Run the nonprofit like a business

Andrew Exner runs an organization with nearly 1,000 people on payroll and more than $84 million in annual research expenditures. He got the job because he knew the person hiring.

"I reached out to him from a network perspective," Exner told the CEO.com Podcast. "He said, 'Great, I've got a job for you.'"

That is not the usual path to executive director of the San José State University Research Foundation. The usual path runs through a terminal degree, a faculty appointment, tenure, and a slow migration into research administration. Exner has a bachelor's in Applied Communications from Mount Royal University in Calgary. He wanted to do sports PR. He has never been a professor.

What he has done is run things. His boss needed someone who could manage a large organization, fix problems that had gone unfixed, and make it more efficient. Exner had done that at for-profits and nonprofits, large and small, in two countries. The skills transferred.

He still meets every person who joins the foundation. He considers hiring the one thing a leader should not offload, and he says it gets harder to hold onto as an organization grows. He holds onto it anyway.

The foundation is a 501(c)(3), one of the oldest nonprofit corporations in the California State University system. It was founded on December 6, 1932 as The San José State College Corporation, and its first project was building the original Spartan football stadium in 1933 with Works Progress Administration labor. Today it exists for one purpose: to let San José State faculty do research without doing the administration. When a professor wants a grant, the foundation applies. When the grant lands, the foundation manages it, hires staff, buys equipment, and finds space. It owns and manages the university's intellectual property. It signs every agreement that lets a researcher touch outside data or work with another institution. It also owns property, is heavily invested in the marine lab at Moss Landing, and has a partnership with NASA.

"There are legal and liability reasons why we're structured as a separate entity from the university," Exner said. "But we do try to operate like a department within the university."

Since he arrived in 2020, the foundation has grown revenue while pushing down the share it spends on administration. He also serves as board secretary and as interim director of the university's Office of Innovation and Corporate Partnerships, the office responsible for commercialization, technology transfer, and economic development.

Asked what separates running a large nonprofit from running a large company, he said there is more overlap than difference. The planning cadence is the same. So are execution, efficiency, and a leader's daily obligations. What changes is the legal structure and the mission. He thinks many large nonprofits could stand to borrow more from business: structure, urgency, and goal-oriented behavior, and he thinks that is roughly why he was hired.

His career started at SMART Technologies in Canada. He was doing copyediting and press releases. The company had a product launch bigger than its team, and a colleague who had noticed Exner asking a lot of questions gave him the job of coordinating it. That was his entry to product management, which he calls the place he learned how a business actually works. He later ran tech transfer and a grant-funded startup program at TECTERRA, a government-backed innovation center, and spent time at FrontRow and the California School Boards Association, where he was senior director of business development.

The move to the United States came when an education technology company in California put him in charge of a global sales team and a quota. He had never closed a sale.

"Someone basically put me in charge of a quota and a sales team, a global sales team all over the world, even though I had never actually gone in front of a customer," he said.

Product management left him with a habit he still uses: building frameworks. Take a problem with too many variables, cut it into pieces, decide how you would make the call with the data you have and the data you don't, then sit in a room with smart people and let them try to break it. He said those were the best meetings of his career. He used the same approach when SMART shifted from selling one product to selling a portfolio, and he had to explain to the market how the pieces fit together.

San José State sits in the middle of Silicon Valley. For most of its history, it has been known as the place that supplies the valley with engineers. Exner said that started to change about 18 months to two years ago, when AI products arrived, and the university realized it was positioned to have a say in how the technology gets built and used. He argues that most people assume work happens in a college of engineering or computer science. At San José State, it also runs through the humanities, the arts, psychology, and health sciences, and through a long institutional history in social justice and ethics. He thinks that mix is rare and that it matters for how AI actually gets deployed.

For his side of the house, AI is an infrastructure problem before it is anything else. Where does the computing come from? How is the data secured? How do you run joint projects with international universities without creating a security hole? He pointed to the CHIPS Act as a major opportunity for universities to steer some of that money toward machine learning.

He also made a point that gets lost in most conversations about higher education: the federal funding of university research is an American invention, built during World War II and the Cold War, and it remains one of the country's structural advantages. The foundation does not forecast the macroeconomy. It forecasts on what Washington decides to spend on science.

On the politics of campus life, he was unbothered. Monday through Friday, he said, it feels the same as it always has: young people going to school. He pointed to what a degree still does for a first-generation student at a Hispanic-serving institution like San José State, and said campus protest has been part of the college experience for as long as there have been campuses. Administrators are struggling to balance free speech and student safety. He does not think it threatens the mission.

He is an immigrant from Canada and now a U.S. citizen, and he said that shapes how he reads American politics. He is optimistic by default. He is also convinced that income inequality is underneath most of the country's anger, that the economic indicators look fine on paper while most people feel the economy is not working for them, and that nothing settles until a party or a system speaks to that gap. He said he does not know how it ends otherwise.

He does not read many books. He still reads CBC every morning and the New York Times. He liked airport magazine stands when he traveled more. He listens to The Daily, Stratechery, and Pivot, and actively avoids political analysis shows.

"It's kind of like sports analysis," he said. "They don't know what's going to happen, but they're happy to talk for an hour about all the potential outcomes."

Every guest on the CEO.com Podcast gets the same last question: who gave you a chance? Exner named the SMART colleague who handed him the product launch, and the person in California who handed him a sales team. Both saw a skill set and let him sink or swim.

"There's been a few of those people throughout my career who have really allowed me to try things out and see if I could make it work," he said.

00:00:00 Introduction to Andrew and His Role
00:00:25 Andrew's Unique Career Path
00:01:53 Overview of the Research Foundation
00:04:11 Comparing Nonprofits and For-Profit Companies
00:05:42 A Day in the Life of Andrew
00:07:55 The Impact of AI on Research and Fundraising
00:12:20 Political Climate on College Campuses
00:15:11 Reading Preferences and Recommendations
00:17:52 Key Leadership Traits
00:21:33 Thoughts on the Economic and Political Environment
00:26:14 Opportunities Given by Others
00:29:22 Conclusion and Closing Remarks

WEBVTT

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We<00:03:11.549> have<00:03:11.677> about<00:03:11.821> 1,000<00:03:12.351> people<00:03:12.480> on<00:03:12.656> payroll,<00:03:13.443> so<00:03:13.700> there's<00:03:13.861> a<00:03:13.925> lot<00:03:14.118> of<00:03:14.262> research<00:03:14.583> activity<00:03:15.129> at<00:03:15.209> San<00:03:15.450> Jose<00:03:15.627> State<00:03:15.948> University.

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And,<00:03:17.217> you<00:03:17.249> know,<00:03:17.457> every,<00:03:17.939> you<00:03:17.971> know,<00:03:18.116> couple<00:03:18.357> times<00:03:18.597> a<00:03:18.662> month<00:03:18.902> when<00:03:19.063> we,<00:03:19.464> you<00:03:19.497> know,<00:03:19.737> cut<00:03:19.962> paychecks<00:03:20.444> for<00:03:20.524> everyone<00:03:21.006> based<00:03:21.247> on<00:03:21.327> the<00:03:21.472> work<00:03:21.648> they've<00:03:21.809> done<00:03:21.969> on<00:03:22.130> research,<00:03:22.612> we<00:03:22.660> have<00:03:22.788> a<00:03:22.917> large<00:03:23.832> staff<00:03:24.314> of<00:03:24.458> people<00:03:24.779> doing<00:03:25.100> research.

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So<00:03:25.759> a<00:03:25.807> lot<00:03:25.983> of<00:03:26.064> it<00:03:26.160> is<00:03:26.305> just<00:03:26.610> management<00:03:27.107> of<00:03:27.188> a<00:03:27.332> large<00:03:27.750> nonprofit<00:03:28.312> organization<00:03:29.580> with<00:03:29.741> a<00:03:29.757> lot<00:03:30.062> of,<00:03:31.603> you<00:03:31.748> know,<00:03:31.908> human<00:03:32.181> resources<00:03:32.727> administration,<00:03:33.514> IT<00:03:33.787> needs.

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And<00:03:34.895> so<00:03:34.975> we<00:03:35.071> manage<00:03:35.521> all<00:03:35.682> those<00:03:36.003> areas.

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On<00:03:36.982> behalf<00:03:37.303> of<00:03:37.447> the<00:03:37.527> university.

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It's<00:03:38.907> a<00:03:38.971> separate<00:03:39.292> organization,<00:03:39.870> but<00:03:40.014> we<00:03:40.110> do<00:03:40.255> try<00:03:40.431> to<00:03:40.495> operate<00:03:40.977> like<00:03:41.089> a<00:03:41.153> department<00:03:41.699> within<00:03:41.875> the<00:03:41.955> university.

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We<00:03:42.677> try<00:03:42.838> to<00:03:42.934> make<00:03:43.094> it<00:03:43.174> seamless<00:03:43.784> for<00:03:43.945> our<00:03:44.859> stakeholders,<00:03:45.485> our<00:03:45.645> customers,<00:03:46.126> so<00:03:46.287> to<00:03:46.383> speak,<00:03:46.672> who<00:03:46.832> access<00:03:47.105> our<00:03:47.265> services.

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We<00:03:49.014> just<00:03:49.174> want<00:03:49.415> to<00:03:49.495> make<00:03:49.656> their<00:03:49.816> lives<00:03:50.073> as<00:03:50.281> easy<00:03:50.458> as<00:03:50.618> possible<00:03:51.244> and<00:03:51.340> take<00:03:51.645> all<00:03:51.677> the<00:03:51.805> administrative<00:03:52.463> needs<00:03:52.720> of<00:03:52.864> performing<00:03:53.346> research<00:03:53.827> off<00:03:53.987> their<00:03:54.132> plates.

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So<00:03:55.575> we<00:03:55.656> try<00:03:55.832> to<00:03:55.993> integrate<00:03:56.378> as<00:03:56.474> much<00:03:56.634> as<00:03:56.715> possible,<00:03:57.340> but<00:03:57.420> there<00:03:57.517> are<00:03:58.078> legal<00:03:58.624> and<00:03:59.281> kind<00:03:59.458> of<00:03:59.586> liability<00:04:00.228> reasons<00:04:00.565> why<00:04:00.725> we're<00:04:00.805> structured<00:04:01.287> as<00:04:01.383> a<00:04:01.447> separate<00:04:01.848> entity<00:04:02.105> from<00:04:02.313> the<00:04:02.394> university.

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What<00:04:03.758> would<00:04:03.919> you<00:04:04.192> say<00:04:04.417> to<00:04:04.561> people<00:04:04.802> who<00:04:04.882> are<00:04:04.979> like,<00:04:05.220> hey,<00:04:05.380> what's<00:04:05.605> the<00:04:05.685> difference<00:04:05.959> between<00:04:06.248> running<00:04:06.505> a<00:04:06.649> large<00:04:06.986> 501<00:04:07.934> versus<00:04:08.577> running<00:04:08.834> a<00:04:08.914> large<00:04:09.299> company?

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It's<00:04:11.484> a<00:04:11.725> good<00:04:11.885> question.

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Not,<00:04:13.877> you<00:04:13.909> know,<00:04:14.295> there's<00:04:14.471> more<00:04:14.776> like<00:04:15.162> than<00:04:15.339> dislike<00:04:15.837> is<00:04:15.965> what<00:04:16.126> I<00:04:16.206> would<00:04:16.318> say.

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There's<00:04:16.784> a<00:04:16.864> lot<00:04:17.105> more<00:04:17.266> similarities<00:04:18.230> than<00:04:18.390> there<00:04:19.434> are<00:04:20.141> differences.

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And<00:04:21.860> it's<00:04:22.085> interesting,<00:04:22.647> you<00:04:22.727> know,<00:04:22.952> all<00:04:23.064> the<00:04:23.225> things<00:04:23.514> that<00:04:23.594> you<00:04:23.771> learn<00:04:24.076> through<00:04:24.317> your<00:04:24.478> career<00:04:24.815> that<00:04:24.895> are<00:04:24.976> applicable<00:04:25.538> to<00:04:25.682> just<00:04:25.859> managing<00:04:26.277> a<00:04:26.405> large<00:04:26.742> organization<00:04:28.734> are<00:04:29.071> very,<00:04:29.618> very<00:04:29.778> much<00:04:29.955> the<00:04:30.019> same.

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I've<00:04:30.501> had<00:04:30.678> positions<00:04:31.240> in<00:04:32.203> large<00:04:32.459> and<00:04:32.587> small<00:04:32.844> for-profits,<00:04:33.806> large<00:04:34.127> and<00:04:34.223> small<00:04:34.849> nonprofits.

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Um,<00:04:37.238> yeah,<00:04:37.639> there's,<00:04:37.815> there's<00:04:37.992> a<00:04:38.040> lot<00:04:38.216> of<00:04:38.296> overlap.

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I<00:04:38.938> mean,<00:04:39.964> you<00:04:40.044> know,<00:04:40.204> there<00:04:40.301> are,<00:04:40.702> there<00:04:40.782> are<00:04:41.006> core<00:04:41.263> legal<00:04:41.551> differences<00:04:41.984> and<00:04:42.145> core<00:04:42.610> kind<00:04:42.802> of<00:04:43.267> differences<00:04:43.813> related<00:04:44.326> to<00:04:44.951> what<00:04:45.111> the<00:04:45.256> mission<00:04:45.592> and<00:04:45.753> vision<00:04:46.074> and<00:04:46.234> execution<00:04:46.859> are,<00:04:47.437> but,<00:04:47.982> you<00:04:48.030> know,<00:04:48.158> the<00:04:48.238> planning<00:04:48.703> cadence,<00:04:49.120> the<00:04:49.265> execution,<00:04:49.922> the<00:04:50.018> efficiency,<00:04:50.868> all<00:04:50.964> of<00:04:51.045> the<00:04:51.205> day-to-day<00:04:51.622> things<00:04:52.007> that<00:04:52.103> a<00:04:52.167> leader<00:04:52.472> is<00:04:52.568> responsible<00:04:53.225> for<00:04:53.370> ensuring,<00:04:54.717> um,<00:04:55.519> uh,<00:04:55.759> are<00:04:55.855> very<00:04:56.032> similar.

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And<00:04:56.673> so,<00:04:57.363> you<00:04:57.395> know,<00:04:57.539> again,<00:04:57.924> I<00:04:58.100> think<00:04:58.822> I<00:04:59.062> was<00:04:59.222> given<00:04:59.399> an<00:04:59.527> opportunity<00:05:00.024> to<00:05:00.168> get<00:05:00.280> into<00:05:00.504> this<00:05:00.745> role<00:05:01.049> because<00:05:01.306> someone<00:05:01.706> understood<00:05:02.347> that<00:05:02.507> those<00:05:02.684> skills<00:05:03.228> were<00:05:03.389> very<00:05:03.773> much<00:05:04.350> transferable.

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And<00:05:06.033> not<00:05:06.257> only<00:05:06.433> that,<00:05:07.154> there<00:05:07.250> was<00:05:07.395> a<00:05:07.411> need,<00:05:07.859> I<00:05:07.939> think,<00:05:08.580> you<00:05:08.612> know,<00:05:09.382> as<00:05:09.542> there<00:05:09.718> probably<00:05:10.023> isn't<00:05:10.199> a<00:05:10.215> lot<00:05:10.535> of<00:05:10.744> large<00:05:11.000> nonprofits,<00:05:12.106> to<00:05:12.266> run<00:05:12.426> it<00:05:12.538> a<00:05:12.666> bit<00:05:12.923> more<00:05:13.243> like<00:05:13.484> a<00:05:13.564> business,<00:05:14.285> right?

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To<00:05:14.686> kind<00:05:14.862> of<00:05:14.990> apply<00:05:15.423> some<00:05:15.663> of<00:05:15.743> those<00:05:15.967> lessons,<00:05:17.041> to<00:05:17.233> try<00:05:17.410> to<00:05:17.570> apply<00:05:18.051> some<00:05:18.291> of<00:05:18.355> the<00:05:18.435> same<00:05:18.708> structure<00:05:19.332> and<00:05:19.493> urgency,<00:05:20.839> um,<00:05:21.015> you<00:05:21.111> know,<00:05:21.255> kind<00:05:21.432> of<00:05:22.040> goal-oriented<00:05:23.082> behavior.

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A<00:05:24.284> lot<00:05:24.540> of<00:05:24.845> the<00:05:25.566> you<00:05:25.647> know,<00:05:27.109> it's<00:05:27.269> not<00:05:27.494> always<00:05:27.735> the<00:05:27.815> case,<00:05:28.233> but<00:05:28.394> a<00:05:28.458> lot<00:05:28.635> of<00:05:28.699> those<00:05:28.860> kind<00:05:29.020> of<00:05:29.052> stereotypical<00:05:31.125> views<00:05:31.623> about<00:05:32.009> how<00:05:32.153> you<00:05:32.266> think<00:05:32.571> nonprofits<00:05:33.213> work<00:05:33.535> versus<00:05:33.840> how<00:05:33.920> you<00:05:34.017> think<00:05:34.242> nonprofits—<00:05:34.981> I<00:05:35.061> think<00:05:35.190> a<00:05:35.222> lot<00:05:35.400> of<00:05:35.465> the<00:05:35.546> nonprofit<00:05:36.179> traits<00:05:36.504> can<00:05:36.682> be<00:05:36.715> very<00:05:36.990> useful<00:05:37.412> to<00:05:37.737> nonprofit<00:05:38.240> organizations.

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What<00:05:39.943> does<00:05:40.089> a<00:05:40.171> typical<00:05:40.576> day<00:05:40.803> look<00:05:40.966> like<00:05:41.144> for<00:05:41.225> you?

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You<00:05:44.066> know,<00:05:44.536> there<00:05:44.698> is<00:05:44.843> no—<00:05:45.021> you<00:05:45.086> know,<00:05:45.264> like<00:05:45.410> a<00:05:45.442> lot<00:05:45.588> of<00:05:45.669> people<00:05:45.814> would<00:05:45.928> say,<00:05:46.090> there<00:05:46.235> is<00:05:46.397> no<00:05:46.624> typical<00:05:47.045> day.

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But,<00:05:47.870> you<00:05:47.951> know,<00:05:48.404> I<00:05:48.501> spend<00:05:48.695> a<00:05:48.728> lot<00:05:48.841> of<00:05:48.906> time<00:05:49.068> in<00:05:49.149> meetings,<00:05:49.796> you<00:05:49.828> know,<00:05:50.039> with<00:05:50.201> my<00:05:50.363> leadership<00:05:50.848> team.

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You<00:05:52.420> know,<00:05:52.966> talking<00:05:53.270> about<00:05:53.527> kind<00:05:53.671> of<00:05:53.752> progress<00:05:54.233> on<00:05:54.393> major,<00:05:55.196> you<00:05:55.228> know,<00:05:55.517> programs<00:05:56.078> and<00:05:56.174> initiatives.

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You<00:05:57.811> know,<00:05:57.939> there's<00:05:58.260> a<00:05:58.324> lot<00:05:58.501> of<00:05:58.581> fighting<00:05:58.998> fires.

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You<00:06:00.586> know,<00:06:00.747> the<00:06:00.891> organization<00:06:01.549> is<00:06:01.774> big<00:06:01.934> and<00:06:02.030> complex<00:06:02.672> and<00:06:02.816> changing.

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And<00:06:03.490> so,<00:06:04.517> you<00:06:04.581> know,<00:06:04.678> there's<00:06:04.902> always<00:06:05.143> something<00:06:05.480> different<00:06:05.817> every<00:06:06.041> day<00:06:06.282> to<00:06:06.442> deal<00:06:06.683> with.

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You<00:06:08.368> know,<00:06:08.464> in<00:06:08.592> addition<00:06:08.881> to<00:06:09.009> our<00:06:09.170> core<00:06:09.491> functions,<00:06:10.132> the,<00:06:10.758> you<00:06:10.838> know,<00:06:11.159> the<00:06:11.641> Research<00:06:11.897> Foundation<00:06:12.379> specifically<00:06:13.004> has<00:06:13.165> a<00:06:13.245> lot<00:06:13.421> of<00:06:13.566> also,<00:06:14.063> you<00:06:14.127> know,<00:06:14.224> what<00:06:14.368> I<00:06:14.384> would<00:06:14.544> call<00:06:14.785> kind<00:06:15.026> of<00:06:15.106> like<00:06:15.266> secondary<00:06:16.694> operations<00:06:17.336> for<00:06:17.432> the<00:06:17.497> university.

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You<00:06:18.411> know,<00:06:18.539> we<00:06:18.636> own<00:06:18.796> some<00:06:19.021> property,<00:06:19.518> we're<00:06:19.662> heavily<00:06:19.999> invested<00:06:21.123> in<00:06:21.203> a<00:06:21.283> marine<00:06:22.326> lab<00:06:23.032> out<00:06:23.369> in<00:06:23.433> Moss<00:06:23.754> Landing.

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We<00:06:24.300> have<00:06:24.396> a<00:06:24.476> partnership<00:06:24.893> with<00:06:25.054> NASA.

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So<00:06:26.113> there's<00:06:26.273> a<00:06:26.338> big<00:06:26.562> variety<00:06:27.365> of<00:06:27.686> roles<00:06:28.006> where<00:06:28.087> I,<00:06:28.648> where<00:06:28.809> I<00:06:29.290> kind<00:06:29.403> of<00:06:29.467> step<00:06:29.788> into<00:06:30.093> it.

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You<00:06:30.847> know,<00:06:31.055> a<00:06:31.071> lot<00:06:31.248> of<00:06:31.328> it,<00:06:31.456> quite<00:06:31.617> frankly,<00:06:31.954> too,<00:06:32.195> is<00:06:32.339> escalation<00:06:32.788> management.

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You<00:06:33.559> know,<00:06:34.297> things<00:06:34.586> that<00:06:34.682> people<00:06:34.906> haven't<00:06:35.083> seen<00:06:35.324> before,<00:06:35.805> things<00:06:36.046> that<00:06:36.126> need<00:06:36.286> to<00:06:36.367> be<00:06:36.527> dealt<00:06:36.832> with,<00:06:38.052> processes<00:06:38.597> that<00:06:38.693> need<00:06:38.854> to<00:06:38.934> be<00:06:39.079> created.

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But<00:06:41.165> yeah,<00:06:41.245> I<00:06:41.341> mean,<00:06:41.582> typically<00:06:41.887> I<00:06:41.919> spend<00:06:42.208> a<00:06:42.224> lot<00:06:42.400> of<00:06:42.464> time,<00:06:43.331> you<00:06:43.411> know,<00:06:43.572> in<00:06:43.668> meetings<00:06:44.069> working<00:06:44.374> with<00:06:44.470> colleagues,<00:06:44.952> both<00:06:45.192> in<00:06:45.256> the<00:06:45.337> research<00:06:45.706> foundation,<00:06:46.155> at<00:06:46.251> the<00:06:46.300> university,<00:06:47.038> working<00:06:47.343> with<00:06:47.503> researchers.

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Trying<00:06:49.764> to<00:06:49.846> find<00:06:50.089> creative<00:06:50.495> new<00:06:50.674> ways<00:06:50.999> of<00:06:51.145> doing<00:06:51.486> things<00:06:51.811> and<00:06:51.973> leverage<00:06:52.607> the<00:06:53.354> resources<00:06:53.906> that<00:06:54.004> we<00:06:54.150> have<00:06:54.426> to<00:06:54.572> benefit<00:06:55.044> the<00:06:55.125> university.

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Yeah,<00:06:58.344> no<00:06:58.504> day<00:06:58.665> is<00:06:58.746> the<00:06:58.826> same,<00:06:59.308> but<00:06:59.549> again,<00:06:59.855> we<00:06:59.935> have<00:07:00.031> a<00:07:00.096> great<00:07:00.337> hybrid<00:07:00.658> work<00:07:00.851> environment<00:07:01.301> too.

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So<00:07:01.863> I<00:07:01.944> have<00:07:02.104> found<00:07:02.346> that,<00:07:02.506> you<00:07:02.587> know,<00:07:03.101> since<00:07:03.326> COVID<00:07:03.728> and<00:07:03.808> since,<00:07:04.194> you<00:07:04.226> know,<00:07:04.435> the<00:07:04.515> structure<00:07:04.933> that<00:07:05.013> we<00:07:05.158> have<00:07:05.431> in<00:07:05.576> terms<00:07:05.913> of<00:07:06.058> our<00:07:06.926> hybrid<00:07:07.894> work<00:07:08.217> with,<00:07:08.539> you<00:07:08.571> know,<00:07:08.717> we<00:07:09.023> spend<00:07:09.281> 2<00:07:09.378> days<00:07:09.604> in<00:07:09.684> the<00:07:09.830> office<00:07:10.168> together<00:07:10.571> as<00:07:10.668> a<00:07:10.733> team,<00:07:11.152> so<00:07:11.281> everybody's<00:07:11.700> together<00:07:12.168> in<00:07:12.265> the<00:07:12.426> office,<00:07:12.975> and<00:07:13.055> then<00:07:13.217> 3<00:07:13.378> days<00:07:13.571> a<00:07:13.636> week<00:07:13.862> we're<00:07:13.959> apart.

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And<00:07:14.739> it<00:07:14.803> does<00:07:15.029> change<00:07:15.286> the<00:07:15.431> cadence<00:07:15.769> and<00:07:15.866> structure<00:07:16.317> of<00:07:16.397> how<00:07:16.494> I<00:07:16.590> spend<00:07:16.880> my<00:07:17.057> week.

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You<00:07:17.476> know,<00:07:17.621> when<00:07:17.701> you<00:07:17.798> think<00:07:18.039> about<00:07:18.828> our<00:07:19.006> in-office<00:07:19.472> days<00:07:19.794> are<00:07:19.875> very<00:07:20.100> collaborative,<00:07:20.841> meeting<00:07:21.163> heavy,<00:07:23.256> you<00:07:23.337> know,<00:07:23.804> there<00:07:23.965> is<00:07:24.126> more<00:07:24.384> time<00:07:24.852> for,<00:07:25.174> you<00:07:25.206> know,<00:07:25.432> kind<00:07:25.594> of<00:07:25.690> individual<00:07:26.400> work,<00:07:26.965> you<00:07:27.045> know,<00:07:27.191> on<00:07:27.287> that<00:07:27.465> 3<00:07:27.691> days<00:07:28.013> where<00:07:28.158> you're<00:07:28.271> not<00:07:28.513> together.

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Although<00:07:29.546> the<00:07:29.626> tools<00:07:30.014> we<00:07:30.094> have<00:07:30.272> now<00:07:30.594> make<00:07:30.820> communication<00:07:31.869> so<00:07:32.062> seamless<00:07:32.691> that<00:07:33.240> it's<00:07:33.401> just<00:07:33.595> as<00:07:33.675> easy<00:07:33.853> to<00:07:33.950> get<00:07:33.998> a<00:07:34.063> hold<00:07:34.305> of<00:07:34.370> someone<00:07:35.260> over<00:07:35.502> chat<00:07:36.020> or<00:07:36.085> on<00:07:36.247> a<00:07:36.328> text<00:07:36.570> message<00:07:36.975> or<00:07:37.055> by<00:07:37.298> email,<00:07:38.188> you<00:07:38.269> know,<00:07:38.431> and<00:07:38.592> quite<00:07:38.916> frankly,<00:07:39.239> probably<00:07:39.886> easier<00:07:40.291> to<00:07:40.388> get<00:07:40.534> a<00:07:40.598> hold<00:07:40.776> of<00:07:40.841> someone<00:07:41.164> than<00:07:41.278> it<00:07:41.407> would<00:07:41.488> have<00:07:41.585> been<00:07:41.666> to<00:07:41.747> try<00:07:41.909> to<00:07:41.989> track<00:07:42.232> them<00:07:42.394> down<00:07:42.572> in<00:07:42.717> an<00:07:42.798> office.

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What,<00:07:44.989> how<00:07:45.133> are<00:07:45.229> you<00:07:45.390> thinking<00:07:45.646> about<00:07:45.951> AI?

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How<00:07:46.608> is<00:07:46.688> that<00:07:46.849> changing<00:07:47.634> fundraising?

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How<00:07:48.596> is<00:07:48.692> it<00:07:48.836> changing<00:07:49.317> the<00:07:49.397> way<00:07:49.558> you<00:07:49.702> manage<00:07:50.135> the<00:07:50.311> organization?

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And<00:07:51.241> how<00:07:51.417> is<00:07:51.562> that<00:07:51.722> changing<00:07:52.123> even<00:07:52.283> maybe<00:07:52.556> the<00:07:52.764> grants<00:07:53.101> that<00:07:53.245> you're<00:07:53.341> applying<00:07:54.704> for?

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Yeah,<00:07:55.329> it's<00:07:55.569> a,<00:07:55.746> it's<00:07:55.922> an<00:07:56.050> excellent<00:07:56.307> question.

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It's<00:07:56.852> something,<00:07:57.269> you<00:07:57.365> know,<00:07:57.974> uh,<00:07:58.776> you<00:07:58.856> know,<00:07:59.192> a<00:07:59.208> select<00:07:59.625> group<00:07:59.850> of<00:07:59.978> us<00:08:00.218> are<00:08:00.379> consciously<00:08:00.956> spending<00:08:01.357> time<00:08:01.773> thinking<00:08:02.094> about,<00:08:03.104> you<00:08:03.136> know,<00:08:03.280> the<00:08:03.425> university<00:08:03.922> is<00:08:04.002> an<00:08:04.082> interesting<00:08:04.547> place.

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It<00:08:05.124> is<00:08:05.364> the,<00:08:05.845> it<00:08:05.941> is<00:08:06.166> the<00:08:06.711> oldest<00:08:07.032> public<00:08:07.512> university<00:08:08.250> in<00:08:08.394> the<00:08:08.474> West.

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It<00:08:09.917> is<00:08:10.093> geographically<00:08:10.815> centered<00:08:11.199> right<00:08:11.456> in<00:08:11.536> the<00:08:11.568> middle<00:08:11.761> of<00:08:11.857> Silicon<00:08:12.322> Valley.

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Traditionally,<00:08:13.876> it's<00:08:14.021> been<00:08:14.261> known<00:08:14.582> more<00:08:14.822> as<00:08:14.967> a<00:08:15.127> workforce<00:08:15.624> development<00:08:16.409> engine.

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You<00:08:17.018> know,<00:08:17.451> a<00:08:17.547> lot<00:08:17.884> of<00:08:18.028> graduates<00:08:18.509> from<00:08:18.734> San<00:08:18.990> Jose<00:08:19.231> State<00:08:19.695> end<00:08:19.808> up<00:08:20.016> working<00:08:20.353> for<00:08:20.433> the<00:08:20.577> tech<00:08:20.914> industry<00:08:21.956> in<00:08:22.132> Silicon<00:08:22.597> Valley,<00:08:23.062> but<00:08:23.238> more<00:08:23.543> and<00:08:23.639> more<00:08:23.863> people<00:08:24.056> are<00:08:24.136> starting<00:08:24.440> to<00:08:24.585> recognize,<00:08:26.043> you<00:08:26.124> know,<00:08:26.284> the<00:08:26.428> research<00:08:26.765> and<00:08:26.845> leadership<00:08:27.310> that<00:08:27.390> San<00:08:27.630> Jose<00:08:27.823> State<00:08:28.127> has<00:08:28.704> in<00:08:28.833> a<00:08:28.913> lot<00:08:29.105> of<00:08:29.249> areas<00:08:29.554> that<00:08:29.634> affect<00:08:30.051> AI.

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So,<00:08:31.878> you<00:08:31.958> know,<00:08:32.279> the,<00:08:33.257> you<00:08:33.337> know,<00:08:34.203> 2<00:08:34.363> years<00:08:34.716> ago,<00:08:35.004> maybe<00:08:35.181> even<00:08:35.325> 18<00:08:35.661> months<00:08:35.902> ago,<00:08:35.982> when<00:08:36.126> people<00:08:36.383> really<00:08:36.623> started<00:08:37.024> talking<00:08:37.425> about<00:08:37.809> AI<00:08:38.226> in<00:08:38.306> earnest,<00:08:38.771> you<00:08:38.851> know,<00:08:39.028> products<00:08:39.413> came<00:08:39.653> out<00:08:39.749> where<00:08:39.893> people<00:08:40.326> started<00:08:40.791> to<00:08:41.000> realize<00:08:41.432> the<00:08:41.609> impact<00:08:42.074> that<00:08:42.138> this<00:08:42.298> could<00:08:42.459> have<00:08:42.731> on<00:08:42.875> a<00:08:42.940> number<00:08:43.196> of<00:08:43.292> industries.

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San<00:08:44.687> Jose<00:08:44.960> State<00:08:45.441> understood<00:08:45.986> that<00:08:46.082> we<00:08:46.242> were<00:08:46.403> well<00:08:46.723> positioned<00:08:47.541> to<00:08:48.391> really<00:08:48.712> be<00:08:48.824> a<00:08:49.032> player<00:08:49.754> in<00:08:50.203> kind<00:08:50.491> of<00:08:50.636> shaping<00:08:51.197> how<00:08:51.678> AI<00:08:52.255> impacts<00:08:52.800> the<00:08:52.896> economy,<00:08:53.522> the<00:08:53.682> workforce,<00:08:54.884> different<00:08:55.141> industries<00:08:55.542> that<00:08:55.686> we're<00:08:55.766> involved<00:08:56.247> in.

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So<00:08:57.225> from<00:08:57.386> an<00:08:57.450> academic<00:08:57.947> perspective,<00:08:58.572> there's<00:08:58.764> a<00:08:58.829> leadership<00:08:59.229> team<00:09:00.015> at<00:09:00.368> the<00:09:00.448> university<00:09:01.057> that<00:09:01.234> looks<00:09:01.634> at<00:09:01.779> AI<00:09:02.212> from<00:09:02.436> a<00:09:02.596> perspective<00:09:03.093> of,<00:09:03.863> you<00:09:03.895> know,<00:09:04.039> curriculum.

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You<00:09:04.857> know,<00:09:05.066> what<00:09:05.146> do<00:09:05.226> we<00:09:05.322> need<00:09:05.883> to<00:09:06.204> teach<00:09:06.428> our<00:09:06.541> students<00:09:07.326> to<00:09:07.487> be<00:09:07.631> able<00:09:07.887> to<00:09:07.968> be<00:09:08.208> literate<00:09:08.769> and<00:09:08.946> functional<00:09:10.054> given<00:09:10.280> that<00:09:10.442> AI<00:09:10.637> is<00:09:10.718> going<00:09:10.847> to<00:09:10.928> have<00:09:11.090> such<00:09:11.268> an<00:09:11.414> outsized<00:09:11.835> influence<00:09:12.320> on<00:09:12.466> the<00:09:12.547> economy<00:09:13.032> going<00:09:13.292> forward.

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You<00:09:15.308> know,<00:09:15.436> we<00:09:15.517> have<00:09:15.629> a<00:09:15.678> lot<00:09:15.790> of<00:09:15.919> expertise<00:09:16.659> related<00:09:17.061> to<00:09:17.222> the<00:09:17.302> hardware,<00:09:18.090> the<00:09:18.171> software,<00:09:19.055> all<00:09:19.136> the<00:09:19.313> elements<00:09:19.779> that<00:09:19.956> make<00:09:20.278> up<00:09:20.663> AI<00:09:21.066> and<00:09:21.162> machine<00:09:21.564> learning<00:09:22.191> and<00:09:22.835> really<00:09:23.032> supporting<00:09:24.989> infrastructure<00:09:25.717> that's<00:09:25.928> going<00:09:26.025> to<00:09:26.105> be<00:09:26.267> required<00:09:26.850> for<00:09:27.011> that.

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San<00:09:28.257> Jose<00:09:28.451> State<00:09:28.759> also<00:09:29.001> has<00:09:29.179> a,<00:09:29.584> you<00:09:29.664> know,<00:09:29.826> a<00:09:29.907> really<00:09:30.150> interesting<00:09:30.538> history<00:09:30.878> in<00:09:31.039> terms<00:09:31.525> of<00:09:32.350> social<00:09:32.739> justice,<00:09:34.117> you<00:09:34.181> know,<00:09:34.360> ethical<00:09:34.765> studies.

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So<00:09:36.235> we're—<00:09:36.556> I<00:09:36.621> think<00:09:36.781> we're<00:09:36.878> uniquely<00:09:37.279> positioned<00:09:37.906> where<00:09:38.163> we<00:09:38.388> are,<00:09:38.645> but<00:09:38.790> also<00:09:39.047> with<00:09:39.192> our<00:09:39.353> expertise<00:09:39.931> in<00:09:40.011> those<00:09:40.253> areas<00:09:40.815> to<00:09:40.960> have<00:09:41.201> real<00:09:41.458> impact<00:09:41.860> on<00:09:42.004> how<00:09:42.422> AI<00:09:43.049> is<00:09:43.306> developed<00:09:43.852> and<00:09:43.949> implemented<00:09:44.447> in<00:09:44.560> different<00:09:44.828> industries.

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And<00:09:47.638> lastly,<00:09:48.121> we<00:09:48.218> have<00:09:48.395> a<00:09:48.540> really<00:09:48.846> interesting<00:09:49.425> interdisciplinary<00:09:50.311> approach<00:09:50.697> to<00:09:50.794> research.

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So<00:09:52.066> where<00:09:52.227> most<00:09:52.485> people<00:09:52.710> would<00:09:52.807> just<00:09:53.048> assume<00:09:53.451> that<00:09:53.676> this<00:09:53.918> work<00:09:54.159> happens<00:09:54.820> in,<00:09:55.769> you<00:09:55.802> know,<00:09:56.720> a<00:09:56.736> college<00:09:57.015> of<00:09:57.147> science,<00:09:57.738> right,<00:09:58.084> in<00:09:58.116> terms<00:09:58.232> of<00:09:58.264> computer<00:09:58.725> science<00:09:59.366> or<00:09:59.464> maybe<00:09:59.793> in<00:09:59.941> engineering,<00:10:01.772> you<00:10:01.852> know,<00:10:02.077> we<00:10:02.318> bring,<00:10:03.041> you<00:10:03.073> know,<00:10:03.378> humanities<00:10:04.084> and<00:10:04.164> the<00:10:04.405> arts,<00:10:04.903> we<00:10:05.144> bring,<00:10:06.653> you<00:10:06.685> know,<00:10:06.974> all<00:10:07.070> sorts<00:10:07.327> of<00:10:07.391> different<00:10:07.648> social<00:10:08.098> sciences,<00:10:09.639> psychology,<00:10:10.907> you<00:10:10.940> know,<00:10:11.309> health<00:10:11.469> sciences,<00:10:13.011> you<00:10:13.075> know,<00:10:13.316> really<00:10:13.573> interdisciplinary<00:10:14.359> and<00:10:14.456> holistic<00:10:15.002> look<00:10:15.194> at<00:10:15.323> how<00:10:15.644> AI<00:10:16.061> can<00:10:16.463> be<00:10:16.639> implemented.

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And<00:10:17.346> so<00:10:17.907> from<00:10:18.068> an<00:10:18.132> institutional<00:10:18.694> perspective,<00:10:19.208> that's,<00:10:19.738> you<00:10:19.818> know,<00:10:19.995> I<00:10:20.075> think<00:10:20.252> some<00:10:21.343> areas<00:10:21.600> of<00:10:21.680> strength<00:10:22.018> that<00:10:22.146> San<00:10:22.323> Jose<00:10:22.499> State<00:10:22.724> will<00:10:22.804> have<00:10:22.965> going<00:10:23.270> for<00:10:23.511> it.

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And<00:10:23.752> as<00:10:23.848> a<00:10:23.912> result,<00:10:24.330> we're<00:10:24.426> going<00:10:24.522> to<00:10:24.570> have<00:10:24.795> more<00:10:24.972> and<00:10:25.052> more<00:10:25.357> research<00:10:26.385> happening<00:10:26.674> in<00:10:26.738> that<00:10:26.963> area<00:10:27.524> and<00:10:28.006> You<00:10:28.038> know,<00:10:28.183> for<00:10:28.343> me,<00:10:28.504> in<00:10:28.584> terms<00:10:28.809> of<00:10:28.841> the<00:10:28.970> execution<00:10:29.452> of<00:10:29.532> that<00:10:29.709> research,<00:10:30.110> we<00:10:30.191> think<00:10:30.367> of<00:10:30.512> all<00:10:30.672> sorts<00:10:30.929> of<00:10:31.058> things<00:10:31.315> in<00:10:31.411> terms<00:10:31.716> of,<00:10:32.343> you<00:10:32.375> know,<00:10:32.680> infrastructure,<00:10:33.788> how<00:10:33.949> we<00:10:34.045> get<00:10:34.270> access<00:10:34.848> to,<00:10:35.411> you<00:10:35.475> know,<00:10:35.571> the<00:10:35.668> amount<00:10:35.892> of<00:10:35.957> compute<00:10:36.374> that's<00:10:36.535> going<00:10:36.695> to<00:10:36.760> be<00:10:36.840> required<00:10:37.418> for<00:10:37.499> some<00:10:37.675> of<00:10:37.739> this<00:10:37.964> research,<00:10:39.024> data<00:10:39.330> security,<00:10:40.952> you<00:10:41.032> know,<00:10:41.273> working<00:10:41.658> with<00:10:42.221> other<00:10:43.281> universities<00:10:44.003> and<00:10:44.084> international<00:10:44.646> universities<00:10:45.208> in<00:10:45.288> terms<00:10:45.545> of<00:10:45.594> getting<00:10:45.851> this<00:10:46.011> done.

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So<00:10:46.477> there's<00:10:46.718> a<00:10:46.734> lot<00:10:46.959> of<00:10:47.296> just<00:10:47.537> detail<00:10:47.922> that<00:10:48.035> has<00:10:48.260> to<00:10:48.324> happen<00:10:48.677> for<00:10:48.902> this,<00:10:49.368> you<00:10:49.400> know,<00:10:49.641> for<00:10:49.818> this<00:10:49.946> to<00:10:50.027> happen<00:10:50.348> securely.

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The<00:10:51.633> CHIPS<00:10:52.018> Act<00:10:52.211> is<00:10:52.355> a<00:10:52.420> huge<00:10:54.829> opportunity<00:10:55.487> for<00:10:55.632> a<00:10:55.712> lot<00:10:55.905> of<00:10:56.049> universities,<00:10:56.933> and<00:10:57.398> people<00:10:57.559> are<00:10:57.671> starting<00:10:58.057> to<00:10:58.121> understand<00:10:58.763> how<00:10:58.940> to<00:10:59.181> divert<00:10:59.582> some<00:10:59.823> of<00:10:59.903> that<00:11:00.385> activity<00:11:00.851> and<00:11:00.947> attention<00:11:01.493> towards<00:11:01.991> AI<00:11:02.296> and<00:11:02.393> machine<00:11:02.794> learning<00:11:03.131> specifically.

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So<00:11:04.320> there's<00:11:04.721> kind<00:11:04.882> of<00:11:04.946> a<00:11:04.962> cascading.

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There's<00:11:05.765> a<00:11:05.829> high-level<00:11:06.182> strategy,<00:11:06.728> then<00:11:06.873> there's<00:11:07.050> the<00:11:07.130> implementation<00:11:07.772> of<00:11:07.853> how<00:11:08.077> we<00:11:08.174> do<00:11:08.350> this<00:11:08.655> and<00:11:08.800> how<00:11:08.977> we're<00:11:09.137> effective<00:11:09.603> at<00:11:09.780> it,<00:11:09.924> how<00:11:10.020> we<00:11:10.181> leverage<00:11:10.486> our<00:11:10.599> strengths,<00:11:11.931> you<00:11:11.964> know.

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And<00:11:12.188> then,<00:11:12.510> and<00:11:12.574> then<00:11:12.750> personally,<00:11:13.152> like,<00:11:13.377> each<00:11:13.537> one<00:11:13.650> of<00:11:13.778> us<00:11:13.891> kind<00:11:14.019> of<00:11:14.180> has<00:11:14.292> to<00:11:14.421> think<00:11:14.613> about,<00:11:14.838> okay,<00:11:15.079> like,<00:11:15.320> how<00:11:15.480> does<00:11:15.625> this<00:11:15.786> impact<00:11:16.123> the<00:11:16.203> work<00:11:16.460> that<00:11:16.605> I<00:11:16.765> do?

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Like<00:11:17.231> my,<00:11:17.729> like<00:11:17.905> you<00:11:17.986> said,<00:11:18.291> my<00:11:18.612> typical<00:11:19.013> day<00:11:19.238> in<00:11:19.319> the<00:11:19.415> life,<00:11:19.800> how<00:11:19.897> does<00:11:20.138> AI<00:11:20.539> impact<00:11:21.566> what<00:11:21.726> I<00:11:21.887> do<00:11:22.079> and<00:11:22.223> where<00:11:22.383> I<00:11:22.464> spend<00:11:22.784> my<00:11:23.008> time,<00:11:24.210> you<00:11:24.242> know,<00:11:24.451> and<00:11:24.531> then,<00:11:24.787> you<00:11:24.884> know,<00:11:25.172> I<00:11:25.252> think<00:11:25.348> naturally<00:11:25.765> a<00:11:25.829> lot<00:11:26.005> of<00:11:26.085> us<00:11:26.214> think<00:11:26.326> of<00:11:26.406> our<00:11:26.550> kids<00:11:26.935> too,<00:11:27.111> right?

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It's<00:11:27.432> like,<00:11:27.672> you<00:11:27.752> know,<00:11:28.297> what,<00:11:28.714> how<00:11:28.810> are<00:11:28.890> they<00:11:29.034> going<00:11:29.211> to<00:11:29.259> grow<00:11:29.435> up<00:11:29.691> and<00:11:29.820> what<00:11:29.916> kind<00:11:30.092> of<00:11:30.220> opportunities<00:11:30.813> are<00:11:30.941> they<00:11:31.102> going<00:11:31.182> to<00:11:31.262> have?

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And,<00:11:32.320> you<00:11:32.384> know,<00:11:32.560> what<00:11:32.720> do<00:11:32.865> they<00:11:33.041> need<00:11:33.265> to<00:11:33.426> understand<00:11:34.019> around<00:11:34.403> these<00:11:34.499> sorts<00:11:34.804> of<00:11:34.964> things,<00:11:36.070> you<00:11:36.102> know,<00:11:36.326> to<00:11:36.487> be<00:11:36.583> successful<00:11:37.176> in<00:11:37.272> whatever<00:11:37.672> careers<00:11:38.009> they<00:11:38.169> choose?

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Because<00:11:39.355> much<00:11:39.532> like<00:11:39.708> the<00:11:39.868> internet<00:11:40.734> impacted<00:11:41.359> just<00:11:41.631> about<00:11:41.855> every<00:11:42.240> corner<00:11:42.657> of<00:11:42.801> the<00:11:42.897> economy,<00:11:44.484> um,<00:11:45.381> you<00:11:45.445> know,<00:11:45.622> I<00:11:45.702> think,<00:11:46.503> I<00:11:46.583> think<00:11:46.663> it's<00:11:46.824> pretty<00:11:47.048> obvious<00:11:47.529> now,<00:11:48.186> you<00:11:48.250> know,<00:11:48.651> that<00:11:48.827> people<00:11:49.067> will<00:11:49.227> understand<00:11:49.772> that<00:11:49.933> AI<00:11:50.125> is<00:11:50.333> going<00:11:50.413> to<00:11:50.494> have<00:11:50.670> that<00:11:50.846> similar<00:11:51.947> impact<00:11:52.452> in<00:11:52.534> terms<00:11:52.794> of<00:11:52.941> leaving<00:11:53.137> no<00:11:53.348> stone<00:11:53.674> unturned<00:11:54.244> to<00:11:54.391> how<00:11:54.570> it<00:11:54.652> can<00:11:54.815> change<00:11:55.124> how<00:11:55.287> we<00:11:55.385> work.

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I<00:11:56.816> have<00:11:56.913> to<00:11:56.995> ask<00:11:57.174> you,<00:11:57.304> it<00:11:57.336> seems<00:11:57.710> like<00:11:58.279> universities<00:11:59.109> and<00:11:59.190> college<00:11:59.515> campuses<00:12:00.003> in<00:12:00.149> particular<00:12:00.865> have<00:12:00.979> become<00:12:01.304> very<00:12:01.548> political.

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Like,<00:12:03.898> it's<00:12:03.995> kind<00:12:04.156> of<00:12:04.237> become<00:12:04.560> political<00:12:05.044> whether<00:12:05.254> or<00:12:05.286> not<00:12:05.432> you<00:12:05.609> choose<00:12:05.932> to<00:12:06.013> even<00:12:06.255> go<00:12:06.400> to<00:12:06.497> college.

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Like,<00:12:07.288> I<00:12:07.320> don't<00:12:07.563> know<00:12:07.692> if<00:12:08.499> that<00:12:08.660> might<00:12:08.757> be<00:12:08.999> overstating<00:12:09.564> it,<00:12:09.790> but<00:12:10.533> what<00:12:10.614> is<00:12:10.694> your<00:12:10.791> sense<00:12:11.243> for<00:12:11.324> that?

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As<00:12:11.599> somebody<00:12:11.873> who's<00:12:12.051> on<00:12:12.212> the<00:12:12.309> ground<00:12:12.632> every<00:12:12.793> day,<00:12:13.502> who's<00:12:13.905> going<00:12:14.485> to<00:12:14.871> these<00:12:15.048> universities<00:12:15.548> every<00:12:15.757> day,<00:12:15.935> like,<00:12:16.659> how<00:12:16.756> does<00:12:16.982> it<00:12:17.046> actually<00:12:17.385> feel<00:12:17.868> on<00:12:18.029> campus?

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Yeah,<00:12:20.923> it's—<00:12:21.164> I<00:12:21.180> mean,<00:12:21.325> it<00:12:21.421> feels<00:12:21.806> the<00:12:21.838> same<00:12:22.144> to<00:12:22.240> me,<00:12:22.384> to<00:12:22.545> be<00:12:22.705> perfectly<00:12:23.171> honest.

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Like,<00:12:23.829> you<00:12:23.894> know,<00:12:24.070> Monday<00:12:24.311> to<00:12:24.456> Friday,<00:12:25.355> you<00:12:25.451> know,<00:12:25.660> you've<00:12:25.853> got,<00:12:26.559> you<00:12:26.623> know,<00:12:27.346> young<00:12:27.522> adults<00:12:28.004> going<00:12:28.245> to<00:12:28.325> school.

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You<00:12:29.224> know,<00:12:29.594> the,<00:12:29.931> the<00:12:30.075> main<00:12:30.413> tenets<00:12:30.734> of<00:12:30.814> going<00:12:30.991> to<00:12:31.119> university<00:12:31.617> in<00:12:31.697> terms<00:12:31.954> of<00:12:32.018> being<00:12:32.179> in<00:12:32.243> those<00:12:32.484> formative<00:12:33.046> years<00:12:33.544> and<00:12:33.624> exploring<00:12:34.250> your<00:12:34.507> kind<00:12:34.732> of<00:12:34.828> like<00:12:35.069> intellectual<00:12:35.679> and<00:12:35.792> social<00:12:36.273> interests,<00:12:36.755> I<00:12:36.900> think<00:12:37.060> universities<00:12:37.654> are<00:12:37.718> still<00:12:37.975> a<00:12:38.200> very<00:12:39.340> effective<00:12:39.950> place<00:12:40.609> at<00:12:40.769> that.

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I<00:12:41.315> think<00:12:41.572> there<00:12:41.813> is<00:12:42.054> this<00:12:42.214> kind<00:12:42.391> of<00:12:42.535> perfect<00:12:42.857> storm<00:12:43.563> of<00:12:45.007> you<00:12:45.104> know,<00:12:45.986> the,<00:12:47.333> you<00:12:47.365> know,<00:12:47.670> for<00:12:47.814> a<00:12:47.830> number<00:12:48.071> of<00:12:48.215> years<00:12:48.472> people<00:12:48.809> have<00:12:48.937> been<00:12:49.097> kind<00:12:49.258> of<00:12:49.338> questioning<00:12:49.691> the<00:12:49.819> relevance<00:12:50.316> of<00:12:50.413> a<00:12:50.477> higher<00:12:50.733> education<00:12:51.199> degree,<00:12:51.664> right?

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Is<00:12:52.001> it<00:12:52.161> worth<00:12:52.466> what<00:12:52.578> it<00:12:52.786> used<00:12:52.947> to,<00:12:53.123> given<00:12:53.348> the<00:12:53.444> costs<00:12:53.749> have<00:12:53.909> escalated<00:12:54.406> so<00:12:54.727> much?

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You<00:12:55.994> know,<00:12:56.395> most<00:12:56.668> of<00:12:56.796> what<00:12:56.876> I've<00:12:57.117> read<00:12:57.374> indicates<00:12:57.935> that<00:12:58.095> still<00:12:58.561> economically<00:12:59.619> it's,<00:13:00.020> it's<00:13:00.181> the<00:13:00.341> best<00:13:00.566> way<00:13:00.662> to<00:13:00.806> get<00:13:00.902> a<00:13:00.918> leg<00:13:01.223> up,<00:13:01.528> right?

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It's<00:13:02.442> a<00:13:02.506> transformative<00:13:03.292> experience,<00:13:04.511> especially<00:13:05.073> for,<00:13:06.115> you<00:13:06.179> know,<00:13:06.356> underrepresented<00:13:07.142> populations<00:13:07.719> in<00:13:07.783> the<00:13:07.815> United<00:13:08.040> States.

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San<00:13:08.585> José<00:13:08.858> State<00:13:09.259> is<00:13:09.387> a<00:13:09.483> minority-serving<00:13:10.366> institution,<00:13:10.991> a<00:13:11.071> Hispanic-serving<00:13:11.889> institution.

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And<00:13:14.038> has<00:13:14.214> been<00:13:14.375> rated,<00:13:15.000> you<00:13:15.032> know,<00:13:15.497> consistently<00:13:16.154> as<00:13:16.282> one<00:13:16.378> of<00:13:16.442> the<00:13:16.699> most<00:13:16.859> transformative<00:13:17.597> institutions.

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And<00:13:18.318> it's<00:13:18.462> because<00:13:18.863> a<00:13:18.927> first-generation<00:13:19.745> college<00:13:20.129> student<00:13:20.626> getting<00:13:20.883> a<00:13:21.011> college<00:13:21.428> degree<00:13:22.245> still<00:13:22.470> has<00:13:22.710> an<00:13:22.951> outsized<00:13:23.448> impact<00:13:24.153> on,<00:13:24.954> you<00:13:24.987> know,<00:13:25.195> earning<00:13:25.580> potential<00:13:26.157> and<00:13:26.237> social<00:13:26.638> mobility<00:13:27.119> going<00:13:27.439> forward.

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So<00:13:28.706> that<00:13:28.882> kind<00:13:29.122> of,<00:13:29.363> you<00:13:29.459> know,<00:13:30.164> you<00:13:30.244> know,<00:13:30.405> table<00:13:30.741> stakes<00:13:31.206> of<00:13:31.286> getting<00:13:31.543> a<00:13:31.671> college<00:13:32.008> degree<00:13:32.408> to<00:13:32.553> kind<00:13:32.665> of<00:13:32.793> make<00:13:32.970> it<00:13:33.050> into<00:13:33.210> the<00:13:33.354> middle<00:13:33.515> class<00:13:33.851> in<00:13:33.931> the<00:13:34.012> U.S.<00:13:34.396> still<00:13:34.637> exists.

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Now,<00:13:36.737> you<00:13:36.833> know,<00:13:37.779> does<00:13:38.003> the<00:13:38.163> relevance<00:13:38.805> of<00:13:38.997> the<00:13:39.141> degree<00:13:39.606> you<00:13:39.702> take<00:13:40.119> in<00:13:40.263> college<00:13:40.969> from<00:13:41.081> an<00:13:41.225> academic<00:13:41.786> perspective<00:13:42.427> determine<00:13:42.828> the<00:13:42.972> outcome<00:13:43.245> of<00:13:43.373> your<00:13:43.549> career?

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I<00:13:44.207> think<00:13:44.415> that's<00:13:44.640> where<00:13:44.736> people<00:13:45.089> start<00:13:45.491> to<00:13:45.636> kind<00:13:46.375> of,<00:13:46.664> you<00:13:46.744> know,<00:13:46.841> have<00:13:47.001> a<00:13:47.146> relevant<00:13:47.548> question<00:13:48.126> around,<00:13:49.331> you<00:13:49.411> know,<00:13:49.893> like,<00:13:50.134> what<00:13:50.279> does<00:13:50.391> that<00:13:50.616> course<00:13:51.018> and<00:13:51.098> that<00:13:51.339> book<00:13:51.661> teach<00:13:51.966> you<00:13:52.207> that<00:13:52.303> you<00:13:52.384> take<00:13:52.641> from<00:13:52.882> it?

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But<00:13:53.573> when<00:13:53.653> you<00:13:53.733> think<00:13:53.926> of<00:13:53.990> the<00:13:54.071> experience<00:13:54.713> in<00:13:54.858> terms<00:13:55.340> of,<00:13:55.597> again,<00:13:56.240> you<00:13:56.272> know,<00:13:56.417> 4<00:13:56.722> years<00:13:57.043> going<00:13:57.364> to<00:13:57.509> school,<00:13:57.927> however<00:13:58.312> that<00:13:58.569> looks,<00:13:59.116> and<00:13:59.373> being<00:13:59.614> part<00:13:59.871> of<00:14:00.015> the<00:14:00.096> social<00:14:00.514> fabric,<00:14:01.542> having<00:14:01.863> access<00:14:02.490> to<00:14:02.667> things<00:14:02.891> like<00:14:03.068> research<00:14:03.534> opportunities<00:14:04.193> where<00:14:04.337> you<00:14:04.418> learn<00:14:04.659> critical<00:14:05.012> thinking<00:14:05.334> skills,<00:14:06.362> it's<00:14:06.507> really<00:14:06.748> hard<00:14:07.005> to<00:14:07.085> quantify<00:14:08.531> what<00:14:08.772> part<00:14:09.013> of<00:14:09.093> your<00:14:09.254> college<00:14:09.640> experience<00:14:10.363> leads<00:14:10.620> to<00:14:10.764> that.

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Kind<00:14:11.342> of<00:14:11.423> future<00:14:11.888> success.

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You<00:14:13.414> know,<00:14:13.590> I<00:14:13.671> think<00:14:13.831> the<00:14:13.912> politicization<00:14:15.100> of<00:14:15.180> what's<00:14:15.357> happening<00:14:15.758> on<00:14:15.903> college<00:14:16.240> campuses<00:14:16.882> is<00:14:16.962> just<00:14:17.219> a<00:14:17.267> net<00:14:17.524> product<00:14:17.926> of<00:14:18.070> who's<00:14:18.231> there,<00:14:18.648> right?

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Again,<00:14:19.371> you've<00:14:19.596> got<00:14:19.917> young,<00:14:20.591> interested<00:14:21.378> political<00:14:21.843> people<00:14:22.823> in<00:14:22.919> a<00:14:22.984> political<00:14:23.433> environment<00:14:24.027> that's<00:14:24.348> pretty,<00:14:25.215> um,<00:14:26.436> you<00:14:26.532> know,<00:14:26.677> divided<00:14:27.222> and<00:14:27.303> antagonistic<00:14:28.057> in<00:14:28.186> the<00:14:28.266> US<00:14:28.603> right<00:14:28.828> now.

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Um,<00:14:30.835> and<00:14:31.092> it's<00:14:31.253> not<00:14:31.413> really<00:14:31.590> a<00:14:31.638> surprise.

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And<00:14:32.296> I<00:14:32.441> think,<00:14:32.842> you<00:14:32.874> know,<00:14:33.340> college<00:14:33.741> campus<00:14:34.544> protests<00:14:35.251> and,<00:14:35.732> um,<00:14:37.261> You<00:14:37.342> know,<00:14:38.084> again,<00:14:38.487> kind<00:14:38.745> of,<00:14:39.519> you<00:14:39.552> know,<00:14:40.100> means<00:14:40.407> of<00:14:40.503> trying<00:14:40.665> to<00:14:40.810> call<00:14:41.052> out<00:14:41.084> social<00:14:41.471> justice<00:14:41.955> on<00:14:42.117> behalf<00:14:42.504> of<00:14:42.585> society<00:14:43.149> has<00:14:43.310> always<00:14:43.649> been<00:14:43.746> a<00:14:43.875> part<00:14:44.117> of<00:14:44.214> the<00:14:44.295> college<00:14:44.682> experience.

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So<00:14:45.979> yeah,<00:14:46.318> I<00:14:46.399> think<00:14:46.560> day-to-day<00:14:47.189> college<00:14:47.512> administrators<00:14:48.174> are<00:14:48.222> struggling<00:14:49.206> clearly<00:14:49.545> mostly<00:14:50.013> with,<00:14:50.191> you<00:14:50.288> know,<00:14:50.417> how<00:14:50.594> we<00:14:50.756> balance<00:14:51.159> free<00:14:51.320> speech<00:14:51.869> with<00:14:52.289> the<00:14:52.434> right<00:14:52.676> of<00:14:52.773> every<00:14:52.950> student<00:14:53.418> to<00:14:53.563> kind<00:14:53.676> of<00:14:53.741> safely<00:14:54.306> show<00:14:54.548> up<00:14:54.628> to<00:14:54.709> school<00:14:55.000> and<00:14:55.202> have<00:14:55.456> the<00:14:55.541> experience<00:14:56.132> that<00:14:56.285> they<00:14:56.454> want.

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But<00:14:58.881> I<00:14:58.961> think<00:14:59.139> it's<00:14:59.284> something<00:14:59.527> that'll<00:14:59.704> sort<00:14:59.946> itself<00:15:00.334> out,<00:15:00.592> and<00:15:00.673> I<00:15:00.754> don't<00:15:00.996> think<00:15:01.303> it<00:15:01.416> kind<00:15:01.625> of<00:15:01.738> threatens<00:15:02.449> the<00:15:03.066> the<00:15:03.162> mission<00:15:03.482> or<00:15:03.723> purpose<00:15:04.107> of<00:15:04.203> higher<00:15:04.444> education<00:15:05.085> in<00:15:05.165> terms<00:15:05.421> of<00:15:05.469> where<00:15:05.629> we<00:15:05.726> are<00:15:05.806> right<00:15:05.950> now.

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What<00:15:07.248> do<00:15:07.328> you<00:15:07.488> read?

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Like,<00:15:08.370> what<00:15:08.594> reading<00:15:08.850> recommendations<00:15:09.475> would<00:15:09.571> you<00:15:09.651> have<00:15:09.812> for<00:15:10.036> us?

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Hmm.

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Uh,<00:15:12.440> you<00:15:12.472> know,<00:15:12.696> I<00:15:12.840> read<00:15:13.017> a<00:15:13.097> lot<00:15:13.401> of,<00:15:13.802> uh,<00:15:14.651> kind<00:15:14.779> of<00:15:14.939> short,<00:15:15.805> uh,<00:15:17.327> short<00:15:17.599> format<00:15:18.048> stuff,<00:15:18.385> I<00:15:18.465> guess<00:15:18.705> is<00:15:18.785> the<00:15:18.865> best<00:15:19.106> way<00:15:19.266> to<00:15:19.346> say<00:15:19.586> it.

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I<00:15:19.763> don't<00:15:19.907> read<00:15:20.051> a<00:15:20.067> lot<00:15:20.131> of<00:15:20.307> books.

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You<00:15:20.884> know,<00:15:20.932> I've<00:15:21.109> never,<00:15:21.509> I've<00:15:21.653> never<00:15:21.830> been<00:15:21.926> a<00:15:22.054> fan<00:15:22.310> of<00:15:22.455> like<00:15:22.631> getting,<00:15:23.112> getting<00:15:23.352> deep<00:15:23.592> into<00:15:23.753> books.

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Yeah.

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I<00:15:25.115> joke<00:15:25.355> with<00:15:25.499> the<00:15:25.595> people<00:15:25.788> around<00:15:25.996> me,<00:15:26.140> like<00:15:26.397> once<00:15:26.573> every<00:15:26.717> couple<00:15:27.037> years<00:15:27.230> I'll<00:15:27.374> find<00:15:27.614> a<00:15:27.743> book<00:15:27.983> that<00:15:28.063> I<00:15:28.223> really<00:15:28.464> have<00:15:28.624> to<00:15:28.720> get<00:15:28.864> into<00:15:29.201> and<00:15:29.281> I<00:15:29.425> won't,<00:15:30.210> you<00:15:30.211> know,<00:15:30.350> be<00:15:30.390> satisfied<00:15:30.950> until<00:15:31.190> I<00:15:31.330> finish<00:15:31.570> it<00:15:31.810> and<00:15:31.811> put<00:15:31.870> it<00:15:32.030> down.

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But<00:15:32.370> those<00:15:32.490> are<00:15:32.590> pretty<00:15:32.730> rare.

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I'm<00:15:33.130> really<00:15:33.270> picky<00:15:33.570> about<00:15:33.789> that<00:15:33.950> kind<00:15:34.170> of<00:15:34.330> stuff<00:15:34.450> in<00:15:34.610> terms<00:15:34.790> of<00:15:34.910> what'll<00:15:35.110> hold<00:15:35.190> my<00:15:35.330> attention.

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So,<00:15:37.070> you<00:15:37.071> know,<00:15:37.230> I<00:15:37.330> read<00:15:37.530> a<00:15:37.590> lot<00:15:37.790> of,<00:15:38.090> uh,<00:15:38.490> you<00:15:38.491> know,<00:15:38.610> I<00:15:38.630> read<00:15:38.770> a<00:15:38.830> lot<00:15:38.910> of<00:15:39.030> the<00:15:39.070> news,<00:15:39.730> you<00:15:39.750> know,<00:15:40.130> I<00:15:40.170> read<00:15:40.450> CBC.

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I'm<00:15:41.110> from<00:15:41.250> Canada,<00:15:41.770> so<00:15:41.810> I<00:15:41.910> still<00:15:42.130> read<00:15:42.350> CBC<00:15:42.790> News,<00:15:43.550> you<00:15:43.650> know,<00:15:43.870> each<00:15:43.970> morning.

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And,<00:15:44.850> you<00:15:44.890> know,<00:15:45.130> New<00:15:45.170> York<00:15:45.370> Times,<00:15:45.730> those<00:15:45.850> are<00:15:45.969> kind<00:15:46.150> of<00:15:46.230> my<00:15:46.370> news<00:15:46.590> sources.

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Um,<00:15:48.170> you<00:15:48.210> know,<00:15:48.330> I<00:15:48.331> love<00:15:48.450> magazines,<00:15:49.210> you<00:15:49.270> know,<00:15:49.410> I<00:15:49.470> think<00:15:49.530> that<00:15:49.690> kind—<00:15:49.910> I<00:15:49.930> used<00:15:50.090> to<00:15:50.190> travel<00:15:50.410> a<00:15:50.670> lot,<00:15:51.210> so<00:15:51.570> my<00:15:51.950> routine<00:15:52.270> was<00:15:52.450> always<00:15:52.710> to<00:15:52.910> hit<00:15:53.050> the,<00:15:53.690> you<00:15:53.930> know,<00:15:54.490> the,<00:15:54.491> the<00:15:54.630> magazine<00:15:55.050> stand<00:15:55.410> at<00:15:55.630> an<00:15:55.670> airport.

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And<00:15:57.233> kind<00:15:57.473> of<00:15:57.537> grab<00:15:57.954> a<00:15:58.018> couple,<00:15:59.059> you<00:15:59.091> know,<00:15:59.780> personal<00:16:00.037> interest<00:16:00.373> or<00:16:00.517> business<00:16:00.838> interest<00:16:01.158> magazines.

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And<00:16:01.960> so<00:16:02.104> I<00:16:02.264> like<00:16:02.440> the<00:16:02.585> short<00:16:02.857> format<00:16:04.043> kind<00:16:04.219> of<00:16:04.363> compressed<00:16:04.924> information,<00:16:05.485> which<00:16:05.629> I<00:16:05.661> think<00:16:05.789> is<00:16:05.949> why<00:16:06.030> I<00:16:06.110> like<00:16:06.350> podcasts<00:16:06.847> too,<00:16:07.151> right?

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Like<00:16:07.968> Podcast<00:16:08.449> Now<00:16:08.689> is<00:16:08.834> kind<00:16:09.010> of<00:16:09.090> a<00:16:09.170> big<00:16:09.330> replacement<00:16:09.811> for<00:16:09.939> me<00:16:10.067> in<00:16:10.196> terms<00:16:10.452> of<00:16:10.516> how<00:16:10.676> I<00:16:10.772> consume,<00:16:12.134> you<00:16:12.198> know,<00:16:12.439> relevant<00:16:13.176> information,<00:16:13.961> whether<00:16:14.217> it's,<00:16:14.778> you<00:16:14.874> know,<00:16:15.099> kind<00:16:15.259> of<00:16:15.403> personal<00:16:15.660> interest<00:16:15.900> stuff<00:16:16.284> or<00:16:16.365> whether<00:16:16.557> it's<00:16:16.765> just<00:16:17.022> analysis<00:16:17.646> on<00:16:17.823> day<00:16:17.983> to<00:16:18.063> day,<00:16:18.384> right?

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In<00:16:18.864> terms<00:16:19.040> of<00:16:19.105> how<00:16:19.265> that<00:16:19.441> affects<00:16:19.729> our<00:16:19.906> lives<00:16:20.226> and<00:16:20.306> how<00:16:20.402> we<00:16:20.547> make<00:16:20.707> decisions.

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So<00:16:21.973> again,<00:16:22.165> I'm<00:16:22.293> really<00:16:22.534> picky<00:16:22.726> about<00:16:22.886> podcasts.

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Options.

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Like,<00:16:27.677> I<00:16:27.757> have<00:16:27.853> a<00:16:27.981> very—<00:16:28.462> it's<00:16:28.622> not<00:16:28.718> that<00:16:28.814> I<00:16:28.878> don't<00:16:29.039> have<00:16:29.135> an<00:16:29.215> attention<00:16:29.663> span,<00:16:30.080> but<00:16:30.176> I'm<00:16:30.304> just<00:16:30.400> really<00:16:30.641> picky<00:16:30.881> about<00:16:31.105> how<00:16:31.201> things<00:16:31.442> are<00:16:31.522> presented<00:16:32.307> and<00:16:32.547> the<00:16:33.428> format<00:16:33.925> of<00:16:34.085> things.

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So,<00:16:34.967> you<00:16:34.999> know,<00:16:35.127> for<00:16:35.287> podcasts,<00:16:35.992> I<00:16:36.072> love<00:16:36.168> The<00:16:36.248> Daily.

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Like,<00:16:36.969> that's<00:16:37.434> how<00:16:37.530> I<00:16:38.251> get,<00:16:39.469> again,<00:16:39.757> a<00:16:39.773> lot<00:16:39.949> of<00:16:40.013> kind<00:16:40.190> of<00:16:40.318> news<00:16:40.510> information.

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I<00:16:42.080> do<00:16:42.817> find<00:16:43.042> myself<00:16:43.522> actively<00:16:44.019> avoiding<00:16:44.580> political<00:16:45.958> analysis.

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It's<00:16:47.704> kind<00:16:47.768> of<00:16:47.800> like<00:16:47.944> sports<00:16:48.233> analysis.

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Like,<00:16:48.970> they<00:16:49.066> don't<00:16:49.226> know<00:16:49.322> what's<00:16:49.482> going<00:16:49.578> to<00:16:49.691> happen,<00:16:50.027> but<00:16:50.107> they're<00:16:50.251> happy<00:16:50.444> to<00:16:50.588> talk<00:16:50.908> for<00:16:51.052> an<00:16:51.133> hour<00:16:51.389> about<00:16:51.854> all<00:16:51.950> the<00:16:52.190> potential<00:16:52.591> outcomes.

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All<00:16:53.632> of<00:16:53.696> which<00:16:53.808> I<00:16:53.824> don't<00:16:53.953> really<00:16:54.113> care<00:16:54.337> about,<00:16:54.594> right?

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Like<00:16:54.995> until<00:16:55.219> they<00:16:55.315> happen,<00:16:56.998> you<00:16:57.078> know,<00:16:57.239> people's<00:16:57.559> conjectures<00:16:58.200> on<00:16:58.345> what<00:16:58.521> might<00:16:58.745> happen<00:16:59.258> and<00:16:59.787> what<00:16:59.964> poll<00:17:00.220> says<00:17:00.589> what,<00:17:00.941> and<00:17:01.166> the<00:17:01.326> potential<00:17:02.047> of,<00:17:02.432> you<00:17:02.464> know,<00:17:02.608> if<00:17:02.753> this<00:17:02.929> person<00:17:03.249> gets<00:17:03.474> into<00:17:03.650> office,<00:17:04.131> I<00:17:04.211> just<00:17:04.532> kind<00:17:04.692> of<00:17:04.772> find<00:17:05.029> it<00:17:05.093> all<00:17:06.599> a<00:17:06.615> little<00:17:06.856> wasteful.

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But,<00:17:08.363> but<00:17:08.475> yeah,<00:17:08.876> for<00:17:09.020> the<00:17:09.084> most<00:17:09.340> part,<00:17:09.581> if<00:17:09.677> it's<00:17:09.821> not<00:17:09.998> a<00:17:10.062> political<00:17:10.623> topic<00:17:11.184> that's<00:17:11.344> been<00:17:11.504> rehashed<00:17:11.985> a<00:17:12.049> bunch<00:17:12.226> of<00:17:12.290> times,<00:17:12.690> you<00:17:12.722> know,<00:17:12.867> The<00:17:13.011> Daily<00:17:13.348> is<00:17:13.492> great<00:17:13.588> content.

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Yeah,<00:17:15.816> there's<00:17:16.072> some<00:17:16.249> good<00:17:16.457> kind<00:17:16.633> of<00:17:16.666> society<00:17:17.355> and<00:17:17.515> tech<00:17:17.916> podcasts.

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You<00:17:18.669> know,<00:17:18.813> Strategery<00:17:19.455> is<00:17:19.599> a<00:17:19.663> great<00:17:19.903> one<00:17:20.096> from<00:17:20.320> Ben<00:17:20.480> Thompson.

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He's<00:17:21.926> someone<00:17:22.167> I<00:17:22.264> found<00:17:22.569> reading<00:17:22.746> his<00:17:22.891> newsletter<00:17:23.373> years<00:17:23.614> ago,<00:17:23.871> and<00:17:23.967> I<00:17:24.112> find<00:17:24.417> him<00:17:25.076> just<00:17:25.173> super<00:17:25.414> intelligent<00:17:26.105> and<00:17:26.169> has<00:17:26.282> an<00:17:26.362> interesting<00:17:26.748> way<00:17:26.908> of<00:17:27.005> kind<00:17:27.181> of,<00:17:27.712> you<00:17:27.744> know,<00:17:27.953> breaking<00:17:28.290> down<00:17:29.174> the<00:17:29.319> tech<00:17:29.576> industry.

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Pivot<00:17:30.476> is<00:17:30.605> interesting,<00:17:32.654> you<00:17:32.719> know,<00:17:32.833> for<00:17:33.011> a<00:17:33.044> lot<00:17:33.223> of<00:17:33.288> the<00:17:33.369> stuff<00:17:33.711> that<00:17:33.873> they<00:17:34.101> cover.

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And<00:17:35.526> then<00:17:35.623> I<00:17:35.704> cycle<00:17:36.028> through<00:17:36.254> all<00:17:36.351> kinds<00:17:36.836> of<00:17:36.998> stuff.

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And<00:17:38.130> so<00:17:38.275> I<00:17:38.372> have<00:17:38.469> a<00:17:38.615> pretty<00:17:38.938> wide<00:17:39.359> and<00:17:40.475> big<00:17:40.717> breadth<00:17:41.122> of<00:17:41.849> topics<00:17:42.334> and<00:17:42.415> information<00:17:42.819> that<00:17:42.965> I'm<00:17:43.078> interested<00:17:43.450> in,<00:17:43.547> but<00:17:43.660> I'll<00:17:43.790> consume<00:17:44.129> it<00:17:44.162> in<00:17:44.291> small<00:17:44.582> chunks<00:17:44.859> as<00:17:44.994> I<00:17:45.079> have<00:17:45.501> time<00:17:45.771> and<00:17:45.839> ability.

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What<00:17:47.213> are<00:17:47.358> like<00:17:47.534> the<00:17:47.695> 3<00:17:47.935> most<00:17:48.240> important<00:17:48.658> leadership<00:17:49.203> traits<00:17:49.620> that<00:17:49.765> you've<00:17:50.070> found<00:17:51.466> over<00:17:51.610> the<00:17:51.707> course<00:17:51.883> of<00:17:52.027> your<00:17:52.252> career?

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Yeah,<00:17:54.017> I<00:17:54.033> think<00:17:54.210> a<00:17:55.060> big<00:17:55.157> one<00:17:55.317> I<00:17:55.397> think<00:17:55.542> is<00:17:55.622> just<00:17:55.783> kind<00:17:55.895> of<00:17:56.039> building<00:17:56.424> and<00:17:56.521> leading<00:17:56.826> teams,<00:17:57.644> right?

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I<00:17:58.286> think,<00:17:58.687> you<00:17:58.767> know,<00:17:59.746> some<00:18:00.051> definitions<00:18:01.174> of<00:18:01.255> leadership<00:18:01.816> are<00:18:01.961> really<00:18:02.201> kind<00:18:02.394> of,<00:18:02.538> you<00:18:02.635> know,<00:18:02.843> again,<00:18:03.164> building<00:18:03.501> teams<00:18:03.902> for<00:18:03.983> the<00:18:04.127> things<00:18:04.464> that,<00:18:04.849> you<00:18:04.881> know,<00:18:05.026> an<00:18:05.170> individual<00:18:05.748> can't<00:18:05.989> perform<00:18:06.406> on<00:18:06.534> their<00:18:06.695> own,<00:18:06.935> right?

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It's<00:18:07.288> not<00:18:07.449> a<00:18:07.577> technical<00:18:07.995> challenge,<00:18:08.540> but<00:18:08.620> it's<00:18:08.717> an<00:18:08.797> adaptive<00:18:09.262> challenge,<00:18:09.776> the<00:18:09.904> things<00:18:10.065> that<00:18:10.161> we<00:18:10.305> don't<00:18:10.562> necessarily<00:18:11.204> know<00:18:11.525> right<00:18:11.750> off<00:18:11.910> the<00:18:12.006> bat<00:18:12.231> how<00:18:12.327> to<00:18:12.408> solve<00:18:12.889> that<00:18:13.049> require<00:18:13.515> lots<00:18:13.740> perspectives.

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So<00:18:15.390> again,<00:18:15.774> I<00:18:15.854> think<00:18:16.047> people<00:18:16.255> who<00:18:16.303> have<00:18:16.415> a<00:18:16.431> natural<00:18:16.896> tendency<00:18:17.313> to<00:18:17.441> bring<00:18:17.697> people<00:18:18.001> together,<00:18:19.123> you<00:18:19.155> know,<00:18:19.363> gain<00:18:19.620> consensus<00:18:20.341> and<00:18:20.405> kind<00:18:20.565> of<00:18:20.661> rally<00:18:21.062> a<00:18:21.142> team<00:18:21.462> around<00:18:21.719> a<00:18:21.767> shared<00:18:22.183> problem<00:18:23.401> is<00:18:23.545> a<00:18:23.706> big<00:18:23.946> kind<00:18:25.532> of<00:18:25.628> leadership<00:18:26.109> trait.

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The<00:18:27.070> other<00:18:27.214> one<00:18:27.327> is<00:18:27.695> hiring<00:18:28.032> well,<00:18:28.496> you<00:18:28.528> know,<00:18:28.673> again,<00:18:28.977> kind<00:18:29.634> of<00:18:29.698> related<00:18:30.099> to<00:18:30.131> that<00:18:30.355> one.

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I<00:18:30.675> think,<00:18:31.300> you<00:18:31.332> know,<00:18:31.557> one<00:18:31.653> of<00:18:31.717> the<00:18:31.797> things<00:18:32.181> I<00:18:32.294> do<00:18:32.502> well<00:18:32.838> and<00:18:32.999> that<00:18:33.143> I've<00:18:33.319> kind<00:18:33.479> of<00:18:33.543> honed<00:18:33.880> in<00:18:34.040> on<00:18:34.264> a<00:18:34.280> lot<00:18:34.425> of<00:18:34.601> years<00:18:34.921> is<00:18:35.082> just,<00:18:36.107> you<00:18:36.139> know,<00:18:36.379> figuring<00:18:37.164> which<00:18:37.389> people<00:18:37.645> fit<00:18:37.950> into<00:18:38.078> roles<00:18:38.831> and<00:18:39.087> just,<00:18:39.552> you<00:18:39.584> know,<00:18:39.792> hiring<00:18:40.193> based<00:18:40.449> on<00:18:40.545> quality<00:18:41.154> and<00:18:41.250> capability.

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It's<00:18:42.533> just,<00:18:42.790> it's<00:18:43.272> a<00:18:43.336> huge<00:18:43.641> part.

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I<00:18:43.978> mean,<00:18:44.155> again,<00:18:45.006> the<00:18:45.086> team<00:18:45.343> that<00:18:45.424> you<00:18:45.568> have<00:18:45.970> amplifies<00:18:46.548> your<00:18:46.692> abilities<00:18:47.270> and<00:18:47.447> it<00:18:47.495> amplifies<00:18:48.057> your<00:18:48.234> reach.

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And<00:18:48.636> so<00:18:48.828> to<00:18:48.876> have<00:18:49.117> the<00:18:49.278> right<00:18:49.519> people<00:18:49.856> in<00:18:49.920> the<00:18:50.065> right<00:18:51.028> roles,<00:18:51.992> you<00:18:52.024> know,<00:18:52.169> and<00:18:52.329> just<00:18:52.490> being<00:18:52.650> able<00:18:52.843> to<00:18:52.907> hire<00:18:53.309> and<00:18:53.437> that<00:18:53.678> goes,<00:18:53.839> you<00:18:53.935> know,<00:18:54.016> everything<00:18:54.321> from<00:18:54.433> like<00:18:54.578> how<00:18:54.754> you<00:18:54.899> recruit<00:18:55.365> to<00:18:55.461> how<00:18:55.605> you<00:18:55.782> interview<00:18:56.826> to<00:18:56.906> how<00:18:57.067> you<00:18:57.211> make<00:18:57.388> selections<00:18:58.271> and<00:18:58.496> offers<00:18:58.930> and<00:18:59.058> all<00:18:59.155> those<00:18:59.267> sorts<00:18:59.492> of<00:18:59.620> things.

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I<00:19:00.118> think<00:19:00.343> just<00:19:00.520> managing<00:19:00.921> that<00:19:01.146> process<00:19:01.644> is<00:19:01.788> really<00:19:01.965> important<00:19:03.812> for<00:19:03.973> leaders<00:19:04.358> and<00:19:04.438> something<00:19:04.695> that<00:19:04.856> really<00:19:05.081> shouldn't<00:19:05.563> be,<00:19:06.687> you<00:19:06.799> know,<00:19:07.088> offloaded,<00:19:07.522> so<00:19:07.731> to<00:19:07.811> speak.

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You<00:19:08.389> know,<00:19:08.453> I'm<00:19:08.694> a<00:19:08.726> firm<00:19:09.031> believer<00:19:09.369> that<00:19:09.513> people<00:19:09.770> have<00:19:09.931> to<00:19:10.075> be<00:19:10.461> really<00:19:10.653> invested<00:19:11.344> in<00:19:11.826> making<00:19:12.082> those<00:19:12.307> hiring<00:19:12.644> decisions,<00:19:13.285> even,<00:19:13.767> you<00:19:13.863> know,<00:19:14.168> it's<00:19:14.665> a<00:19:14.729> struggle<00:19:15.194> as<00:19:15.291> organizations<00:19:15.916> get<00:19:16.077> larger<00:19:17.697> to<00:19:17.841> kind<00:19:18.018> of<00:19:18.050> still<00:19:18.322> have<00:19:18.499> a<00:19:18.563> hand<00:19:18.836> in<00:19:18.964> that.

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But<00:19:19.702> it's,<00:19:19.943> you<00:19:20.039> know,<00:19:20.167> one<00:19:20.263> of<00:19:20.295> the<00:19:20.408> things<00:19:20.729> I<00:19:20.761> still<00:19:21.226> meet<00:19:21.531> all<00:19:21.611> the<00:19:21.707> people<00:19:22.028> that<00:19:22.429> join<00:19:22.605> our<00:19:22.670> organization,<00:19:25.621> you<00:19:25.701> know,<00:19:25.942> because<00:19:26.215> again,<00:19:26.503> I<00:19:26.985> want<00:19:27.241> to,<00:19:27.546> I<00:19:27.562> want<00:19:27.707> to<00:19:27.787> have<00:19:27.899> a<00:19:28.027> hand<00:19:28.380> and<00:19:28.509> have<00:19:28.669> some,<00:19:29.712> you<00:19:29.744> know,<00:19:29.952> opinion<00:19:30.450> into<00:19:30.754> how<00:19:31.011> people<00:19:31.316> will<00:19:31.428> fit<00:19:32.310> and<00:19:32.455> how<00:19:32.631> their<00:19:32.840> experience<00:19:33.722> matches<00:19:34.139> what<00:19:34.299> we<00:19:34.524> need<00:19:34.700> in<00:19:35.005> terms<00:19:35.278> of<00:19:35.422> work.

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And<00:19:36.850> I<00:19:37.010> think<00:19:37.347> the<00:19:37.427> last<00:19:37.732> one<00:19:37.893> I'd<00:19:37.989> say<00:19:38.230> is<00:19:39.032> you<00:19:39.112> know,<00:19:40.058> I<00:19:40.154> learned<00:19:40.395> early<00:19:40.780> on<00:19:41.357> in<00:19:41.597> product<00:19:41.982> management,<00:19:42.704> you<00:19:42.736> know,<00:19:42.960> doing<00:19:43.137> a<00:19:43.153> lot<00:19:43.377> of<00:19:43.506> work,<00:19:44.003> which<00:19:44.163> was<00:19:44.580> super<00:19:44.885> valuable<00:19:45.382> for<00:19:45.510> my<00:19:45.751> career.

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Being<00:19:46.328> able<00:19:46.505> to<00:19:46.585> do<00:19:46.729> that<00:19:46.905> early<00:19:47.210> on<00:19:47.435> is<00:19:47.595> the<00:19:47.675> ability<00:19:47.964> to<00:19:48.076> build<00:19:48.236> frameworks.

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You<00:19:49.632> know,<00:19:50.161> when<00:19:50.257> you<00:19:50.401> have<00:19:50.562> a<00:19:50.802> kind<00:19:51.364> of<00:19:51.460> a<00:19:51.476> nasty,<00:19:52.262> difficult<00:19:52.823> problem<00:19:53.224> with<00:19:53.384> a<00:19:53.448> lot<00:19:53.641> of<00:19:53.785> variables,<00:19:55.373> you<00:19:55.405> know,<00:19:55.565> some<00:19:55.806> of<00:19:55.870> the<00:19:55.950> people<00:19:56.207> that<00:19:56.351> I<00:19:56.431> really<00:19:56.656> enjoyed<00:19:56.976> working<00:19:57.233> with<00:19:57.393> and<00:19:57.473> that<00:19:57.634> I<00:19:57.794> learned<00:19:58.836> the<00:19:58.933> most<00:19:59.318> from<00:20:00.200> had<00:20:00.360> kind<00:20:00.536> of<00:20:00.600> a<00:20:00.665> unique<00:20:01.017> ability<00:20:01.402> to<00:20:01.547> kind<00:20:01.739> of<00:20:02.124> cut<00:20:02.300> it<00:20:02.429> down<00:20:02.669> into<00:20:02.846> chunks<00:20:03.246> and<00:20:03.407> build<00:20:03.567> frameworks<00:20:04.273> for<00:20:04.369> that<00:20:04.529> decision-making.

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And,<00:20:06.616> you<00:20:06.696> know,<00:20:06.856> it's<00:20:07.017> a<00:20:07.081> lot<00:20:07.258> of<00:20:07.338> discussion<00:20:07.916> and<00:20:08.061> testing<00:20:08.703> and,<00:20:09.666> you<00:20:09.763> know,<00:20:10.068> does<00:20:10.244> it<00:20:10.373> fit,<00:20:10.710> does<00:20:10.806> it<00:20:10.951> not<00:20:11.192> fit,<00:20:11.513> what<00:20:11.657> are<00:20:11.689> the<00:20:11.818> exceptions,<00:20:14.001> you<00:20:14.082> know,<00:20:14.306> working<00:20:14.660> through<00:20:14.949> problems<00:20:15.446> for<00:20:15.591> a<00:20:15.671> way<00:20:15.912> where<00:20:16.008> you<00:20:16.169> can<00:20:16.394> put<00:20:16.554> structure<00:20:17.052> around<00:20:17.453> it<00:20:17.839> and<00:20:18.176> kind<00:20:18.353> of<00:20:18.497> gain<00:20:18.738> consensus<00:20:19.444> on<00:20:19.605> how<00:20:19.765> you<00:20:19.862> would<00:20:20.087> make<00:20:20.263> decisions<00:20:20.905> based<00:20:21.211> on<00:20:21.869> the<00:20:21.949> data<00:20:22.270> that<00:20:22.350> you<00:20:22.495> have,<00:20:22.977> the<00:20:23.073> data<00:20:23.266> that<00:20:23.458> you<00:20:23.555> don't<00:20:23.860> have.

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And<00:20:24.919> likewise,<00:20:25.546> you<00:20:25.594> know,<00:20:25.706> I<00:20:25.867> had<00:20:25.979> a<00:20:26.043> role<00:20:27.729> at<00:20:27.826> a<00:20:27.954> tech<00:20:28.131> company<00:20:28.532> back<00:20:28.773> in<00:20:28.853> Canada<00:20:29.415> where<00:20:29.560> I<00:20:29.736> was<00:20:29.897> responsible<00:20:30.635> for<00:20:31.406> kind<00:20:31.502> of<00:20:31.582> communicating<00:20:32.159> a<00:20:32.223> solutions<00:20:32.849> offering.

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The<00:20:33.426> company<00:20:33.730> was<00:20:33.907> moving<00:20:34.147> from<00:20:34.372> being<00:20:34.548> really<00:20:34.852> kind<00:20:35.013> of<00:20:35.430> a<00:20:35.494> single<00:20:35.894> product-focused<00:20:36.696> company<00:20:37.113> to<00:20:37.193> a<00:20:37.257> solutions<00:20:38.796> company<00:20:39.117> that<00:20:39.213> had<00:20:39.341> a<00:20:39.437> portfolio<00:20:40.062> of<00:20:40.159> products.

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And<00:20:41.377> again,<00:20:41.665> I<00:20:41.762> think<00:20:41.922> the<00:20:42.018> ability<00:20:42.403> to<00:20:42.563> build<00:20:42.820> frameworks<00:20:43.525> and<00:20:43.685> organize<00:20:44.166> information<00:20:44.888> is<00:20:45.048> just<00:20:45.272> really<00:20:45.465> important<00:20:46.026> so<00:20:46.250> that<00:20:46.298> you<00:20:46.330> communicate,<00:20:48.655> you<00:20:48.767> know,<00:20:48.831> sometimes<00:20:49.360> complex<00:20:49.777> information.

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But<00:20:50.498> again,<00:20:50.835> it's<00:20:51.380> the<00:20:51.460> efficiency<00:20:52.021> of<00:20:52.101> how<00:20:52.246> you<00:20:52.422> put<00:20:52.598> things<00:20:52.823> together<00:20:53.159> so<00:20:53.384> people<00:20:53.624> can<00:20:53.785> digest<00:20:54.346> it<00:20:54.506> and<00:20:54.666> building<00:20:54.987> those<00:20:55.227> frameworks<00:20:55.788> and<00:20:55.869> structures<00:20:56.430> of<00:20:56.510> information<00:20:57.552> is<00:20:57.696> really<00:20:57.873> important,<00:20:58.899> you<00:20:58.979> know,<00:20:59.316> not<00:20:59.556> just<00:20:59.765> from<00:20:59.877> a<00:20:59.893> marketing<00:21:00.502> perspective,<00:21:01.144> but,<00:21:01.705> you<00:21:01.737> know,<00:21:01.881> from<00:21:02.042> a<00:21:02.186> positioning<00:21:02.747> perspective,<00:21:03.389> you<00:21:03.421> know,<00:21:03.790> how<00:21:03.982> is<00:21:04.142> it<00:21:04.206> that<00:21:04.351> you<00:21:04.431> deliver<00:21:04.768> value?

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How<00:21:05.409> is<00:21:05.505> it<00:21:05.586> these<00:21:05.810> things<00:21:06.051> fit<00:21:06.211> together?

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And<00:21:06.852> again,<00:21:07.157> it's<00:21:07.269> about<00:21:07.638> testing<00:21:08.279> and,<00:21:09.161> you<00:21:09.193> know,<00:21:09.338> kind<00:21:09.482> of<00:21:09.578> trying<00:21:09.739> to<00:21:09.899> poke<00:21:10.139> holes<00:21:10.460> in<00:21:10.604> it.

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You<00:21:10.861> know,<00:21:11.118> some<00:21:11.278> of<00:21:11.342> the<00:21:11.406> most<00:21:11.647> interesting<00:21:12.048> meetings<00:21:12.449> were<00:21:12.545> just<00:21:12.721> a<00:21:12.785> few<00:21:13.010> people<00:21:13.250> sitting<00:21:13.507> down<00:21:13.844> and<00:21:13.924> saying,<00:21:14.709> you<00:21:14.742> know,<00:21:14.870> what<00:21:14.966> if<00:21:15.030> we<00:21:15.191> put<00:21:15.335> it<00:21:15.431> together<00:21:15.752> like<00:21:15.976> this?

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And<00:21:16.634> having<00:21:17.211> smart<00:21:17.516> people<00:21:17.836> kind<00:21:17.997> of<00:21:18.061> poke<00:21:18.317> holes<00:21:18.702> in<00:21:18.734> it<00:21:18.782> and<00:21:18.975> say,<00:21:19.199> does<00:21:19.360> it<00:21:19.504> work?

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You<00:21:20.001> know,<00:21:20.161> why<00:21:20.402> doesn't<00:21:20.642> it<00:21:20.803> work?

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How<00:21:21.284> can<00:21:21.428> we<00:21:21.524> make<00:21:21.701> it<00:21:21.781> stronger?

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Um,<00:21:23.288> so<00:21:23.529> again,<00:21:23.833> I,<00:21:23.994> I,<00:21:24.154> I,<00:21:24.555> I<00:21:24.780> boil<00:21:25.039> that<00:21:25.217> down<00:21:25.460> to<00:21:25.541> kind<00:21:25.703> of<00:21:25.848> building<00:21:26.124> frameworks<00:21:26.836> and<00:21:26.998> organizing<00:21:27.484> information<00:21:28.132> in,<00:21:28.440> in<00:21:28.537> ways<00:21:28.780> that's<00:21:29.023> both<00:21:29.249> useful<00:21:29.606> for<00:21:29.913> communicating<00:21:30.561> and<00:21:30.642> making<00:21:30.836> decisions.

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How<00:21:33.232> do<00:21:33.296> you<00:21:33.393> think<00:21:33.570> about<00:21:33.779> the<00:21:33.940> current<00:21:34.439> just<00:21:34.842> macroeconomic<00:21:36.356> environment<00:21:36.758> we're<00:21:36.855> in,<00:21:36.935> the<00:21:37.080> current<00:21:37.322> environment<00:21:37.805> we're<00:21:37.966> in<00:21:38.062> with<00:21:38.143> like<00:21:38.385> presidential<00:21:38.916> election<00:21:39.270> happening<00:21:39.737> obviously<00:21:40.140> in<00:21:40.188> our<00:21:40.381> country,<00:21:40.719> but<00:21:40.945> throughout<00:21:41.202> the<00:21:41.347> world<00:21:41.686> there's,<00:21:42.008> there's<00:21:42.169> a<00:21:42.185> number<00:21:42.491> of<00:21:42.620> these<00:21:42.960> elections<00:21:43.446> happening.

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How<00:21:44.515> do<00:21:44.580> you<00:21:44.904> think,<00:21:45.228> like,<00:21:45.649> where<00:21:45.811> are<00:21:46.216> we<00:21:46.459> going?

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Like,<00:21:47.415> what<00:21:47.463> does<00:21:47.674> 2025<00:21:48.403> look<00:21:48.630> like?

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Generally<00:21:52.595> speaking,<00:21:52.998> I'm<00:21:53.143> optimistic.

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So,<00:21:54.447> you<00:21:54.544> know,<00:21:54.834> I<00:21:55.011> like<00:21:55.268> to<00:21:55.413> think<00:21:55.800> that<00:21:56.299> things<00:21:56.621> will<00:21:56.798> sort<00:21:57.104> themselves<00:21:57.652> out.

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It's<00:21:58.634> hard<00:21:58.875> to<00:21:58.956> be<00:21:59.101> optimistic<00:21:59.600> these<00:21:59.825> days,<00:22:00.083> to<00:22:00.180> be<00:22:00.325> perfectly<00:22:00.792> frank.

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You<00:22:03.682> know,<00:22:04.083> yeah,<00:22:05.449> I<00:22:05.529> wish<00:22:05.722> from<00:22:05.851> a<00:22:06.011> political<00:22:06.493> perspective<00:22:07.040> and<00:22:07.120> an<00:22:07.216> economic<00:22:07.779> perspective,<00:22:08.582> you<00:22:08.630> know,<00:22:08.727> I<00:22:08.823> think<00:22:09.000> a<00:22:09.128> lot<00:22:09.321> of<00:22:09.369> the<00:22:09.771> problems,<00:22:10.655> you<00:22:10.687> know,<00:22:11.153> their<00:22:11.313> root<00:22:11.474> cause<00:22:11.860> right<00:22:12.036> now<00:22:12.261> has<00:22:12.438> to<00:22:12.534> do<00:22:12.920> with<00:22:13.322> things<00:22:13.552> that<00:22:13.733> people<00:22:14.833> just<00:22:14.964> aren't<00:22:15.128> looking<00:22:15.456> at.

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Like,<00:22:15.850> I<00:22:15.867> think<00:22:16.113> income<00:22:16.376> inequality<00:22:16.934> is<00:22:17.016> a<00:22:17.081> huge<00:22:17.328> one.

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I<00:22:18.133> think<00:22:18.294> a<00:22:18.310> lot<00:22:18.696> of<00:22:18.856> the,<00:22:19.643> you<00:22:19.740> know,<00:22:20.061> economic<00:22:20.559> and<00:22:20.784> political<00:22:21.266> angst<00:22:21.571> that's<00:22:21.732> going<00:22:22.069> on<00:22:22.246> in<00:22:22.310> the<00:22:22.455> country<00:22:22.889> stems<00:22:23.515> from,<00:22:24.704> you<00:22:24.784> know,<00:22:24.961> people<00:22:25.202> talk<00:22:25.539> about<00:22:25.845> it<00:22:25.941> as<00:22:26.085> this<00:22:26.310> idea<00:22:26.712> that<00:22:26.873> they've<00:22:27.049> been,<00:22:27.676> you<00:22:27.708> know,<00:22:27.933> left<00:22:28.174> behind<00:22:28.897> or<00:22:29.058> that<00:22:29.443> their<00:22:29.700> lives<00:22:30.005> aren't<00:22:30.166> as<00:22:30.262> good<00:22:30.439> as<00:22:30.584> they<00:22:30.744> want.

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And<00:22:31.291> people<00:22:31.451> are<00:22:31.548> searching<00:22:32.030> for<00:22:32.254> ways,<00:22:32.833> you<00:22:32.913> know,<00:22:33.234> just<00:22:33.459> to<00:22:33.861> get<00:22:33.957> ahead<00:22:34.182> and<00:22:34.263> be<00:22:34.423> happy.

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But<00:22:35.580> I<00:22:35.660> think<00:22:35.949> there<00:22:36.110> are<00:22:36.287> some<00:22:37.331> structural<00:22:37.958> changes<00:22:38.359> that<00:22:38.456> need<00:22:38.616> to<00:22:38.761> be<00:22:38.857> made<00:22:39.580> to<00:22:39.741> address<00:22:40.142> income<00:22:40.464> inequality.

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It<00:22:41.187> just<00:22:41.331> keeps<00:22:41.524> getting<00:22:41.813> worse<00:22:42.086> and<00:22:42.295> worse.

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And<00:22:42.777> I<00:22:42.857> don't<00:22:43.339> really<00:22:43.580> understand<00:22:44.303> how<00:22:44.480> that<00:22:45.042> doesn't<00:22:45.363> have<00:22:45.684> a,<00:22:46.327> you<00:22:46.407> know,<00:22:46.792> relatively<00:22:47.290> difficult<00:22:47.836> end<00:22:48.173> or<00:22:48.510> some<00:22:48.815> correction,<00:22:49.442> right,<00:22:49.634> if<00:22:49.779> it's<00:22:49.923> not<00:22:50.164> dealt<00:22:50.341> with.

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Um,<00:22:52.669> so<00:22:52.974> yeah,<00:22:53.054> I<00:22:53.167> mean,<00:22:53.327> from<00:22:53.536> a,<00:22:53.697> from<00:22:53.809> a<00:22:53.873> general<00:22:54.194> economic<00:22:54.596> perspective,<00:22:55.158> again,<00:22:55.720> you<00:22:55.816> know,<00:22:56.442> you<00:22:56.523> know,<00:22:56.667> I'm<00:22:56.764> not<00:22:56.924> a<00:22:57.004> political<00:22:57.470> expert.

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Um,<00:22:58.915> you<00:22:58.947> know,<00:22:59.333> I'm<00:22:59.477> an,<00:22:59.734> I'm<00:22:59.830> an<00:22:59.911> immigrant<00:23:00.264> to<00:23:00.360> the<00:23:00.440> US<00:23:00.681> from<00:23:00.922> Canada,<00:23:01.356> so<00:23:01.725> I<00:23:01.757> think<00:23:02.046> my<00:23:02.223> upbringing,<00:23:02.865> my<00:23:03.026> upbringing<00:23:03.604> and<00:23:03.748> my<00:23:03.989> kind<00:23:04.166> of<00:23:04.294> idea<00:23:04.615> of<00:23:04.792> political<00:23:05.434> discourse<00:23:06.237> and<00:23:06.622> how<00:23:06.799> politics<00:23:07.666> kind<00:23:07.827> of<00:23:07.859> shapes<00:23:08.324> day-to-day<00:23:08.886> is<00:23:09.031> a<00:23:09.191> little<00:23:09.368> bit<00:23:09.593> different.

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You<00:23:11.295> know,<00:23:11.439> than<00:23:11.552> someone<00:23:11.857> who's<00:23:12.017> grown<00:23:12.258> up<00:23:12.354> in<00:23:12.483> the<00:23:12.563> US.

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So<00:23:13.462> I,<00:23:13.783> you<00:23:13.864> know,<00:23:14.008> I'm<00:23:14.104> a<00:23:14.425> US<00:23:14.666> citizen<00:23:14.987> now,<00:23:15.244> so<00:23:15.389> I'm<00:23:16.095> conscious<00:23:16.593> to<00:23:17.460> recognize<00:23:17.942> that<00:23:18.102> I'm<00:23:18.198> a<00:23:18.279> part<00:23:18.520> of<00:23:18.600> it,<00:23:18.841> right?

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I<00:23:19.146> don't<00:23:19.403> get<00:23:19.563> to<00:23:19.708> just<00:23:20.350> observe<00:23:20.928> necessarily,<00:23:21.570> like<00:23:21.795> I<00:23:21.955> am<00:23:22.052> a<00:23:22.196> part<00:23:22.373> of<00:23:22.517> it<00:23:23.256> through<00:23:23.400> more<00:23:23.657> than<00:23:24.139> just<00:23:24.380> my<00:23:24.621> vote.

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But<00:23:26.146> that,<00:23:26.371> you<00:23:26.403> know,<00:23:26.547> but<00:23:26.708> that<00:23:26.949> perspective<00:23:27.527> does<00:23:27.896> change<00:23:28.313> how<00:23:28.474> I<00:23:28.715> look<00:23:28.875> at<00:23:28.956> the<00:23:29.116> lens<00:23:29.437> of<00:23:29.518> what's<00:23:29.678> happening<00:23:30.079> in<00:23:30.160> US<00:23:30.561> politics.

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And<00:23:31.589> I<00:23:31.765> would<00:23:32.006> love<00:23:32.263> to<00:23:32.408> see<00:23:33.836> things<00:23:34.880> settle<00:23:35.281> out<00:23:35.442> a<00:23:35.538> bit.

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I<00:23:35.940> just<00:23:36.325> don't<00:23:36.534> know<00:23:36.646> how<00:23:36.742> that<00:23:36.967> happens<00:23:37.465> without<00:23:37.866> addressing<00:23:38.444> some<00:23:38.765> of<00:23:38.990> the<00:23:39.777> kind<00:23:39.954> of<00:23:40.178> root<00:23:40.435> causes<00:23:41.543> of,<00:23:42.523> again,<00:23:43.085> just,<00:23:43.325> just<00:23:43.711> people's<00:23:44.048> feelings<00:23:44.466> like<00:23:44.674> the<00:23:44.755> country's<00:23:45.092> going<00:23:45.413> in<00:23:45.557> two<00:23:45.654> directions,<00:23:46.296> right?

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Either<00:23:47.275> it<00:23:47.420> benefits<00:23:47.821> me<00:23:47.982> or<00:23:48.142> it<00:23:48.223> doesn't.

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So<00:23:48.929> I<00:23:49.170> think<00:23:49.331> until<00:23:50.567> a<00:23:50.631> group<00:23:51.049> or<00:23:51.177> a<00:23:51.257> party<00:23:51.675> or<00:23:51.835> a<00:23:51.852> system<00:23:53.265> comes<00:23:53.602> along<00:23:54.003> that<00:23:54.148> can<00:23:54.308> start<00:23:54.726> to<00:23:54.870> speak<00:23:55.207> to<00:23:55.448> and<00:23:55.529> address<00:23:55.994> that<00:23:56.315> root<00:23:56.556> cause,<00:23:57.680> um,<00:23:58.322> yeah,<00:23:58.884> there's<00:23:59.222> going<00:23:59.318> to<00:23:59.382> be<00:23:59.462> a<00:23:59.478> lot<00:23:59.719> of<00:23:59.784> conflict<00:24:00.410> and<00:24:00.570> tension<00:24:01.229> kind<00:24:01.453> of<00:24:01.534> within<00:24:01.710> the<00:24:01.871> political<00:24:02.272> system.

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You<00:24:02.931> know,<00:24:03.316> economically<00:24:04.039> speaking,<00:24:05.404> Again,<00:24:06.046> I<00:24:06.127> think<00:24:06.271> they're<00:24:06.689> clearly<00:24:07.010> tied,<00:24:07.476> right?

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Like<00:24:07.910> most<00:24:08.231> of<00:24:08.360> the<00:24:08.520> economic<00:24:08.954> indicators,<00:24:09.645> at<00:24:09.725> least<00:24:09.918> in<00:24:10.047> the<00:24:10.127> US<00:24:10.448> right<00:24:10.657> now,<00:24:10.786> are<00:24:10.930> pretty<00:24:11.171> positive,<00:24:11.669> right?

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Like<00:24:12.071> there's<00:24:12.232> a<00:24:12.392> good<00:24:12.537> argument<00:24:13.115> to<00:24:13.260> be<00:24:13.436> made<00:24:13.934> for<00:24:14.641> the<00:24:14.722> economy<00:24:15.204> is<00:24:15.364> doing<00:24:15.670> well.

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How<00:24:16.152> you<00:24:16.248> would<00:24:16.409> measure<00:24:16.730> that<00:24:17.051> by,<00:24:18.240> you<00:24:18.336> know,<00:24:18.835> stock<00:24:19.220> market<00:24:19.541> indices<00:24:20.264> or<00:24:20.505> the,<00:24:21.212> you<00:24:21.244> know,<00:24:21.453> housing<00:24:21.871> market<00:24:22.449> or<00:24:22.658> average<00:24:22.996> wages,<00:24:23.702> you<00:24:23.735> know,<00:24:24.265> all<00:24:24.441> those<00:24:24.586> sorts<00:24:24.843> of<00:24:24.923> things.

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You<00:24:25.405> can,<00:24:25.887> you<00:24:25.968> can<00:24:26.691> cherry-pick<00:24:27.092> what<00:24:27.253> data<00:24:27.638> you<00:24:27.735> want<00:24:28.056> to<00:24:28.153> say<00:24:28.297> that<00:24:28.442> the<00:24:28.522> economy<00:24:28.876> is<00:24:28.956> doing<00:24:29.245> well.

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And<00:24:29.486> there's<00:24:29.647> this<00:24:29.743> huge<00:24:29.984> gap<00:24:30.225> between<00:24:30.546> how<00:24:30.707> people<00:24:30.996> are<00:24:31.109> feeling,<00:24:31.575> right?

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No<00:24:32.297> one<00:24:32.457> feels<00:24:32.794> like<00:24:33.019> the<00:24:33.115> economy<00:24:33.516> is<00:24:33.676> working<00:24:33.997> for<00:24:34.302> them,<00:24:35.040> you<00:24:35.120> know,<00:24:35.681> at<00:24:35.761> least<00:24:35.922> the<00:24:36.002> majority<00:24:36.419> of<00:24:36.467> the<00:24:36.564> population<00:24:37.125> doesn't.

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And<00:24:37.590> so<00:24:37.751> I,<00:24:38.264> again,<00:24:38.504> I<00:24:38.713> think<00:24:38.809> people<00:24:39.226> have<00:24:39.371> identified<00:24:40.333> this<00:24:40.718> big<00:24:40.959> gap<00:24:41.311> in<00:24:41.536> terms<00:24:41.921> of,<00:24:42.819> you<00:24:42.900> know,<00:24:43.220> growth<00:24:43.621> and<00:24:43.766> earnings,<00:24:44.423> but<00:24:44.568> that<00:24:45.049> there<00:24:45.161> is<00:24:45.322> a<00:24:45.386> huge,<00:24:46.172> you<00:24:46.204> know,<00:24:46.428> wage<00:24:46.749> gap<00:24:47.150> that<00:24:47.246> has<00:24:47.471> kind<00:24:47.696> of,<00:24:47.952> you<00:24:47.984> know,<00:24:48.738> um,<00:24:49.300> only<00:24:49.460> grown<00:24:49.861> over<00:24:49.957> the<00:24:50.038> last<00:24:50.278> 20<00:24:50.663> years.

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So<00:24:51.962> again,<00:24:52.428> I<00:24:52.588> think<00:24:52.700> that's<00:24:52.861> a<00:24:52.925> big<00:24:53.149> part<00:24:53.342> of<00:24:53.486> it<00:24:53.566> is<00:24:53.791> just<00:24:54.128> making<00:24:54.449> sure<00:24:54.689> that<00:24:54.850> everyone<00:24:55.154> feels<00:24:55.491> like<00:24:55.636> they're<00:24:55.956> part<00:24:56.293> of<00:24:56.390> the<00:24:56.502> success<00:24:57.015> of<00:24:57.095> that<00:24:57.256> economy<00:24:57.817> and<00:24:57.897> trying<00:24:58.154> to<00:24:58.298> deal<00:24:58.603> with<00:24:58.699> some<00:24:59.004> of<00:24:59.245> the<00:25:00.047> root<00:25:00.223> cause<00:25:00.608> issues.

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So,<00:25:02.790> you<00:25:02.886> know,<00:25:03.031> they're<00:25:03.416> tied,<00:25:03.977> but,<00:25:05.116> you<00:25:05.196> know,<00:25:05.517> we<00:25:05.614> don't<00:25:05.822> do<00:25:05.918> a<00:25:05.934> lot<00:25:06.143> of<00:25:06.239> outlook<00:25:06.640> or<00:25:06.720> forecasting<00:25:07.442> based<00:25:07.763> on<00:25:08.068> the,<00:25:09.608> you<00:25:09.688> know,<00:25:09.785> macroeconomic<00:25:10.731> conditions<00:25:11.212> of<00:25:11.277> the<00:25:11.373> country.

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Research<00:25:12.897> for<00:25:13.121> us<00:25:13.539> is<00:25:13.635> certainly<00:25:14.180> driven<00:25:14.565> largely<00:25:14.982> by<00:25:15.207> federal<00:25:15.544> funders,<00:25:16.025> so<00:25:16.266> there<00:25:16.490> is<00:25:16.651> a<00:25:16.683> certain<00:25:17.292> element<00:25:17.790> that<00:25:17.934> we<00:25:18.095> look<00:25:18.271> into<00:25:18.672> related<00:25:19.137> to<00:25:19.298> how<00:25:19.875> the<00:25:20.020> federal<00:25:20.421> government<00:25:20.838> is<00:25:20.934> going<00:25:21.030> to<00:25:21.143> be<00:25:21.255> funding<00:25:21.881> research.

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You<00:25:22.602> know,<00:25:22.843> that's<00:25:23.389> largely,<00:25:24.608> you<00:25:24.688> know,<00:25:24.848> a<00:25:24.913> factor<00:25:25.330> of<00:25:25.474> how<00:25:25.554> much<00:25:25.811> money<00:25:25.971> they<00:25:26.196> have<00:25:26.469> and<00:25:26.597> also<00:25:26.854> how<00:25:26.998> much<00:25:27.175> they<00:25:27.319> want<00:25:27.399> to<00:25:27.479> prioritize<00:25:28.217> putting<00:25:28.458> the<00:25:28.618> resources<00:25:29.100> they<00:25:29.260> have<00:25:30.462> into<00:25:30.703> research.

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And<00:25:31.584> I<00:25:31.664> think<00:25:31.824> that's<00:25:32.369> one<00:25:32.481> of<00:25:32.625> the,<00:25:33.170> you<00:25:33.266> know,<00:25:33.330> amazing<00:25:33.747> strengths<00:25:34.147> of<00:25:34.228> the<00:25:34.372> U.S.<00:25:34.708> economy.

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You<00:25:35.349> know,<00:25:35.445> it<00:25:35.573> really<00:25:35.750> goes<00:25:35.990> back<00:25:36.246> to<00:25:36.390> kind<00:25:36.647> of,<00:25:36.855> you<00:25:36.951> know,<00:25:37.095> the<00:25:37.192> World<00:25:37.416> War<00:25:37.512> II<00:25:37.752> days<00:25:38.634> into<00:25:38.778> the<00:25:38.874> Cold<00:25:39.114> War<00:25:39.274> days.

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But<00:25:40.877> the<00:25:40.973> federal<00:25:41.341> funding<00:25:41.758> of<00:25:41.902> university<00:25:42.559> research<00:25:43.184> that<00:25:43.264> has<00:25:43.360> now<00:25:43.584> expanded<00:25:44.257> to<00:25:44.401> tackle<00:25:44.706> all<00:25:44.978> sorts<00:25:45.363> of<00:25:46.084> interesting<00:25:47.446> problems<00:25:47.942> is<00:25:48.247> a<00:25:48.327> kind<00:25:48.487> of<00:25:48.583> a<00:25:48.711> uniquely<00:25:49.128> American,<00:25:50.410> or<00:25:50.490> at<00:25:50.570> least<00:25:50.810> an<00:25:50.890> American-led<00:25:51.996> construct.

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And<00:25:52.733> so,<00:25:54.175> you<00:25:54.399> know,<00:25:54.559> we<00:25:54.639> look<00:25:54.880> at<00:25:54.976> it<00:25:55.040> from<00:25:55.456> that<00:25:55.777> perspective<00:25:56.258> in<00:25:56.338> terms<00:25:56.594> of<00:25:56.722> how<00:25:56.898> it'll<00:25:57.139> impact<00:25:57.539> our<00:25:57.619> organization,<00:25:58.581> but<00:25:58.725> on<00:25:58.885> a<00:25:59.302> On<00:25:59.382> a<00:25:59.526> kind<00:26:00.345> of,<00:26:00.650> again,<00:26:01.051> personal<00:26:01.693> view<00:26:01.869> of<00:26:01.950> politics,<00:26:04.260> I<00:26:04.533> do<00:26:04.758> wish<00:26:05.384> there<00:26:05.560> would<00:26:05.721> be<00:26:05.945> more<00:26:06.266> focus<00:26:06.924> and<00:26:07.165> structure<00:26:07.582> related<00:26:08.208> to<00:26:09.476> how<00:26:09.652> we<00:26:09.733> just<00:26:09.893> make<00:26:10.054> sure<00:26:10.214> that<00:26:10.294> everyone<00:26:10.551> feels<00:26:11.016> like<00:26:11.337> they're<00:26:12.220> part<00:26:12.477> of<00:26:12.541> what<00:26:12.685> we're<00:26:12.782> trying<00:26:12.958> to<00:26:13.103> build.

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Finally,<00:26:15.028> we<00:26:15.253> ask<00:26:15.510> everybody<00:26:15.750> the<00:26:15.831> same<00:26:16.135> question<00:26:16.489> at<00:26:16.633> the<00:26:16.713> end<00:26:16.858> of<00:26:16.954> every<00:26:17.195> interview.

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That<00:26:17.820> is,<00:26:17.933> at<00:26:18.061> CEO.com,<00:26:18.944> we<00:26:19.104> believe<00:26:19.377> the<00:26:19.505> chances<00:26:19.923> one<00:26:20.163> gives<00:26:20.581> is<00:26:20.709> just<00:26:20.853> as<00:26:20.966> important<00:26:21.271> as<00:26:21.351> the<00:26:21.447> chances<00:26:21.832> one<00:26:21.929> takes.

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When<00:26:23.196> you<00:26:23.373> hear<00:26:23.597> that,<00:26:23.774> who<00:26:23.934> gave<00:26:24.175> you<00:26:24.336> a<00:26:24.352> chance<00:26:24.817> to<00:26:24.962> get<00:26:25.122> you<00:26:25.282> to<00:26:25.363> where<00:26:25.539> you<00:26:25.700> are<00:26:25.860> today?

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Oh,<00:26:28.269> you<00:26:28.302> know,<00:26:29.093> like<00:26:29.319> most<00:26:29.578> people,<00:26:29.901> I<00:26:29.981> think,<00:26:30.304> who,<00:26:30.627> you<00:26:30.724> know,<00:26:30.854> get<00:26:30.918> in<00:26:31.031> the<00:26:31.096> leader<00:26:31.338> positions,<00:26:31.855> it's<00:26:32.485> probably<00:26:32.727> multiple,<00:26:33.211> right?

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That,<00:26:33.841> you<00:26:33.874> know,<00:26:34.100> I<00:26:34.164> can<00:26:34.261> identify<00:26:34.810> a<00:26:34.827> couple.

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Again,<00:26:36.165> when<00:26:36.310> I<00:26:36.471> was<00:26:36.955> working<00:26:37.616> back<00:26:37.857> in<00:26:37.922> Canada<00:26:38.244> and<00:26:38.422> one<00:26:38.567> of<00:26:38.631> my<00:26:38.728> first<00:26:38.986> jobs<00:26:39.373> out,<00:26:39.534> you<00:26:39.614> know,<00:26:39.776> I<00:26:39.792> was<00:26:39.953> doing<00:26:40.179> public<00:26:40.501> relations,<00:26:40.985> which<00:26:41.097> is<00:26:41.226> what<00:26:41.339> I<00:26:41.404> took<00:26:41.662> in<00:26:41.807> college,<00:26:42.210> and<00:26:42.290> I<00:26:42.355> was<00:26:42.516> convinced<00:26:42.935> I<00:26:43.016> wanted<00:26:43.258> to<00:26:43.338> do<00:26:43.483> sports<00:26:43.822> PR.

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You<00:26:45.901> know,<00:26:45.998> it<00:26:46.078> was<00:26:46.175> exciting.

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You<00:26:47.191> know,<00:26:47.529> I<00:26:47.545> had<00:26:47.771> kind<00:26:47.948> of<00:26:48.013> an<00:26:48.158> athletic<00:26:48.577> background<00:26:49.044> and<00:26:49.222> loved<00:26:49.383> the<00:26:49.463> people<00:26:49.705> I<00:26:49.866> worked<00:26:50.173> with<00:26:50.430> and<00:26:50.511> loved<00:26:50.753> working<00:26:50.995> with<00:26:51.156> amateur<00:26:51.623> athletes.

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And<00:26:53.314> thought<00:26:53.554> that<00:26:53.730> would<00:26:53.875> be<00:26:54.035> the<00:26:54.115> way.

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And,<00:26:54.917> you<00:26:55.013> know,<00:26:55.221> learned<00:26:55.462> quickly<00:26:55.782> I<00:26:55.878> might<00:26:56.103> want<00:26:56.247> to<00:26:56.295> try<00:26:56.536> something<00:26:56.984> else.

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And<00:26:58.026> I<00:26:58.106> got<00:26:58.299> into<00:26:58.507> a<00:26:58.523> tech<00:26:58.764> company,<00:26:59.469> uh,<00:26:59.805> doing<00:27:00.350> copy<00:27:00.687> editing<00:27:01.024> and<00:27:01.232> press<00:27:01.472> release,<00:27:02.434> um,<00:27:02.755> work<00:27:03.011> kind<00:27:03.396> of<00:27:03.476> through<00:27:03.652> my<00:27:04.053> PR<00:27:04.454> background.

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Um,<00:27:07.018> and<00:27:07.099> that<00:27:07.259> company<00:27:07.563> was<00:27:08.140> taking<00:27:08.365> on<00:27:08.477> a<00:27:08.541> huge<00:27:08.782> product<00:27:09.166> launch<00:27:09.503> and<00:27:09.583> they<00:27:09.743> realized<00:27:10.529> that,<00:27:10.945> uh,<00:27:11.667> you<00:27:11.731> know,<00:27:11.907> they<00:27:12.132> weren't<00:27:12.388> as—<00:27:12.853> they<00:27:13.029> didn't<00:27:13.318> have<00:27:13.398> enough<00:27:13.590> resource<00:27:13.991> behind<00:27:14.215> this<00:27:14.376> product<00:27:14.712> launch<00:27:14.969> that<00:27:15.097> was<00:27:15.193> critical,<00:27:16.315> as<00:27:16.475> critical<00:27:16.876> of<00:27:16.956> the<00:27:17.036> company<00:27:17.373> as<00:27:17.501> they<00:27:17.838> really<00:27:18.078> could<00:27:18.303> be<00:27:18.415> at<00:27:18.479> that<00:27:18.639> point.

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And<00:27:19.024> they<00:27:19.120> needed<00:27:19.345> some<00:27:19.505> help.

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And,<00:27:21.110> you<00:27:21.142> know,<00:27:21.287> I<00:27:21.432> had<00:27:21.544> a<00:27:21.608> colleague<00:27:22.010> at<00:27:22.170> work<00:27:22.636> who<00:27:22.990> I<00:27:23.054> think<00:27:23.359> picked<00:27:23.520> up<00:27:23.761> on<00:27:23.857> the<00:27:23.937> fact<00:27:24.243> that<00:27:24.339> I<00:27:24.564> asked<00:27:24.676> a<00:27:24.740> lot<00:27:24.901> of<00:27:24.965> questions<00:27:25.512> and<00:27:25.608> that<00:27:25.769> I,<00:27:26.427> you<00:27:26.491> know,<00:27:26.668> kind<00:27:26.813> of<00:27:26.909> understood<00:27:27.455> the<00:27:27.632> business<00:27:28.178> well<00:27:28.355> enough.

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And,<00:27:29.479> you<00:27:29.543> know,<00:27:29.720> he<00:27:29.865> gave<00:27:29.993> me<00:27:30.122> a<00:27:30.186> shot<00:27:31.953> at,<00:27:33.093> you<00:27:33.173> know,<00:27:33.334> helping<00:27:33.720> out<00:27:33.896> as<00:27:33.977> a<00:27:34.057> product<00:27:34.442> launch<00:27:34.764> coordinator.

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And<00:27:36.225> that<00:27:36.386> was<00:27:36.531> really<00:27:36.707> my<00:27:37.350> stepping<00:27:37.735> stone<00:27:37.976> into<00:27:38.153> product<00:27:38.538> management.

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And,<00:27:39.502> you<00:27:39.534> know,<00:27:39.583> I<00:27:39.759> credit<00:27:40.016> a<00:27:40.064> growing<00:27:40.321> company,<00:27:40.803> you<00:27:40.884> know,<00:27:41.028> for<00:27:41.125> anyone<00:27:41.366> who's<00:27:41.526> ever<00:27:41.831> worked<00:27:42.024> at<00:27:42.104> a<00:27:42.169> growing<00:27:42.554> company,<00:27:42.972> it<00:27:43.052> just<00:27:43.213> provides<00:27:43.679> opportunity<00:27:44.819> for<00:27:44.964> people<00:27:45.221> who<00:27:45.301> are<00:27:45.381> ambitious<00:27:46.024> and<00:27:46.184> people<00:27:46.393> who<00:27:46.570> want<00:27:46.747> to<00:27:46.811> try<00:27:47.068> different<00:27:47.325> things.

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And<00:27:48.658> we<00:27:48.754> had<00:27:48.979> two<00:27:49.156> founders,<00:27:50.104> um,<00:27:50.698> of<00:27:50.778> a<00:27:50.842> company<00:27:51.180> that's<00:27:51.485> called<00:27:51.662> Smart<00:27:51.967> Technologies.

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And,<00:27:53.878> you<00:27:53.910> know,<00:27:54.296> I'm<00:27:54.537> sure,<00:27:55.163> you<00:27:55.211> know,<00:27:55.806> I'm<00:27:56.288> sure<00:27:56.400> they<00:27:56.528> had<00:27:56.641> a<00:27:56.705> hand<00:27:57.107> or<00:27:57.251> knew<00:27:57.428> what<00:27:57.524> was<00:27:57.669> going<00:27:58.054> on<00:27:58.392> and<00:27:58.633> would<00:27:58.713> have<00:27:58.857> had<00:27:59.034> to<00:27:59.114> bless<00:27:59.580> the<00:27:59.677> idea<00:28:00.078> of<00:28:00.319> me<00:28:00.464> kind<00:28:00.624> of<00:28:00.656> stepping<00:28:01.106> up<00:28:01.219> into<00:28:01.427> other<00:28:01.684> roles.

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But<00:28:02.632> yeah,<00:28:02.793> they<00:28:02.873> had<00:28:03.034> confidence<00:28:03.467> in<00:28:03.612> me<00:28:03.772> and,<00:28:04.013> you<00:28:04.046> know,<00:28:04.238> trying<00:28:04.495> out<00:28:04.576> product<00:28:04.897> management.

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And<00:28:05.443> for<00:28:05.604> me,<00:28:05.700> that<00:28:05.877> was<00:28:06.021> a<00:28:06.102> huge<00:28:07.049> learning<00:28:07.451> ground,<00:28:08.334> um,<00:28:09.571> in<00:28:09.715> terms<00:28:10.021> of<00:28:10.262> all<00:28:10.438> aspects<00:28:10.936> of<00:28:11.017> a<00:28:11.161> business<00:28:11.563> and<00:28:11.707> getting,<00:28:12.205> you<00:28:12.269> know,<00:28:12.591> all<00:28:12.687> the<00:28:12.767> perspectives<00:28:13.490> on<00:28:14.212> you<00:28:14.292> know,<00:28:15.238> running<00:28:15.431> a<00:28:15.559> product<00:28:16.056> essentially.

00:28:16.457 --> 00:28:18.894
So<00:28:16.778> I<00:28:16.938> learned<00:28:17.339> more<00:28:17.499> than<00:28:17.643> I<00:28:17.740> ever<00:28:17.900> thought<00:28:18.141> I<00:28:18.365> would<00:28:18.477> in<00:28:18.557> that<00:28:18.782> role.

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And<00:28:19.984> then,<00:28:20.209> you<00:28:20.241> know,<00:28:20.385> the<00:28:20.481> second<00:28:20.786> big<00:28:21.011> opportunity<00:28:21.411> was<00:28:21.572> what<00:28:21.668> brought<00:28:21.828> me<00:28:21.925> down<00:28:22.085> to<00:28:22.149> the<00:28:22.293> US.

00:28:23.095 --> 00:28:29.701
I<00:28:23.416> took<00:28:23.528> a<00:28:23.656> job<00:28:24.009> in<00:28:24.153> international<00:28:24.666> sales<00:28:26.719> for<00:28:27.023> an<00:28:27.440> education<00:28:27.921> technology<00:28:28.402> company<00:28:28.787> here<00:28:28.963> in<00:28:29.108> California.

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That's<00:28:29.909> what<00:28:30.070> brought<00:28:30.246> me<00:28:30.390> to<00:28:30.487> the<00:28:30.631> US.

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And<00:28:32.796> I<00:28:32.812> had<00:28:32.972> never<00:28:33.148> done<00:28:33.309> sales<00:28:33.597> before.

00:28:34.078 --> 00:28:36.836
I<00:28:34.094> mean,<00:28:34.239> I<00:28:34.319> worked<00:28:34.495> with<00:28:34.591> salespeople<00:28:35.120> a<00:28:35.136> lot,<00:28:35.601> you<00:28:35.634> know,<00:28:35.762> in<00:28:35.842> product<00:28:36.163> management.

00:28:36.980 --> 00:28:42.127
I<00:28:37.061> was<00:28:37.622> knee-deep<00:28:38.343> in<00:28:38.439> our,<00:28:38.888> you<00:28:38.920> know,<00:28:39.145> with<00:28:39.369> our<00:28:39.466> sales<00:28:39.931> force<00:28:40.267> and<00:28:40.347> with<00:28:40.492> our<00:28:40.588> distributors<00:28:41.293> all<00:28:41.454> over<00:28:41.646> the<00:28:41.775> world.

00:28:44.036 --> 00:28:55.667
But<00:28:44.181> someone<00:28:44.598> basically<00:28:45.320> put<00:28:45.464> me<00:28:45.496> in<00:28:45.560> charge<00:28:45.817> of<00:28:45.897> a<00:28:45.945> quota,<00:28:46.844> you<00:28:46.924> know,<00:28:47.309> and<00:28:47.405> a<00:28:47.421> sales<00:28:47.822> team,<00:28:48.287> a<00:28:48.368> global<00:28:48.640> sales<00:28:49.009> team,<00:28:49.474> you<00:28:49.506> know,<00:28:49.731> all<00:28:49.891> over<00:28:50.116> the<00:28:50.212> world,<00:28:50.838> you<00:28:50.870> know,<00:28:51.095> even<00:28:51.255> though<00:28:51.319> I<00:28:51.415> had<00:28:51.576> never<00:28:51.881> actually<00:28:52.378> gone<00:28:52.619> in<00:28:52.715> front<00:28:52.875> of<00:28:52.956> a<00:28:53.036> customer<00:28:53.421> and<00:28:53.501> had<00:28:53.597> to<00:28:53.726> close<00:28:53.966> a<00:28:53.998> sale<00:28:54.223> before.

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And<00:28:56.084> so<00:28:56.308> I,<00:28:56.549> again,<00:28:56.790> I<00:28:56.870> think<00:28:57.062> people<00:28:57.287> had<00:28:57.431> faith<00:28:57.832> again<00:28:58.169> and<00:28:58.313> saw,<00:28:59.035> you<00:28:59.100> know,<00:28:59.260> much<00:28:59.436> like<00:28:59.597> I<00:28:59.677> got<00:28:59.837> the<00:28:59.982> job<00:29:00.239> that<00:29:00.383> I<00:29:00.399> have<00:29:00.656> today,<00:29:01.442> saw<00:29:01.602> a<00:29:01.698> skill<00:29:02.083> set,<00:29:02.500> saw<00:29:02.725> an<00:29:02.869> ability,<00:29:04.169> but<00:29:04.409> had<00:29:04.570> to<00:29:04.650> go<00:29:04.714> on<00:29:04.875> a<00:29:04.891> limb<00:29:05.933> and<00:29:06.318> essentially<00:29:06.816> give<00:29:06.976> me<00:29:07.137> a<00:29:07.217> chance<00:29:07.618> to<00:29:07.698> sink<00:29:07.955> or<00:29:08.035> swim.

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And<00:29:08.596> so<00:29:09.206> There's<00:29:09.366> been<00:29:09.462> a<00:29:09.526> few<00:29:09.687> of<00:29:09.719> those<00:29:09.943> people<00:29:10.264> throughout<00:29:10.568> my<00:29:10.665> career<00:29:11.226> that<00:29:11.322> have<00:29:12.091> really<00:29:12.268> allowed<00:29:12.733> me<00:29:12.909> to<00:29:13.807> try<00:29:14.191> things<00:29:14.496> out<00:29:14.752> and<00:29:14.833> see<00:29:14.993> if<00:29:15.137> I<00:29:15.217> could<00:29:15.394> make<00:29:15.570> it<00:29:15.698> work.

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And<00:29:17.462> I<00:29:17.622> credit<00:29:18.600> that<00:29:18.776> diversity<00:29:19.257> of<00:29:19.401> experience<00:29:20.027> with<00:29:20.267> getting<00:29:20.443> where<00:29:20.604> I<00:29:20.684> am<00:29:20.764> today.

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Andrew,<00:29:23.153> means<00:29:23.393> the<00:29:23.489> world<00:29:23.714> to<00:29:23.746> have<00:29:23.954> you<00:29:24.114> here.

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Thank<00:29:25.076> you<00:29:25.156> so<00:29:25.269> much<00:29:25.557> for<00:29:25.637> sharing<00:29:25.894> your<00:29:26.038> experience<00:29:26.519> with<00:29:26.695> us.

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Best<00:29:27.112> of<00:29:27.256> luck<00:29:27.433> in<00:29:27.513> everything<00:29:27.817> you're<00:29:27.978> doing.

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You're<00:29:29.244> running<00:29:29.501> an<00:29:29.581> incredible<00:29:29.982> organization,<00:29:30.527> incredibly<00:29:31.088> large<00:29:31.424> organization.

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You've<00:29:32.290> got<00:29:32.466> like<00:29:32.771> $84<00:29:33.252> million<00:29:33.845> of<00:29:33.989> external<00:29:34.470> revenue.

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You<00:29:35.693> got<00:29:35.774> 1,000<00:29:36.242> university<00:29:38.327> researchers<00:29:38.893> on<00:29:38.974> the<00:29:39.055> payroll.

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It's<00:29:40.024> pretty<00:29:40.202> impressive<00:29:40.671> what<00:29:40.784> you're<00:29:40.913> working<00:29:41.156> on<00:29:41.317> there.

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So<00:29:41.657> congratulations<00:29:42.853> and<00:29:42.950> best<00:29:43.192> of<00:29:43.257> luck<00:29:43.435> in<00:29:43.467> the<00:29:43.580> future.

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Thanks,<00:29:44.922> Clint.

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I<00:29:45.185> enjoyed<00:29:45.398> the<00:29:45.529> chat.