45.959> think<00:03:46.200> it's<00:03:46.360> evolving<00:03:47.080> for<00:03:47.400> us<00:03:47.840> in<00:03:48.000> professional<00:03:48.560> services.

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It's<00:03:50.160> really<00:03:51.400> a<00:03:51.440> huge<00:03:51.840> enabler<00:03:52.320> especially<00:03:53.080> for<00:03:53.280> work.

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Think<00:03:54.120> about<00:03:54.680> even<00:03:54.920> the<00:03:55.040> accounting<00:03:55.480> space.

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Um,<00:03:57.200> I<00:03:57.480> spent<00:03:58.240> last<00:03:58.640> week<00:03:58.960> dealing<00:03:59.280> with<00:03:59.440> a<00:03:59.520> bunch<00:03:59.760> of<00:03:59.880> large<00:04:00.160> data<00:04:00.440> sets,<00:04:01.280> and<00:04:02.560> my<00:04:02.760> AI<00:04:03.080> partner<00:04:04.040> was<00:04:04.240> a<00:04:04.320> huge<00:04:04.680> enabler

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there,<00:04:05.720> right?<00:04:06.280> Doing<00:04:06.520> work<00:04:06.760> that<00:04:06.920> I<00:04:06.959> would<00:04:07.120> have<00:04:07.480> normally<00:04:07.920> done<00:04:08.160> on<00:04:08.320> my<00:04:08.520> own<00:04:08.760> in<00:04:08.880> Excel,<00:04:09.880> it<00:04:10.000> accelerated<00:04:10.720> whether<00:04:10.959> it<00:04:11.040> was<00:04:11.400> model<00:04:11.760> creation,<00:04:12.320> formula<00:04:12.760> creation,

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or<00:04:13.320> the<00:04:13.440> analysis<00:04:13.959> of<00:04:14.040> that<00:04:14.280> data.<00:04:15.200> And<00:04:15.320> so,<00:04:15.880> we<00:04:16.040> want<00:04:16.320> like<00:04:16.640> our<00:04:16.840> base<00:04:17.320> of<00:04:17.519> consultants<00:04:18.440> who<00:04:18.600> are<00:04:18.720> working<00:04:19.120> inside<00:04:19.560> of<00:04:19.640> these<00:04:19.760> companies<00:04:20.560> to<00:04:20.680> be<00:04:20.880> the<00:04:21.040> most<00:04:21.359> kind

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of<00:04:21.720> AI<00:04:22.600> educated<00:04:25.000> of<00:04:25.240> the<00:04:25.360> executives<00:04:26.080> that<00:04:26.200> are<00:04:26.320> helping<00:04:26.680> these<00:04:27.080> CEOs.

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So,<00:04:27.919> for<00:04:28.120> us,<00:04:28.280> that's<00:04:28.560> where<00:04:28.680> it<00:04:28.760> starts.<00:04:29.520> It's<00:04:29.680> not<00:04:29.840> a<00:04:29.880> blanket<00:04:30.360> strategy<00:04:30.880> that<00:04:31.080> all<00:04:31.240> companies<00:04:31.680> should<00:04:31.800> be<00:04:32.000> using<00:04:32.280> a<00:04:32.360> certain<00:04:32.760> set<00:04:33.000> of<00:04:33.120> AI<00:04:33.360> tools.

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It's<00:04:34.360> making<00:04:34.680> sure<00:04:34.880> the<00:04:35.000> consultants<00:04:35.720> that<00:04:35.880> are<00:04:35.960> working<00:04:36.440> with<00:04:37.480> the<00:04:37.680> clients<00:04:38.800> are<00:04:40.080> AI<00:04:40.400> native,<00:04:41.120> they're<00:04:41.280> AI<00:04:42.040> educated,<00:04:42.800> and

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they<00:04:43.120> know<00:04:43.320> what<00:04:43.560> tools<00:04:43.840> are<00:04:43.919> at<00:04:44.080> their<00:04:44.320> disposal<00:04:45.320> to<00:04:45.440> perform<00:04:46.360> higher<00:04:46.680> quality<00:04:47.040> work<00:04:47.440> and<00:04:47.600> more<00:04:47.840> work<00:04:48.200> for<00:04:48.320> less<00:04:48.560> time.

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Yeah,<00:04:50.865> I<00:04:51.170> guess,<00:04:51.475> I<00:04:51.780> guess<00:04:52.085> like<00:04:52.390> part<00:04:52.695> of<00:04:53.000> my<00:04:53.305> question<00:04:53.610> there<00:04:53.915> is<00:04:54.220> like<00:04:54.525> you're,<00:04:54.830> you're<00:04:55.135> doing<00:04:55.440> all<00:04:55.745> these<00:04:56.050> M&A<00:04:56.355> deals,<00:04:56.660> sorry,<00:04:56.965> and<00:04:57.270> you've<00:04:57.575> acquired<00:04:57.880> five,

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you're<00:04:58.680> looking<00:04:58.919> at<00:04:59.000> acquiring<00:04:59.560> more.<00:05:00.640> What<00:05:00.800> is<00:05:00.919> the<00:05:01.040> calculus<00:05:01.600> there<00:05:01.919> versus,<00:05:03.040> hey,<00:05:03.320> I<00:05:03.400> can<00:05:03.560> just<00:05:04.160> build<00:05:04.440> this<00:05:04.640> myself<00:05:05.280> or<00:05:05.440> build<00:05:05.760> these,<00:05:06.120> this<00:05:06.320> product?

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I<00:05:06.880> guess<00:05:07.080> it's<00:05:07.200> the<00:05:07.320> relationship<00:05:07.880> with<00:05:08.000> the<00:05:08.080> customer<00:05:08.520> that's<00:05:08.760> the<00:05:08.840> value<00:05:09.160> there?

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For<00:05:10.120> sure.<00:05:10.960> It's<00:05:11.200> the,<00:05:11.560> if<00:05:11.680> you<00:05:11.800> think<00:05:12.000> about<00:05:12.280> what<00:05:12.480> you,<00:05:13.520> when,<00:05:13.840> when<00:05:14.000> someone<00:05:14.440> shows<00:05:14.800> up<00:05:15.000> and<00:05:15.160> says<00:05:15.440> they<00:05:15.560> need<00:05:15.760> a<00:05:15.840> CFO,<00:05:17.160> they're,<00:05:17.480> they're,<00:05:17.919> they're<00:05:18.040> not

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always<00:05:18.520> asking<00:05:18.919> for<00:05:19.080> just<00:05:19.320> a<00:05:19.400> balance<00:05:19.800> sheet<00:05:20.600> or<00:05:20.800> a<00:05:20.880> P&L<00:05:22.000> that<00:05:22.120> they're<00:05:22.280> confident<00:05:22.880> in.

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They're<00:05:23.320> not<00:05:23.560> asking<00:05:24.360> for<00:05:24.919> bank<00:05:25.160> reconciliations.

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All<00:05:26.280> that<00:05:26.520> work<00:05:26.720> needs<00:05:27.000> to<00:05:27.120> be<00:05:27.240> done,<00:05:27.440> but<00:05:27.560> that's<00:05:27.680> not<00:05:27.880> what<00:05:28.000> they're<00:05:28.280> really<00:05:28.600> hiring<00:05:29.040> us<00:05:29.240> for.

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Right?<00:05:30.280> They're<00:05:30.440> hiring<00:05:30.720> us<00:05:30.880> for,<00:05:31.720> you<00:05:31.800> know,<00:05:31.880> 20<00:05:32.160> or<00:05:32.240> 30<00:05:32.520> years<00:05:32.800> of<00:05:32.880> executive<00:05:33.360> experience.

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Like<00:05:34.560> I<00:05:34.600> think<00:05:34.760> we've<00:05:34.960> solved<00:05:35.400> the<00:05:35.480> problems<00:05:35.960> they're<00:05:36.080> trying<00:05:36.400> to<00:05:36.480> solve<00:05:36.760> already.

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And<00:05:38.600> can<00:05:38.840> that<00:05:38.960> be<00:05:39.120> replaced<00:05:39.520> by<00:05:39.720> AI?

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Can<00:05:40.640> that<00:05:40.800> relationship<00:05:41.560> and<00:05:41.640> that<00:05:41.800> trust<00:05:42.120> be<00:05:42.240> replaced<00:05:42.680> by<00:05:42.880> AI?

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I<00:05:43.800> think<00:05:44.080> the<00:05:44.160> activity<00:05:44.760> can.<00:05:45.520> I'm<00:05:45.680> not<00:05:45.960> sure<00:05:46.640> we<00:05:46.800> can<00:05:47.040> replace<00:05:47.480> the<00:05:47.600> wisdom,<00:05:48.360> the<00:05:48.480> judgment,<00:05:49.600> the<00:05:49.760> counsel<00:05:50.720> that<00:05:50.960> you<00:05:51.400> provide<00:05:52.160> to

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these<00:05:52.560> entrepreneurs<00:05:53.240> and<00:05:53.360> founders.<00:05:54.320> That's,<00:05:54.800> they're<00:05:54.920> really<00:05:55.080> buying<00:05:55.360> confidence,<00:05:55.960> they're<00:05:56.080> buying<00:05:56.400> clarity,<00:05:56.840> they're<00:05:57.040> buying<00:05:57.400> the<00:05:57.560> experience<00:05:59.000> that,<00:05:59.640> you<00:05:59.760> know,

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fractional<00:06:00.440> leader<00:06:00.760> could<00:06:00.960> offer.<00:06:01.960> So,<00:06:03.000> um,<00:06:03.640> when<00:06:03.840> we're<00:06:03.920> thinking<00:06:04.200> about<00:06:04.680> additional<00:06:05.160> divisions,<00:06:05.640> for<00:06:05.760> example,<00:06:06.160> there<00:06:06.400> are<00:06:07.200> certain<00:06:08.120> back

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office<00:06:08.800> functions<00:06:09.280> or<00:06:09.360> professional<00:06:09.880> services<00:06:10.880> that<00:06:11.000> are<00:06:11.680> more<00:06:12.400> positioned<00:06:13.560> to<00:06:13.680> be<00:06:13.840> disrupted<00:06:14.600> by<00:06:14.760> artificial<00:06:15.280> intelligence.

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And<00:06:16.240> the<00:06:16.320> question<00:06:16.640> for<00:06:16.800> us<00:06:17.040> yesterday<00:06:17.360> in<00:06:17.440> the<00:06:17.520> board<00:06:17.720> meeting<00:06:17.919> was,<00:06:18.400> should<00:06:18.680> we,<00:06:19.840> should<00:06:20.000> we,<00:06:20.520> should<00:06:20.640> we<00:06:20.760> run<00:06:21.000> straight<00:06:21.360> at<00:06:21.560> that?

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Should<00:06:22.580> we<00:06:22.960> actually<00:06:23.340> expand<00:06:23.720> to<00:06:24.100> another<00:06:24.480> division<00:06:24.860> or<00:06:25.240> buy<00:06:25.620> another<00:06:26.000> business<00:06:26.380> that<00:06:26.760> isn't<00:06:27.140> in<00:06:27.520> a<00:06:27.900> vertical<00:06:28.280> that<00:06:28.660> is<00:06:29.040> ripe<00:06:29.420> for<00:06:29.800> disruption?

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And<00:06:31.640> like<00:06:32.000> get<00:06:32.200> on<00:06:32.280> the,<00:06:32.520> get<00:06:32.640> on<00:06:32.720> the,<00:06:32.960> get<00:06:33.120> on<00:06:33.200> the<00:06:33.280> forefront<00:06:33.720> of<00:06:33.800> that<00:06:34.040> because<00:06:34.880> likely<00:06:35.280> that'll<00:06:35.520> mean<00:06:35.720> we<00:06:35.840> can<00:06:35.960> provide<00:06:36.360> way<00:06:36.600> more<00:06:36.840> value<00:06:37.360> with<00:06:37.680> less<00:06:37.919> people,<00:06:38.480> way<00:06:38.640> more

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value<00:06:39.360> for<00:06:39.520> less<00:06:39.760> cost<00:06:40.680> because<00:06:40.960> it'll<00:06:41.160> be<00:06:41.720> AI<00:06:42.440> enabled.

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Or,<00:06:44.240> or<00:06:44.520> do<00:06:44.640> we<00:06:44.919> see<00:06:45.080> that<00:06:45.240> as<00:06:45.360> a<00:06:45.400> threat?

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And<00:06:46.280> my<00:06:46.600> opinion<00:06:47.080> is,<00:06:47.960> at<00:06:48.080> least<00:06:48.280> in<00:06:48.360> the<00:06:48.440> space<00:06:48.720> that<00:06:48.880> we're<00:06:49.080> in<00:06:49.200> as<00:06:49.360> I<00:06:49.440> look<00:06:49.640> at<00:06:49.720> our<00:06:49.840> competitive<00:06:50.360> set,<00:06:51.040> that<00:06:51.160> we<00:06:51.320> should<00:06:51.600> lean<00:06:51.840> in.

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That<00:06:52.840> we<00:06:53.000> should,<00:06:53.520> we<00:06:53.640> should<00:06:53.840> lean<00:06:54.120> in<00:06:54.280> and<00:06:54.480> find<00:06:54.840> those<00:06:55.040> verticals<00:06:56.120> that<00:06:56.360> will<00:06:56.600> be<00:06:56.760> disrupted<00:06:57.640> and<00:06:58.080> will,<00:06:58.400> and<00:06:58.560> if,<00:06:59.200> and<00:06:59.320> if<00:06:59.520> we're<00:06:59.760> at<00:06:59.840> the<00:07:00.120> forefront<00:07:00.560> of<00:07:00.600> that,<00:07:00.880> then

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it's<00:07:01.240> a<00:07:01.280> really,<00:07:02.200> I<00:07:02.240> think<00:07:02.440> it's<00:07:02.600> an<00:07:02.720> attractive<00:07:03.280> market<00:07:03.680> position.

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Even<00:07:04.440> if<00:07:04.560> that<00:07:04.760> means<00:07:05.080> more<00:07:05.400> automation<00:07:05.880> and<00:07:05.960> more<00:07:06.200> AI<00:07:06.480> and<00:07:06.680> less<00:07:07.520> humans.

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Tell<00:07:10.740> me<00:07:11.080> what<00:07:11.420> you<00:07:11.760> think<00:07:12.100> cuz<00:07:12.440> you<00:07:12.780> mentioned<00:07:13.120> like,<00:07:13.460> hey,<00:07:13.800> previously<00:07:14.140> you<00:07:14.480> were<00:07:14.820> spending<00:07:15.160> a<00:07:15.500> lot<00:07:15.840> of<00:07:16.180> your<00:07:16.520> time<00:07:16.860> with<00:07:17.200> AI<00:07:17.540> tools<00:07:17.880> on<00:07:18.220> ChatGPT<00:07:18.560> and

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now<00:07:18.880> it's<00:07:19.040> primarily<00:07:20.080> Claude<00:07:21.040> and<00:07:21.640> Coda<00:07:22.360> and<00:07:22.919> I've<00:07:23.120> gone<00:07:23.280> through<00:07:23.440> that<00:07:23.720> same<00:07:24.200> experience<00:07:24.720> myself<00:07:25.280> where<00:07:25.480> I<00:07:25.560> find<00:07:25.800> myself<00:07:26.160> opening<00:07:26.480> Claude<00:07:26.919> every

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day<00:07:27.497> and<00:07:27.834> ChatGPT<00:07:28.171> every<00:07:28.509> once<00:07:28.846> in<00:07:29.183> a<00:07:29.520> while.

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Which<00:07:30.440> is<00:07:30.520> really<00:07:30.760> weird<00:07:31.120> and<00:07:31.280> I<00:07:31.320> don't,<00:07:31.880> so<00:07:32.040> I<00:07:32.080> still<00:07:32.320> use<00:07:32.520> both<00:07:32.800> but<00:07:32.919> it's<00:07:33.040> certainly<00:07:33.360> mostly<00:07:33.880> Claude.

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Why<00:07:35.360> do<00:07:35.480> you<00:07:35.560> think<00:07:35.760> that<00:07:35.960> is?<00:07:37.960> Um,<00:07:39.400> listen,<00:07:39.960> and<00:07:40.080> this<00:07:40.280> is<00:07:40.440> what's<00:07:40.840> like,<00:07:41.000> I<00:07:41.080> use<00:07:41.280> Grok<00:07:41.800> in<00:07:41.920> my<00:07:42.080> car.

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I'm<00:07:56.920> communicating<00:07:57.640> all<00:07:57.760> day<00:07:57.880> long,<00:07:58.240> and<00:07:58.360> I<00:07:58.440> think<00:07:58.760> Claude,<00:07:59.520> I've<00:07:59.680> tuned<00:08:00.080> Claude<00:08:00.440> in<00:08:00.520> a<00:08:00.600> way<00:08:00.760> that<00:08:00.920> does<00:08:01.080> just<00:08:01.360> a<00:08:01.400> much<00:08:01.720> better<00:08:01.960> job<00:08:02.200> of<00:08:02.320> getting<00:08:02.560> me<00:08:02.720> 80<00:08:02.960> to<00:08:03.080> 90%<00:08:03.800> there.

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I<00:08:18.200> think<00:08:18.400> the<00:08:18.520> reasoning<00:08:19.000> is,<00:08:19.280> is<00:08:19.480> much<00:08:19.720> better.

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From<00:08:20.280> a<00:08:20.320> data<00:08:20.600> analysis<00:08:21.160> perspective,<00:08:21.760> I've<00:08:21.919> found<00:08:22.200> it<00:08:22.320> to<00:08:22.400> be<00:08:22.960> more<00:08:23.200> reliable,<00:08:23.720> not<00:08:23.960> 100%.

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the<00:08:29.080> other<00:08:29.320> night,<00:08:29.760> and<00:08:30.640> when<00:08:30.760> I<00:08:30.840> woke<00:08:31.040> up<00:08:31.160> in<00:08:31.240> the<00:08:31.320> morning<00:08:31.680> and<00:08:31.800> I<00:08:32.159> looked<00:08:32.400> at<00:08:32.479> the<00:08:32.520> formula,<00:08:32.840> I<00:08:32.919> thought,<00:08:33.240> "Well,<00:08:33.640> Claude<00:08:33.919> got<00:08:34.120> it<00:08:34.240> wrong<00:08:34.479> on<00:08:34.599> this<00:08:34.800> one."

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doing,<00:08:37.479> or<00:08:37.960> you<00:08:38.039> can<00:08:38.200> get<00:08:38.320> in<00:08:38.400> trouble,<00:08:38.640> but<00:08:39.039> I<00:08:39.120> think<00:08:39.320> it<00:08:39.400> does<00:08:39.560> a<00:08:39.640> better<00:08:40.000> job,<00:08:41.120> um,<00:08:41.200> with<00:08:41.520> data<00:08:41.760> analysis,<00:08:43.000> uh,<00:08:43.159> and,<00:08:43.440> and<00:08:43.599> model<00:08:43.880> building<00:08:44.200> than<00:08:44.320> ChatGPT.

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Um,<00:08:46.440> so,<00:08:46.640> that's<00:08:46.880> been<00:08:47.040> my<00:08:47.160> experience<00:08:47.680> so<00:08:47.839> far,<00:08:48.200> but,<00:08:48.440> but<00:08:48.640> really<00:08:49.080> what<00:08:49.280> Coda<00:08:49.720> does<00:08:50.000> is<00:08:50.120> like,<00:08:50.800> again,<00:08:51.040> it<00:08:51.120> breaks<00:08:51.400> us<00:08:51.560> out<00:08:51.720> of<00:08:51.839> just<00:08:52.080> like<00:08:52.240> that<00:08:52.480> prompting<00:08:53.040> relationship,

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and<00:08:54.320> now<00:08:54.640> it's<00:08:55.320> organizing<00:08:55.880> files,<00:08:56.520> and<00:08:56.640> it's,<00:08:57.280> it<00:08:57.360> can<00:08:57.480> control<00:08:57.800> my<00:08:58.000> calendar,<00:08:58.640> and<00:08:58.760> it<00:08:58.839> can<00:08:59.400> identify,<00:09:00.520> you<00:09:00.600> know,<00:09:00.920> I<00:09:00.960> like,<00:09:01.200> I,<00:09:01.839> I<00:09:01.920> hooked<00:09:02.200> up

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my<00:09:02.440> text<00:09:02.800> messaging<00:09:03.400> to<00:09:03.920> prioritize<00:09:04.680> who<00:09:04.839> I<00:09:04.920> haven't<00:09:05.200> responded<00:09:05.800> to<00:09:06.000> yet<00:09:06.280> that<00:09:06.800> is<00:09:06.960> a<00:09:07.040> high<00:09:07.200> priority,<00:09:07.920> right?

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I<00:09:08.200> had<00:09:08.320> 642<00:09:09.440> unread<00:09:09.720> text<00:09:10.000> messages,<00:09:10.520> and<00:09:10.680> so<00:09:10.880> I,<00:09:11.360> so,<00:09:11.480> I've<00:09:11.560> been<00:09:11.960> piloting<00:09:12.440> a<00:09:12.520> lot<00:09:12.800> of<00:09:12.960> uses<00:09:13.520> that<00:09:13.720> are<00:09:14.200> like<00:09:14.400> breaking<00:09:14.839> beyond<00:09:15.280> just<00:09:15.600> asking<00:09:16.040> it<00:09:16.400> for

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its<00:09:16.800> opinion<00:09:17.280> or<00:09:17.400> to<00:09:17.520> help<00:09:17.760> review<00:09:18.080> some<00:09:18.280> content<00:09:19.440> or<00:09:19.520> to<00:09:19.640> analyze<00:09:19.960> some<00:09:20.080> data,<00:09:20.400> but<00:09:20.520> also<00:09:20.800> to<00:09:20.920> help<00:09:21.280> kind<00:09:21.400> of<00:09:21.520> automate<00:09:22.040> my<00:09:22.280> daily<00:09:22.880> kind<00:09:23.040> of<00:09:23.200> work<00:09:23.440> life.

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I,<00:09:27.108> I,<00:09:27.415> as<00:09:27.723> I<00:09:28.031> talk<00:09:28.338> to<00:09:28.646> people,<00:09:28.954> I<00:09:29.262> was<00:09:29.569> talk<00:09:29.877> talking<00:09:30.185> to<00:09:30.492> Pete<00:09:30.800> Larkin<00:09:31.108> the<00:09:31.415> other<00:09:31.723> day,<00:09:32.031> and<00:09:32.338> Chad<00:09:32.646> Jardine,<00:09:32.954> and<00:09:33.262> some<00:09:33.569> of<00:09:33.877> these<00:09:34.185> other<00:09:34.492> CMOs<00:09:34.800> that

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So,<00:09:43.600> tell<00:09:43.800> us<00:09:43.960> what<00:09:44.160> a<00:09:44.280> typical<00:09:44.760> day<00:09:44.920> looks<00:09:45.200> like<00:09:45.400> for<00:09:45.560> you.

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Um,<00:09:47.440> I've<00:09:47.720> had,<00:09:48.160> so<00:09:48.400> as<00:09:48.600> much<00:09:48.840> as<00:09:48.960> I<00:09:49.000> love<00:09:49.280> automation<00:09:49.880> and<00:09:50.000> AI,<00:09:50.480> I<00:09:50.600> have<00:09:50.760> had<00:09:50.960> this,<00:09:51.560> the<00:09:51.760> same,<00:09:52.560> um,<00:09:52.640> executive<00:09:53.080> assistant<00:09:53.480> for<00:09:54.120> I<00:09:54.240> think<00:09:54.400> it's<00:09:54.480> been<00:09:54.640> 16<00:09:55.360> or

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17<00:09:55.960> years<00:09:56.240> now<00:09:56.840> across<00:09:57.240> four<00:09:57.400> different<00:09:57.720> companies.

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Um,<00:10:25.600> we<00:10:25.680> have<00:10:26.120> 14,000<00:10:26.960> clients.

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you're<00:10:43.600> not<00:10:43.839> just<00:10:43.960> being<00:10:44.480> pulled<00:10:44.760> in<00:10:44.880> every<00:10:45.120> single<00:10:45.360> direction.

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game-time<00:10:57.800> decisions<00:10:58.920> where<00:10:59.320> I'll<00:10:59.440> be<00:10:59.560> like,<00:10:59.839> "Hey,<00:11:00.080> I<00:11:00.280> really<00:11:00.560> want<00:11:00.720> to<00:11:00.760> meet<00:11:00.920> with<00:11:01.040> this<00:11:01.200> person.

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done.<00:11:20.560> I<00:11:20.680> now<00:11:21.320> introduce<00:11:21.839> some<00:11:22.160> AI<00:11:22.560> into<00:11:22.800> the<00:11:22.920> next<00:11:23.200> part<00:11:23.400> of<00:11:23.480> my<00:11:23.640> day.

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Um,<00:11:27.960> we<00:11:28.160> use<00:11:28.400> ClickUp,<00:11:29.560> um,<00:11:29.680> as<00:11:29.880> our<00:11:30.000> our<00:11:30.480> tools.

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So,<00:11:31.000> we're<00:11:31.120> using<00:11:31.360> a<00:11:31.400> lot<00:11:31.560> of<00:11:31.640> ClickUp<00:11:32.000> agents.<00:11:32.520> So,<00:11:32.640> I<00:11:32.680> have<00:11:32.880> a<00:11:33.280> a<00:11:33.360> briefing<00:11:33.760> document<00:11:34.200> that<00:11:34.320> shows<00:11:34.720> all<00:11:34.840> the<00:11:34.960> priorities<00:11:35.400> across<00:11:35.760> the<00:11:35.880> entire<00:11:36.280> team.

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So,<00:11:37.240> I<00:11:37.520> I<00:11:37.600> just<00:11:37.760> have<00:11:37.920> a<00:11:37.960> flash<00:11:38.480> report<00:11:38.880> that<00:11:39.000> I<00:11:39.080> can<00:11:39.240> basically<00:11:39.640> look<00:11:40.480> look<00:11:40.680> at<00:11:40.800> what's<00:11:41.160> been<00:11:41.360> done,<00:11:41.720> what's<00:11:41.960> behind,<00:11:42.600> and<00:11:43.120> sometimes<00:11:43.560> I<00:11:43.640> can<00:11:43.800> reprioritize<00:11:44.840> if<00:11:45.000> I<00:11:45.080> feel

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like<00:11:45.480> there's<00:11:45.840> something<00:11:46.160> not<00:11:46.400> getting<00:11:46.640> done.<00:11:47.400> And<00:11:47.480> then<00:11:47.600> I<00:11:47.680> get<00:11:47.840> into<00:11:48.120> a<00:11:48.200> marathon<00:11:48.600> of<00:11:48.680> meetings.

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I<00:11:49.240> wish<00:11:49.480> I<00:11:49.520> could<00:11:49.760> I<00:11:49.800> wish<00:11:50.040> I<00:11:50.080> had<00:11:50.240> a<00:11:50.320> different<00:11:50.720> way<00:11:50.840> to<00:11:50.960> manage<00:11:51.320> my<00:11:51.440> day,<00:11:51.720> but<00:11:52.280> I<00:11:52.360> spend<00:11:52.640> a<00:11:52.680> lot<00:11:52.920> of<00:11:53.040> time<00:11:53.640> talking.

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I<00:11:55.160> know<00:11:55.320> that's<00:11:55.600> actually<00:11:55.920> a<00:11:56.120> interesting<00:11:57.440> product<00:11:57.920> idea.

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How<00:11:58.600> do<00:11:58.760> you<00:12:00.240> How<00:12:00.400> do<00:12:00.480> you<00:12:00.600> eliminate<00:12:01.120> meetings<00:12:01.960> or<00:12:02.080> the<00:12:02.240> need<00:12:02.560> for<00:12:02.720> meetings<00:12:03.440> as<00:12:03.600> much<00:12:03.840> as<00:12:03.960> you<00:12:04.080> possibly<00:12:04.440> can?

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You<00:12:04.800> know,<00:12:04.960> I'm<00:12:05.080> like,<00:12:06.040> Yeah,<00:12:06.200> that'll<00:12:06.480> be<00:12:06.640> like<00:12:06.840> the<00:12:06.960> one<00:12:07.320> that's<00:12:07.520> a<00:12:07.600> billion-dollar<00:12:08.320> idea.

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If<00:12:08.760> somebody<00:12:09.040> can<00:12:09.200> figure<00:12:09.440> that<00:12:09.600> like<00:12:09.800> some<00:12:10.200> some<00:12:10.360> sort<00:12:10.600> of<00:12:10.680> way<00:12:10.800> for<00:12:11.080> AI<00:12:11.520> to<00:12:11.680> eliminate<00:12:12.080> I<00:12:12.120> don't<00:12:12.280> know<00:12:12.360> what<00:12:12.480> that<00:12:12.640> is.

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Cuz<00:12:13.440> you<00:12:13.520> still<00:12:13.760> need<00:12:14.000> the<00:12:14.080> human<00:12:14.400> interaction,<00:12:14.920> right?

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Like<00:12:15.280> even<00:12:15.480> with<00:12:15.600> your<00:12:15.760> assistant,<00:12:16.200> I<00:12:16.240> imagine<00:12:16.680> your<00:12:16.800> assistant<00:12:17.240> is<00:12:17.360> using<00:12:17.720> AI,<00:12:18.560> and<00:12:18.680> it<00:12:18.800> only<00:12:19.040> enables<00:12:19.520> her<00:12:20.120> and<00:12:20.400> makes<00:12:20.640> her<00:12:20.840> even<00:12:21.080> better.

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Like<00:12:21.920> this<00:12:22.080> whole<00:12:22.240> idea<00:12:22.560> that<00:12:22.760> like<00:12:23.400> you're<00:12:23.520> just<00:12:23.680> going<00:12:23.800> to<00:12:23.840> have<00:12:23.920> AI<00:12:24.200> assistants.

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Yeah,<00:12:25.880> you<00:12:26.040> can,<00:12:26.640> but<00:12:26.800> also<00:12:27.080> like<00:12:27.960> if<00:12:28.160> you<00:12:28.200> have<00:12:28.320> a<00:12:28.400> human<00:12:28.760> there,<00:12:28.960> too,<00:12:29.400> you're<00:12:29.640> a<00:12:29.680> hundred<00:12:30.000> times<00:12:30.280> more<00:12:30.440> efficient<00:12:30.800> rather<00:12:31.040> than<00:12:31.160> ten<00:12:31.360> times.

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That's<00:12:32.600> right.<00:12:33.520> That's<00:12:34.000> that's<00:12:34.240> absolutely<00:12:34.600> right.

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There's<00:12:34.920> context.<00:12:36.320> I<00:12:36.360> mean,<00:12:36.560> Michelle<00:12:37.400> maybe<00:12:37.680> Claude<00:12:37.960> will<00:12:38.120> send<00:12:38.360> it<00:12:38.480> someday<00:12:38.839> know<00:12:39.000> me<00:12:39.120> as<00:12:39.240> well<00:12:39.360> as<00:12:39.440> Michelle<00:12:39.760> does,<00:12:40.040> but<00:12:40.200> like<00:12:40.760> Michelle<00:12:41.480> knows<00:12:41.680> all<00:12:41.880> of<00:12:41.960> my<00:12:42.120> particularities

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and<00:12:43.280> what<00:12:44.000> where<00:12:44.200> I<00:12:44.240> like<00:12:44.520> to<00:12:44.680> eat,<00:12:45.120> how<00:12:45.360> to<00:12:45.600> structure<00:12:46.040> the<00:12:46.160> day,<00:12:46.440> and<00:12:46.600> where<00:12:46.760> I<00:12:46.839> need<00:12:47.080> time<00:12:47.320> blocks<00:12:47.640> and<00:12:47.760> breaks.

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And<00:12:48.640> that<00:12:48.800> just<00:12:49.000> has<00:12:49.120> come<00:12:49.280> with<00:12:49.440> a<00:12:49.480> lot<00:12:49.680> of<00:12:49.760> time<00:12:50.080> in<00:12:50.160> the<00:12:50.240> trenches<00:12:50.720> together.

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So,<00:12:51.360> she's<00:12:51.600> been<00:12:52.040> she's<00:12:52.280> been<00:12:52.440> phenomenal.<00:12:53.640> But<00:12:54.040> eliminating<00:12:54.560> meetings<00:12:55.080> if<00:12:55.720> I<00:12:55.800> do<00:12:56.120> think<00:12:56.480> that<00:12:57.240> that<00:12:58.280> there<00:12:58.480> is<00:12:59.200> there

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are<00:12:59.440> some<00:13:00.000> some<00:13:00.120> things<00:13:00.480> that<00:13:00.640> I've<00:13:00.760> implemented.<00:13:02.320> I've<00:13:02.560> just<00:13:03.080> opted<00:13:03.440> out<00:13:03.560> of<00:13:03.640> a<00:13:03.680> lot<00:13:03.920> of<00:13:04.000> meetings.

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All<00:13:04.480> right,<00:13:04.760> I've<00:13:04.960> I've<00:13:05.240> added<00:13:05.760> optional<00:13:06.280> to<00:13:06.400> a<00:13:06.440> lot<00:13:06.640> of<00:13:06.720> meetings,<00:13:07.120> and<00:13:07.240> I<00:13:07.280> tried<00:13:07.640> to<00:13:08.600> go<00:13:08.760> back<00:13:09.040> and<00:13:09.120> leave<00:13:09.280> obviously<00:13:09.640> AI<00:13:09.880> note-takers<00:13:10.680> are<00:13:10.839> a<00:13:10.920> huge<00:13:11.800> you<00:13:11.880> know,<00:13:11.960> give

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us<00:13:12.200> a<00:13:12.280> huge<00:13:12.480> advantage<00:13:12.920> cuz<00:13:13.080> I<00:13:13.160> can<00:13:13.320> still<00:13:13.560> review<00:13:14.480> and<00:13:14.640> what<00:13:14.800> was<00:13:14.960> discussed<00:13:15.600> and<00:13:15.800> ensure<00:13:16.200> that<00:13:16.360> we're<00:13:16.480> all<00:13:16.640> staying<00:13:17.000> aligned.

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Last<00:13:18.320> week<00:13:18.640> I<00:13:18.760> had<00:13:19.080> Claude<00:13:19.520> go<00:13:19.720> through<00:13:20.200> I<00:13:20.440> connected<00:13:20.920> up<00:13:21.040> to<00:13:21.160> Fireflies<00:13:22.400> and<00:13:22.640> reviewed<00:13:23.080> all<00:13:23.360> of<00:13:23.839> my<00:13:24.040> notes<00:13:24.520> for<00:13:24.600> the<00:13:24.720> entire<00:13:25.160> week<00:13:25.520> and<00:13:25.720> identified<00:13:26.800> everything

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I<00:13:27.320> committed<00:13:27.840> to<00:13:27.960> do<00:13:28.280> in<00:13:28.360> those<00:13:28.600> meetings.<00:13:29.480> And<00:13:29.640> the<00:13:29.720> scary<00:13:30.200> part,<00:13:30.520> Clint,<00:13:30.760> was<00:13:31.040> is<00:13:31.160> there<00:13:31.320> was<00:13:31.480> 65<00:13:32.360> things<00:13:33.400> that<00:13:33.560> I<00:13:33.600> had<00:13:33.720> committed<00:13:34.120> to<00:13:34.240> do<00:13:34.720> just<00:13:34.920> in<00:13:35.000> the<00:13:35.120> conversation

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of<00:13:35.920> all<00:13:36.040> these<00:13:36.240> meetings<00:13:37.120> over<00:13:37.360> a<00:13:37.440> 5-day<00:13:37.840> period.

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65<00:13:39.520> more<00:13:39.720> things<00:13:40.200> that<00:13:40.320> were<00:13:40.440> not<00:13:40.680> already<00:13:41.040> on<00:13:41.200> my<00:13:41.360> calendar.

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And<00:13:42.026> so<00:13:42.292> then<00:13:42.559> I<00:13:42.825> had<00:13:43.091> to<00:13:43.357> then<00:13:43.623> I<00:13:43.890> asked,<00:13:44.156> well,<00:13:44.422> create<00:13:44.688> a,<00:13:44.954> you<00:13:45.221> know,<00:13:45.487> a<00:13:45.753> plan<00:13:46.019> like<00:13:46.286> prior<00:13:46.552> help<00:13:46.818> me<00:13:47.084> prioritize<00:13:47.350> this<00:13:47.617> and<00:13:47.883> create<00:13:48.149> a<00:13:48.415> ClickUp,<00:13:48.681> you<00:13:48.948> know,<00:13:49.214> a<00:13:49.480> Click

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Up,<00:13:50.018> you<00:13:50.237> know,<00:13:50.455> project<00:13:50.673> plan<00:13:50.892> and<00:13:51.110> task<00:13:51.328> list<00:13:51.547> that<00:13:51.765> I<00:13:51.983> could<00:13:52.202> then<00:13:52.420> upload<00:13:52.638> into<00:13:52.857> ClickUp<00:13:53.075> and<00:13:53.293> to<00:13:53.512> kind<00:13:53.730> of<00:13:53.948> triage<00:13:54.167> it<00:13:54.385> a<00:13:54.603> little<00:13:54.822> bit<00:13:55.040> more.

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Um,<00:13:56.680> but<00:13:56.840> I<00:13:56.920> thought<00:13:57.280> the<00:13:57.400> way<00:13:57.600> to<00:13:58.520> the<00:13:58.640> way<00:13:58.800> to<00:13:58.960> really<00:13:59.520> take<00:13:59.760> a<00:13:59.800> hold<00:13:59.960> of<00:14:00.040> my<00:14:00.160> time<00:14:00.400> is<00:14:00.640> A<00:14:00.760> to<00:14:01.280> commit<00:14:01.600> to<00:14:01.680> less,<00:14:02.480> to<00:14:02.560> delegate<00:14:03.040> more.

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These<00:14:03.440> are<00:14:03.560> obvious<00:14:03.920> things,<00:14:04.720> but<00:14:05.200> but<00:14:05.360> also<00:14:05.920> to<00:14:06.320> make<00:14:06.560> sure<00:14:06.800> that<00:14:06.960> those<00:14:07.200> meetings<00:14:07.640> is<00:14:07.720> a<00:14:07.760> lot<00:14:08.000> of<00:14:08.080> work<00:14:08.240> that<00:14:08.360> can<00:14:08.480> be<00:14:08.560> done<00:14:08.800> asynchronously<00:14:09.640> that<00:14:10.160> doesn't<00:14:10.440> require

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me<00:14:10.960> to<00:14:11.160> be<00:14:11.360> on<00:14:11.480> a<00:14:11.520> 30-minute<00:14:12.240> or<00:14:12.720> hour-long<00:14:13.160> meeting.

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And<00:14:13.680> to<00:14:13.760> the<00:14:13.840> extent<00:14:14.240> that<00:14:14.360> we<00:14:14.480> can<00:14:14.680> move<00:14:14.920> that<00:14:15.280> to<00:14:15.600> to<00:14:15.720> Slack<00:14:16.160> or<00:14:16.240> coordinate<00:14:16.720> that<00:14:16.920> in<00:14:17.000> the<00:14:17.120> office,<00:14:18.040> it's<00:14:18.240> far<00:14:18.440> better.

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But<00:14:19.400> the<00:14:19.560> these<00:14:19.800> are<00:14:19.880> all<00:14:20.080> ideals,<00:14:20.560> Clint,<00:14:20.960> like<00:14:21.680> my<00:14:21.840> calendar<00:14:22.240> still<00:14:23.000> is<00:14:23.240> often<00:14:23.600> times<00:14:23.880> back-to-back.

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But<00:14:25.400> Michelle's<00:14:25.840> great<00:14:26.040> at<00:14:26.200> time<00:14:26.480> blocking,<00:14:27.000> so<00:14:27.400> I'm<00:14:27.760> I'm<00:14:28.000> a<00:14:28.080> religious<00:14:28.680> time<00:14:28.920> blocker<00:14:29.360> in<00:14:29.440> terms<00:14:29.680> of<00:14:29.800> like<00:14:30.040> non-negotiable<00:14:30.880> time,<00:14:31.960> um,<00:14:32.040> where<00:14:32.520> there's<00:14:33.080> blocks

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throughout<00:14:34.040> my<00:14:34.200> week<00:14:34.520> that<00:14:34.680> I<00:14:34.760> can<00:14:34.960> just<00:14:35.680> focus<00:14:36.200> and<00:14:36.320> get<00:14:36.520> some<00:14:36.680> work<00:14:36.920> done.

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Yeah,<00:14:38.160> at<00:14:38.200> some<00:14:38.440> point<00:14:38.680> at<00:14:38.760> some<00:14:38.920> point<00:14:39.080> you<00:14:39.120> have<00:14:39.200> to<00:14:39.320> work.<00:14:39.560> You<00:14:39.880> You<00:14:39.960> mentioned<00:14:40.240> ClickUp.

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We<00:14:40.640> use<00:14:40.880> ClickUp,<00:14:41.240> too.<00:14:42.600> And<00:14:42.760> I<00:14:42.800> think<00:14:43.000> it's<00:14:43.120> a<00:14:43.160> great<00:14:44.080> uh<00:14:44.160> platform.

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How<00:14:45.240> long<00:14:45.480> until<00:14:45.680> we<00:14:45.800> don't<00:14:45.960> even<00:14:46.160> need<00:14:46.480> like<00:14:46.720> these<00:14:47.520> Has<00:14:47.720> it<00:14:47.800> has<00:14:47.920> it<00:14:48.000> like<00:14:48.160> eliminated<00:14:49.480> so<00:14:49.760> far<00:14:50.240> any<00:14:50.720> need<00:14:51.120> for<00:14:51.320> SaaS<00:14:51.680> products<00:14:52.360> or<00:14:52.440> anything<00:14:52.760> like<00:14:52.920> that?

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Has<00:14:53.240> it<00:14:53.360> eliminated<00:14:53.960> any<00:14:54.120> tech<00:14:54.400> for<00:14:54.560> you<00:14:54.839> any<00:14:55.000> tech<00:14:55.240> needs?

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Well,<00:14:56.560> it<00:14:56.839> it's<00:14:57.080> such<00:14:57.280> a<00:14:57.320> great<00:14:57.440> question<00:14:57.680> cuz<00:14:57.760> I<00:14:57.839> have<00:14:57.920> these<00:14:58.160> AI<00:14:58.440> agents<00:14:58.800> over<00:14:58.960> here<00:14:59.120> in<00:14:59.200> ClickUp.

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And<00:14:59.839> then<00:14:59.960> I'm<00:15:00.360> building<00:15:01.280> a<00:15:01.520> I'll<00:15:01.960> I'll<00:15:02.160> use<00:15:02.400> agents<00:15:02.800> loosely,<00:15:03.480> right?

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Building<00:15:04.440> some<00:15:04.640> automation<00:15:05.160> and<00:15:05.280> tools<00:15:05.560> and<00:15:05.680> projects<00:15:06.200> over<00:15:06.400> here<00:15:06.560> in<00:15:06.680> Claude<00:15:07.040> and<00:15:07.160> Co-work.

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And<00:15:08.839> it<00:15:09.000> it<00:15:09.400> it's<00:15:09.600> like,<00:15:09.800> well,<00:15:10.320> which<00:15:10.560> tool<00:15:10.800> does<00:15:11.040> what<00:15:11.320> for<00:15:11.440> me,<00:15:12.040> right?

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And<00:15:12.480> today<00:15:13.000> Claude<00:15:13.680> is<00:15:14.320> what<00:15:14.520> I<00:15:14.680> use.

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And<00:15:15.280> it's<00:15:15.400> largely<00:15:15.839> governing<00:15:16.680> my<00:15:16.880> life<00:15:17.160> and<00:15:17.280> prioritization<00:15:18.240> both<00:15:18.800> personal<00:15:19.240> and<00:15:19.360> professional.

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But<00:15:21.160> like<00:15:21.440> when<00:15:21.600> it<00:15:21.680> comes<00:15:21.880> to<00:15:22.040> team<00:15:22.360> management<00:15:23.240> and<00:15:23.400> coordinating<00:15:24.000> all<00:15:24.120> the<00:15:24.240> activities<00:15:24.800> and<00:15:24.920> projects<00:15:25.400> and<00:15:25.520> deadlines<00:15:25.960> and<00:15:26.040> dependencies,<00:15:27.200> ClickUp<00:15:27.600> still<00:15:27.920> is<00:15:28.080> the

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better<00:15:28.400> tool<00:15:28.640> for<00:15:28.800> that.<00:15:29.200> But,<00:15:29.800> at<00:15:29.960> some<00:15:30.200> point,<00:15:30.560> right?

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We're<00:15:31.840> not<00:15:32.000> going<00:15:32.120> to<00:15:32.160> need,<00:15:32.800> you<00:15:32.880> know,<00:15:32.960> two<00:15:33.120> or<00:15:33.200> three<00:15:33.400> different<00:15:33.720> SaaS<00:15:34.000> products.

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I<00:15:34.480> mean,<00:15:34.840> I<00:15:34.920> think<00:15:35.080> about<00:15:35.560> I<00:15:35.600> mean,<00:15:35.680> ClickUp<00:15:36.000> has<00:15:36.160> a<00:15:36.200> note-taker.

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I'm<00:15:36.760> still<00:15:37.000> using<00:15:37.280> Fireflies,<00:15:38.520> right?

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Gemini<00:15:39.200> has<00:15:39.400> a<00:15:39.440> note-taker.<00:15:39.880> I'm<00:15:39.960> in<00:15:40.040> the<00:15:40.280> Google<00:15:40.480> Workspace.

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So,<00:15:41.440> they're<00:15:41.640> still<00:15:42.160> We're<00:15:42.280> still<00:15:42.480> kind<00:15:42.640> of<00:15:42.720> littered<00:15:43.240> with<00:15:43.720> all<00:15:43.920> of<00:15:44.000> these<00:15:44.200> SaaS<00:15:44.520> products<00:15:45.080> that<00:15:45.760> sometimes<00:15:46.240> talk<00:15:46.480> to<00:15:46.560> one<00:15:46.720> another,<00:15:47.200> but<00:15:47.480> oftentimes<00:15:48.000> don't<00:15:48.200> do<00:15:48.320> that

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well.<00:15:48.720> We're<00:15:48.840> a<00:15:48.920> HubSpot<00:15:49.400> shop<00:15:49.680> as<00:15:49.800> well.<00:15:50.120> So,<00:15:50.520> the<00:15:50.600> three<00:15:50.800> tools<00:15:51.040> I<00:15:51.120> use<00:15:51.320> every<00:15:51.520> day<00:15:51.680> are<00:15:51.800> ClickUp,<00:15:52.520> Claude,<00:15:53.160> and<00:15:53.280> HubSpot.

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And<00:15:54.280> like<00:15:55.440> they're<00:15:55.640> they're<00:15:55.800> kind<00:15:56.040> of<00:15:56.120> working<00:15:56.400> together.

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I've<00:15:56.840> hooked<00:15:57.080> HubSpot<00:15:57.600> up<00:15:58.040> to<00:15:58.160> ChatGPT<00:15:58.920> and<00:15:59.240> and<00:15:59.400> Claude.

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So,<00:16:00.640> they're<00:16:00.840> talking,<00:16:01.320> and<00:16:01.440> I<00:16:01.520> can<00:16:01.680> query<00:16:02.200> HubSpot<00:16:02.760> data,<00:16:03.120> but<00:16:03.560> HubSpot<00:16:04.000> has<00:16:04.200> its<00:16:04.400> own<00:16:04.680> AI<00:16:04.920> assistant.

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So,<00:16:07.120> like<00:16:07.680> when<00:16:07.840> does<00:16:08.000> it<00:16:08.120> come<00:16:08.360> together,<00:16:09.040> Clint?

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[gasps]<00:16:10.920> I<00:16:11.040> know,<00:16:11.280> it's<00:16:11.440> it's<00:16:11.680> really<00:16:12.000> interesting.<00:16:12.480> Like<00:16:12.800> I<00:16:12.920> I<00:16:13.040> don't<00:16:13.240> even<00:16:13.440> know<00:16:13.640> what<00:16:13.960> What<00:16:14.080> do<00:16:14.160> you<00:16:14.240> think<00:16:14.480> it<00:16:14.920> this<00:16:15.160> world<00:16:15.440> looks<00:16:15.640> like<00:16:15.840> in<00:16:15.960> 6<00:16:16.200> months?

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I<00:16:16.560> don't<00:16:16.720> even<00:16:16.920> know.<00:16:19.000> I<00:16:19.040> don't<00:16:19.240> either.

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I<00:16:19.800> just<00:16:20.600> I<00:16:20.680> just<00:16:20.840> know<00:16:20.960> that<00:16:21.280> in<00:16:21.440> 6<00:16:21.760> months<00:16:22.120> I'm<00:16:22.240> not<00:16:22.400> going<00:16:22.520> to<00:16:22.600> be<00:16:22.680> talking<00:16:23.000> about<00:16:23.240> Claude.

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We'll<00:16:23.760> see.<00:16:24.400> Yeah,<00:16:24.720> I<00:16:24.839> think<00:16:25.080> you're<00:16:25.200> right.

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Yeah,<00:16:25.880> I<00:16:25.960> think<00:16:26.240> I<00:16:26.360> think<00:16:26.680> I<00:16:26.760> think<00:16:27.000> you're<00:16:27.080> exactly<00:16:27.440> right.

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And<00:16:28.280> then<00:16:28.440> you've<00:16:28.560> got<00:16:28.800> like<00:16:29.560> obviously<00:16:30.000> you're<00:16:30.120> in<00:16:30.240> Utah,<00:16:30.720> and<00:16:30.920> Utah<00:16:31.440> is<00:16:32.560> um<00:16:33.320> primarily<00:16:33.800> a<00:16:33.880> SaaS<00:16:35.000> kind<00:16:35.240> of<00:16:35.480> tech<00:16:35.720> hub.

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It's<00:16:36.120> not<00:16:36.280> It's<00:16:36.440> not<00:16:36.680> only,<00:16:37.240> but<00:16:37.520> that's<00:16:37.760> probably<00:16:38.040> where<00:16:38.760> our<00:16:38.920> biggest<00:16:39.320> companies<00:16:39.800> and<00:16:39.920> biggest<00:16:40.280> wins<00:16:40.520> have<00:16:40.640> come<00:16:40.839> out<00:16:40.960> of<00:16:41.040> that<00:16:41.240> space.

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And<00:16:42.560> now<00:16:42.880> we're<00:16:43.000> going<00:16:43.240> through<00:16:43.360> this<00:16:43.560> interesting<00:16:44.080> period<00:16:44.520> in<00:16:44.640> SaaS<00:16:45.160> where<00:16:45.320> it<00:16:45.440> seems<00:16:45.760> like<00:16:46.680> I<00:16:46.720> mean,<00:16:46.839> you're<00:16:46.960> seeing<00:16:47.160> what's<00:16:47.320> happening<00:16:47.640> to<00:16:47.760> public<00:16:48.040> SaaS<00:16:48.320> companies

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and<00:16:49.240> this<00:16:49.400> you<00:16:49.480> know,<00:16:49.640> stock<00:16:50.040> market<00:16:50.360> kind<00:16:50.520> of<00:16:50.600> going<00:16:50.839> down<00:16:51.080> there.

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And<00:16:52.440> it<00:16:52.520> does<00:16:52.720> seem<00:16:52.960> like,<00:16:53.480> you<00:16:53.600> know,<00:16:53.720> things<00:16:54.000> like<00:16:54.200> HubSpot<00:16:54.839> and<00:16:54.960> ClickUp,<00:16:55.360> I<00:16:55.400> mean,<00:16:55.560> those<00:16:55.680> things<00:16:55.880> are<00:16:55.960> so<00:16:56.160> entrenched<00:16:56.640> that<00:16:56.760> I'm<00:16:56.880> not<00:16:57.200> particularly<00:16:57.640> HubSpot<00:16:58.440> I'm

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not<00:16:58.640> entirely<00:16:59.160> sure<00:16:59.320> why<00:16:59.480> that's<00:16:59.680> down<00:17:00.000> so<00:17:00.120> much.

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That's<00:17:00.520> down<00:17:00.800> a<00:17:00.839> ton<00:17:01.560> in<00:17:01.720> publicly.<00:17:02.160> And<00:17:02.240> I'm<00:17:02.320> like,<00:17:02.839> I<00:17:02.880> don't<00:17:03.000> think<00:17:03.160> that's<00:17:03.360> going<00:17:03.600> away.

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That<00:17:04.160> might<00:17:04.280> be<00:17:04.400> a<00:17:04.720> Not<00:17:04.959> financial<00:17:05.360> advice<00:17:05.680> to<00:17:05.760> those<00:17:05.920> listening,<00:17:06.240> but<00:17:06.640> might<00:17:06.760> be<00:17:06.880> a<00:17:06.920> good<00:17:07.120> time<00:17:07.319> to<00:17:07.720> you<00:17:07.839> know,<00:17:08.079> buy<00:17:08.439> some<00:17:08.720> some<00:17:09.000> of<00:17:09.040> these<00:17:09.280> things.

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Like<00:17:10.400> I<00:17:10.439> don't<00:17:10.600> know<00:17:10.680> if<00:17:10.800> the<00:17:10.920> SaaS<00:17:11.240> thing<00:17:11.600> SaaS<00:17:11.920> is<00:17:12.040> dead<00:17:12.360> thing<00:17:12.560> is<00:17:12.720> overblown<00:17:13.439> or<00:17:13.680> what's<00:17:13.880> going<00:17:14.120> on.

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Yeah.<00:17:16.240> I<00:17:16.319> mean,<00:17:16.480> listen,<00:17:17.120> from<00:17:17.280> my<00:17:17.400> perspective<00:17:18.120> as<00:17:18.400> a<00:17:18.439> consultant,<00:17:19.120> right?

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As<00:17:19.400> we<00:17:19.600> like<00:17:19.880> embed<00:17:20.199> ourselves<00:17:20.640> in<00:17:20.760> these<00:17:21.040> companies<00:17:21.520> across<00:17:21.800> the<00:17:21.920> country,<00:17:22.959> um<00:17:23.600> these<00:17:23.760> companies<00:17:25.160> there<00:17:25.360> are<00:17:25.439> some<00:17:25.680> forward-thinking<00:17:26.240> companies,<00:17:26.600> no<00:17:26.760> doubt.

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But,<00:17:27.839> um<00:17:28.160> we're<00:17:28.280> still<00:17:28.560> doing,<00:17:29.800> you<00:17:29.920> know,<00:17:30.200> companies'<00:17:30.640> first<00:17:30.920> HubSpot<00:17:31.400> implementations,<00:17:31.960> their<00:17:32.080> first<00:17:32.360> CRM<00:17:32.760> implementations.

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And<00:17:34.520> so,<00:17:35.160> I<00:17:35.320> I<00:17:35.360> think<00:17:35.920> that<00:17:36.320> the<00:17:36.440> reality<00:17:37.040> is<00:17:37.360> is<00:17:37.520> like<00:17:38.560> there<00:17:38.880> is<00:17:39.600> technology<00:17:40.080> is<00:17:40.160> moving<00:17:40.440> at<00:17:40.600> such<00:17:40.880> a<00:17:40.960> rate<00:17:41.440> that<00:17:41.600> there's<00:17:41.760> just<00:17:42.000> so<00:17:42.080> much<00:17:42.280> uncertainty<00:17:43.440> about

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where<00:17:44.720> these<00:17:45.000> SaaS<00:17:45.360> platforms<00:17:46.600> land<00:17:47.240> in<00:17:47.360> the<00:17:47.440> long<00:17:47.760> term.

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And<00:17:49.040> but<00:17:49.280> from<00:17:49.480> a<00:17:49.560> practical<00:17:50.200> perspective,<00:17:50.920> like<00:17:52.520> every<00:17:53.040> I<00:17:53.080> I<00:17:53.360> I<00:17:53.400> can't<00:17:53.680> tell<00:17:53.840> you<00:17:53.920> HubSpot<00:17:54.320> is<00:17:54.560> eating<00:17:55.040> the<00:17:55.160> market<00:17:55.720> when<00:17:55.840> it<00:17:55.920> comes<00:17:56.120> to<00:17:56.200> SMBs,<00:17:57.160> right?

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Yeah.<00:17:57.720> People<00:17:57.920> are<00:17:58.520> they're<00:17:58.680> displacing<00:18:00.040> older<00:18:00.440> enterprise<00:18:01.680> CRMs,<00:18:02.880> and<00:18:03.400> um<00:18:03.560> they're<00:18:03.720> even<00:18:03.880> moving<00:18:04.280> upmarket<00:18:04.880> a<00:18:04.920> bit<00:18:05.200> into<00:18:05.600> little

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more<00:18:06.000> enterprise,<00:18:06.440> although<00:18:06.640> Salesforce<00:18:07.320> probably<00:18:07.680> owns<00:18:07.880> that<00:18:08.120> even.

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But,<00:18:09.200> you<00:18:09.280> know,<00:18:09.400> I've<00:18:09.960> turned<00:18:10.240> off<00:18:10.400> Dynamics<00:18:11.000> for<00:18:11.160> clients,<00:18:12.160> you<00:18:12.280> know,<00:18:12.480> because<00:18:12.800> HubSpot<00:18:13.200> was<00:18:13.320> just<00:18:13.520> a<00:18:13.560> better<00:18:13.800> tool.

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It's<00:18:14.320> become<00:18:15.320> ubiquitous<00:18:16.000> to<00:18:16.160> just<00:18:16.440> kind<00:18:16.600> of<00:18:17.160> CRM,<00:18:17.960> sales<00:18:18.280> and<00:18:18.360> marketing<00:18:18.800> management<00:18:19.600> for<00:18:20.400> small<00:18:20.920> and<00:18:21.320> mid-size<00:18:21.920> and<00:18:22.000> even<00:18:22.200> scaling

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companies.<00:18:23.400> It's<00:18:23.480> not<00:18:23.600> the<00:18:23.680> only<00:18:23.840> solution.<00:18:24.200> I've<00:18:24.320> used<00:18:24.520> Salesforce<00:18:25.040> as<00:18:25.200> well.

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I'll<00:18:25.800> probably<00:18:26.000> get<00:18:26.120> a<00:18:26.160> call<00:18:26.440> from<00:18:26.680> a<00:18:26.720> Salesforce<00:18:27.280> rep<00:18:27.520> after<00:18:27.760> this<00:18:27.920> podcast,<00:18:28.440> but<00:18:29.160> um<00:18:29.720> so,<00:18:29.840> I<00:18:29.920> think<00:18:30.120> there's<00:18:30.640> there's<00:18:30.880> a<00:18:31.160> a<00:18:31.280> lot<00:18:31.720> of<00:18:31.840> room<00:18:32.040> for<00:18:32.160> those<00:18:32.360> companies<00:18:32.760> to

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continue<00:18:33.320> to<00:18:33.920> to<00:18:34.080> grow<00:18:34.320> and<00:18:34.440> gain<00:18:34.680> share,<00:18:35.000> but<00:18:35.280> it<00:18:35.400> will<00:18:35.560> really<00:18:35.800> depend<00:18:36.160> on<00:18:36.280> how<00:18:36.480> they're<00:18:36.840> integrating<00:18:37.960> the<00:18:38.080> latest<00:18:38.400> technology.

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And<00:18:39.360> now<00:18:39.640> I<00:18:39.760> almost<00:18:40.080> log<00:18:40.360> into<00:18:40.600> platforms<00:18:41.120> that<00:18:41.280> don't<00:18:41.520> have<00:18:41.720> any<00:18:42.080> AI<00:18:42.320> enablement,<00:18:42.840> and<00:18:42.960> I<00:18:43.000> think<00:18:43.240> to<00:18:43.320> myself,<00:18:44.280> "What's<00:18:44.440> going<00:18:44.720> on<00:18:44.880> here?

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Like,<00:18:45.960> are<00:18:46.160> their<00:18:46.280> engineers<00:18:46.800> on<00:18:46.920> vacation?"<00:18:47.600> Like,<00:18:48.240> like<00:18:48.600> I<00:18:48.640> mean,<00:18:48.760> they<00:18:48.880> can<00:18:49.120> build<00:18:50.280> so<00:18:50.600> many<00:18:50.800> tools<00:18:51.160> on<00:18:51.280> top<00:18:51.520> of<00:18:51.640> the<00:18:51.760> LLMs<00:18:52.320> that<00:18:52.520> already<00:18:52.800> exist.

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So,<00:18:53.520> why<00:18:54.000> why<00:18:54.160> haven't<00:18:54.480> they<00:18:54.600> enabled<00:18:55.240> my<00:18:55.440> workflow<00:18:56.080> with<00:18:56.640> artificial<00:18:57.080> intelligence?

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Yeah.<00:18:59.200> Yeah,<00:18:59.600> totally.<00:18:59.713> [laughter]<00:19:00.880> That's<00:19:01.160> actually<00:19:01.480> a<00:19:01.520> great<00:19:01.760> point,<00:19:02.040> too.

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So,<00:19:03.000> tell<00:19:03.200> me<00:19:03.320> how<00:19:03.440> you<00:19:03.520> think<00:19:03.680> about<00:19:03.960> leading<00:19:04.280> people.

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What<00:19:05.800> is<00:19:05.920> leadership<00:19:06.440> to<00:19:06.600> you?<00:19:09.040> So,<00:19:11.160> it's<00:19:11.400> a<00:19:11.520> great<00:19:11.760> question.

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you<00:19:21.000> know,<00:19:21.200> whether<00:19:21.440> or<00:19:21.480> not<00:19:21.720> I'm<00:19:21.840> a<00:19:21.920> good<00:19:22.160> leader<00:19:22.400> or<00:19:22.480> bad<00:19:22.760> leader,<00:19:23.000> but<00:19:23.800> um<00:19:24.280> for<00:19:24.480> me<00:19:24.800> there's<00:19:25.480> there's<00:19:25.720> a<00:19:26.240> a<00:19:26.280> human<00:19:26.640> component<00:19:27.240> and<00:19:27.680> and<00:19:27.880> kind<00:19:28.000> of<00:19:28.080> an<00:19:28.280> art<00:19:28.520> component

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and<00:19:29.120> there's<00:19:29.320> like<00:19:29.880> a<00:19:29.960> more<00:19:30.320> formulaic<00:19:31.080> science<00:19:31.360> component.

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I<00:19:31.840> think<00:19:32.240> leaders<00:19:32.600> have<00:19:32.840> to<00:19:32.920> make<00:19:33.120> the<00:19:33.240> tough<00:19:33.440> decisions<00:19:34.480> and<00:19:34.600> as<00:19:34.720> a<00:19:34.800> like<00:19:35.120> uh<00:19:36.040> as<00:19:36.120> a<00:19:36.160> people<00:19:36.520> pleaser,<00:19:37.400> a<00:19:37.480> never<00:19:37.840> recovering<00:19:38.280> people<00:19:38.600> pleaser,<00:19:39.520> that's<00:19:39.760> probably<00:19:40.120> the

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area<00:19:40.560> that<00:19:40.680> I've<00:19:40.800> struggled<00:19:41.240> with<00:19:41.360> the<00:19:41.480> most<00:19:42.400> is<00:19:42.960> um<00:19:43.400> the<00:19:43.520> leader<00:19:43.920> has<00:19:44.240> to<00:19:44.360> make<00:19:44.520> the<00:19:44.600> decision<00:19:45.160> and<00:19:45.240> not<00:19:45.480> everything<00:19:45.920> can<00:19:46.120> be<00:19:47.040> a<00:19:47.120> decision<00:19:47.640> by<00:19:47.760> committee.

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I<00:19:48.800> see<00:19:49.040> so<00:19:49.200> much<00:19:49.480> of<00:19:49.600> that<00:19:49.960> like<00:19:50.680> um<00:19:50.960> it's<00:19:51.160> not<00:19:51.440> always<00:19:52.080> kind<00:19:52.680> to<00:19:53.600> lead<00:19:53.960> with<00:19:54.920> by<00:19:55.040> consensus.

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And<00:19:56.600> so<00:19:57.120> I<00:19:57.240> think<00:19:57.640> really<00:19:57.960> strong<00:19:58.320> leadership<00:19:58.840> requires<00:19:59.360> you<00:19:59.520> to<00:19:59.680> have<00:20:00.160> a<00:20:00.240> clarity<00:20:00.720> of<00:20:00.840> vision<00:20:01.600> that<00:20:01.720> can<00:20:01.840> be<00:20:01.960> articulated<00:20:02.640> that<00:20:02.880> rally<00:20:03.280> people,<00:20:04.280> but<00:20:04.600> it

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also<00:20:05.120> requires<00:20:05.560> you<00:20:05.680> to<00:20:05.800> have<00:20:06.040> the<00:20:06.160> discipline<00:20:06.760> to<00:20:06.920> make<00:20:07.520> all<00:20:07.760> of<00:20:07.840> the<00:20:08.280> decisions.

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With<00:20:09.920> the<00:20:10.240> vision<00:20:10.560> as<00:20:10.680> the<00:20:10.760> backdrop<00:20:11.560> that<00:20:11.720> will<00:20:12.120> kind<00:20:12.320> of<00:20:12.680> help<00:20:12.920> you<00:20:13.040> achieve<00:20:13.440> that<00:20:14.040> and<00:20:14.120> that<00:20:14.320> requires<00:20:14.920> all<00:20:15.160> sorts<00:20:15.520> of<00:20:15.640> tough<00:20:15.880> decisions<00:20:16.400> every<00:20:16.600> single<00:20:16.920> day.

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It<00:20:17.960> involves<00:20:18.520> candor<00:20:19.000> and<00:20:19.160> tough<00:20:19.440> feedback<00:20:20.040> to<00:20:20.160> underperformers.

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It<00:20:21.240> requires<00:20:22.160> sometimes<00:20:22.600> restructuring<00:20:23.560> and<00:20:23.880> tough<00:20:24.120> personnel<00:20:24.600> decisions.

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Um<00:20:26.160> it<00:20:26.320> requires<00:20:27.160> tough<00:20:27.400> conversations<00:20:28.280> at<00:20:28.480> every<00:20:28.720> level.

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I<00:20:29.200> mean<00:20:29.400> I<00:20:29.440> was<00:20:29.640> in<00:20:29.720> a<00:20:29.800> board<00:20:30.080> meeting<00:20:30.360> last<00:20:30.720> week<00:20:31.000> and<00:20:31.800> uh<00:20:32.000> we<00:20:32.120> got<00:20:32.360> lots<00:20:32.600> of<00:20:32.720> great<00:20:33.040> feedback<00:20:33.560> on<00:20:33.640> what<00:20:33.800> we<00:20:33.880> should<00:20:34.160> and<00:20:34.280> shouldn't<00:20:34.640> do.

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It<00:20:35.160> requires<00:20:36.320> um<00:20:36.400> it<00:20:36.520> requires<00:20:36.880> us<00:20:37.040> to<00:20:37.120> now<00:20:38.080> take<00:20:38.320> that<00:20:38.560> feedback<00:20:39.120> and<00:20:39.320> action<00:20:39.720> on<00:20:39.880> it.

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Um<00:20:41.000> so<00:20:41.400> I<00:20:41.480> think<00:20:41.840> great<00:20:42.160> leadership<00:20:42.600> comes<00:20:42.800> down<00:20:43.000> to<00:20:43.120> vision,<00:20:43.600> clarity<00:20:44.000> of<00:20:44.080> vision,<00:20:44.400> like<00:20:44.560> crystal<00:20:45.000> clear<00:20:45.360> clarity<00:20:45.720> of<00:20:45.800> vision,<00:20:46.760> the<00:20:46.840> ability<00:20:47.360> to<00:20:47.520> not<00:20:47.920> care<00:20:48.280> what<00:20:48.480> people

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think.<00:20:49.320> I'm<00:20:49.480> reading<00:20:49.680> a<00:20:49.760> book<00:20:50.000> right<00:20:50.200> now<00:20:50.560> called<00:20:50.840> The<00:20:51.480> Courage<00:20:51.840> to<00:20:51.920> Be<00:20:52.040> Disliked.

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Right?<00:20:54.320> And<00:20:54.480> I'm<00:20:54.680> I'm<00:20:55.080> so<00:20:55.240> some<00:20:55.480> things<00:20:55.680> are<00:20:55.800> really<00:20:56.560> trying<00:20:56.800> to<00:20:57.080> I'm<00:20:57.160> trying<00:20:57.360> to<00:20:57.480> tune<00:20:57.800> myself<00:20:58.240> to<00:20:58.360> realize<00:20:58.800> that<00:20:59.320> if<00:20:59.480> I'm<00:20:59.600> doing<00:20:59.920> my<00:21:00.120> job<00:21:00.440> right,<00:21:01.280> my<00:21:01.640> NPS

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That<00:21:06.000> there'll<00:21:06.160> be<00:21:06.280> some<00:21:06.480> passives<00:21:07.000> and<00:21:07.080> there<00:21:07.240> should<00:21:07.480> be<00:21:07.640> some<00:21:07.840> detractors<00:21:08.600> and<00:21:08.680> that's<00:21:09.200> hard<00:21:09.520> for<00:21:09.640> me<00:21:09.800> to<00:21:09.920> reconcile<00:21:10.640> as<00:21:10.800> a<00:21:10.840> people<00:21:11.200> pleaser.

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Um<00:21:12.760> and<00:21:12.880> then<00:21:13.280> finally,<00:21:13.720> I<00:21:13.840> think<00:21:14.080> it<00:21:14.440> it<00:21:14.760> it<00:21:14.960> is<00:21:15.200> all<00:21:15.400> about<00:21:16.160> obsessive<00:21:18.000> focus<00:21:18.400> on<00:21:18.480> the<00:21:18.560> right<00:21:18.800> things.

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Prioritize<00:21:19.560> like<00:21:19.680> obsessive<00:21:20.280> prioritization.<00:21:21.880> Um<00:21:22.240> oftentimes,<00:21:23.360> whether<00:21:23.680> it's<00:21:24.240> there's<00:21:24.440> all<00:21:24.600> these<00:21:24.880> different<00:21:25.240> frameworks<00:21:25.960> for<00:21:26.160> leading,<00:21:26.520> but<00:21:26.640> it's<00:21:26.800> all<00:21:27.000> about

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cascading<00:21:28.000> a<00:21:28.040> vision<00:21:28.400> down<00:21:28.680> into<00:21:29.360> activities.

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And<00:21:31.200> um<00:21:31.560> if<00:21:31.720> you<00:21:31.800> can<00:21:31.960> cascade<00:21:32.560> your<00:21:32.680> vision<00:21:32.960> down<00:21:33.200> into<00:21:33.440> goals<00:21:34.520> down<00:21:34.800> to<00:21:34.920> the<00:21:35.080> individual<00:21:36.320> so<00:21:36.440> that<00:21:36.640> they're<00:21:36.880> prioritizing<00:21:38.000> they're<00:21:38.680> crystal

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clear.<00:21:40.040> I<00:21:40.080> mean,<00:21:40.160> that's<00:21:40.440> just<00:21:41.000> the<00:21:41.120> essential<00:21:42.360> role<00:21:42.600> of<00:21:42.680> the<00:21:42.800> leader<00:21:43.120> is<00:21:43.240> to<00:21:43.320> make<00:21:43.480> sure<00:21:43.720> everyone<00:21:44.120> is<00:21:44.240> aligned<00:21:45.200> and<00:21:45.320> they're<00:21:45.520> all<00:21:45.960> running<00:21:46.320> as<00:21:46.480> hard<00:21:46.840> and<00:21:47.000> fast<00:21:47.360> as

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they<00:21:47.600> can<00:21:47.960> towards<00:21:48.760> towards<00:21:49.040> your<00:21:49.480> goal<00:21:49.920> or<00:21:50.320> your<00:21:50.440> mission<00:21:50.880> or<00:21:51.560> to<00:21:51.680> accomplish<00:21:52.120> this<00:21:52.320> greater<00:21:52.640> vision.

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So,<00:21:54.080> I<00:21:54.120> hope<00:21:54.280> that<00:21:54.440> doesn't<00:21:54.760> feel<00:21:55.000> too<00:21:55.200> academic,<00:21:55.920> but<00:21:56.520> for<00:21:56.640> me,<00:21:56.800> those<00:21:57.040> are<00:21:57.160> the<00:21:57.280> things<00:21:57.600> that<00:21:57.760> I've<00:21:58.080> I've<00:21:58.240> really<00:21:58.440> tried<00:21:58.760> to<00:21:58.880> improve<00:21:59.280> in<00:21:59.360> my<00:21:59.560> own<00:21:59.720> leadership<00:22:00.200> approach.

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No,<00:22:01.160> yeah,<00:22:01.400> that's<00:22:01.640> great.<00:22:02.040> Um<00:22:02.360> you<00:22:02.440> mentioned<00:22:02.800> The<00:22:02.880> Courage<00:22:03.200> to<00:22:03.280> Be<00:22:03.400> Disliked.

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I'm<00:22:03.840> going<00:22:03.960> to<00:22:04.040> check<00:22:04.240> that<00:22:04.440> out.<00:22:04.600> What<00:22:04.720> else<00:22:04.960> do<00:22:05.080> you<00:22:05.160> read?<00:22:05.440> What<00:22:05.640> reading<00:22:05.920> recommendations<00:22:06.600> would<00:22:06.760> you<00:22:06.840> have<00:22:07.040> for<00:22:07.240> us?

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I<00:22:08.840> love<00:22:09.160> the<00:22:09.280> book<00:22:09.920> um<00:22:10.200> I<00:22:10.280> just<00:22:11.320> because<00:22:11.600> I'm<00:22:11.760> obsessed<00:22:12.160> about<00:22:12.440> failure.

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Like<00:22:13.480> I<00:22:13.600> think<00:22:13.840> so<00:22:14.080> much<00:22:14.440> so<00:22:14.600> many<00:22:14.840> of<00:22:14.920> the<00:22:15.040> lessons<00:22:16.400> um<00:22:16.720> that<00:22:16.880> inform<00:22:17.360> our<00:22:17.480> leadership<00:22:18.240> or<00:22:18.400> our<00:22:18.520> roles<00:22:18.840> as<00:22:19.000> entrepreneurs<00:22:19.800> and<00:22:19.960> founders<00:22:20.360> and<00:22:20.520> owners<00:22:20.800> of<00:22:20.880> businesses

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come<00:22:21.920> from<00:22:22.120> failure,<00:22:22.440> not<00:22:22.640> success.<00:22:23.120> We<00:22:23.240> do<00:22:23.360> such<00:22:23.600> a<00:22:23.640> good<00:22:23.800> job<00:22:24.040> of<00:22:24.160> like<00:22:24.320> showcasing<00:22:24.920> the<00:22:25.040> successful<00:22:26.120> CEOs<00:22:26.720> and<00:22:26.840> winners.

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They're<00:22:27.440> the<00:22:27.520> ones<00:22:28.120> typically,<00:22:28.640> right,<00:22:28.920> that<00:22:29.040> are<00:22:29.120> sitting<00:22:29.440> on<00:22:29.600> the<00:22:29.680> stage<00:22:30.040> at<00:22:30.160> Silicon<00:22:30.520> Slopes<00:22:30.800> Summit.

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They're<00:22:31.640> the<00:22:31.760> ones<00:22:32.120> that<00:22:32.320> we're<00:22:32.440> writing<00:22:32.720> articles<00:22:33.080> about<00:22:33.320> in<00:22:33.400> Entrepreneur<00:22:33.880> Magazine,<00:22:34.760> but<00:22:35.040> I<00:22:35.160> felt<00:22:35.600> like<00:22:35.840> the<00:22:36.040> the<00:22:36.200> most<00:22:36.680> important<00:22:37.200> lessons<00:22:37.600> can<00:22:37.720> be<00:22:37.880> extracted

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from<00:22:38.960> the<00:22:39.120> ugly<00:22:40.120> and<00:22:40.480> the<00:22:40.560> messy<00:22:41.080> and<00:22:41.280> the<00:22:41.720> the<00:22:41.960> collapses<00:22:42.640> and<00:22:42.720> the<00:22:42.800> failures.

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And<00:22:43.400> so,<00:22:43.520> the<00:22:43.640> book<00:22:43.920> Quit<00:22:44.800> by<00:22:44.960> Annie<00:22:45.160> Duke,<00:22:45.520> if<00:22:45.680> you<00:22:46.040> haven't<00:22:46.360> read<00:22:46.560> that,<00:22:46.760> I<00:22:46.840> love<00:22:47.320> I<00:22:47.440> love<00:22:47.760> that<00:22:47.960> book.

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Um<00:22:49.440> I<00:22:49.560> think<00:22:49.880> it<00:22:50.120> provides<00:22:50.720> not<00:22:50.960> only<00:22:51.560> it<00:22:51.680> try<00:22:51.880> to<00:22:51.960> kind<00:22:53.040> it<00:22:53.360> she<00:22:53.560> really<00:22:53.840> works<00:22:54.520> to<00:22:54.840> overcome<00:22:56.360> this<00:22:56.600> kind<00:22:56.800> of<00:22:56.920> mythical

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like<00:22:58.440> glorified<00:22:59.440> view<00:22:59.800> of<00:23:00.240> entrepreneurship<00:23:01.240> that<00:23:01.520> says<00:23:01.920> you<00:23:02.080> never<00:23:02.440> quit,<00:23:03.160> that<00:23:03.280> you<00:23:03.440> never<00:23:03.760> give<00:23:04.040> up,<00:23:04.600> and<00:23:04.760> like<00:23:04.880> that's<00:23:05.120> the<00:23:05.360> only<00:23:05.600> way<00:23:05.800> to

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succeed<00:23:06.600> and<00:23:06.720> tries<00:23:07.000> to<00:23:07.120> normalize<00:23:08.120> the<00:23:08.200> decisions<00:23:08.920> that<00:23:09.080> are<00:23:09.120> required<00:23:09.760> to<00:23:09.880> sometimes<00:23:10.480> stop<00:23:11.640> and<00:23:11.760> to<00:23:11.880> sometimes<00:23:12.560> like,<00:23:13.360> you<00:23:13.400> know,<00:23:14.320> hang

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up<00:23:14.600> the<00:23:14.680> cleats.<00:23:15.840> Um<00:23:16.680> And<00:23:17.240> and<00:23:17.360> so<00:23:17.520> I<00:23:17.960> I<00:23:18.120> found<00:23:18.440> that<00:23:18.680> to<00:23:18.760> just<00:23:18.960> be<00:23:19.080> a<00:23:19.160> really<00:23:19.760> interesting<00:23:20.280> contrarian<00:23:20.920> view<00:23:21.400> and<00:23:21.920> and<00:23:22.040> is<00:23:22.280> consistent<00:23:22.800> with

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my<00:23:23.880> um<00:23:24.440> my<00:23:24.640> study<00:23:25.080> of<00:23:25.240> failure<00:23:25.640> in<00:23:25.760> entrepreneurship.

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And<00:23:27.360> we<00:23:27.440> don't<00:23:27.640> often<00:23:28.000> in<00:23:28.560> equip<00:23:29.080> entrepreneurs<00:23:29.880> with<00:23:30.080> a<00:23:30.160> framework.

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So,<00:23:30.800> she<00:23:30.960> does<00:23:31.080> a<00:23:31.120> good<00:23:31.240> job<00:23:31.600> to<00:23:32.120> also<00:23:32.360> give<00:23:32.520> us<00:23:32.640> a<00:23:32.720> framework<00:23:33.240> to<00:23:33.360> make<00:23:33.720> these<00:23:34.040> quick<00:23:34.280> decisions<00:23:34.880> through<00:23:35.040> our<00:23:35.200> lives,<00:23:35.560> professional<00:23:36.160> and<00:23:36.280> personal,<00:23:37.240> and<00:23:37.480> great<00:23:37.760> examples

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of<00:23:38.840> entrepreneurs<00:23:39.600> who<00:23:39.760> stopped,<00:23:40.680> who<00:23:40.800> just<00:23:41.040> said,<00:23:41.240> "Hey,<00:23:42.120> the<00:23:42.640> the<00:23:42.800> odds<00:23:43.040> are<00:23:43.120> too<00:23:43.320> high,<00:23:43.720> the<00:23:44.400> it<00:23:44.520> could<00:23:44.680> be<00:23:44.800> the<00:23:45.120> the<00:23:45.600> tolls<00:23:46.040> on<00:23:46.240> family<00:23:46.920> or

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mental<00:23:47.480> health<00:23:47.720> were<00:23:47.840> too<00:23:48.040> high."<00:23:48.760> And<00:23:48.880> so,<00:23:49.000> they<00:23:49.160> stopped<00:23:49.760> and<00:23:50.200> there's<00:23:50.400> something,<00:23:50.840> you<00:23:50.920> know,<00:23:51.080> subsequently<00:23:51.880> they<00:23:52.040> had<00:23:52.280> some<00:23:52.440> had<00:23:52.640> success,<00:23:53.040> some<00:23:53.240> didn't,<00:23:54.000> but

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that<00:23:54.360> that<00:23:54.480> was<00:23:54.600> still<00:23:54.880> the<00:23:55.040> right<00:23:55.320> decision.<00:23:56.360> So,<00:23:57.080> um<00:23:57.320> I<00:23:57.400> like<00:23:57.640> that<00:23:57.840> book.

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I'm<00:23:58.160> reading<00:23:58.360> a<00:23:58.400> lot<00:23:58.600> of<00:23:58.680> books<00:23:59.000> cuz<00:23:59.160> this<00:23:59.360> year<00:23:59.560> is<00:23:59.800> my<00:24:00.400> my<00:24:00.480> whole<00:24:00.680> goal<00:24:00.920> this<00:24:01.160> year<00:24:01.360> is<00:24:01.640> discipline<00:24:02.400> and<00:24:02.960> so,<00:24:03.160> I'm<00:24:03.320> reading<00:24:03.520> a<00:24:03.560> lot<00:24:03.720> of<00:24:03.800> books<00:24:03.960> around<00:24:04.160> the<00:24:04.240> psychology

00:24:04.880 --> 00:24:11.120
of<00:24:05.000> money<00:24:05.400> and<00:24:05.600> so,<00:24:05.720> like<00:24:06.440> I<00:24:06.920> I<00:24:07.040> read<00:24:07.400> the<00:24:07.480> book<00:24:07.840> The<00:24:08.000> Art<00:24:08.200> of<00:24:08.320> Spending,<00:24:09.160> just<00:24:09.360> finished<00:24:09.680> that<00:24:09.960> last<00:24:10.280> week.

00:24:11.120 --> 00:24:19.280
Um<00:24:11.760> it<00:24:11.880> had<00:24:12.040> a<00:24:12.080> lot<00:24:12.240> of<00:24:12.360> common<00:24:12.800> sense<00:24:13.640> advice,<00:24:14.320> but<00:24:15.160> um<00:24:15.600> Die<00:24:15.800> With<00:24:16.000> Zero<00:24:16.280> is<00:24:16.360> another<00:24:16.640> book<00:24:16.880> that<00:24:17.040> I<00:24:17.320> I<00:24:17.400> really<00:24:17.680> loved<00:24:18.080> that<00:24:18.280> kind<00:24:18.440> of<00:24:18.560> reframed<00:24:19.200> the

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way<00:24:19.440> I<00:24:19.520> think<00:24:19.800> about,<00:24:20.920> you<00:24:20.960> know,<00:24:21.120> wealth.

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So,<00:24:22.480> so<00:24:22.560> that<00:24:22.680> that's<00:24:22.960> a<00:24:23.040> handful.<00:24:23.480> I'm<00:24:23.600> always<00:24:23.880> listening<00:24:24.320> to<00:24:24.440> an<00:24:24.560> Audible<00:24:24.880> book<00:24:25.520> and<00:24:25.680> I'm<00:24:25.840> also<00:24:26.800> I<00:24:26.960> have<00:24:28.080> probably<00:24:28.480> three<00:24:28.760> or<00:24:28.880> 400<00:24:29.720> business<00:24:30.160> books

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and<00:24:30.720> self-help<00:24:31.240> books<00:24:31.600> and<00:24:31.800> some<00:24:32.040> fiction,<00:24:32.360> but<00:24:32.520> mostly<00:24:32.840> non-fiction<00:24:34.040> that<00:24:34.320> I've<00:24:34.560> only<00:24:34.840> read<00:24:35.160> two<00:24:35.360> or<00:24:35.480> three<00:24:35.680> chapters<00:24:36.200> of.

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And<00:24:37.000> so,<00:24:37.320> I<00:24:37.440> am<00:24:37.800> really,<00:24:38.920> speaking<00:24:39.240> of<00:24:39.360> quitting,<00:24:40.040> if<00:24:40.280> a<00:24:40.320> book<00:24:40.640> doesn't<00:24:41.000> get<00:24:41.160> me<00:24:41.280> excited<00:24:42.080> and<00:24:42.240> leaning<00:24:42.520> in,<00:24:42.760> I<00:24:42.840> just<00:24:43.240> shut<00:24:43.520> it<00:24:43.720> and<00:24:43.840> start<00:24:44.160> something<00:24:44.560> new<00:24:44.840> and

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I<00:24:45.040> don't<00:24:45.280> feel<00:24:45.440> bad<00:24:45.680> about<00:24:45.960> it<00:24:46.080> anymore.<00:24:46.520> For<00:24:46.680> years<00:24:46.960> I<00:24:47.040> thought,<00:24:47.720> "I<00:24:47.800> need<00:24:47.960> to<00:24:48.040> finish<00:24:48.440> the<00:24:48.560> book."

00:24:48.840 --> 00:24:54.560
But<00:24:48.960> if<00:24:49.080> I<00:24:49.160> get<00:24:49.360> the<00:24:49.520> essence<00:24:50.000> of<00:24:50.120> what<00:24:50.240> it's<00:24:50.400> trying<00:24:50.640> to<00:24:51.160> Sometimes<00:24:51.440> I'll<00:24:51.560> skip<00:24:51.880> to<00:24:51.960> the<00:24:52.080> end<00:24:52.240> and<00:24:52.320> just<00:24:52.520> read<00:24:52.800> two<00:24:52.920> or<00:24:53.000> three<00:24:53.240> chapters<00:24:53.720> at<00:24:53.840> the<00:24:53.920> end<00:24:54.040> of<00:24:54.120> the<00:24:54.160> book<00:24:54.440> and

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I<00:24:55.080> shut<00:24:55.400> it<00:24:55.520> and<00:24:55.640> pick<00:24:55.800> up<00:24:55.920> the<00:24:56.040> next<00:24:56.360> one.

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So,<00:24:57.360> it's<00:24:57.640> rare<00:24:57.880> for<00:24:58.000> me<00:24:58.160> to<00:24:58.240> get<00:24:58.480> all<00:24:58.600> the<00:24:58.680> way<00:24:58.880> through<00:24:59.840> a<00:24:59.920> book,<00:25:00.240> but<00:25:00.840> on<00:25:01.000> a<00:25:01.400> on<00:25:01.520> occasion<00:25:02.040> I'll<00:25:02.400> find<00:25:02.640> one<00:25:02.800> like<00:25:03.040> Quit<00:25:03.480> or<00:25:04.200> um<00:25:04.560> Die<00:25:04.800> With

00:25:05.000 --> 00:25:11.600
Zero<00:25:06.160> um<00:25:06.360> that<00:25:06.680> is,<00:25:07.560> you<00:25:07.600> know,<00:25:07.720> Let<00:25:08.000> Them<00:25:08.240> is<00:25:08.400> obviously<00:25:08.880> a<00:25:09.400> a<00:25:09.480> book<00:25:09.760> that<00:25:09.920> my<00:25:10.080> wife<00:25:10.360> had<00:25:10.520> me<00:25:10.680> read.

00:25:11.600 --> 00:25:14.840
Um<00:25:11.680> Mel<00:25:11.920> Robbins,<00:25:12.800> that's<00:25:13.280> teaching<00:25:13.600> the<00:25:13.720> was<00:25:13.880> a<00:25:13.920> big<00:25:14.200> book.

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Oh,<00:25:15.280> it's<00:25:15.360> phenomenal.<00:25:16.320> She<00:25:16.720> She<00:25:17.000> did<00:25:17.240> really<00:25:17.480> well<00:25:17.760> with<00:25:17.920> that<00:25:18.160> one.

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Yeah.<00:25:18.793> Wow.<00:25:19.026> I<00:25:19.259> mean,<00:25:19.492> I<00:25:19.725> think<00:25:19.958> it's<00:25:20.191> like<00:25:20.424> the<00:25:20.656> top<00:25:20.889> 10<00:25:21.122> New<00:25:21.355> York<00:25:21.588> Times<00:25:21.821> [clears<00:25:22.054> throat]<00:25:22.287> best<00:25:22.520> sellers.

00:25:23.640 --> 00:25:29.240
So.<00:25:24.080> So,<00:25:24.360> what<00:25:24.560> do<00:25:24.640> people<00:25:25.000> get<00:25:25.160> wrong<00:25:25.520> about<00:25:25.800> marketing?

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It's<00:25:29.680> too<00:25:29.920> easy<00:25:30.200> to<00:25:30.320> do<00:25:30.440> a<00:25:30.520> lot<00:25:30.760> of<00:25:30.880> activity<00:25:31.360> in<00:25:31.480> marketing<00:25:31.920> that<00:25:32.040> doesn't<00:25:32.360> matter.

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Like<00:25:33.560> what<00:25:33.760> what<00:25:33.880> they<00:25:34.000> get<00:25:34.200> wrong<00:25:34.440> is<00:25:34.720> they<00:25:34.920> think<00:25:35.320> marketing<00:25:35.800> is<00:25:35.960> this<00:25:36.200> like,<00:25:36.680> here<00:25:36.880> are<00:25:36.920> all<00:25:37.160> the<00:25:37.240> things<00:25:37.600> you<00:25:37.720> can<00:25:38.040> do<00:25:38.160> in<00:25:38.280> marketing<00:25:38.720> and<00:25:38.840> you<00:25:38.920> can<00:25:39.040> do<00:25:39.200> anything,

00:25:40.000 --> 00:25:48.200
but<00:25:40.120> you<00:25:40.280> can't<00:25:40.880> do<00:25:41.200> everything.<00:25:42.520> Whether<00:25:42.840> it's<00:25:43.040> budget,<00:25:43.520> people,<00:25:43.960> time,<00:25:44.440> focus,<00:25:44.880> like<00:25:45.800> what<00:25:46.040> I<00:25:46.120> found<00:25:46.480> is<00:25:46.720> so<00:25:46.880> many<00:25:47.040> companies<00:25:47.480> are<00:25:47.560> just<00:25:47.760> trying<00:25:47.920> to<00:25:48.000> do

00:25:48.200 --> 00:25:54.000
all<00:25:48.400> the<00:25:48.520> things.<00:25:49.000> And<00:25:49.560> every<00:25:49.800> marketing<00:25:50.200> consultant<00:25:50.720> that<00:25:50.800> comes<00:25:51.080> in,<00:25:51.280> every<00:25:51.480> agency<00:25:51.880> that<00:25:52.000> comes<00:25:52.240> in<00:25:52.360> says,<00:25:52.840> "Oh,<00:25:53.000> you<00:25:53.120> should<00:25:53.280> be<00:25:53.400> doing<00:25:53.680> this."

00:25:54.000 --> 00:25:56.600
Like,<00:25:54.200> "Oh,<00:25:54.400> what<00:25:54.520> are<00:25:54.600> you<00:25:54.640> doing<00:25:54.840> with<00:25:55.040> SEO?"<00:25:55.880> Mhm.

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Right?<00:25:56.720> Oh,<00:25:57.960> how<00:25:58.160> many<00:25:58.320> reviews<00:25:58.640> do<00:25:58.720> you<00:25:58.800> do?

00:25:58.880 --> 00:26:05.080
And<00:25:59.000> like<00:25:59.120> these<00:25:59.280> are<00:25:59.400> all<00:25:59.600> essential.<00:26:00.120> They're<00:26:00.280> all<00:26:00.600> like<00:26:00.880> essential,<00:26:01.440> but<00:26:01.560> if<00:26:01.680> everything's<00:26:02.160> essential,<00:26:02.600> then<00:26:03.360> what<00:26:03.600> is<00:26:03.720> critical?

00:26:05.080 --> 00:26:13.600
And<00:26:05.760> And<00:26:05.920> so,<00:26:06.040> like<00:26:06.560> again,<00:26:07.400> when<00:26:07.800> I<00:26:08.200> when<00:26:08.400> I<00:26:08.480> we<00:26:08.640> step<00:26:08.920> into<00:26:09.080> a<00:26:09.120> business<00:26:09.560> and<00:26:09.640> we<00:26:09.760> analyze<00:26:10.200> kind<00:26:10.320> of<00:26:10.400> what<00:26:10.560> they're<00:26:10.680> doing,<00:26:12.000> it's<00:26:12.320> not<00:26:12.600> it<00:26:12.880> either<00:26:13.240> it's

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not<00:26:13.840> working<00:26:15.400> because<00:26:16.560> they're<00:26:16.920> not<00:26:17.160> executing,<00:26:17.960> which<00:26:18.160> sometimes<00:26:18.600> is<00:26:18.680> the<00:26:18.760> case,<00:26:19.400> but<00:26:19.560> often<00:26:19.880> times<00:26:20.160> they're<00:26:20.280> just<00:26:20.480> trying<00:26:20.640> to<00:26:20.720> do<00:26:20.880> too<00:26:21.040> many<00:26:21.240> things.

00:26:21.560 --> 00:26:26.960
They<00:26:21.680> spread<00:26:22.000> themselves<00:26:22.480> too<00:26:22.640> thin,<00:26:22.880> they<00:26:23.000> spread<00:26:23.280> the<00:26:23.360> budget<00:26:23.720> so<00:26:24.320> so<00:26:24.520> thin<00:26:24.840> that<00:26:25.040> they're<00:26:25.200> not<00:26:25.520> getting<00:26:25.720> the<00:26:25.840> impact.

00:26:26.960 --> 00:26:34.920
Um<00:26:27.440> for<00:26:27.560> example,<00:26:27.960> we<00:26:28.080> have<00:26:28.240> a<00:26:28.480> I<00:26:28.600> have<00:26:28.760> a<00:26:28.800> client<00:26:29.280> who,<00:26:30.040> you<00:26:30.120> know,<00:26:30.400> had<00:26:30.680> a<00:26:30.960> a<00:26:31.040> budget<00:26:31.520> and<00:26:31.600> it<00:26:31.680> was<00:26:31.840> spread<00:26:32.120> across,<00:26:32.800> you<00:26:32.880> know,<00:26:33.040> 15<00:26:33.480> or<00:26:33.560> 20<00:26:33.920> channels.

00:26:34.920 --> 00:26:40.240
You<00:26:35.160> weren't<00:26:35.560> really<00:26:36.000> making<00:26:36.320> like<00:26:36.480> it's<00:26:36.560> like<00:26:36.840> when<00:26:37.000> I<00:26:37.040> see<00:26:37.240> someone<00:26:37.480> buying<00:26:37.720> one<00:26:37.920> billboard,<00:26:38.320> I<00:26:38.360> bought<00:26:38.560> a<00:26:38.600> lot<00:26:38.760> of<00:26:38.840> billboards<00:26:39.320> in<00:26:39.400> my<00:26:39.560> day,<00:26:39.760> Clint.

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Yeah.<00:26:40.520> And<00:26:40.600> I<00:26:40.680> see<00:26:40.840> people<00:26:41.080> buying<00:26:41.320> one<00:26:41.520> billboard,<00:26:42.200> that<00:26:42.480> one<00:26:42.680> billboard<00:26:43.280> probably<00:26:43.760> doesn't<00:26:44.080> get<00:26:44.200> it<00:26:44.280> done.

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Certainly<00:26:44.840> not<00:26:45.040> in<00:26:45.120> the<00:26:45.200> short<00:26:45.480> term.<00:26:45.960> Yeah.<00:26:46.440> Like<00:26:47.160> it<00:26:47.200> needs<00:26:47.440> to<00:26:47.520> be<00:26:47.640> a<00:26:47.720> strategy<00:26:48.200> where<00:26:48.320> you<00:26:48.400> have<00:26:48.520> enough<00:26:48.960> reach<00:26:49.280> and<00:26:49.400> frequency<00:26:49.920> and<00:26:50.040> awareness<00:26:50.640> and<00:26:50.760> impact

00:26:51.320 --> 00:26:54.160
over<00:26:51.560> time<00:26:52.440> that<00:26:52.600> you<00:26:52.720> can<00:26:52.880> really<00:26:53.040> establish<00:26:53.600> a<00:26:53.680> brand.

00:26:54.160 --> 00:27:02.680
And<00:26:54.320> so,<00:26:55.080> putting<00:26:55.880> uh<00:26:56.440> $5,000<00:26:57.320> into<00:26:57.520> a<00:26:57.560> billboard<00:26:58.120> and<00:26:58.280> $5,000<00:26:59.040> into<00:26:59.800> another<00:27:00.160> channel<00:27:00.560> or<00:27:00.680> radio<00:27:01.160> and<00:27:01.280> $5,000<00:27:02.400> into

00:27:02.680 --> 00:27:11.120
TV<00:27:03.200> or<00:27:03.640> if<00:27:03.760> we're<00:27:03.840> talking<00:27:04.240> B2B<00:27:04.800> like<00:27:05.440> we've<00:27:05.560> got,<00:27:06.040> you<00:27:06.120> know,<00:27:06.200> LinkedIn<00:27:06.840> and<00:27:06.920> we<00:27:07.000> have<00:27:07.160> Google<00:27:07.640> like<00:27:08.120> just<00:27:08.400> spreading<00:27:08.800> that<00:27:09.000> out<00:27:09.320> too<00:27:09.560> broadly<00:27:10.120> sometimes<00:27:10.560> we<00:27:10.680> dilute

00:27:11.120 --> 00:27:17.000
the<00:27:11.240> impact.<00:27:12.000> So,<00:27:12.200> a<00:27:12.320> tighter,<00:27:12.880> more<00:27:13.120> focused<00:27:13.560> go-to-market<00:27:14.120> strategy<00:27:14.640> to<00:27:14.800> me<00:27:15.040> I<00:27:15.120> think<00:27:15.360> is<00:27:15.520> more<00:27:15.720> effective.

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It<00:27:17.040> allows<00:27:17.400> you<00:27:17.480> to<00:27:17.720> win<00:27:17.960> in<00:27:18.120> fewer<00:27:18.440> channels.<00:27:19.840> You<00:27:20.000> mentioned<00:27:20.360> billboards<00:27:21.160> which<00:27:21.480> obviously,<00:27:22.000> you<00:27:22.080> know,<00:27:22.240> we<00:27:22.360> both<00:27:22.600> live<00:27:22.760> in<00:27:22.880> Utah<00:27:23.320> here<00:27:23.840> and<00:27:24.240> there's<00:27:24.480> tons<00:27:24.760> of

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billboard<00:27:25.440> wars<00:27:26.120> and,<00:27:26.360> you<00:27:26.440> know,<00:27:26.760> like<00:27:27.480> everybody<00:27:27.800> has<00:27:27.920> a<00:27:27.960> blanket<00:27:28.360> company<00:27:28.760> or<00:27:28.880> a<00:27:28.920> cookie<00:27:29.280> company<00:27:29.800> or,<00:27:30.120> you<00:27:30.240> know,<00:27:30.320> these<00:27:30.520> various<00:27:30.840> things<00:27:31.200> and<00:27:31.320> it<00:27:31.400> seems<00:27:31.640> like<00:27:32.240> all

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you<00:27:32.480> got<00:27:32.600> to<00:27:32.680> do<00:27:33.000> to<00:27:33.160> launch<00:27:33.440> one<00:27:33.520> of<00:27:33.600> those<00:27:33.880> is<00:27:33.960> have<00:27:34.080> the<00:27:34.160> budget<00:27:34.480> for<00:27:34.600> a<00:27:34.680> billboard.

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But<00:27:36.720> um<00:27:37.240> Silicon<00:27:37.600> Slopes<00:27:37.840> had<00:27:37.960> a<00:27:38.000> billboard<00:27:38.560> for<00:27:38.680> a<00:27:38.720> number<00:27:39.080> of<00:27:39.240> years<00:27:39.720> and<00:27:39.800> it<00:27:39.920> actually<00:27:40.280> was<00:27:40.840> um<00:27:41.880> it<00:27:42.000> was<00:27:42.200> donated<00:27:42.800> to<00:27:43.000> us<00:27:43.360> but<00:27:43.600> the<00:27:43.840> the<00:27:44.000> amount<00:27:44.440> that

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it<00:27:44.960> So<00:27:45.200> so<00:27:45.320> we<00:27:45.440> didn't<00:27:45.680> actually<00:27:45.920> have<00:27:46.000> to<00:27:46.080> pay<00:27:46.280> for<00:27:46.480> it<00:27:46.560> out<00:27:46.680> of<00:27:46.800> the<00:27:47.000> org.

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And<00:27:48.120> I'd<00:27:48.240> always<00:27:48.480> say<00:27:48.640> if<00:27:48.880> if<00:27:49.040> the<00:27:49.200> org<00:27:49.480> had<00:27:49.600> to<00:27:49.720> pay<00:27:49.960> for<00:27:50.120> that<00:27:50.280> I<00:27:50.360> would<00:27:50.520> not<00:27:50.840> pay<00:27:51.000> for<00:27:51.280> it.

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I<00:27:51.960> don't<00:27:52.080> know<00:27:52.120> what<00:27:52.240> that<00:27:52.440> does.<00:27:53.920> I<00:27:53.960> don't<00:27:54.120> know<00:27:54.200> what<00:27:54.320> it<00:27:54.480> is.

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I<00:27:54.960> don't<00:27:55.120> know.<00:27:55.320> And<00:27:55.480> we<00:27:55.600> had<00:27:55.760> it<00:27:55.880> at<00:27:56.000> like<00:27:56.200> this<00:27:56.400> really<00:27:56.600> nice<00:27:56.840> location<00:27:57.240> at<00:27:57.280> the<00:27:57.360> point<00:27:57.520> of<00:27:57.560> the<00:27:57.640> mountain<00:27:57.840> like<00:27:57.960> right<00:27:58.120> as<00:27:58.200> you're<00:27:58.360> coming<00:27:58.680> in<00:27:59.120> I<00:27:59.280> remember.

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to<00:27:59.840> to<00:28:00.000> Lehi<00:28:00.520> and<00:28:00.680> we'd<00:28:00.880> put<00:28:01.120> things<00:28:01.440> on<00:28:01.600> there<00:28:01.760> and<00:28:01.880> things<00:28:02.120> like<00:28:02.240> that.

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And<00:28:02.560> then<00:28:02.680> we<00:28:02.960> we<00:28:03.120> did<00:28:03.320> like<00:28:03.480> the<00:28:03.600> digital<00:28:04.960> billboards<00:28:05.960> um<00:28:06.480> for<00:28:06.640> various<00:28:07.040> events<00:28:07.400> and<00:28:07.480> things<00:28:07.720> like<00:28:07.840> that.

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And<00:28:08.160> I<00:28:08.240> never<00:28:08.800> experienced<00:28:09.520> any<00:28:10.040> ROI<00:28:10.680> for<00:28:10.920> that<00:28:12.080> that<00:28:12.320> I<00:28:12.400> that<00:28:12.600> I<00:28:12.640> could<00:28:12.880> feel<00:28:13.320> that<00:28:13.480> like<00:28:13.760> felt,<00:28:14.080> you<00:28:14.160> know,<00:28:14.280> like<00:28:14.440> the<00:28:14.640> the<00:28:14.800> best<00:28:15.160> channel<00:28:15.520> for<00:28:15.880> Silicon<00:28:16.360> Slopes

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and<00:28:17.560> I<00:28:17.640> wonder<00:28:17.960> what<00:28:18.400> what<00:28:18.600> you're<00:28:18.760> seeing<00:28:19.040> right<00:28:19.200> now<00:28:19.520> has<00:28:19.880> always<00:28:20.400> been<00:28:20.800> and<00:28:20.920> continues<00:28:21.440> to<00:28:21.560> be<00:28:21.720> our<00:28:21.880> newsletter<00:28:22.440> list.

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Yeah.<00:28:23.680> There's<00:28:23.880> like<00:28:24.040> nothing<00:28:24.720> that<00:28:24.960> even<00:28:25.360> comes<00:28:25.640> close<00:28:25.880> to<00:28:25.960> that.

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And<00:28:27.680> uh<00:28:27.840> you<00:28:27.920> like<00:28:28.160> we<00:28:28.320> we<00:28:28.600> even<00:28:28.840> with<00:28:28.960> paid<00:28:29.320> social<00:28:29.640> and<00:28:29.800> obviously<00:28:30.120> we're<00:28:30.200> a<00:28:30.240> different<00:28:30.440> thing<00:28:30.560> we're<00:28:30.640> not<00:28:30.760> selling<00:28:30.960> a<00:28:31.000> product,<00:28:31.440> right?

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We're<00:28:31.680> not<00:28:31.880> like<00:28:32.200> So<00:28:32.520> so<00:28:33.440> I<00:28:33.560> get<00:28:33.800> why<00:28:34.160> some<00:28:34.360> of<00:28:34.400> these<00:28:34.560> other<00:28:34.760> channels<00:28:35.120> would<00:28:35.240> be<00:28:35.360> easier<00:28:35.680> but<00:28:35.800> like<00:28:36.000> social<00:28:36.360> media<00:28:36.640> it's<00:28:36.800> like<00:28:36.960> okay<00:28:37.640> for<00:28:37.840> us<00:28:38.160> like<00:28:38.760> in<00:28:38.880> terms<00:28:39.120> of<00:28:39.160> like

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promotion<00:28:39.760> LinkedIn's<00:28:40.160> probably<00:28:40.520> the<00:28:40.640> best<00:28:40.960> one.

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The<00:28:41.320> other<00:28:41.440> ones<00:28:41.640> are<00:28:41.800> completely<00:28:42.320> irrelevant<00:28:43.480> to<00:28:44.120> to<00:28:44.280> Silicon<00:28:44.680> Slopes<00:28:44.960> honestly<00:28:45.360> in<00:28:45.440> terms<00:28:45.680> of<00:28:45.800> like<00:28:45.960> driving<00:28:46.400> attendees<00:28:46.920> to<00:28:47.040> events<00:28:47.400> or<00:28:47.480> things<00:28:47.720> like<00:28:47.880> that.

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And<00:28:49.040> so,<00:28:49.520> um<00:28:50.040> what<00:28:50.160> do<00:28:50.240> you<00:28:50.320> think<00:28:50.480> about<00:28:50.840> owning<00:28:51.440> like<00:28:51.680> the<00:28:51.920> nice<00:28:52.160> thing<00:28:52.280> about<00:28:52.440> Silicon<00:28:52.720> Slopes<00:28:52.960> is<00:28:53.080> we<00:28:53.320> own<00:28:53.560> that<00:28:53.880> list.

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Right?<00:28:55.680> Like<00:28:55.840> we<00:28:56.080> own<00:28:56.320> that<00:28:56.560> relationship.<00:28:57.880> Um<00:28:58.440> versus<00:28:58.880> like<00:28:59.080> these<00:28:59.280> ones<00:28:59.520> that<00:28:59.680> you<00:28:59.800> pay<00:29:00.000> for<00:29:00.200> and<00:29:00.280> things<00:29:00.480> like<00:29:00.600> that.

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How<00:29:00.800> do<00:29:00.880> you<00:29:00.960> think<00:29:01.160> about<00:29:01.360> like<00:29:01.520> the<00:29:01.800> owned<00:29:02.920> properties<00:29:03.360> that<00:29:03.520> you<00:29:03.640> have<00:29:04.200> versus<00:29:04.720> the<00:29:04.840> ones<00:29:05.280> that,<00:29:05.720> you<00:29:05.840> know,<00:29:05.960> like<00:29:06.120> the<00:29:06.240> social<00:29:06.600> media<00:29:07.000> or<00:29:07.080> the<00:29:07.160> various<00:29:07.560> paid<00:29:08.480> advertising?

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Owned,<00:29:09.720> earned,<00:29:09.960> and<00:29:10.120> paid,<00:29:10.520> right?<00:29:10.920> Yeah,<00:29:11.000> yeah,<00:29:11.120> yeah.

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Think<00:29:11.760> about<00:29:12.440> is<00:29:12.640> owned,<00:29:12.880> earned,<00:29:13.040> and<00:29:13.160> paid.

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Those<00:29:13.720> are<00:29:14.280> the<00:29:14.400> audiences<00:29:15.120> that<00:29:15.320> we're<00:29:15.480> building.

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And<00:29:16.800> and<00:29:17.120> earned<00:29:17.440> is<00:29:17.560> fantastic,<00:29:18.240> right?

00:29:18.800 --> 00:29:23.600
You<00:29:18.960> were<00:29:19.040> in<00:29:19.160> that<00:29:19.440> through<00:29:20.640> PR,<00:29:20.920> and<00:29:21.000> thought<00:29:21.200> leadership,<00:29:21.600> and<00:29:21.680> this<00:29:21.840> podcast<00:29:22.400> you<00:29:22.480> might<00:29:22.680> consider<00:29:23.160> earned.

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Sure,<00:29:23.880> sure,<00:29:24.120> sure,<00:29:24.280> sure,<00:29:24.480> yeah.<00:29:25.040> Content<00:29:25.520> that<00:29:25.720> resonates<00:29:26.160> with<00:29:26.280> the<00:29:26.400> community<00:29:26.920> and<00:29:27.080> with<00:29:27.200> the<00:29:27.400> audience,<00:29:27.880> and<00:29:28.520> people<00:29:29.200> learn<00:29:29.400> about<00:29:29.760> you,<00:29:29.920> they<00:29:30.080> lean<00:29:30.320> in,

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and<00:29:30.720> hopefully<00:29:31.080> they<00:29:31.200> become<00:29:31.560> an<00:29:31.640> owned<00:29:31.880> audience.<00:29:32.880> But<00:29:33.040> you<00:29:33.200> have<00:29:33.520> to<00:29:33.640> do<00:29:33.840> some<00:29:34.080> earned<00:29:34.840> and<00:29:35.040> paid,<00:29:35.960> right?

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In<00:29:36.840> order<00:29:37.320> to<00:29:37.480> drive<00:29:37.880> your<00:29:38.080> owned.<00:29:38.760> Like<00:29:38.960> the<00:29:39.080> problem<00:29:39.400> is<00:29:39.520> is<00:29:39.760> for<00:29:40.520> unless<00:29:40.840> you<00:29:40.960> have<00:29:41.160> just<00:29:41.400> a<00:29:41.480> massive<00:29:42.760> owned,<00:29:43.360> like<00:29:43.680> massive<00:29:44.080> list,<00:29:44.800> you

00:29:44.880 --> 00:29:52.760
can<00:29:45.080> constantly<00:29:45.680> be<00:29:46.240> marketing<00:29:46.720> to<00:29:47.000> or<00:29:47.080> communicating<00:29:47.720> with,<00:29:48.240> there's<00:29:48.960> there<00:29:49.080> has<00:29:49.280> to<00:29:49.320> be<00:29:49.400> a<00:29:49.480> constant<00:29:50.000> drumbeat<00:29:50.440> of<00:29:50.520> these<00:29:50.800> other<00:29:51.080> activities<00:29:52.000> to<00:29:52.120> kind<00:29:52.280> of<00:29:52.360> drive

00:29:52.760 --> 00:30:01.560
and<00:29:52.880> grow<00:29:53.200> that.<00:29:54.000> But<00:29:54.320> it's<00:29:54.960> like<00:29:55.160> when<00:29:55.280> you<00:29:55.400> think<00:29:55.640> about<00:29:56.440> acquisition,<00:29:57.280> and<00:29:57.400> I<00:29:57.440> don't<00:29:57.600> know<00:29:57.680> how<00:29:57.840> Silicon<00:29:58.200> Slopes<00:29:58.480> thinks<00:29:58.720> about<00:29:58.960> acquisition,<00:30:00.200> but<00:30:00.600> um<00:30:01.080> all

00:30:01.560 --> 00:30:06.080
of<00:30:01.600> those<00:30:01.800> have<00:30:01.960> different<00:30:02.320> CAC<00:30:02.520> profiles.<00:30:03.240> So<00:30:03.400> my<00:30:03.680> cost<00:30:04.000> to<00:30:04.080> acquire<00:30:04.400> a<00:30:04.440> customer<00:30:04.920> obviously<00:30:05.400> is<00:30:05.560> less.

00:30:06.080 --> 00:30:09.160
Owned<00:30:06.360> is<00:30:06.560> oftentimes<00:30:07.240> a<00:30:07.280> customer,<00:30:07.680> but<00:30:07.800> not<00:30:08.040> always,<00:30:08.520> right?

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Right.<00:30:09.640> It<00:30:09.680> doesn't<00:30:09.920> mean<00:30:10.040> they're<00:30:10.160> a<00:30:10.200> customer,<00:30:10.600> it<00:30:10.640> just<00:30:10.800> means<00:30:11.040> we<00:30:11.120> have<00:30:11.240> a<00:30:11.280> relationship,<00:30:12.040> and<00:30:12.160> I<00:30:12.240> can<00:30:12.400> talk<00:30:12.680> to<00:30:12.800> them,<00:30:13.040> and<00:30:13.120> I<00:30:13.160> already<00:30:13.400> know<00:30:13.560> who<00:30:13.720> they<00:30:13.920> are.

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And<00:30:15.040> they<00:30:15.200> already<00:30:15.480> have<00:30:15.680> some<00:30:15.800> awareness<00:30:16.280> of<00:30:16.360> my<00:30:16.520> brand.

00:30:16.880 --> 00:30:20.160
I<00:30:16.920> earned<00:30:17.240> the<00:30:17.320> right<00:30:17.760> to<00:30:17.880> like<00:30:18.480> go<00:30:18.640> have<00:30:18.840> a<00:30:18.880> conversation.

00:30:20.160 --> 00:30:28.200
And<00:30:20.280> that<00:30:20.640> a<00:30:20.680> good<00:30:20.960> example<00:30:21.400> for<00:30:21.560> us<00:30:21.720> is<00:30:21.840> like<00:30:22.120> we're<00:30:22.400> a<00:30:22.680> a<00:30:22.760> business<00:30:23.200> that<00:30:23.360> started<00:30:23.720> in<00:30:23.840> finance,<00:30:24.400> and<00:30:24.480> now<00:30:24.680> we<00:30:24.840> have<00:30:25.480> sales<00:30:25.800> tax,<00:30:26.080> and<00:30:26.160> valuation,<00:30:26.880> and<00:30:27.040> marketing<00:30:27.480> services,

00:30:28.200 --> 00:30:30.960
full<00:30:28.400> stack<00:30:28.720> marketing.<00:30:29.720> We<00:30:29.760> have<00:30:29.960> HR.

00:30:30.960 --> 00:30:34.240
Um<00:30:31.240> we<00:30:31.320> have<00:30:31.440> a<00:30:31.480> turnaround<00:30:31.920> restructuring<00:30:32.400> business<00:30:32.720> when<00:30:32.840> things<00:30:33.040> don't<00:30:33.280> go<00:30:33.440> well.

00:30:34.240 --> 00:30:40.680
And<00:30:34.920> and<00:30:35.040> so<00:30:35.360> when<00:30:35.520> you<00:30:35.840> think<00:30:36.000> about<00:30:36.280> the<00:30:36.360> breadth<00:30:36.680> of<00:30:36.800> services,<00:30:37.560> I<00:30:37.640> have<00:30:37.800> a<00:30:37.920> huge<00:30:38.560> owned<00:30:38.840> audience<00:30:39.200> of<00:30:39.320> people<00:30:39.560> we<00:30:39.680> worked<00:30:39.880> with<00:30:40.000> for<00:30:40.120> 30<00:30:40.440> years.

00:30:40.680 --> 00:30:47.040
They<00:30:40.800> may<00:30:40.920> not<00:30:41.160> be<00:30:41.280> using<00:30:41.640> us<00:30:41.800> anymore<00:30:42.240> they<00:30:42.360> have<00:30:42.480> a<00:30:42.560> full-time<00:30:43.040> CFO,<00:30:44.080> but<00:30:44.240> now<00:30:44.440> I<00:30:44.520> have<00:30:44.720> the<00:30:44.840> right<00:30:45.080> to<00:30:45.160> go<00:30:45.280> have<00:30:45.440> a<00:30:45.480> conversation<00:30:46.040> about<00:30:46.240> whether<00:30:46.400> or<00:30:46.480> not<00:30:46.600> we<00:30:46.720> can<00:30:46.840> help

00:30:47.040 --> 00:30:52.680
them<00:30:47.200> in<00:30:47.320> marketing,<00:30:48.120> or<00:30:48.240> even<00:30:48.400> just<00:30:48.560> provide<00:30:48.880> content<00:30:49.400> and<00:30:49.520> say<00:30:49.680> like,<00:30:50.160> "This<00:30:50.320> is<00:30:50.400> how<00:30:50.560> you<00:30:50.680> should<00:30:50.800> evaluate<00:30:51.240> your<00:30:51.360> marketing<00:30:51.800> ROI.

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This<00:30:52.800> is<00:30:52.880> how<00:30:52.960> you<00:30:53.040> should<00:30:53.200> evaluate<00:30:53.640> your<00:30:53.760> billboard<00:30:54.320> return<00:30:54.600> on<00:30:54.640> investment."

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That's<00:30:55.358> a<00:30:55.636> conversation<00:30:55.914> we<00:30:56.192> should<00:30:56.470> have<00:30:56.749> another<00:30:57.027> time,<00:30:57.305> cuz<00:30:57.583> I<00:30:57.861> spent<00:30:58.139> [clears<00:30:58.417> throat]<00:30:58.695> I've<00:30:58.973> spent<00:30:59.251> a<00:30:59.530> significant<00:30:59.808> amount<00:31:00.086> millions<00:31:00.364> of<00:31:00.642> dollars<00:31:00.920> investing

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in<00:31:01.520> out<00:31:01.640> of<00:31:01.720> home<00:31:01.880> across<00:31:02.200> five<00:31:02.640> were<00:31:02.760> at<00:31:02.880> Homey,<00:31:03.360> and<00:31:03.520> Homey<00:31:03.840> had<00:31:04.040> tons<00:31:04.360> of<00:31:04.640> billboards.

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And<00:31:05.840> that<00:31:06.040> worked<00:31:06.280> really<00:31:06.480> well,<00:31:06.920> right?<00:31:07.280> Like<00:31:07.480> so<00:31:07.680> so<00:31:07.840> there<00:31:08.040> are<00:31:08.240> like<00:31:09.280> Yeah,<00:31:09.440> there<00:31:09.600> are<00:31:09.760> like<00:31:10.000> use<00:31:10.240> cases<00:31:10.680> for<00:31:10.840> all<00:31:11.040> of<00:31:11.120> these<00:31:11.360> things.

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Like<00:31:11.840> like<00:31:12.120> like<00:31:12.320> you<00:31:12.400> said,<00:31:13.480> um<00:31:14.280> yeah,<00:31:14.440> it's<00:31:14.560> just<00:31:14.880> it's<00:31:15.040> just<00:31:15.200> this<00:31:15.440> really<00:31:15.840> interesting<00:31:16.360> time.

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Um<00:31:22.760> tell<00:31:22.960> us<00:31:23.080> about<00:31:23.560> that<00:31:23.800> podcast.

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How's<00:31:24.560> it's<00:31:24.720> going?<00:31:25.200> What<00:31:25.320> was<00:31:25.480> the<00:31:25.560> reason<00:31:25.920> for<00:31:26.040> that?

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So,<00:31:27.680> The<00:31:27.840> Real<00:31:28.160> F<00:31:28.400> Word<00:31:29.000> is<00:31:29.200> the<00:31:29.280> name<00:31:29.440> of<00:31:29.480> the<00:31:29.560> podcast.

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It's<00:31:30.160> all<00:31:30.240> about<00:31:30.480> failure,<00:31:31.040> and<00:31:31.440> I<00:31:31.720> launched<00:31:32.160> the<00:31:32.240> first<00:31:32.560> season<00:31:32.840> last<00:31:33.120> year.

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I<00:31:33.320> have<00:31:33.480> seven<00:31:33.720> more<00:31:33.880> episodes<00:31:34.480> I<00:31:34.520> have<00:31:34.720> yet<00:31:34.960> to<00:31:35.080> release.

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Um<00:31:36.800> and<00:31:36.920> it<00:31:37.040> was<00:31:37.160> just<00:31:37.360> a<00:31:37.440> labor<00:31:37.680> of<00:31:37.800> love.

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There<00:31:38.560> was<00:31:38.760> not<00:31:39.080> a<00:31:39.640> a<00:31:39.720> business<00:31:40.200> intent<00:31:40.640> here.

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I<00:31:41.120> will<00:31:41.560> produce<00:31:42.120> a<00:31:42.240> hundred<00:31:42.680> episodes,<00:31:43.880> um<00:31:44.680> because<00:31:45.160> I<00:31:45.240> feel<00:31:45.480> like<00:31:45.760> it's<00:31:46.000> a<00:31:46.400> a<00:31:46.440> narrative,<00:31:47.120> and<00:31:47.600> there's<00:31:47.800> dialogue<00:31:48.280> there<00:31:48.440> that<00:31:48.600> is<00:31:48.720> really<00:31:48.960> valuable.

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For<00:31:49.640> me,<00:31:49.800> it's<00:31:49.960> been<00:31:50.160> like<00:31:50.440> entrepreneur<00:31:51.120> therapy<00:31:52.400> to<00:31:52.520> talk<00:31:52.840> to<00:31:53.000> entrepreneurs<00:31:53.680> who<00:31:53.840> have<00:31:54.040> like<00:31:54.640> had<00:31:54.880> to<00:31:55.000> feel<00:31:55.520> it.

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They've<00:31:57.560> had<00:31:57.720> to<00:31:57.840> show<00:31:58.120> up<00:31:58.280> and<00:31:58.400> tell<00:31:58.520> investors<00:31:59.040> they've<00:31:59.280> lost<00:31:59.640> millions<00:32:00.040> of<00:32:00.120> dollars.

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They've<00:32:01.200> had<00:32:01.320> to<00:32:01.400> shut<00:32:01.680> something<00:32:02.040> down<00:32:02.280> that<00:32:02.400> they<00:32:02.520> spent<00:32:02.840> in<00:32:02.960> some<00:32:03.160> cases<00:32:03.640> decades<00:32:04.160> building.

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They've<00:32:05.200> had<00:32:05.320> to<00:32:05.440> fire<00:32:05.920> all<00:32:06.040> their<00:32:06.280> employees.<00:32:07.040> They've<00:32:07.560> lost<00:32:07.880> their<00:32:08.080> homes,<00:32:08.960> their<00:32:09.160> spouses.

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They've<00:32:10.800> lost,<00:32:11.520> you<00:32:11.640> know,<00:32:11.920> relationships.<00:32:13.640> Um<00:32:14.080> in<00:32:14.200> some<00:32:14.440> cases,<00:32:14.960> they've<00:32:15.160> almost<00:32:15.520> lost<00:32:15.840> their<00:32:16.040> lives<00:32:17.160> because<00:32:17.520> of<00:32:17.600> the<00:32:17.720> consequence<00:32:18.400> of<00:32:18.560> pursuing<00:32:19.120> something

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And<00:32:25.400> And<00:32:25.840> And<00:32:25.960> so,<00:32:26.320> to<00:32:26.520> to<00:32:26.720> have<00:32:26.920> that<00:32:27.120> discussion<00:32:27.800> about<00:32:28.080> how<00:32:28.280> we'd<00:32:28.720> divorce<00:32:29.160> our<00:32:29.280> identities<00:32:30.560> and<00:32:30.760> our<00:32:30.840> business<00:32:31.200> outcomes,<00:32:31.920> I<00:32:32.080> think<00:32:32.360> is<00:32:32.920> um

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is<00:32:33.800> is<00:32:34.120> it's<00:32:34.440> it's<00:32:34.640> as<00:32:34.800> much<00:32:35.040> about<00:32:35.280> mental<00:32:35.560> health<00:32:35.840> as<00:32:35.960> it<00:32:36.120> is<00:32:36.280> about<00:32:36.600> like<00:32:36.840> go<00:32:36.960> to<00:32:37.080> market<00:32:37.680> success<00:32:38.640> and<00:32:38.840> frameworks.

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Um,<00:32:40.600> it's<00:32:40.840> about<00:32:41.600> the<00:32:41.680> psychology<00:32:42.680> of<00:32:43.040> what<00:32:43.200> it<00:32:43.720> takes<00:32:44.240> to<00:32:44.600> fail<00:32:45.880> and<00:32:46.400> and<00:32:46.760> the<00:32:47.000> one<00:32:47.240> thing<00:32:47.440> I<00:32:47.520> wish<00:32:47.760> I<00:32:47.800> would<00:32:47.960> have<00:32:48.080> known<00:32:48.440> early

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building.<00:33:40.160> It's<00:33:40.400> not<00:33:40.760> actually<00:33:41.160> the<00:33:41.320> business<00:33:42.800> or<00:33:42.920> the<00:33:43.040> financial<00:33:43.560> outcome<00:33:43.800> it's<00:33:43.960> the<00:33:44.160> exper-<00:33:44.600> the<00:33:44.720> accumulation<00:33:45.280> of<00:33:45.320> those<00:33:45.560> life<00:33:45.840> experiences<00:33:46.720> and<00:33:46.840> human<00:33:47.160> experiences

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On<00:33:56.480> all<00:33:56.640> the<00:33:56.760> data<00:33:57.000> and<00:33:57.080> research<00:33:57.560> is<00:33:58.000> the<00:33:58.120> probability<00:33:58.760> of<00:33:58.880> success<00:33:59.360> does<00:33:59.560> increase<00:34:00.760> because<00:34:01.120> of<00:34:01.200> those<00:34:01.400> experiences.

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And<00:34:03.000> so<00:34:03.520> so<00:34:03.600> anyway<00:34:03.760> that's<00:34:04.000> what<00:34:04.160> the<00:34:04.360> the<00:34:04.440> real<00:34:04.640> effort<00:34:04.960> is<00:34:05.040> all<00:34:05.160> about<00:34:05.560> and<00:34:06.240> and<00:34:06.400> I<00:34:06.480> would<00:34:06.960> I<00:34:07.120> I'm<00:34:07.520> like<00:34:07.720> I<00:34:07.760> said<00:34:08.040> we're<00:34:08.159> going<00:34:08.280> to<00:34:08.679> keep<00:34:09.040> driving<00:34:09.480> to<00:34:09.600> season<00:34:10.000> 2<00:34:10.240> here

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And<00:34:40.000> so<00:34:40.120> she<00:34:40.280> talked<00:34:40.520> about<00:34:40.760> failure<00:34:41.639> through<00:34:41.840> the<00:34:41.960> lens<00:34:42.280> of<00:34:42.440> like<00:34:42.679> a<00:34:42.760> political<00:34:43.240> campaign<00:34:44.120> and<00:34:44.280> what<00:34:44.440> that<00:34:45.040> you<00:34:45.120> know,<00:34:45.200> how<00:34:45.360> she<00:34:45.600> kind<00:34:45.800> of<00:34:45.919> navigated<00:34:47.040> all<00:34:47.240> of<00:34:47.320> that<00:34:47.560> after

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That's<00:34:54.600> it.<00:34:55.760> Good<00:34:55.960> for<00:34:56.120> you.

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00:35:16.240 --> 00:35:22.680
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00:35:30.640 --> 00:35:38.120
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down<00:35:38.360> companies<00:35:38.960> and<00:35:40.360> I<00:35:40.680> don't<00:35:40.920> think<00:35:41.080> there's<00:35:41.280> really<00:35:41.800> I<00:35:41.840> think<00:35:42.000> it's<00:35:42.120> we're<00:35:42.240> better<00:35:42.560> today,<00:35:43.360> but<00:35:43.840> 10<00:35:44.080> years<00:35:44.360> ago<00:35:44.960> when<00:35:45.640> when<00:35:45.840> I<00:35:45.880> had<00:35:46.040> to<00:35:46.120> go

00:35:46.280 --> 00:35:53.640
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00:35:53.640 --> 00:35:57.880
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00:35:57.880 --> 00:36:02.400
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00:36:02.400 --> 00:36:08.120
Right.<00:36:03.120> For<00:36:03.240> sure.<00:36:03.720> Yeah.<00:36:04.280> Thought<00:36:04.560> this<00:36:04.760> was<00:36:05.000> just<00:36:05.240> and<00:36:05.360> no<00:36:05.600> I<00:36:05.680> didn't<00:36:05.880> feel<00:36:06.000> like<00:36:06.160> I<00:36:06.200> had<00:36:06.360> anyone<00:36:06.760> to<00:36:06.880> talk<00:36:07.160> to<00:36:07.280> about<00:36:07.560> that.

00:36:08.120 --> 00:36:14.400
There<00:36:08.200> was<00:36:08.320> no<00:36:08.480> one<00:36:08.600> that<00:36:08.720> I<00:36:08.800> could<00:36:09.000> relate<00:36:09.360> to.<00:36:09.560> In<00:36:09.680> fact,<00:36:10.320> Bobby<00:36:10.560> Page<00:36:10.840> and<00:36:10.960> I<00:36:11.080> sat<00:36:11.400> down<00:36:11.720> for<00:36:11.880> lunch<00:36:12.280> and<00:36:12.600> we<00:36:13.160> this<00:36:13.320> whole<00:36:13.520> idea<00:36:13.800> started.

00:36:14.400 --> 00:36:22.560
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00:36:22.560 --> 00:36:29.035
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00:36:29.035 --> 00:36:34.560
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00:36:34.560 --> 00:36:36.800
So,<00:36:35.200> not<00:36:35.400> the<00:36:35.520> fight<00:36:35.760> club,<00:36:36.000> the<00:36:36.120> fail<00:36:36.440> club.

00:36:36.800 --> 00:36:41.640
So,<00:36:37.040> maybe<00:36:37.360> the<00:36:37.480> fail<00:36:37.680> club<00:36:37.920> is<00:36:38.280> and<00:36:38.400> you<00:36:38.480> know,<00:36:38.680> Lindsay<00:36:39.160> Ivey's<00:36:39.480> done<00:36:39.640> good<00:36:39.800> work<00:36:40.040> with<00:36:40.200> her<00:36:40.760> With<00:36:40.960> FailFest.

00:36:41.640 --> 00:36:43.960
Yeah,<00:36:41.800> what<00:36:42.000> Lindsay's<00:36:42.320> done<00:36:42.520> with<00:36:42.640> FailFest<00:36:43.160> is<00:36:43.280> so<00:36:43.520> cool.

00:36:43.960 --> 00:36:51.240
She's<00:36:44.240> the<00:36:44.320> best.<00:36:45.040> I<00:36:45.120> love<00:36:45.400> it.<00:36:46.040> Um<00:36:46.360> finally,<00:36:46.840> we<00:36:47.000> end<00:36:47.160> every<00:36:47.360> interview<00:36:47.600> with<00:36:47.720> the<00:36:47.800> same<00:36:48.040> question<00:36:48.560> and<00:36:48.760> that<00:36:48.920> is<00:36:49.040> at<00:36:49.200> ceo.com<00:36:50.000> we<00:36:50.120> believe<00:36:50.400> the<00:36:50.520> chances<00:36:50.960> one

00:36:51.240 --> 00:36:54.520
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00:36:54.520 --> 00:36:58.280
When<00:36:54.680> you<00:36:54.880> hear<00:36:55.080> that,<00:36:55.320> who<00:36:55.480> gave<00:36:55.680> you<00:36:55.800> a<00:36:55.840> chance<00:36:56.120> to<00:36:56.200> get<00:36:56.320> you<00:36:56.400> to<00:36:56.480> where<00:36:56.640> you<00:36:56.760> are<00:36:56.880> today?

00:36:58.280 --> 00:37:02.960
Um<00:36:58.600> 2005<00:37:00.240> I<00:37:00.280> was<00:37:00.400> part<00:37:00.640> of<00:37:00.720> a<00:37:00.840> program<00:37:01.320> called<00:37:01.560> Hunto.

00:37:02.960 --> 00:37:11.320
Yeah.<00:37:03.520> Greg<00:37:03.840> Warnock.<00:37:04.600> That<00:37:05.160> was<00:37:05.480> one<00:37:05.720> of<00:37:06.040> like<00:37:06.240> pre<00:37:07.280> maybe<00:37:07.600> pre-Y<00:37:08.000> Combinator<00:37:08.760> or<00:37:08.880> about<00:37:09.120> the<00:37:09.200> same<00:37:09.440> time,<00:37:09.720> same<00:37:09.960> time<00:37:10.160> as<00:37:10.280> Techstars.

00:37:11.320 --> 00:37:19.040
Super<00:37:11.920> early<00:37:12.320> entrepreneurship<00:37:13.040> incubator<00:37:13.600> and<00:37:13.760> Allan<00:37:14.080> Hall<00:37:15.000> and<00:37:15.160> Greg<00:37:15.400> Warnock<00:37:15.920> threw<00:37:16.200> a<00:37:16.280> couple<00:37:16.560> million<00:37:16.880> bucks<00:37:17.240> in<00:37:17.360> a<00:37:17.400> bunch<00:37:17.640> of<00:37:17.720> young<00:37:17.960> entrepreneurs<00:37:18.640> to<00:37:18.760> give

00:37:19.040 --> 00:37:26.840
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00:37:26.840 --> 00:37:35.120
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00:37:35.120 --> 00:37:39.880
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00:37:39.880 --> 00:37:47.720
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00:37:47.720 --> 00:37:50.600
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00:37:50.600 --> 00:37:54.800
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00:37:54.800 --> 00:37:58.440
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00:37:58.440 --> 00:38:06.520
If<00:37:58.600> it<00:37:58.720> wasn't<00:37:59.120> for<00:37:59.240> that,<00:37:59.640> I<00:37:59.760> would<00:37:59.920> not<00:38:00.160> have<00:38:01.280> had<00:38:01.520> the<00:38:01.640> opportunity<00:38:02.160> to<00:38:02.600> to<00:38:02.720> work<00:38:02.960> in<00:38:03.040> venture<00:38:03.320> capital<00:38:03.800> for<00:38:03.920> seven<00:38:04.280> years<00:38:04.640> where<00:38:04.800> I<00:38:05.200> was<00:38:05.400> able<00:38:05.600> to<00:38:05.720> rub<00:38:05.920> shoulders<00:38:06.360> with

00:38:06.520 --> 00:38:11.160
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00:38:11.160 --> 00:38:20.360
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00:38:20.360 --> 00:38:29.320
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00:38:29.320 --> 00:38:37.120
No<00:38:29.520> business.<00:38:30.360> I<00:38:30.440> just<00:38:30.680> had<00:38:31.160> um<00:38:32.240> Alan<00:38:32.520> Hall<00:38:32.680> or<00:38:32.760> Greg<00:38:32.960> Warnock<00:38:33.400> who<00:38:33.520> said,<00:38:34.120> "Listen,<00:38:34.440> we<00:38:34.520> need<00:38:34.720> some<00:38:34.840> people<00:38:35.280> to<00:38:35.440> help<00:38:35.680> us<00:38:35.800> raise<00:38:36.040> capital."

00:38:37.120 --> 00:38:45.600
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00:38:45.600 --> 00:38:54.320
I<00:38:45.640> had<00:38:45.920> no<00:38:46.160> business<00:38:46.560> working<00:38:46.840> in<00:38:46.920> venture<00:38:47.160> capital,<00:38:47.640> but<00:38:48.480> um<00:38:48.800> they<00:38:49.080> saw<00:38:49.360> something<00:38:49.800> in<00:38:49.920> me<00:38:50.120> and<00:38:50.240> they<00:38:50.360> gave<00:38:50.600> me<00:38:50.720> a<00:38:50.800> chance<00:38:51.480> and<00:38:52.320> that<00:38:52.520> was<00:38:53.000> um<00:38:53.880> something

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I<00:38:54.440> will<00:38:54.760> I<00:38:54.840> will<00:38:55.040> forever<00:38:55.360> be<00:38:55.480> grateful<00:38:55.880> for.

00:38:56.920 --> 00:39:02.280
So,<00:38:57.840> all<00:38:58.040> the<00:38:58.760> conversations<00:38:59.560> about<00:38:59.840> venture<00:39:00.120> capital<00:39:00.560> notwithstanding,<00:39:01.440> right?

00:39:02.280 --> 00:39:04.680
Um<00:39:02.720> I'm<00:39:02.960> Yeah,<00:39:03.160> I<00:39:03.240> mean<00:39:03.400> there's<00:39:03.600> still<00:39:03.760> a<00:39:03.800> place<00:39:04.120> for<00:39:04.280> it,<00:39:04.400> right?

00:39:04.680 --> 00:39:07.400
And<00:39:04.840> who<00:39:05.320> Did<00:39:05.480> Hunto<00:39:05.800> did<00:39:05.960> you<00:39:06.040> have<00:39:06.160> to<00:39:06.240> give<00:39:06.360> up<00:39:06.560> equity?

00:39:07.400 --> 00:39:09.920
By<00:39:07.520> the<00:39:07.600> way,<00:39:07.680> am<00:39:07.800> I<00:39:07.840> saying<00:39:08.080> it<00:39:08.120> right?<00:39:08.240> Is<00:39:08.280> it<00:39:08.400> called<00:39:08.600> Hunto?<00:39:09.360> Hunto.

00:39:09.920 --> 00:39:14.600
Yeah.<00:39:10.080> Hunto,<00:39:10.320> yeah,<00:39:10.480> yeah.<00:39:11.200> Um<00:39:12.120> that<00:39:12.280> was<00:39:12.440> like<00:39:12.720> a<00:39:13.000> what<00:39:13.200> Benjamin<00:39:13.600> Franklin's?

00:39:14.600 --> 00:39:21.240
Like<00:39:14.760> it's<00:39:15.000> it's<00:39:15.240> something<00:39:15.520> Yeah,<00:39:15.680> yeah,<00:39:15.920> yeah.<00:39:16.160> So,<00:39:16.560> um<00:39:17.400> anyways,<00:39:17.680> did<00:39:17.840> you<00:39:17.920> have<00:39:18.040> to<00:39:18.120> give<00:39:18.240> up<00:39:18.400> equity<00:39:19.160> or<00:39:19.440> was<00:39:19.720> it<00:39:20.800> Yeah,<00:39:21.040> for<00:39:21.160> sure.

00:39:21.240 --> 00:39:24.040
Was<00:39:21.496> it<00:39:21.752> like<00:39:22.008> a<00:39:22.264> Y<00:39:22.520> Combinator<00:39:22.776> type<00:39:23.032> thing?<00:39:23.288> Yeah,<00:39:23.544> you<00:39:23.800> did.

00:39:24.040 --> 00:39:26.720
We<00:39:24.360> There<00:39:24.480> was<00:39:25.000> It<00:39:25.080> was<00:39:25.200> interesting.<00:39:25.760> came<00:39:26.000> out<00:39:26.120> of<00:39:26.200> that,<00:39:26.440> right?

00:39:26.720 --> 00:39:28.880
Wasn't<00:39:26.960> HireVue<00:39:27.360> in<00:39:27.480> there?<00:39:28.080> Good<00:39:28.280> memory,<00:39:28.560> Clint.

00:39:28.880 --> 00:39:34.160
Yeah,<00:39:29.040> you<00:39:29.840> You<00:39:29.880> and<00:39:29.960> I<00:39:30.040> are<00:39:30.120> old<00:39:30.240> enough<00:39:30.480> to<00:39:30.560> remember<00:39:30.800> there's<00:39:31.040> there<00:39:31.360> But<00:39:31.520> here's<00:39:31.720> the<00:39:31.800> interesting<00:39:32.160> thing,<00:39:32.320> there<00:39:32.480> are<00:39:32.600> some<00:39:32.960> great<00:39:33.160> companies<00:39:33.520> that<00:39:33.640> kind<00:39:33.800> of<00:39:33.880> came

00:39:34.160 --> 00:39:39.560
out<00:39:34.560> of<00:39:34.760> Hunto,<00:39:35.760> but<00:39:36.040> more<00:39:36.280> importantly,<00:39:36.720> there's<00:39:36.880> some<00:39:37.000> great<00:39:37.240> entrepreneurs<00:39:38.400> that<00:39:39.040> came<00:39:39.160> out<00:39:39.240> of<00:39:39.280> Hunto.

00:39:39.560 --> 00:39:43.400
Incredible<00:39:40.120> entrepreneurs.<00:39:40.920> Yeah,<00:39:41.160> it's<00:39:41.400> fun<00:39:41.640> to<00:39:42.040> to<00:39:42.200> see<00:39:42.440> some<00:39:42.600> of<00:39:42.640> those<00:39:42.840> entrepreneurs.

00:39:43.400 --> 00:39:47.200
I<00:39:43.480> bump<00:39:43.680> into<00:39:43.880> them<00:39:44.000> all<00:39:44.120> the<00:39:44.200> time<00:39:44.600> and<00:39:45.000> they've<00:39:45.160> all<00:39:45.320> had<00:39:45.520> success<00:39:45.960> in<00:39:46.040> their<00:39:46.240> own<00:39:46.440> right.

00:39:47.200 --> 00:39:55.760
And<00:39:47.640> um<00:39:48.000> I<00:39:48.120> think<00:39:48.360> that<00:39:48.720> was<00:39:48.960> the<00:39:49.200> biggest<00:39:50.600> uh<00:39:50.920> return<00:39:51.480> on<00:39:51.600> investment<00:39:52.800> is<00:39:53.160> what<00:39:53.320> it<00:39:53.440> did<00:39:53.840> for<00:39:54.720> I<00:39:54.800> think<00:39:54.960> we<00:39:55.080> ran<00:39:55.280> Hunto

00:39:55.760 --> 00:40:05.480
for<00:39:55.960> 3<00:39:56.320> years<00:39:56.880> as<00:39:57.080> an<00:39:57.160> investment<00:39:57.720> vehicle<00:39:58.240> and<00:39:58.360> then<00:39:58.480> Greg<00:39:58.760> and<00:39:58.880> I<00:39:59.000> Greg<00:39:59.280> asked<00:39:59.520> me<00:39:59.640> to<00:39:59.760> help<00:40:00.000> run<00:40:00.200> it<00:40:00.720> for<00:40:00.880> several<00:40:01.240> years<00:40:01.600> just<00:40:01.880> as<00:40:02.520> free<00:40:02.720> education<00:40:03.400> for<00:40:03.680> aspiring<00:40:04.200> entrepreneurs.

00:40:05.480 --> 00:40:12.640
And<00:40:05.720> we<00:40:05.840> did<00:40:06.000> that<00:40:06.240> for<00:40:06.360> a<00:40:06.400> number<00:40:06.680> of<00:40:06.760> years.<00:40:07.440> Um<00:40:07.880> and<00:40:08.640> and<00:40:08.760> I<00:40:08.960> it's<00:40:09.240> it's<00:40:09.440> fun<00:40:09.640> I<00:40:10.040> I<00:40:10.120> still<00:40:10.480> bump<00:40:10.720> into<00:40:11.080> some<00:40:11.320> Hunto<00:40:11.680> alum.

00:40:12.640 --> 00:40:20.880
But<00:40:12.880> at<00:40:12.960> the<00:40:13.080> time<00:40:13.400> what<00:40:13.520> they<00:40:13.640> did<00:40:13.760> it<00:40:13.840> was<00:40:13.960> a<00:40:14.040> $250,000<00:40:15.280> investment<00:40:16.360> and<00:40:16.800> there<00:40:16.920> was<00:40:17.240> equity<00:40:17.960> shared<00:40:18.360> obviously<00:40:18.760> with<00:40:18.880> the<00:40:18.920> investors<00:40:20.400> Hunter<00:40:20.680> Greg

00:40:20.880 --> 00:40:24.680
and<00:40:21.000> Alan<00:40:21.480> and<00:40:21.920> there<00:40:22.040> was<00:40:22.160> also<00:40:22.440> shared<00:40:22.720> equity<00:40:23.040> across<00:40:23.440> the<00:40:23.560> partners.

00:40:24.680 --> 00:40:32.640
So<00:40:24.800> the<00:40:25.120> the<00:40:25.240> idea<00:40:25.720> was<00:40:26.080> let's<00:40:26.400> de-risk<00:40:27.080> the<00:40:27.200> entrepreneurial<00:40:27.760> journey<00:40:28.240> journey<00:40:28.480> cuz<00:40:29.160> Greg<00:40:29.400> knew<00:40:29.600> that<00:40:29.880> probably<00:40:30.880> you<00:40:30.960> know<00:40:31.040> best<00:40:31.320> case<00:40:31.520> scenario<00:40:31.880> one<00:40:32.080> out<00:40:32.200> of<00:40:32.280> five

00:40:32.640 --> 00:40:38.560
win<00:40:33.400> and<00:40:33.560> that<00:40:33.760> could<00:40:33.920> return<00:40:34.480> the<00:40:34.600> investment<00:40:35.240> for<00:40:35.360> the<00:40:35.560> others<00:40:36.520> that<00:40:36.840> were<00:40:36.960> their<00:40:37.240> ventures<00:40:37.640> had<00:40:37.800> failed.

00:40:38.560 --> 00:40:43.720
So<00:40:38.720> it<00:40:38.800> was<00:40:38.920> a<00:40:38.960> really<00:40:39.440> interesting<00:40:40.040> experiment.<00:40:41.800> It<00:40:41.880> did<00:40:42.040> not<00:40:42.280> return<00:40:42.640> capital.

00:40:43.720 --> 00:40:51.320
Um<00:40:44.160> so<00:40:44.400> it<00:40:44.520> was<00:40:44.760> philanthropic<00:40:45.480> by<00:40:45.640> nature<00:40:47.120> but<00:40:47.360> we<00:40:47.480> learned<00:40:47.800> a<00:40:47.840> lot<00:40:48.400> and<00:40:48.720> some<00:40:49.040> some<00:40:49.240> great<00:40:49.480> entrepreneurs<00:40:50.040> were<00:40:50.160> born.

00:40:51.320 --> 00:40:53.440
Uh<00:40:51.680> that's<00:40:51.840> awesome.<00:40:52.200> Joe<00:40:52.400> thanks<00:40:52.640> so<00:40:52.720> much<00:40:52.880> for<00:40:53.000> coming<00:40:53.240> on.

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Let's<00:40:53.640> have<00:40:53.760> you<00:40:53.880> on<00:40:53.960> again.<00:40:55.080> Thank<00:40:55.320> you.

00:40:55.440 --> 00:40:59.240
pleasure.<00:40:56.360> I<00:40:56.480> really<00:40:56.760> appreciate<00:40:57.240> it.